Here's Guido's update: Yesterday was a bit of an anomaly in that I had awkward feelings about W's whereabouts the previous day (she's in apt, I'm at house). We had plans to go out with my relatives last night so I spent the majority of the day wondering if she would call, if it was still on, etc.<p>Anyway, she called and asked what time to be ready. I LB'd a bit and asked her where she'd been all day, etc. She calmly explained that she finished all of her shopping for X-mas and that I need to trust that her contact (physical at least) is done with OM. She says that my "snooping" will only make it harder on me.<p>So, went to W's apt, had some cocktails, talked and then picked up relatives. We all had a fantastic evening. The restaurant was great, conversation was great and we dropped them off at their hotel. <p>On the way home, she said that we really should think about going out to see them in Colorado. I mentioned that it would be nice but that it was hard to think about that until things were better. <p>We had a nice conversation on the ride home and then I walked her upstairs and gave her a hug and kiss and told her that it was nice to spend time with her. She agreed.<p>I had the promising warm fuzzies. . .then today comes along and wonks me in the a**. Probably all my doing but I must vent, because I sure as hell did in the car today.<p>She called me on the cell to talk about our X-mas plans with family. After that was worked out, I asked her if she was doing anything NY Eve. She's got plans--going out with her new good single friend and about "20 or 25 people" to a bar to ring in the New Year while I have 9 y/o at home.<p>It set me off--I brought it up again then dropped it but after I got off the phone I ranted for the beter part of an hour. I feel like progress is being made and that this will have great results. I think that, although OM still calls her, that basically the A is smoldering. I am trying to believe that she is not seeing him, but we all know how excruciating it is to finally believe that. I will give her the benefit of the doubt.<p>What set me off was that here I am, reading Harley's books, coming up with my own self improvement skills, being emotionally/sexually/everything frustrated and from a casual observer's point of view, it appears that she's the one having fun. <p>
Admittedly, I am not the world's most patient individual. However, with an A that has lasted over 1 1/2 years, and a separation that is into its second month--that is pushing me to the limits of what I know as patience. <p>I guess I see the behavior of how she was before she moved out (partying, going out, doing whatever) and that makes me go ballistic. That is probably wrong, right??<p>Help--some of you guys have shown extreme patience. I AM VENTING!!!! RRROOOOAAAARRRRR!!!!<p>Thanks, GOD BLESS ALL, and HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!<p>Guido [img]images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/img]

Hi G,<p>Wow you did good up until the bad news. Let's work on that ok? <p>Figure she will do her best to be the worst ringing in the new year. What will your position be? Plan that ahead so that when it does happen you thinking will kick in to what you prepared for easier than reactionary rage. <p>I know you are upset and have the right to be but you also need to be prepared for these worse kind of situations. Oh.. after a few rounds of this you get to be kinda an expert in your own arena. Each time you wil improve bit by bit. <p>So for now, vent as you need. She is planning to do a stupid thing. You could tell her that her plans are hurtful to you and your children and that it is actually more hurtful than anything you have said or done. <p>JMHO for now.<p>Take Care,
L.

Orchid--thanks for the advice. W invited me out this evening to have dinner with her and S. I went, was actually happy she called. Midway through dinner, she borrows my phone to call her cell phone VM and then immediately has to go outside to her car to take some cold medicine. I'm thinking, yeah right. She comes in and I'm visibly not the picture of happy.<p>She asks what's wrong--I say who was so important that you had to go make a phone call. No one, I took some cold medicine. Besides, she says, her phone is in her purse. <p>So if that's the case, why borrow my cell phone to call your cell phone VM if it was in your purse. Not to mention the call detail will be available in two days. I know, I know, I fu**ed up LB BAD BOY, but I'm getting worn down.<p>Then I aked her if she had any thoughts or feedback as to where we were headed. NO. A few minutes passes, she asks what's the deal. I say well, how can you not have any opinion. She says she doesn't know if she wants to be single or be married. <p>Well, drop the freakin' bomb. I ask how the outcome is magically going to appear February 11(90 day time period)when it seems like she is and has enjoyed living the single life at my expense. Mind you, the past year, I've pretty much been the patron Saint of taking care of our S, getting him to practices, taking care of the house, the bills, painting--all the while she is carrying on with the jackhole lover of hers and all of her party friends. She was never home, always late, spent weekends out of town, at the lake, etc etc etc. While I did everything--and got treated like shi* in the process.<p>So, now, she doesn't know. . . maybe my impatient nature is showing, but that doesn't lead my in the warm and fuzzy department. She did say that at least she is spending time with me and calling me to do a few things.<p>I ended with a sincere apology--I told her I was sorry for the rant but that I don't want to be led along to then get my heart (what tiny molecular structure is left of it) ripped out. I also told her that I immensely enjoyed the time we have spent and that, although it is difficult, I am trying to believe that she is sincere about A being over.<p>Orchid, when the phone bill comes out and if I see the number appear, I'm really going to not know what to do. Her cell usage dropped big time, and I PRAY it's because she has stopped calling him, not because she either got another phone or a calling card. But the point remains, and this is my breaking point, is that if the A is still going strong, I really don't think I can physically and mentally take it. I will be forced to go Plan B all the way to save sanity.<p>Dammit. . . I love this woman, despite all the crap that's happened. How can she say she doesn't know if she wants to be married??? <p>Thanks, all, and Orchid, for listening and responding. These tear ducts of mine that haven't been used since I was a kid are working overtime and I'm not the emotional type.<p>Guido<p> [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img]

guido,
Did you observe that she recognize the changes in you ? from master of LB ?. You want to make sure that she see/convince your change before thinking about plan B. Have you shows that you could handle your outbursts ?, you know that WW is testing left and right to convince herself.
Happy Holiday, you have come a long way to this point.<p>[ December 24, 2001: Message edited by: redhat ]</p>

I gota jump in here.
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> What set me off was that here I am, reading Harley's books, coming up with my own self improvement skills, being emotionally/sexually/everything frustrated and from a casual observer's point of view, it appears that she's the one having fun. <hr></blockquote>Take a look at my thread. PlanA/Plan B - Need Suggestions, somewhere around page 5. <p>I was in the same boat. IT SUCKS!!! I have the same problem with the whole patients issue. I can't sit still and do nothing. I want to see progres.<p>Your eating, drinking, and sleeping this stuff to make your M work. This has become your world. You think MB is a solution that will make your M better than it has ever been.(So your right [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] )<p>She will see this. She's not going to drop any hints. She's not going to come out and tell you. She's not going to give you anything that might make you think it's working.<p>She is afraid that it's a temporary change, and she's not going to reattatch herself to the person/situation she has grown to be so uncomfortable with. She wants to know that this will last. (Ok, that's my W, but I think it's your too)<p>The bottom line:
Spend what time you can with her. Show her the changes you have made. She will see whats going on around her.<p>My hopes and prayers go with you. You are on, as they say, "the right track". <p>Thanks
Rev<p>[ December 24, 2001: Message edited by: rev ]</p>

Mornin G, <p>Glad to see you survived the evening and that some happy events happened. Yep they sure know how to twist our hearts..... <p>But if our hearts get ripped out?!?!? That's our own fault.... Get it!?!?!? So let's work on that. <p>ASAP go out and find the book "love must be tough" by Dr. James Dobson. Man, I have talked about his books and Dr. Harley's books soo much I should get a kick back?!?!? he he he [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Anyway, that book while giving common sense stuff, helps. It is a reminder. Actually we plan B other all the time but don't really care since our hearts are not intertwined as much. Think about that. Then realize that the woman out there in your W's body, claiming her identity is just as foreign to you and your family right now. With that in mind, prepare your defenses so that when the claws come out towards to rip out your heart (oooh how graphic)..... your defenses will already be prepared and you will survive. No matter what the 'alien' throws against you. In the end, you may be able to see your real W again. Til then, take care. <p>I think opinions from other guys would be a good thing. RH and others can give you better perspective. I am just a BS vensuian who knows how bad my kind can get. I am not proud of that reputation but I can at least warn you martian men!<p>Take your posts to GQII as well and see what responses you get. There are several guys in the same boat as you. You will draw strength from them and give the same in return. It does get better in the handling dept. That piece takes time. <p>I will be here to check in on you. K?<p>Take Care,
L.