Okay, for anyone who wants to hear how bad you can LB read on. For those of you that don't, sorry probably not the right thread for you.

Quick version of my story:
H had EA/PA since 4/01 with secretary/office manager. He is her boss. We are moving Sept. 1 to get away from all of this. She is taking his position in the company when we leave. So for the last month and for the next month, my H is "training" her for the position. He is "in love" with her and I am just his best friend, so he will "work on our M for 3 months when we get to Utah, but we will probably not make it".

Now for the story... Last night, I called my H at about 5:30 PM and told him I wanted to spend some time just talking together, since we have been so busy over the last three weeks. He said he would be home in a couple of hours and I told him, "Just don't make it 9 o'clock, okay." Well, I guess to him that meant I can be home at 9. So by 9:05, I was distraut and sobbing. He gets home and says, "What's your freakin' problem? It's only 9:10!"

So after I compose myself some, I asked if he enjoyed making me worried and wondering what he was up to. He said that I was crazy and that he was home when I had told him to be. BLAH BLAH BLAH

Then, he was complaining about a guy who he also needed to train for his position (the OW and this guy are splitting up the duties). He was saying how this guy didn't deserve this opportunity, couldn't be trusted and lies a lot. I listened to this for about 15 minutes and then I just couldn't take it anymore....

I said and you think OW deserves this opportunity? All she is proving is that in this day and age, screwing the right person gets you ahead in life! He said that she has done plenty for the company to warrant this and I am just being a vendictive wife who can't see past the emotions of this. I told him to take the hate that he was feeling for this guy and times it by ten and then he might have a slight understanding of what I feel for this woman. I asked how many times that guy had lied to his face, and said that I couldn't possibily count all the lies she had told me.

Anyway, he kept defending her and I finally said, "if you want to defend your GIRLFRIEND, you can get the f@@k out of my house." He said, "I'm not leaving." So I would leave the room and for some reason, he kept following me and saying, "Let's try this again." And start a new topic of conversation, yet it always ended back with HER! First of all, my H has NEVER continued an arguement with me, if I walk away, then he lets it lie. No matter if I want him to come get me. So in a certain light, that part of it was good. Second, he did want to keep talking about something. I just wish it wouldn't have kept circling around what a "great" person she is.

I guess why I am posting is, how do I handle his blatent attempt to defend her "honor" in front of me? I do not know if my personality can just smile and take that!

In the end, before we went to bed, I told him that I was going to put my ring back on today, to symbolize my commitment to our M. He said okay, then I told him I would like for him to do the same, but I would understand if he could'nt yet. And this morning, his ring was gone...

I have no idea what that alien is thinking anymore! One minute he is sweet, the next he can only think of her! ARRGGG!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> Any advice here would be wonderful. I know that for me, one of the best therapies is writing all of this down. So thanks for reading a VERY long post!

Oh pq-- I hear your pain in what you're posting. My WH early on tried to defend the OW to me saying things like "she tried to end this", "you shouldn't be so harsh on her", etc.etc.

I spent the first month before I found MB lovebusting all over the place. Then, I read and read here and other books -- the three I recommend are SAA by Harley, After the Affair by Janis Abrams Spring, and Private Lies by ???. What I came to realize was that I had to stop focusing on what the OW did or did not do (and she did plenty believe me), but put all of my focus on my relationship with my WH and me. It is really hard. I have to see the OW from time to time and be as professional as I can. Now, in my head I think boy would I like to stand up in this meeting and announce "Hey y'all did you know that bimbette here is sleeping with my husband?" But I don't and I try to focus on something else.

It basically comes down to the fact that it's not the OW's fault really -- if it weren't her it would have been somebody else. They worked together and there was ample opportunity for her to meet his needs. Yes, OW made a bad decision to have a PA with a married man. Really stupid and completely devoid of integrity in my mind. However, it was ultimately my WH's choice.

I agree it's really frustrating when they defend the OW. What they are really doing is defending themselves and their choice to have an A.

You need to find a way to concentrate on something else so that you don't lovebust. It's really hard and is a struggle everyday, but I am seeing some improvements.

Keep working on it. You can do this because you care (which I know because you are here).

pq-

Sorry you had a bad night <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> Try to bite your tongue and vent to us. I know it's hard. You sound just like me before my WH moved out. I couldn't help but LB.

I do agree with unsureheart, don't focus on OW, if it wasn't her it would have been someone else. What are you doing to fix those things that contributed to making the A possible. Work on you. It helps me to remember that despite the pain I feel, the A might have been the best thing for me and my WH. Neither of us would have opened our eyes to the problems if the A didn't happen. Now I have the chance to fix those flaws in me and make our relationship better if my WH comes back. If not I'll be able to hold my head up high that I tried my best. The only person that you can change and control right now is YOU. We all have a lot of love to give. Let's hope all of our WS's realize it before they make the biggest mistake of their lives - letting us go. If not someone else will benefit from our improvements. I have way too much life left in me to think any other way

Hi, pq,

I've read a few of your posts and I'm very sorry for your pain. I asked my H to move out primarily bc I couldn't stop the LBs (yes, as harsh as yours). I was really starting to hate the person I've become - angry, bitter and vindictive. I needed the separation for my own sanity and self preservation.

I think if you can just make it through this training period you have some positive things working on your behalf. You are moving away and even if there's phone/email contact between your H and OW - you will be the only person at his side to meet his ENs. Have you filled out the questionaire and has he so you can become the expert at meeting them for him?

It's so hard to act as if this doesn't bother you, but can you do it for one hour at a time? Set your goals at an obtainable level. I printed out my Plan A goals then carried them with me. Whenever I felt the urge to vent at my H I read the piece of paper.

Above everything else... Breathe ~ Relax * Recover * Refocus * Regenerate!

Try not to be your own enemy - the LBs will only push your H towards the OW who is always dripping with kindness and smiles (it's part of the fantasy ya know)!

Good luck!

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

How are you doing?

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Hi!

I've been missing in action for awhile, but all is going okay. I wrote my H a letter one night after one of our "talks". This one was not really talking as much as screaming. And I told him I had decided to not focus on making US work and that I was probably trying to "fix" our marriage too soon. And that I couldn't do it alone and I didn't know if he was ready to work on it with me. Since then, it has calmed down a lot in our household. He has started telling me he loves me on the phone, and in person when I tell him I love him, he blows me a kiss. Doesn't sound like a lot when I am sitting here typing it, but it sure feels nice! Anyway, I am in Missouri for a week, and I am trying to not think about what he could be up to at home. I keep trying to remind myself that I can only change MY actions... I wish that statement was more comforting. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

pq,

Baby steps... one day at a time! I'm sure your mind is racing, but try to focus on these seemingly little things.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Thanks for the support Free! I am not feeling good about my marriage having any hope right now. Yesterday was our anniversary and we ended up talking four times, but there was no feeling to ANY of these conversations. Not even on my end! What does that mean? Anyway, I am having a great time here in Missouri with my friend, but at night my mind starts to race again and again... Ohh the joys of marriage!!!

PQ,
All I can say is hang in there. You have plenty of company here. I recognize myself in your situation and I finally had to do Plan B since I was so hurt and he was still contacting OW and lying about it. It was really going to kill me and I just didn't have any more reserves left. The halfhearted trying, "but don't think it is going to work" stuff might all be b/c of withdrawal. Until you both move, and no contact at all (!) he can not really begin true recovery.

I am personally hoping that my H can get through that period without the two of them continuing on. They don't live in the same state so this fantasy can go on for quite a while.

ajr: Can you give me any advice for the separation and working on yourself stuff? Mine began 8/4 and I am just reeling from one emotion to the next. I try to have faith that I will learn lessons and be a better person out of all of this, and then the horrible pain of rejection brings me down again. My H and I really do have so much going for us, can he just not see it or won't see it? Or am I really just so horrible to live with that it is too great a sacrifice for him?

Thanks!

Hi PQ, Hi Anne6263. I'm still here but haven't posted for a while. Sorry to use your space PQ but I wanted to respone to Anne. First off you are not horrible to live with. Other than that I do not know what to say right now.

On Tuesday, I hit that "I'm done" stage. Don't want anything to do with my WH and think maybe I should go right past Plan B and file. We have basically moved into a Plan B anyways. The thought of wasting another 2-3 years of my life wading through his fog. I have found myself fantisizing about the baseball players at the game I went to on Saturday and about a friend that has been flirting at work. I know scary stuff. If I get myself caught up in that I'm no better than my WH. Part of me just wants to say "scr@w this, it's time to move on. I'm better than all this and I deserve better". Sorry I couldn't be of more help I'm just not in the right frame of mind to give advice on how to stick it out right now.

Hi ALL!

I am back from my trip and I see that I have missed a few posts...

AJR,
Don't you ever worry about posting on my thread! Heavens, we have carried on conversations for weeks just between us! So what happened to make you think "I'm done"? Did you post this somewhere else and I missed it? I know that you are stronger than this! You can and will find the courage to keep trying to make it work. You are the one that gives me hope and strength when I need it, so I am not going to allow you to throw in the towel until I get the scoop!!! Besides it is probably my turn to be strong ! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Anne,

I haven't heard your story, but I can tell you that I hear from my WH how horrible of a person I am and how I should see that since he is still here, what sacrifices he is making. I think all of that is a CROCK! He might be using those words to make himself feel less guilt about doing something terribly wrong. It his only justification. So please, try to see past his fog and know that you must be a good person. You are willing to forgive him and work on your marriage and that is not easy! Sometimes when I feel like I have hit bottom, I bounce!!

Update...
Yesterday, I got home from Missouri. My H calls me to tell me that he has a meeting after work with the main boss that he has to go to. After some talking, come to find out that the "meeting" is at the bar and with the WHOLE company! This would include OW!!! So i get a little upset and get off the phone. Decide to call him back and ask if I can come. Remarkably, when he called me back, he just didn't have to go anymore. Then I start looking around the house and notice that he did NOTHING while I was gone! Not even one dish and I was out of town for 9 days!!! Let alone pack ANYTHING!! Here is the kicker... I had left him notes all over the house before I left, to remind him how much our daughter and myself loved him. There was atleast four of them WADDED up on the floor. And the rest were not even moved (like the one in the refigerator). And I lost it. I called up my friend who is moving with us and told her I was done. I needed to go to UT early so that I could find a job fast so I didn't have to rely on someone who thinks that I am a doormat! Needless to say, the phonetree started and my H called me screaming about how I was F@@king crazy and he could not deal with my irrational behavior and what did I want him to do, keep allthe little notes wrapped up with a big red bow! After much heated discussion, I told him to just go to the bar, that was apparently where he wanted to be instead of seeing his wife and kid that were gone for a week. To that, he told me that he wouldn't go no matter what now because the stress that it will cause isn't worth it. So he comes home and won't say a word to me! Works all night until 11 PM. Then comes in to sleep and I finally ask him what was going on. I know him and if he didn't want to have sex after I was gone for a week, then he was probably getting it somewhere else. Yeah I know, HUGE LB's goin' on that day!!! Needless to say, we ended up talking for some time and made up. He even told me how much he missed me while I was gone!
Then today rolls around, and I get another call about big boss wanting to go get a beer with him after work. So I said, "Go! Have a great time! I messed things up last night for you, so talk with him tonight!" Then at about 5PM he calls me to tell me that it will be him, the big boss, and OW!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> How nice! I said fine and tried to be calm. When I finally close to losing it, I told him I couldn't talk anymore that this was too hurtful. He told me over and over again, "Thank-you honey for understanding." But all I could think about all night was that he was out to some fancy restaurant with HER!! So when he came home, I couldn't even look at him. I just kept cleaning and packing. He tried to talk a bit and I told him that I wasn't in the right state of mind to talk. So at 10PM, he asked if I was ready for bed, I said yep. And in bed we went, and 5 mins later here I was on the computer. I can't sleep. I know that his is trying and he keeps telling me to remember this all goes away in 9 days. But does it? Does my worries and doubt of the truth magically disappear??? It s@cks so bad because I WANT to trust him, but I don't know if I ever will again. He also told me that he is not even thinking of working on us until we move. And that I give him twice the stress that his job does and he can't handle that much right now. How do people live through this???

SORRY about the long post, but you know me... long winded and eager to share! Thanks for listening! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

PQ-

Here's the story. We are essentially in Plan B. I have no desire to see WH at all. Don't answer the phone when he calls. I am happier and stronger than ever before. I have a theme song. I spent about 2 hours last night dancing with my dogs in the living room as I listened to "I Will Survive" by Gloria Gaynor over and over. In 5 months he has not shown any remorse, has never really said he wants to change his behavior, has not made any movements toward IC. I want a family and I refuse to WASTE another 2-3 years for him to grow up. My IC said that she thought she was meeting me for the first time yesterday. She said I had been flat, dead in previous appointments. Said I got my spirit back. She said I created a "fantasy lover" in order to move past my pain. Now I'm indifferent to my WH. She says that the male friend at work that touched my shoulder reminded me that I am lovable, visable, touchable. I therefore let him consume my mind to help push the pain from my WH indifference out of my mind. I finally realize that I would rather be alone than miserable and that I am going to be OK, I will love again. I feel that I am ready to move on. She said I used friend to help me realize that I love myself all completely in my mind and he probably has no idea. Not sure I WANT to find the courage to keep trying, instead I WANT to find the courage to move on. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Good for you AJR!! All I want is to see you happy! And I am glad that you have found what it is you want! Good luck! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Hi- don't know if you know me, but I recently started posting (bitterly complaining? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> ) on this great forum!

I, like I tell many here who inspire me, think you are STRONG and doing a great job. I am very much a novice to this MB, but have done a lot of reading on the forum and Dr. Harley's principles. Also ordered Surviving the Affair! In your post on the bottom it says something like WS is willing to work on marriage, but thinks it's a lost cause. I am pretty sure this statement is a COP-OUT. Doesn't sound like he is willing to invest very much in "trying". So I guess you have a lot of work to do still. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Anyway, I am glad to be here for you to vent to! I hope things get better for you in your marriage, but if they don't you are really learning some great things to take on with you!!

Welcome Libby!

I want to thank you for your kind words. I am getting very nervous about what it will be like after moving away. I definitely have some GOOD Plan Aing to do. I know that for about 3 months I did pretty good, but the last few have been full of landmines! I just read on GQII RamblinRose's post "Do you want to be right or do you want to be married". And I now realize that a lot of my problems are that I am a huge control freak! Not only in my marriage, but in other relationships. Especially with my daughter, 7 yrs. old. Does anyone know HOW to stop being controlling? Is there any books out there to help? I can now see that a lot of my H's problems with me is caused by this. That must be a big LB for him and I am surprised that it didn't come up on his LBQ!

I know that after the move, I need to stop focusing on the OW, but I am afaid that not knowing if he is in contact with her will take over my thoughts!!! Any suggestions on how to avoid this???

Last thought... Libby: you are SO RIGHT in that these principals are going to help me in my marriage, whether it be this one or a future one!!! Take Care! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Welcome Libby!!!

Hope your having a good week PQ!!!

I still come a read posts and want to encourage you to keep fighting as long as its what you want and that you always remember to LOVE yourself. You can make it to Utah and begin to work on your marriage. I might be singing a different tune if my husband ever indicated that he wanted to even try. His lack of any desire has left my Love bank null and void, thus the Plan B.

Just to give you an update PQ -- I got my hair done on Saturday. Pretty drastic. Cut off about 8 inches, got a highlight. Today at work EVERYONE commented on how good it looked. Several of the men in the office were stopped in their tracks and said "WOW!!! You look great!!!". One of the women told me she was thinking of coming over and telling me that I needed to stop changing and losing weight cause she was the only DIVA in the office. Made me feel great <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> Then I saw my WH this evening. Do you think he said WOW!! Hell no. He was all business for five minutes then said "you cut your hair" Then "its lighter" More business and then a flat "It looks good". I got to say that that made his love bank drop even further.

That's why I'm moving on with no expectation that he will come home. If he does, then it will be my turn to decide if I still want him. I'm amazed at how easy this Plan B has been. What does that mean???

Ajr,

Thank-you so much for always encouraging me and giving support to me! It is SO appreciated! Well it sounds to me like you have become a HOTTIE!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> You probably were one before, you just never knew it! You sound so confident and strong! You are such a great person, not matter what you decide to do. And I for one am very glad that you are still posting at this sight! Please keep me up to date on your life, I feel like we have a good connection! by the way, my H came in while I have been on the MB sight and kissed me good-night and told me thanks for all I did for him.(I haven't LBed for THREE whole days!) Are you impressed or what??? Take care Sweetie! I am goin' to bed while my H is still awake! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Cut off 8 inches!! Don't all men love long hair? I cut off my hair to impress a crush once and, sure, everybody stopped and looked at me, but it was in surprise then in admiration. They were like 'I knew you in the morning'.

PQ- Are you in the middle of your move? Haven't heard anything from you lately. I had a rough night. I thought I was off this roller coaster for good, now it looks like it may turn into an E ticket ride. You can find my post under GQII - I thought I was done...

Hey AJR!!

I am in the mist of finding a house, so I do not have a lot of access to a computer. Nor do I have much privacy or time. But I posted on you thread in GQII. I will update on how i am doing later! For now, take care!!!!