Hi Forum, I am 25 years old. I have been married for almost 6 years. me have no children. All we have right now is a lot of problems. I have tried to talk to my husband for the last 2 years about the lonliness and the emptiness feeling that I had. I had a nervous breakdown in June. THis was the second one since we have been married. He is a very munipulative man.I left him in Spetember because I had met someone who was going throught the same thing with his wife. He had tried and tried. He as well was on medication and etc. I have known this person for quite a while. I have just never payed much attention to him. He and i started talking and then before u know there we were. He left his wife the same time I had left my husband. I went back to my husband. Then he went back to his wife. <BR>Folks, This is so hard. I always said this would never happen to me. I know that affairs are wrong. The reason I came back was becasue I knew deep in my heart that is what GOD would want. Im in love with the new man. And it seems that im so confused right now. Here it is New Years and im with my husband. I had the most depressing Christmas that I had ever had in my life. I was not with the one that I wanted to be with. I cant wait to talk to the om Monday when he gets back to work. I need all your prayers! God is very dissappointed in me right now! <BR>Im in love with the im and I still love my husband! My husband doesnt understand the lonliness thing though!<BR>

Welcome <B>inamess</B> to the Marriage Builders - Infidelity Forum.<P>The people here represent both betrayed spouses and betrayers(waywards... this is "you") alike and the occasional Other Woman/Man/Person (OP/OW/OM).<BR><B>All</B> of us are really here to try and build or rebuild our marriages... and we are trying to use principles and concepts that are espoused by Dr. Willard Harley of Marriage Builders(MB).<P>First and foremost... you have to get the OM out of your life!!! You can tell where this site is heading... by our title... <B>Marriage Builders</B>!<P>There is a wealth of information here at this site, starting from the <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/" TARGET=_blank>Marriage Builder's Home Page</A>.<P>If you're new to the ideas being presented here at MB start off with <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3000_intro.html" TARGET=_blank>Dr. Harley's Basic Concepts</A>.<P>Many of us need to start immediately working on our marriages and a <B>sound</B> understanding of <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan A and Plan B</A> is crucial! Even as a wayward... think of starting yourself in a <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan A</A>.<P>You'll see a barrage of "terms" which you might guess the meaning of... but an alternative is to look up what they mean at this site... Words like (click on them to find out):<BR><A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3400_lovebust.html" TARGET=_blank>Love Busters</A>, <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3200_love.html" TARGET=_blank>Love Bank</A>, <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3300_needs.html" TARGET=_blank>Emotional Needs</A>, <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3550_give.html" TARGET=_blank>Giver and Taker</A>, <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3500_policy.html" TARGET=_blank>The Policy of Joint Agreement(POJA)</A>.<P>You'll need to learn more about, not just marriage building... but self building too! The learning isn't going to happen overnight though... look at the <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8100_article.html" TARGET=_blank>Articles</A> and <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5525_qa.html" TARGET=_blank>Infidelity Q&A</A>.<BR>The real learning is best aided by obtaining some of the books from the <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6000_bookstore.html" TARGET=_blank>MB Bookstore</A>... of most important for those who have affairs in progress, or soon to be, is <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6070_sa.html" TARGET=_blank>"Surviving An Affair"</A> by Dr. Willard Harley. <B>This is the 'bible' for this forum.</B><BR>Other books can be very useful as well... like <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6020_needs.html" TARGET=_blank>"His Needs, Her Needs"</A> and <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6030_love.html" TARGET=_blank>"Love Busters"</A>.<BR>There will be many other good books that the MB people will recommend... take their advice... they've been around.<P>Most of all... you will find <B>compassion</B> and <B>love</B> here. No judging... no demeaning... no malice here! Even as a betrayer!<BR>The people here have all had their lives thrown into a whirlwind of despair, confusion, and sadness.<BR>We've all experience gut wrenching emotions that we though could never exist, in anyone's idea of humanity.<BR>Feelings of hatred, love, disillusionment, envy, rejection, emptiness, <B>deep depression</B>, and on and on... This appplies equally to you and your husband!<P>Just the books and facts aren't going to get you through it all... not without <B>support</B>. That's where <B>we</B> come in! <B>We</B> care... because <B>we</B> know how it feels. Believe it... <B>You are <I>not</I> alone</B>! <BR>Come to this forum to vent... to cry... to laugh (a little)... to express your feelings... to advise others... or just to get away!<BR>You're probably going through H*!! right now... don't go it alone... remember... <B>you are <I>not</I> alone</B>! <P>We can give you help... to build back many vital aspects of your life and sanity. <P>Post... Post... Post... Reply... Reply... Reply... READ! READ! READ!<P>I've been speaking in behalf of some dear friends... as well as some complete strangers too..., when I've used <B>"we"</B>!<BR>But... if you're here... join in with them... they <B>will</B> join in with you. <B>We</B> do not always agree with each other on how to handle situations... but each of us is offering to you advice base on individual experiences. Search out those people on the forum that have experiences similar to yours... and ask... ask... ask! <P>Above all else... make a commitment to yourself to stop seeing the OM... until you've thoroughly read the bulk of informaton on this site! Please.... (when posting... ask for advice from other <B>waywards</B>!)<BR><B>Please!</B><P>Jim<BR>---------------------------------<BR>Where two or more are gathered...<p>[This message has been edited by NSR (edited January 01, 2000).]

imamess,<P>Welcome to our world of MB.<P>Thank you for your candid honesty.<BR>Believe it or not that is the starting point.<P>I'm not going to lecture on how destuctive infidelity is I imagine you already know.<P>Some things to think about;(3) - How do affairs begin?<BR>What are emotional meeds?<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Our most important emotional needs are those that make us feel the happiest and most satisfied whnever they are met. (page 29 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>When out most important emotional needs go unmet, we tend to feel somewhat empty and depressed. (page 30 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>The power of unmet emotional needs explains why people are willing to give up their spouses as well as their chilren, careers, and beliefs to have their emotional needs met. (page 31 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Affairs satisfy unmet emotional needs<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Regardless of where an affair falls on the affairs continuum, it exists because it meets important emotional needs. (page 32 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Love, a powerful emotion<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Love makes ending an affair extremely difficult (page 33 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>The love bank<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>This feeling of attraction to someone is the way our emotions encourage us to spend time with people who treat us well. (page 35 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>(4) - How do affairs usually end?<BR>A secret second life enables an affair to grow<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Wayward spouses do not necessarily have a history of lying, but their affair turns them into masters of deception. (page 40 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>How to keep a secret second life secret<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>"Stay out of my private life", "I'm disappointed you don't trust me", "I can't remember", "We're just friends", and "I just need some time away to think things through" (pages 40-44 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Privacy isn't something that improves marriages, It's honesty and openness that improves marriages. (page 41 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Since many affairs are with friends, it's often difficult to distinguish between an affair and an innocent friendship. (page 43 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>An affair is an illusion<BR>With separation comes reality<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Most affairs die a natural death. (page 50 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>(5) - How should affairs end?<BR>Total separation - The right way to end and affair<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Permanent separation not only helps prevent a renewal of the affair, but it is also a crucial gesture of consideration to the betrayed spouse. (page 55 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Without total separation, marital recovery is almost impossible. (page 56 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>An affair is a very powerful addiction. (page 56 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>How to tell a lover that the relationship is over (letter on page 58-59)<BR>Extraordinary precautions must be taken to guarantee separation...<BR><OL TYPE=1> <BR><LI> Changing jobs and relocating (Situation dependent)<BR><LI> Blocking all communication (phone, e-mail, pager, etc.)<BR><LI> Accounting for time<BR><LI> Accounting for money<BR><LI> Spending leisure time together<BR></OL><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Easy access to a former lover must be avoided at all costs. (page 60 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>A secret life depends not only on hidden time, but also on hidden money. (page 62 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>When there's less emotional attachment<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>The extraordinary precautions do more than end marriage-threatening affairs; they help a couple form the kind of relationship they always wanted. (page 65 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>(6) - Preparing for marital recovery<BR>Getting through withdrawal<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Marital recovery cannot begin until withdrawal has ended. (page 68 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>An affair offers no painless escape<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>The pain of total separation from a lover is great at first, but eventually comes to an end, and marital recovery can then begin. (page 70 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>The symptoms of withdrawal<BR>What about withdrawalafter a one-night stand?<BR>What if the Wayward spouse contacts the lover?<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>If there is a failure to totally separate from a lover, it usually means that the measures taken to guarantee separation are inadequate. (page 73 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><B>Any</B> contact with the OP by the wayward, sets the wayward's recovery time back to the beginning. (page 73 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>What if the wayward spouse doesn't want to totally separate from the lover?<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>While there is no hope for reconciliation when the affair is underway, as soon as the affair is ended, reconciliation is definitely possible. (page 74 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P><BR>I hope this helps.<P>Keep coming back.<P>Bill<BR><P>------------------<BR>BB<BR>

Bill,<BR>Thank you so much for your help. I dont get to see the om that often since he is married as well. I think the relationship is dying anyway. Now the hard part. What do i tell the om? And do i tell my husband about the other man? I have an appointment with a minister for counseling on Thurs. My husband is still a little leary of the counseling thing. But i think he will go. This is a start of a new year. We are going to sttend church tommorow. That was part of the deal when i left. but for some reason my husband does not like church. But this is my way of knowing. I want a christian family. I have a big need for church right now. How must i do about doing this? Thank you so much for your help. GOD BLESS!

inamess--<P>Jim and Bill's replies were wonderful. They are filled with helpful information about this website. (you guys are great!-thanks for taking the time to amass that info.)<P>Congrats on your hard work that you've already started. Hang in there, the road is rough but the rewards are many.<P>As to your last questions, I think you should tell OM that it's over. And MAKE it be over. It's up to you whether you decide to tell your H or not, but truly, without total honesty...you will still have problem areas in your relationship. If/when you tell him, be prepared for another rocky road depending on his reactions. <P>We're here for you. This website is remarkable in its valuable information and caring people who will listen, guide, and share. Vent here. <P>Your marriage is worth it!

Lucks,<BR>Thank you so much for you help. Should I tell the om on the phone or meet him or what? I am suppose to meet the other man saturday. I think i will tell him then. He is a greeat guy! He was very understanding when I came back home. However I would not leave him alone. So that was my fault. And as far as my husband. I think I will have to decide on taht one. THANKS! GOD BLESS!

Imamess,<P>I appreciated your post very much. It seems that til now I've been the only one here that was the infidel AND wants to reconcile. You might find help in reading the threads that I've started,(do a search of repenting) the people here are .... well nothing short of workers of God I think.<P>I won't replay my story here for you, again read the threads, but know that I am convinced that If I truely want reconciliation and not be exposed to risk again, she must know about my affair. That time is coming very soon, I'm with you. Lets hang together through that one.<P>God loves you and he is faithful and true, I have experienced an unbelievable amount of grace, by taking my broken spirit back to him for repair.<P>Read Psalm 51<P>We'll be talking, your doing the right thing.

repent,<BR>your in here with me. Im so glad that someone knows what im going through. I always said i would never have an affair but it happened. i have just prayed for God to show me signs of the right thing to do. I have this thing inside of me saying build your marriage. My heart is still with the other person. I have to tell the om that it is over tommorow. Should I tell him person or on the phone? This is gonna be so hard. But i will just pray hard for the strength and the courage. This is gonna kill my husband when i tell him. Any suggestions repent? What is your email address? My email is Rpstyle@aol.com. Mail me. youll be in my prayers!!!!!!!!!

I know exactly what you are going through! My prayers are with you. I however, am not one to be giving you advice, being that I am a Betrayer myself. I can only support you. Listen to the others and learn. Their oppinions are extremely helpful. Good luck!

lacee,<BR>where u going through the same thing? Im so hurt at telling the om tommorow. Can u help? Mail me at Rpstyle@aol.com

Inamess,<P>Some advice: If you want to work on your marriage will absolutely need to break all contact with the OM. Any new contact will start your withdrawl from all over again. Withdrawl by the way is what you are going through right now. It is very painful but will pass with time. <P>As for telling your H, the Harley's recommend being very honest with your spouse. It will hurt him terribly and it might even end the marriage, but it is nearly impossible to truely rebuild a marriage with this lie in the background. Why? There are several reasons, but the most obvious is that from now on your H will never really understand why you are down. He will never really know what you need because in order to avoid telling him about the affair you will need to avoid telling him other things. Finally, if he doesn't know about the affair he cannot make the changes necessary for you two to have a successful marriage. <P>I know it sounds easier to run and hide: get a divorce or keep the affair to ourself but eventually the lack of honesty will come and get you. You say you would like a Christian life style, but what you decide will determine how you will feel about yourself for the rest of your life. And if you spend the rest of your life punishing yourself for what you have done, you will also be punishing your H. He will never have a happy wife.<P>God Bless You and Your H<P>JL

Imamess,<P>My situation regarding the OW was perhaps a little different than yours in that our relationship was about sex for both us, mostly. What I mean is that the emotional attachment wasn't nearly as strong as someone who "fell in love" the got physical.<P>Regardless, I believe that you would be better off doing it over the phone, if you are truely committed to trying to make your marriage work. My reason is, that seeing him in person will make it much more difficult to do. There will be the natural feeling of wanting to hang on, from both sides and saying goodbye "for the last time" may be enough of an emotional pull to keep you from actually severing the relationship. Over the phone, you have more control of yourself, or at least can express more control.<P>Pray that the Holy Spirit will guide you and I know He will.<P>God bless you, your doing the right thing.

Hey MB Friends!<BR>I sat down and told H saturday. He was very hurt and very upset. He could not believe that I would do anything like that. Of course he is going through the gammit of emotions right now. He did tell that he did not want me to leave. Sunday was our big day. Our first day back in church and it was great. I was at the alter just as soon as they made the call. I feel so much better! I was touched my the masters hand yesterday. I have jumped that biggest hurdles. And I think this may have opened H eyes. He is willing to get into counseling and agreed to start on the MB stuff. This is a prayer answered. Thank you guys so much for all your support! Thank you for all the prayers!<BR>Now the big one is the withdrawal. Today is the first day that i will be able to contact the OM! Im not even calling him to tell him that it is over. I dont think he will bother calling me, since he is married as well. I thought about it and the wd process would start over. I havent had any contact with him since Wednesday. So ill let you know things went today. As for me and H, it is greeeat! Thank you all!!!!!<BR>

inamess--<P>I'm soooo glad you told your H. You did the right thing. Now you can both heal and work on the problems in your relationship, together!<P>Well done. <P>Laura

inamess,<P>I really am gad you told your H!!!<P>Now on to some hard work... (It isn't always the betrayed that has all the work... contrary to what you might read in the posts.)<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Permanent separation not only helps prevent a renewal of the affair, but it is also a crucial gesture of consideration to the betrayed spouse. (page 55 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>...and... <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Without total separation, marital recovery is almost impossible. (page 56 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Now for the ultimate benefit to your H... go for "telling the OM that the relationship is over" (letter on page 58-59 of <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6070_sa.html" TARGET=_blank>"Surviving An Affair"(SAA)</A>.) Write this <B>with your H</B>... get his concurrence on it... and have a third party (NOT YOU) deliver it to the OM! What a blessing you will be giving your H... the best first few steps of recovery!<P>Then definitely get into the <BR><B>Four rules to guide marital recovery...</B><BR><OL TYPE=1> <BR><LI> <B>The Rule of Protection:</B> Avoid being the cause of your spouse's unhappiness.<BR><LI> <B>The Rule of Care:</B> Meet your spouse's most important <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3300_needs.html" TARGET=_blank>Emotional Needs</A>.<BR><LI> <B>The Rule of Time:</B> Take time to give your spouse undivided attention.<BR><LI> <B>The Rule of Honesty:</B> Be totally open and honest with your spouse.<BR></OL><P>Good luck...<BR>Congratulations!<P>Jim

Okay guys! Thanks for all the dupport and prayers. I called the Om on the phone today and told him absolutely no contact, that I was rebuilding my marriage and I had a rocky road in front of me. He said he had thought about this weekend and he thought that was best. He wanted to make sure that H wouldnt tell Om w. WOW! Dont you know that marriage will last. I took his belongings that I had to his freind so I wouldnt have to see him. I was so proud of my self. Today at luch I was going to a restaurant and the OM was there. I didnt go in, I left! I was so proud! The OM said that was fine and he would let it die. For me not to call him or anything that way he could get over it! I told him that I told H and he was rather upset. He said WHY DID U DO THAT? I said " I wnat my marriage to work" I thought about it and it isnt worth losing my marriage. He said he honored that and He wished me the best. He said said he knew I was a special lady and he should have never taken advantage of the vulnerability I was in at the time. NOW THAT IS SCARY! But of course we didnt have a very serious relationship either! <BR>Next, I ahd the appointment with my counselor. She said she was proud fo the control that I had taken upon myself to get my life back in order. <BR>now the next thing is to get those cards paid off. I charged those up when I was in the lonely world hoping H would come home and stay with me. Shew! Do I have a great H or what? We have put each other through HELL!! Last year was when I really started showing myself. Now I owe about 35,000 in credit cards. Nothing is like having a family that is trying though! H didnt call the OM today or anything. H is a very private person. He isnt really the type to do that. But, I didnt know I mean that is a sour subject. Well guys! Your all in my prayers. Now I have to focus on my job, I have let it slide. Im anoutside sales rep for Chemicals. So I need to get that in order. YOU GUYS R THE BEST!!!!!!!!!<BR>XOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOX

Okay guys! Thanks for all the dupport and prayers. I called the Om on the phone today and told him absolutely no contact, that I was rebuilding my marriage and I had a rocky road in front of me. He said he had thought about this weekend and he thought that was best. He wanted to make sure that H wouldnt tell Om w. WOW! Dont you know that marriage will last. I took his belongings that I had to his freind so I wouldnt have to see him. I was so proud of my self. Today at luch I was going to a restaurant and the OM was there. I didnt go in, I left! I was so proud! The OM said that was fine and he would let it die. For me not to call him or anything that way he could get over it! I told him that I told H and he was rather upset. He said WHY DID U DO THAT? I said " I wnat my marriage to work" I thought about it and it isnt worth losing my marriage. He said he honored that and He wished me the best. He said said he knew I was a special lady and he should have never taken advantage of the vulnerability I was in at the time. NOW THAT IS SCARY! But of course we didnt have a very serious relationship either! <BR>Next, I ahd the appointment with my counselor. She said she was proud fo the control that I had taken upon myself to get my life back in order. <BR>now the next thing is to get those cards paid off. I charged those up when I was in the lonely world hoping H would come home and stay with me. Shew! Do I have a great H or what? We have put each other through HELL!! Last year was when I really started showing myself. Now I owe about 35,000 in credit cards. Nothing is like having a family that is trying though! H didnt call the OM today or anything. H is a very private person. He isnt really the type to do that. But, I didnt know I mean that is a sour subject. Well guys! Your all in my prayers. Now I have to focus on my job, I have let it slide. Im anoutside sales rep for Chemicals. So I need to get that in order. YOU GUYS R THE BEST!!!!!!!!!<BR>XOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOX