I am talking to SH. I will post it after.

Ok, just got off phone with SH. Is was very helpful and encouraging. It is long too. But I have to go pick up D now who has a dance party after school. I will post to you when I have time.

Talking to SH is fun... but it's not action.

I have a question for you, lostnhurt.

Are you here for shoulders to cry on, or are you here to learn the actions that you must take in order to change how your life and marriage are going?

L&H,

I am curious how the sessions with SH go? Do you come out with ideas of what to do, or reassurance of hope? I know all of our situations are different, but I'm curious as to how they go.

And how long did it take for you to get a session set up? Is there a long waiting list? Like I said, I'm seriously considering it, too.

Especially after the rollercoaster just took a big nosedive on me tonight (partly by my doing, most likely, for asking the wrong question at the wrong time).

It's too bad we all live so far away from each other. I think we could use a good hug from each other now and then.

LL

JustJ-

Please don't be so hard on lostnhurt. We are all at different stages in this pain. You are doing very well, but some are not. I was a complete walking disaster for the first 3 months after I found out.

Let's give our fellow BS's a break. Let them work through this like we did. I know you are an expert, but please remember how you felt when you just found out. Hugs to you, girl.

I agree with Believer.

I do come here for advice. I don't do the best following it, but it doesn't mean I don't want to.

However, I do also come here specifically for support (a shoulder to cry on, someone who understands my pain, etc), too. This is one place I feel like I can go and express myself and others will understand what I'm feeling, because they've been there in their own way. It's a tiny way we can share each others' burdens.

LL

<small>[ March 19, 2004, 09:05 PM: Message edited by: lordslady ]</small>

LL and lostnhurt -

Yes we are all here to share each others burdens. Some of us are further along than others. But we will all get through this together.

We have to believe that the Lord has a miracle for us. Although we can't see it right now, he is working on it. We are hopeless, have given up, are completely lost. But Jesus came for the sick and broken-hearted. No matter how bad it seems to us, he can redeem our marriages.

Ok, I finally have some time to post. But not all. First of all I want to thank all of you to be supportive and listening.

Believer and LL, you guys are great. Thank you for your confort.

Just J, thank you too. I know you are an expert. I come here for a shoulder to cry, which is extremely important to me. I also come here for advice. But I have to adopt the advice that is best to my own situation. I know your concern. Imagine if I take all the advice here and put them in action, what kind of results will I get, many of them are contraditing each other, that is why I am confused too. But keep giving me advice, someday it maybe useful. We don't know what is right or wrong now, only GOD know.

LL, it is not hard to get an appointment with SH. I called Thursaday, and got one on Friday. It was like that last few time. he did give me hope. I will post later on what he tell me to do.

I want to tell you that H and I had another talk last night. Given that this whole week he didn't go out at all. He was with us whole day today. My brother is coming over from Canada to take my mom over, I send her to half way, so the kids can meet each other too. So I invited him to come along. He said ok. So this morning, we all got up to go to Chinese school, after that we picked up my parents and drove to Canada. My brohter;s family and us met in a restraunt for about an hour, the kids had good time too, even though itwas short. Then we dropped my dad back to his appartment. After that, we went grocery shopping and just came back about an hour ago. Now he is taking S out to buy the paint for his car. BTW, H took half day off yesterday to be home with S, they shape the wood into a desired shape already. I took D to her piano lesson last night.

Last night, after kids went to bed, H was still in the office infront of computer. I came over and gave him a hug. He started out talk:

H: You really don't like I went overnight outside, right?
Me: Of course not.
H: Why?
Me: Because I love you, I want you to stay home.
H: It is boring to saty home, we have no cable(cable was cut last year b/c kids watch too much, I think I should reintstall it).
Me: You can have fun to be with the kids. Why don't you ask me what I like, instaed of what I don't like.
H: Ok, what do you like?
Me: I like the whole family to be together to do things. As long as we are together, I am happy.

H: It is very BORING.

Me: What kind of fun do you have when you go out?

H: I will go to the bar and watch TV.

Me: Do you think you will be happy like this for the rest of your life?

H: I don't know. But at least now.

Me: I know that you are not happy. Do you want both os us to be happy?(SH's technique)

H: Yeh.

Me: How about we go to some seminars to listen to others for that?

H: Ok.

Me: Then I am going to sign up one.

H: You can go by yourself and come back to teach me.

Me: It doesn't work that way. It takes two to be in a marriage.

H: I don't believe it.

Me: It is getting late. Let's go to bed.

H: Ok. (He was going to the guest room. I invited him over, he came)

H: This bed is really nice and confortable.

Me: Thanks.

H: We are in divorce, why do we sleep together?

Me: We are not. It is just your imagination.

H: It is ok not to have a D.

Me: ?

H: But you got to let me go out and don't ask.

Me: No, it doesn't work that way. This is something I can not tolerate.

H: I know you've been very nice to me these few months. I can feel it. But I don't know how long it can last. I feel that it is not from your heart.

Me: It is reasonable for you to feel that. Maybe I ignored you too much.

H: You don't have to work so hard. I know that I hurt you.

Me: Be nice nice to you is not hard at all. What is hard is that you leaving me. The things you did hurt me.

H: I am not so good, why do you still love me?

Me: I know you are good, that is why I love you.

H: I may do something hurting you. If not the kids, I 've been gone.

Me: I know, that is why I love you. I don't like something you did, but it doesn't mean I don't love you. Just like for the kids, I love them, but I don't always like the things they did. D is not good for the kids, not good for anyone around us. Let's find a way to make our M better, then everyone wins.

H: I don't know. Just for kids to put two incompatibel people togehter?

Me: We maybe incompatible. But we can work it out to be compatible.

H: It is hard.

Me: I agree. But we can work it out.

H:(Sigh)

We wer holding each other. I long for this affection long time. Then he said:

H: Are you sleep now? I can't sleep in my own bed. I have to go back to my pig stile.(don't know the spelling).

He is home. Talk to you guys later.

Sounds very promising. It is good that you can talk to him so calmly. Just keep it up, you are making progress.

It is nice that he is trying to spend some family time. I think I would get cable again. You can monitor the time the kids watch it. That way he knows that you are listening to him and trying to make him happy.

Believer, I think we are moving a little bit forward. We had another talk this morning. He agreed to go to the MB weekend seminar.

I will do my best. When I have time, I will post more about SH's suggestion and our talk too.

l&h - Thanks for clarifying why you come here.

believer - Thanks for the reminder to be gentle. I'm not, sometimes.

l&h - I hope my question didn't hurt you -- I honestly wanted to know why you were here. I see a lot of pain, lots and lots of it, in your situation. I don't like seeing people in pain and not doing anything about it. Most people don't have to suffer as long as they make themselves suffer.

I hope your husband can change. I hope you can change, too. I hope you can both change in ways that you can be happy together. There is a chance for that.

Oh, and I don't think of myself as an expert in this stuff. I speak well, and to the point. But if I were an expert, well, I'd be in a different place myself, I think.

JustJ - You know we love you. But some of us are a little slow getting it.

Also different cultures play into the problem. Lostnhurt is American-Chinese. I have read statistics between different cultures. People of Asian roots have a lot of trouble wondering if they are doing the right thing or not. They have traditions that are much different than the rest of us.

Lostnhurt is very brilliant - went to college early, but she still has problems being able to stand up to WH and make the right decision. Please bear with her.

Believer and Just J, thank you both. I know that Just J wants me to do things right too. But I have to weigh all the different methods in between. Only myself knows the situation better.

H and I had another long talk this morning. Even thught he is gone again now. He's been home for the whole week, he told me he will go the bar to watch basket ball game, which I don't believe. I told him to go with him, he just flet from the house. But I will have some time to post and talk to friends here.

Here is a brief of what Sh told me.

1. I am doing good for Plan A. He said that there are 3 side affect of a good plan A. Feel like a doormat, unfairness, enabling(A). I feel all of those.

2. Right now, M is the ist priority, A is sencondary. A is the symptom of a bleeding M.

3. Now I have to figure a way to give him the sense of hope that M can be recovered and better. I have to educate him, and stand firm on the point of looking the option for a better M.I need to repeat all these ideas over and over for the next couple weeks.

4. Seperation and Plan B are last resort for me. If all the aobe fail, then can consider PI and seperation. ut it is too early now. There is no use for the evidence.

5. As long as I do things that are not on my expensex, I should continue Plan A. I should address his unhappiness and depression while talking.

So in this mornings conversation, I followed along SH's idea. H still told me for moving out, I said again that he has his own choice, but I don't not want to. I said that I can't tie him with a rope, I am not strong enough, even with all 3 of us(kids). He laughed, also said that even I can hold his body, I can hold his heart. I knew that. Then I start talking about the option of having a happy M and going to seminar. He said that I can go by myself and tell him. I said that I read the books and website, I pretty much know the concept. he let me tell him about it. So I started my long lecturing about all the basic concepts, his needs her needs, love busters etc. I also told him about the examples in the books are exactly like where we are. He got intersted. I also told him the solution other than what we did. He seemed to be more interested. Finally, I told him that the seminar is in SF, CA, where his parents are. The kids can see grand parents. he said ok, go ahead to book the tickets. I told him that the tickets costs about $270 each. He said, if it works, he will pay even if it is $2700. I was so trilled.

Then we started talking about our feelings. What happened to us. I told him that he hurted me a lot of his recent behaviors. I aksed him whom he went with to the concert and dinner on the day of D's conference. He was so suprised. How did you know. I said it showed on the credit card. He said he went with a friend. I said who? I don't want to tell you. Is it a male or female. I cried. I said that it really hurts me, you should have gone to a concert with me, and you are still married, you went to concert and dinner with another woman. He said sorry, but I went to some with you. I told him that he hurt me. I also asked him if I did the same thing to him, like going out at nights, going to concert with OM, what he would do. He said, i would D, I don't understand why you still love me after I've done so much. I told him that I love him, I want this family, all the pros of staying married etc. he finally said again, so let's not get a D now. I said what do you mean? Not a D now, but a D a year later? He said I don't know.

Then he asked me losing how many pounds. I asked him to guess. He said somewhere between 10 and 20 lbs. But you look nice now. I told him that I couldn't sleep well now. He said you were not like this before. Do you know how many nights i want S, but you refused me and slept. I couldn't sleep, I had to go downstairs to sit in front of the computer, only come back at about 5am. Then you woke me up at 6. You never knew. I was really sorry to hear that. I told him that too. Then he said you need to go to church now, let's talk later. I invited him to go along, but he didn't want to. But at least he read a Christian news paper I placed by the toilet.

I was prasing GOD. I know I need keep my expectation low, but my faith on GOD high. Please keep me in your prayer.

L&H

You are doing good. This all sounds positive to me. Do all you can before you enter a Plan B, it is very painful in the beginning. I will keep you in my prayers.

NY

Ny, and all my friends,

I just book the tickets. We all going. Kids will stay with grand parents.

But I also read about the weekend. It requires a lot of follow up work and committments. I am afraid that he won't do it. But I will keep praying.

That sounds great. Even if he does not do the homework, at least he will be exposed to some new idea. Also the fact that he is talking to you so much is very hopeful.

I took it as positive sign. But I can't put too much hope to it. He is out again. Talk about addiction!

You seem to be doing much better though. I think he will start changing fairly soon. He has too much to lose.

He came home about 12:30am. But he didn't come to my room to brush his teeth and went straight to bed. I made some drinks for his cough and left a note for him in the kitchen. This morning, I found the note with his thank you, even though he didn't drink it.

I talked to him briefly, he said he was too tired last night. He said he will drink it this morning. I just said that I hope you come home earlier, it is not good for your health. Then I left.

I recall something happened on Saturday when we were in the resatraunt in Ca. We met a guy woh were in the same college about 20 years ago(H and I went to the same college in MI). This guy is also Chinese. But he was famous about A's. He was living with a lady while his wife was in China. Then later broke up with this W, and D with his W. Then many many more. On Sat, we saw him with a girl in 20's. So our Sunday morning's talk included that part. He said look at him, he is so free, changing GF all the time. I asked, do you like that life style? He said, no, but he is free.

I think that H really feel Trapped. How do I make him not feeling that? How do i make him not feel bored?

H just called and told me that my mom called and she wanted me to pick her up in Canada. I said what? He said, just kidding. But she called, and wanted you to call back.

I really feel that his sense of humor is coming back. He was so much fun before, and he lost of his sense of humor for these few months. I can see that it is a little like him now. We can talk calmly and peacefully now. I keep praying.