This is my first post. Briefly I've been married 11 years to a man that I felt was the salt of the earth- spiritual, loyal , and honest. He has always been a dedicated husband and father until October,2001. At that point, he began working longer hours,including weekends. He also had an increase in the number of out of town trips.
I didn't suspect anything until I was paying his cell phone bill in December. In a classic scenario, I noticed the bill was $300 and there were many 40 min calls late at night to an unfamiliar number. I was so shocked and (unfortunately) immediately confronted him. He denied any wrong doing and has continued to deny any EA or PA up to the present time. It turns out, the phone number is to a cell phone of a 28 yearold co-worker. (He is 44 and I am a still-attractive 43).
He did agree to counseling for about 3 months, but never really participated.He continues to deny any involvement with this coworker.
He announced in May that he was "suffocating" and "had to leave". We planned to tell our 8 yearold and 5 yearold the next night, but when he came home that night, he said he still loved me and was sorry that he hurt me and promised to work on repairing our M.
That lasted about 2 weeks....after a business trip to Europe, he came home and said again that he could no longer stay. He moved out June 30 and since then has been even more distant to me and our children.
I had instituted Plan A in March and switched to Plan B when he moved out, but I don't see any changes. In fact, there is a charge on our credit card for a reservation for a 2 night stay in a hotel in Las Vegas!
He is not talking at all about the relationship and has been reluctant to do so in the past. I'm ready to give up, but would love to hear ANY ideas/solutions/words of encouragement.

Dear PB:
This sounds like "deja vu" (same story) to me. My H used the same words. We only went for councelling twice but he didnt even try, I believe he went just so he could say that he tried and it didnt work. He really just wanted to leave the family and be with the OW. But there is a part of him that doesnt want to let me go. I just have so much trouble doing Plan B. I am working on it and getting there slowly.

I wouldnt suggest giving up but working on yourself. Learn to be strong, independant and love yourself. Try not to focus too much on him (that was my big mistake). A very strong Plan A is important I think but I realize now that actions speak louder than words so I try to better myself in every area I can. Keep reading in these sites here, there is a wealth of information here.

I truly feel your pain, you are on the right track. Prayer helps me a lot, Kim...

Dear Kim,
Thanks for the words of encouragement. I don't know how you've endured this for a year and a half! I'm trying hard to work on me, but it just seems so dark where I am. H came to pick up the kids today and wasn't wearing his wedding ring. That was so devastating!
I feel that he has NO interest at all in me or restoring our M. But I'm not sure what is worse- no hope or some interest but no moving forward.
Prayer and friends/family have been my salvation!

pb511,

Welcome to MB. Learn as much as you can about MB .... follows the General Welcome link.

Focus on plan A and have faith that many has travel this road ... either they saved their marriage or they moved on guilt free knowing that they had done anything within their power to save M.

Don't speculate on thing or try to make sense WS's behavior. Just look at their actions.

God Bless you. -RH-
<strong>Dear Kim,
Thanks for the words of encouragement. I don't know how you've endured this for a year and a half! I'm trying hard to work on me, but it just seems so dark where I am. H came to pick up the kids today and wasn't wearing his wedding ring. That was so devastating!
I feel that he has NO interest at all in me or restoring our M. But I'm not sure what is worse- no hope or some interest but no moving forward.
Prayer and friends/family have been my salvation!</strong>[/QUOTE]

Dear redhat,
Thank you for focusing the issue. It's hard for me to just accept that I can't change my WS's behavior. It's also hard to wait for any "crumb" that is dropped in my direction.
The tunnel seems long and dark- it's just hard to believe that couples can actually pull thru this and create a fufilling relationship when things are so bleak. I almost feel like he's doing his own kind of PLAN B, but one that is designed to continue to pull away.

pb511-

I have a very similar story too!! Hey, MF!! In a way, it's kinda funny that they are so unoriginal.

I gather that you are in Plan B because he moved out?? Are you aware you can Plan A even if they move out? I've had no choice but to do this with my WH. I can tell you that when I finally begged him to tell me the truth about the relationship, that that is when things turned around for me. I could finally deal with it. I could start working on the forgiveness, the anger, and the hurt. I have to remind myself every day of the actions/words that might result of the fog. That makes it a little (not much, but some) easier. Anyway, would you reconsider the Plan A again, for a little while? Or do you feel confident enough in the one you've already laid down?

Please keep posting.

Dear Brokenhearted-
It's so reassurring to know that there are others going thru what I am!
Part of my problem is that I may be doing a mixture Plan A/Plan B.
I try to be positive (with no relationship talk)whenever I am with him. If he calls- and it's only to talk to the children- if I answer, I am pleasant and try to end the conversation first.
My major frustration continues to be his denial of any EA/PA thru this whole thing. I have begged, pleaded, asked him directly, but he continues to say he is not involved with anone. This is even though I found a love letter from this particular co-worker.
I truly believe, if he would admit the A, we could then start to work on our M, but the longer this goes on, the more damage is done.

Yes, isnt it amazing how our stories are so similiar, ....... the lying, cheating, coldness, hearing "i dont love you anymore" "I have moved on".

I am sure even our pain feels the same, waking up at night hoping that all this is just a dream, all future dreams seem hopeless, feeling numb sometimes, wanting to know the right answer what to do, but we just take one day at at time, moving forward, we are here for one another, God bless, Kim...

Dear Kim,
I try to find the positives in all of this. This website has given me the support that family and friends can't give because they haven't been thru this. I keep thinking that these WSs must have their own website where the get "scripts" because their messages are so similar! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
The most painful thing for me now is that he's taken off his wedding ring. This to me says that his mind is made up and there is no hope for change.
Has anyone been this way and come back???

pb511, you are so right...i am beginning to think there is some sort of support group for WS's that gives them all tips on what to say and how to act when they have an A.

I am not one to give advice since I am only 3 weeks into my own ordeal...but I wouldnt put too much emphasis on the wedding ring. I would be willing to bet that altho he isnt wearing it...it still means something to him and he has put it away in a safe place. I truly hope things work out so he will decide the safest place for it is back on his finger.

I too was wondering if anyone actually is able to rebuild their relationship with a WS. The other nite I found a thread on this BB about it...several members who had posted here previously told stories of how they DID rebuild their relationships and were happier than ever.

It was pretty late since I couldnt sleep so I went net surfing (another fun and exciting side effect of this nightmare) so I cant remember where it was offhand. I will try to find it for you...it helped me gain a little more hope.

Here is the link to success stories...hope it works correctly:

web page

Dear wontgiveup,
The link worked and was very helpful. I think part of the problem is that once you succeed, you are probably less motivated to logon and participate here because you probably don't need the support.
PS. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> Can anyone explain what "giver snap" is?

PB:

If this is a duplicate, I apologize. My browser went whacky.

But, it is deja vu for me too. Many of us here, I think. My H and I are separated 4 months with a messy A he had because it was "fun" and I was "boring." They want their freedom, and feel "trapped."

The only thing I can suggest right now is to read read read and keep a positive mental attitude. It's really hard to do that. But, here's a few techniques that have helped me (and I'll admit, I'm made boocoo mistakes throughout all of this, and H is making big D sounds, but I'm blowing them off right now. He hasn't made a move.)

- Find some funny mental images. H is claiming he wants to trade in minivan for an MG. Now, he's 6'3" and couldn't fit behind the wheel of an MG. His knees would be at his chest, and he couldn't drive without top down. He's such a crabby and mean person right now that kids and I laugh about what a wonderful mood he'd be in when driving in that car when it snowed or rained. And we picture him driving kids to marching band practice in that car (imagine H, kids, tubas, flags, drums... in an MG!) with a bumper sticker that said "be kind to animals today and kiss a percussionist.

- Keep a reliable and close circle of confidants. Not EVERYONE in your family or all of your friends. Find those whom you can trust and rely on when you're really down and need an ear or a hand. Not those who will gossip. Not everyone needs to know the details, either. If someone needs to know that you're separated, keep it just to the facts they need to know. I have a few gossipy acquaintances, and while I can enjoy their company for lunch and such, they DON'T need to know the juicy and nasty details of the A. (And in my case it was REALLY messy. I have a thread in the General Q II somewhere about my saga, but don't have the link right now.)

- Find small things to celebrate or look forward to. That REALLY helps. Today, for me and our daughters, it is celebrating that TWO got their braces off and we get to eat corn on the cob tonight! It's summer, July, and the corn is ripe here where we're at. Kids have been hankering for it for sometime. It is a time when I can say "whew" because I also feel great: I paid off the ortho WITHOUT H's help. (Sense of accomplishment helps a lot!) Small celebration, I know. But, it is a positive step for ME too because of the enormity of that ortho bill and strained finances and given the fact it was caught up in four months, and when he left, the bill was behind almost a year. (He became really irresponsible with money. And, there's another legal saga in the background, too! But, that's another post, another story...)

- Finally, it helps me enormously to post. Especially when I am angry with H or feel sad/hurt. At least, it's a place to vent. I can also review my posts, others' posts, and information here and not feel so lonely and gather ideas. And there's a place to get feedback on ideas BEFORE acting on them.

Your H won't want to talk about your M. I don't know if he ever will, mine certainly doesn't seem to want to. We're in stalemate right now. But, to me, that's better than divorce court right now... we shall see what he does about the DIY divorce kit. But, I see a few small signs. He's agreeing to see/contact kids a bit more now. However, I barely notice them (at least, I don't give him many external signs that I do--I just say OK when he wants kids, stuff like that).

Good luck, I'll try to follow your posts and keep in touch.

Dear bluekeys,
Thanks SO MUCH for your post. It was extremely helpful to me. I was starting to feel abandoned by even this discussion forum! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />
Your strength really impresses me. I think that the longer your H stays, the more likely things will be in your favor.
My H's ice seems to be melting a bit. He has been abit more talkative and friendly during our limited interactions- although, I, too, am pretending not to notice...........
I'm trying to focus on the poitives and am certainly grateful for all that I still do have. My children are a tremendous source of love and support. Fortunately both of our families have been incredibly loving and supportive to me. I just have to stick out the fog.
One final note- I think your H should go for the MG- it's a heck of a lot less trouble than an OW!
Thanks again- I really needed your post.

PB:

You're welcome. Understand though that a lot of what I've said comes from hindsight and I'm just myself getting into the groove of this situation and learning that getting a grip on MYSELF is the key here <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

As for the MG, let him have it... you're right it's much less trouble than the OW <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I hope he gets a red one. I always wanted a candy apple red 64-1/2 Mustang myself! Now that I'm going further back into our prehistoric relationship times, I remember when I bought a Mustang off of my MIL. (It was one of those fastbacks with the HUGE 401 engines, 8 cylinder, and was the most fun car I ever had... even with TWO car seat crammed sin the back <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> ). H would spend HOURS in the drive with in on weekends just tinkering. He'd pop open a beer, head out, and then in minutes... all of the testosterone in the neighborhood would come running out to drool and help and just hang out. So, maybe the MG is a great idea???? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Keep in touch PB!

pb511,
"giver snap". In a relationship, there is a givers and takers ... we have to balance those ourself. Read giver&taker section on basic concept. Giver snap is when the most extreme taker shows up and leave no room to giver at all. It is very hard to battle this specially when there is still OP

-RH-

<small>[ July 19, 2002, 04:14 PM: Message edited by: redhat ]</small>

redhat,
You are an inspration. You really "get" this whole thing. I've seen other posts from you and they are always insightful.

To all-
It's a tough day today- the kids are with the H all day today and had them last evening, too. It's like adding insult to injury- now I need my children the most and he gets to take them out for fun activities! I'm trying to stay busy but it is tough.
I thought the ice was melting a bit, but our last 2 encounters have continued to be distant.
It's also hard to Plan B when you have to have contact because of visitation,etc.
I read the entire "Surviving an Affair" last night. It was very helpful, except there is not much info if you have a WS who still won't admit to the A!

PB...

Just checking in to see how you're doing.

Sounded kinda down in your last post... Keep us up to date with your situation. Each meeting with your H will be up and down, I think for a while.

Dear bluekeys,
Thanks for thinking of me.
It continues to be hard for me. I hae this whole situation and starting to feel anger creeping in again. It just seems so futile........I wonder why I continue to want to try to rebuild with someone who continues to hurt me and does not seem to care.
I've been reading the other posts and that has helped. I'm scheduling a consultation here to see what Dr. Harley's input is. When do you know to throw in the towel? I keep telling myself "it ain't over til it's over?"

PB... sorry, haven't checked in lately and the site was down over the weekend... grrrr....

I hate this situation too. Had another setback (really vicious argument with H about divorce... but I'm stepping back again because that argument was horrid). But another step forward. He came by voluntarily today to show off his new car. Not an MG, but a Jeep. (It's actually a pretty cool car, and we honestly got along for about an hour... like I said this stuff is SOOOO up and down.) I'm still considering myself whether to file and shake the pants off of him or to put an attorney on retainer to just ward him off if he does mess with the DIY thing (atty tells me he might as well put a bullseye on his back if he does... those DIY divorces are not easy to do for anyone w/o a legal background). So, I'm sitting here biding my time... and d*mn that's hard to do.

When to throw in towel? I'm the LAST person to know that one. I want this M to work. My H is actually a very decent person down deep inside and I truly do love the guy. I just detest what he's doing, and he's having this huge MLC. So it's day by day, and I made so many mistakes throughout all of this because of the stress of the situation. And I am having a hard time dealing with the resentment and anger... but slowly it's going away... my normal sense of humor's coming back as I work on MYSELF. And, that's a big part of the Part A/Part B (although I'm really in actuality doing neither... I'm working more with the Divorce Busting principles, but hang out here because there is still a wealth of info and support).

I guess it ain't over until YOU decide it's over. How long can you go and how much stamina do you have?

Someone also said:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">i am beginning to think there is some sort of support group for WS's that gives them all tips on what to say and how to act when they have an A. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">There is. There's a site called The Other Woman. I don't know the URL, maybe someone else does know it. Make me want to PUKE <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Let us know how your session went... keep posting... let's hear updates.