Medic- I to are were you are now. did i really want her, or was it cause i couldnt have her, or was it just who she was with. I dont know. <P>I have decide to give up for now and let her do her thing. If it was ment to be it will happen. I cant let this eat me up.<P>When I was young, my mom gave me advice.<P>You said it like the toy you want so bad. My mom used t tell me " we will wait a couple of weeks, and if you still want it we will get it". I'm gonna use her advice again. Leave this alone for awhile and see if this is still what I want.<P>This may not help at all, but i hope it did.<BR><P>------------------<BR>brownphdt<P>

Medic,<P>Maybe it isn't the feelings you are hearing, so much, but rather the protection....<P>I didn't want to commit to spending Christmas with my husband. My girlfriend called and invited us over there for snowmobiling. I wasn't sure that I would rather stay home and cook Christmas dinner for our family, and my daughter/son in law/grandson. I couldn't even tell my girlfriend if I was coming or not on Christmas Eve.<P>I couldn't even tell my daughter if I was cooking on Christmas. My husband finally went out on Christmas and went to the convenience stores to get as much stuff put together as possible for a Christmas dinner. (My son in law had already sent a turkey home with me, and told me to put it in the frig to defrost....)<P>I mean, that is how non-committal I've been through all of this. I didn't even decorate the tree until after H, Son and I opened gifts Christmas morning. <P>I know what you mean, I can't even tell my son if my husband is going to the wedding in May (tux needs to be ordered.) <P>I am scared to death to put any more emotional investments into this relationship, as well as build any further memories.<P>But, I have to look at what is right, and not look at how I feel. Because chances are - my marriage will work out, and this all will be a faded memory in 5-7 years. I still maybe have another 35 years after the memories of this infidelity fades to make and enjoy memories.<P>It is a perspective, and we have to guard against protecting ourselves so much.<P>I think it is protection and walls and insulation that you are hearing, and it sounds like feelings, but it isn't. <P>tnt

Hey Paul,<P>Sorry to hear of the big D. I'm really wrestling with the idea of if I wanted her back because I love her or because someone else is interested in her. It seems we think alike.<P>I'm gonna sit on it too for a while till I get my head on straight.<P>And yes, you did help by just responding and showing you care.<P>Thanks Buddy.<P>Tim

Y'know ... I'm a singer. A pretty good one, too, and it isn't just me who says that - everyone who has heard me says it. I love to sing, and my dream growing up was to be a recording artist. Once, long ago, I had a very real opportunity to break into the professional music business. It's not a pretty business, as people can see from the number of alcohol and drug casualties that occur there. There's not much of a home life for people who must travel all over the world, live in hotels, eat take out all the time. But there is great emotional reward in singing one's heart out and hearing thunderous applause, whistling and cheering and KNOWING it is for you. And, let's face it, if you truly "hit it big," as all the people who've heard me sing seem to think I could STILL do (at 40 years old), it's a pretty financially rewarding field to be in, too.<P>But (you knew there was a "but" didn't you?)<P>I hemmed and hawed. I weighed the bad against the good. I WAS AFRAID TO DO IT. So, I passed up what probably was my only opportunity to live my dream. At the time, I was sure I'd made the right decision, because I didn't have to be afraid if I just stayed home and occasionally sang at weddings and school functions.<P>And now, I'm sorry I held back. I had the opportunity of a lifetime and I managed not only to let my fear disguise itself as "common sense," but to pass off the misgivings about the "lifestyle" as the real reason I held back - and in doing so, lost that opportunity. I can only kick myself, now. I may never have the same opportunity again.<P>This is a true story. I didn't make any of it up - I wish that some of it WAS BS, but it's not.<P>Medic, I think you know what I'm saying here.<P>------------------<BR>terri<BR>I believe in miracles...<P>

Tim,<P>whats up man? Think about this for a minute.<P>Everyone has said essentialy the same thing. Step back take it easy.<P>The way I see it is my old relationship is dead. My new marriage is going to have the new and improved Bill.<P>It is amazing that as the betrayed I can see how I virtualy sucked the life out of Robin.<BR>I have to expect that when the prize is in reach I may not want it, or feel like I don't want it.<P>Love is something you grow so kick back crack open a silver bullet relax and give youself time. This isn't a race to see who wins there S back. It's about the hope of renewing a commitment. Crack open another bullet and play with the box some more. Warm your feet back up alittle. Crack open another bullet...wait, aren't you on meds?<BR>Only two silver bullets. We don't want you winding up like that guy in that email I sent ya. Then again if you bail out now after all your effort you might wind up like that.<P>That was pretty digusting wasn't it. Thank my cousin for shareing that lovely snapshot.<P>Anyhow you get the drift of all our replies. Take it easy, and let it happen.<P>Remember:"It's not over till we say it's over! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? H*ll no!" Blutto...Animal House 1984<P>Bill<P><P>------------------<BR>BB<BR>

OK TNT,<P>Maybe, just maybe you have a point here. I was having a discussion with myself. It's alright all three of us were in attendance. Me, myself and I. <P>If I had the choice between tight underware and my W, I imagine Val would win. This is really getting tough. I like T backs.<P>I don't know what I'm thinking anymore.<P><BR>TERRI!<P>I think I got it. You know you guys don't make it any easier when you make sense. I would like nothing more than to find total happiness for the rest of my life.<P>I would like Val to be part of it. <P>Back to the drawing board.<P>Tim

<P>Now I can go to sleep happy.<P>------------------<BR>terri<BR>I believe in miracles...<P>

Hey Medic, <BR>I know exactly what you are going through. My H has been making baby steps towards us working things out. And for so long that is what I wanted. But at times, I'm just not sure. Without knowing it, I have made a new life for myself and our son. I have grown, and I don't know if that is what I want anymore. <BR>I wish I had some wonderful advice to give you, but all I can say is that you are not alone. I think this must be normal. Take is slow, see what happens, what developes. Part of it for me is that I am afraid of having my feelings slammed again. Keep an open mind and heart. They will lead you in the right direction.<P>------------------<BR>Lots of love,<BR>Viki<P><BR>

Tim, <BR>I believe many of us feel the way you do, and while you may have some special issues to deal with as suppressing your emotions, I believe that the bottom line is we think that if we reopen our hearts to them again, will they hurt us as they have in the past. I know for me, this has been one of the most gutwrenching experiences i have ever had. Why would I want to open myself back up to someone who has already shown me I can't trust them, he has already shown me a complete lack of care, etc.....the bottom line is that somewhere along the line, I also has issues in the marriage. And somewhere along the line, I loved this man passionately. I have a history, kids, plans and desires with him. I owe it to myself to open back up and try to recapture a new beginning and relationship with him. If the opportunity arises, I will take it slow, and right now my lovebank for him is dangerously low, so I know it will take time. But the love was once there, it can be recaptured. <P>------------------<BR>Susan<P><BR>

Tim, I'm going to tell you a story. <BR>WHen I was a teenager, me and my friends used to do alot of hiking back home.We used to have a lot of fun.<BR>One day we were hiking and we saw a statue that seemed to be almost hanging in the air, way up. ALl that area had a lot of quite old monuments and stuff, some older than 700 years. We kept walking, entered a rocky terrain, and went smack into a huge rock. There, right on the top was our statue.It was so high we couldn't see it well, but it was there.Our first thought was "it's there! let's climb!". So we did. Well the climb wasn't as easy as it looked.One by one some of our friends started giving up.I kept going, adrenaline pumping I wanted to get there so badly.When all of the other girls and some of the boys had given up, I felt an even biger boost "I'm the only girls that's going to make it!" Fighting for footing and safe places to put my hands and pull, I kept going.I was bruised from sliding down sometimes, my hands were bleeding,and had a pretty bad cut on my leg ( never do any of this when you're wearing shorts !)We finally got to the top. Three of us only, if I'm not mistaken. First we rested and looked at the scenery. It was beautifull. Then we looked at the statue... there was a tiny problem. We could see it alright, however the rock was split in to and the statue was on the other side of the gap.It was a small gap, nothing too difficult, and on the statue there was some writing that I wanted to check. My friends passed over easily, and there they were, touching it, looking at all the details. I froze before jumping.I had done all the difficult parts of the climb, some that looked impossible, and then suddenly I couldn't do a small jump. Thoughts like "I can see it perfectly from here" or "is it worth to jump?" kept coming. I wonder if I was afraid that after jumping I would realise all that effort hadn't been worth, or if I would be disapointed, or something. "maybe it's only a silly statue like many we've seen before..." I didn't jump, and up to today I regret it.I will never know for real what the statue was like and what the inscription said.<BR>Sometimes we do all the difficult things, and when it comes to the final "jump" we freeze.<BR>when my H's affair started, and while it seemed it would never end, I fought hard. When it seemed that things would never work out with us, I fought harder.When rebuilding really started... I had doubts.What if things would never really get better? What if I wasn't able to fulfill his needs the way he needed, or he wasn't able to fulfill mine?What would we do then? Would he have another afair?What if it was too late? What if all the fight had taken aways my love from him?WHat would happen when life threw us one of it's curves, will we close into ourselves and drift away from each other?<BR>This time I "Jumped" I didn't want to spend the rest of my life thinking about what was on the other side of the gap. <BR>And I'm quite happy I did jump! Things are as close to perfect as possible and have been for a year.<BR>Hang in there, Tim. I think I know how you're feeling, but give it a rest for a bit. Try to do pleasant things with w and the kids - with no pressure on, just for the fun of it - relax for a bit - it's needed too after all the emotional drain -, and them if you feel ready...jump!<BR>Take care<BR>Kat<P>------------------<BR>Each and everyone of us is deserving of a kind word, a gentle thought, and the gift of understanding.

medic:<P>If it makes you feel any better, the doubts that you are experiencing at this point in the recovery process are completely normal (and very predicitible). It's documented in SAA, and it certainly happened in my case. You've put so much effort into a goal that was "unreachable", that once it actually gets close, you question yourself...<P>tnt said it... just do what's right.<P>If you need motivation for this next part, give Steve Harley a call. He was a great help to me in dealing with these feelings and helping me understand the nature of these doubts. He'd be a great asset for your recovery!

Tim -- <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>If I had the choice between tight underware and my W, I imagine Val would win. This is really getting tough. I like T backs.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>This is the thing I love about you the most. No matter what is going on in your life, your sense of humor always comes out.<P>Man, just do what these people are saying. Don't try to get this worked out right this second. Back off a little. You have accomplished what you set out to do. You have Val interested in reconciling. Maybe what you are going thru is kind of an anti-climax because of your success. This kind of thing happens all thru your life's activities, right?? You work hard to accomplish something against stiff odds and once you are successful, you kind of lose interest in it for a while. But it <B>does</B> come back. Just give it some time.<P>Pullin' for ya, my friend...<P>--DeWayne--<BR>

hiya,<P>i posted a new string specifically for you, addressing this 'now i gotcha, get out of my life' thing we are experiencing..<P>hope it helps a bit<P>lizzipearl<P>------------------<BR><BR>"I have found the Pearl of Great Price"<BR>

OK, Tim,<P>Here is my little perspective. You have been working so hard on Val and getting short-circuited on every front. After a while you get tired and sorta just "give up" a little. Not throw the towel in - just retract and try to be her friend. Plan Medic, I believe it has been called.<P>So, you are doing Plan Medic, but also checking the world out..."just in case" you end up divorced. So, you went out a few times with your friend (girl) and talked to another old girlfriend, etc. <P>THEN< all of a sudden Val starts to notice you aren't pressuring her so much and you are being so darn NICE and CHARMING, and after all...who could resist Medic at his most charming?????? <P>So, now you think: OK< If I got back with Val, we would have to work hard...really hard to get back to a really loving and close relationship. Yet, if I just started over with someone else, they would be all over me like white on rice. In other words, the PAYBACK for your efforts would be MUCH GREATER initially. Up to now, there has barely been any payback for your efforts.<P>I wonder if this is some of your thinking?????<P>Why fight to re-establish this relationship when I can go and start fresh and have some chick thinking I am great and it will be so wonderful and she will be all over me with just a little effort!!!! Ah....BLISS! Oh....FANTASY!<P>As the betrayed, I want to make a general statement here. I think all of us without our S's focus so MUCH on just getting the betrayer to COME HOME. Then, if they do, we think we have WON the big prize! YIKES>>>>we forget that this is just the beginning of recovery. But, for those of us putting in so much overtime on this single thing, it is undaunting to think that is only the beginning and there is SO MUCH MORE hard work to do after that.<P>The bottom line is this: and only you can answer this question: You have been married twice so you know there is no perfect relationship out there just waiting to be discovered: Are you better off with Val in your life and the new Medic or not?? That is the only question you gotta answer. It WILL be different, Tim, because you are different and have learned and experienced so much. Do you want to start all over again with someone new and have to figure out what their emotional needs are and teach them what your emotional needs are and learn how to live with that person by trial and error, because really that is how it works????<P>Don't let the steep hill scare you off, friend...<P>Desiree<P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

Thanks to WilliamJ, Viki, Sue, Kat1, K, HP, POGP and RMA.<P>I really appreciate your responses. I have no clue what's going on in my mind. This is a totally new territory for me. She is within my reach.<P>I feel like I'm still on the roller coaster but we got stuck on the first hill. I don't know, the chain broke, the motor burned out or something. Things were looking up and now I'm at a stand still. <P>The fire department has been called to rescue us. It's a volunteer squad so it's going to take a little while. Here I sit trying to figure out what the hell is going on.<P>My FMD increased the dosage of Wellbutrin and I'm feeling really good. I don't believe that this has changed my thought patterns. Just got rid of the depression.<P>This situation is similar to my first marriage. We never wanted to try at the same time. I'm not interested in getting back together now and Val seems to be.<P>I have gone through phases before. Usually many times a day. The not giving a rats behind has been going on for well over a week. I don't think it's a phase.<P>Maybe someone or something is trying to tell me that it is not in my best interest to get back with Val.<P>I don't know if you guys saw my post a while back. I asked a dear close friend if she was happily married. She responded that she is happy and it doesn't matter if she is married or not. She married for love and not for happiness. Happiness comes from within. What a concept. That and she's a blonde.<P>I have found happiness in myself. Don't get any wierd ideas. I'm not like that! Do I need to be married? <P>I guess I'll hit the HOLD button. I'm not going anywhere soon.<P>Thanks again friends.<P>2000 will be OUR year.<P>Tim

Tim,<P>Put the picture back on your frige.<BR>While your there grab a bullet.<BR>Go through that photo album again.<BR>Try not to obsess on thinking you don't want her.<P>Take it easy. Spend some time with her it should come back.<P>Bill<P>------------------<BR>BB<BR>

Tim,<P>Forgive Val, every minute if necessary, get out your feelings, remorses and resentments and forgive her from your heart: for months you have been making love deposits following Dr. H's advise but have put your feelings in a sack, little by little, all the pain, Val's bad manners or apathy, etc. Now you don't feel anything or simply don't want to open the sack because it can be painful or the bag is too heavy.<P>I don't think you have to use your head and not your feelings, because the problem is you are not sure you FEEL love for her (love is also somewhere in that sack), but love is a conscious decision. You decide whom to love, so love her and, start all over again, begin a new relationship WITH Val.<P>I read somewhere that rebuilding the old relationship is 1, painful; 2, anti-healing; 3-anti-growth; 4- a waste of energy; 5- stupid and 6- irresistible. So what am I doing at MB & why am replying to your post? Because it is possible to build a NEW relationship with the same person- no problem can ever be solved with the same mentality that created the problem, so this new Tim meeting this new Val can create something new & great... the past doesn't matter. You two do.<P>(Plus give me a break… don't you feel lazy about starting the dating game again?)<P>Alex<P>------------------<BR>Live and learn