Awed,

Ok this is quick as i'm in the ofc right now. Just to let you know that I followed your apology statement almost to the letter and wow! what a positive response, he was nodding his head almost <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> like that but I also asked his patience and understanding during this difficult times. Oh it was great talking without LBs and later on we had great S!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

K will post later but shared your posts to me to Brokenhubby too.

Thks again and btw I just ordered the book by Page. Great lostnhurt u seem to be in great recovery i will pray for u too!!!

Hey out of curiosity do you have your original posts Awed? I don't know your story yet maybe you can share it with me one of these days? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />
Takecare and please don't get tired of responding <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> You know you're my inspiration!
BF

Awed,

Here's to you:

"I believe that friends are quiet angels who lift us to our feet when our wings have trouble remembering how to fly"

Thanks for all your help my little angel! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />
BF

blush...thank you! don't think I've been called an angel before... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

from lostnhurt:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I felt so proud of myself that I can be the leader in my M </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">from BF:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Oh it was great talking without LBs and later on we had great S!!! </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">just remember these moments guys...it is so important during recovery to remember and track the good stuff...it will be up and down for a long time yet...awed

I just needed to vent tonight so I don't LB him. We've been doing good for the last week and am very impressed with my own control and detachment. However there are still days that you thought would end up fine but didn't.

After our last sex which was this wknd he was telling me that we've broken off our little agreement of not having any kind of contact as in physical and even dating (which is all of his conditions til Apr. 1)....so am just riding along with what he says because I know he's not going to keep up what he's promised. Anyways, been trying to be seductive and attractive in bed so we can do it again but he's been spending too much time on his own (volleyball, errands, go to his buddy's place) which this week has really tested my resolve and so far I haven't buckled down or LB'd or even call him at all. He's the one who phones me to let me know where he is. In short he's shying away from the act but not on the affection side as he wants to see "if I will miss you" <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> ok whatever...

This afternoon got a VM on my cell at 4:30 saying that he's going to get to the phone stores and then watch the game with his buddy Mark for a few hrs then come hm. I said that's fine, whatever you want to do baby. Of course, I didn't believe he'd be hm by 9 PM so lo and behold he called me with lots of bkgrd noise saying he and his friend are in a party and he let me talked to his friend. Didn't understand much he just said they're in this bar and it was loud etc...bit pissed off there for awhile so called him back after 10 min. (he doesn't pick up when he's out) to say " Thanks for calling and letting your buddy to talk to me. I would appreciate if you guys would call me before you get into the bar so I can understand what you were saying. Have fun and do what you want to do "

I know there's a bit of LB there but I was getting tired of this game. The thing that hit me was during one of our light moments he'd brag that the OW and his frnd they get along etc...can't quote it well but that infuriated me and he took back his words and made some kind of excuse that he didn't mean it that way that bec. his buddy is kinda heavy that the OW will also like him too. (am petite, 5'5, size 4). But this thought haunts me right now and I know I am ready to LB but am trying to control my emotions right now before he comes hm which is probably around 1 - 1:30.

Talking about boundaries, tried to set this time limit with him everytime he'd be out with his friends and he'd be good for awhile and then slip up again. Anyways, I hope to God he's not with her, if he is I don't know how he can live with me and lie about it still (which I know is very typical) or he's getting very good at it.

Just this morning he told me he doesn't want to hurt me anymore he wants to make me happy and make things right for me...don't know what this means but he was promising to make life better for us. Why am i scared today that he's out with her? Because during their A, I noticed his frequency of going out too on Thurs along with Sat and excuse of sports on Sun after mass. So if he's getting sloppy again then good for me.

Need to pray for inner peace right now, it's 11:22 almost mdnght here in Chicago and am feeling something boiling up.

U know, I want to go out tom. night with some of my gfs and just call him from the cell and tell him " baby I don't think I'm cming straight home tnight feel like partying first. bye" <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

k need to breathe and take my tums and just detach. need ur prayers lostnhurt and awed!

I made it through the night without LBing. He came hm at 12:30 which is early to his standards and was very nice. He told me that his buddy Mark is celebrating bec. of his new business venture so there was reason for them to celebrate and showed me his new business card. Ok excuse taken so I just appeared enthusiastic.

Feeling better today and he's plans for us to go out tonight (he broke his NC with me this time he said couldn't do it he misses me so much) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />
k it's working guys...

Have a good wknd. Continue with controlling your emotions and pray for inner peace. Tough my friends esp for someone emotional like me but it's good for the R and your well being too. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

BF

good job on not LBing I have a tendancy to do that alot when my emotions get the best of me. Learning to control that is quite a challange.

Good for you BF!

When you can identify the problem (LBing) AND fix it, it really shows growth for you.

Congratulations! You're getting better everyday.

Stay strong, think clearly, improve yourself.

BH

Hi my dear friends,

Just an update: Haven't LB'd in almost 2 weeks now and because of this WS has been rethinking about his plan to move out and take a break on Apr. 1. He said he has been approved for his lease application and all he needs to do is show up at the apt on Thurs.

"Baby, it's up to you do what's best for you, what will make you happy and what you feel you deserve" and this I said with all sincerity and love.

Had no resentment whatsoever, I guess it will hurt on the day itself if ever but I am confident that whatever happens after that is in God's master plan for me. He said he doesn't want to do it anymore bec. we've gotten better over the last 2 weeks when previous to that we had such a huge fight and I wanted him to move out so I can stop hurting. Now he's very confused bec. he doesn't want to be away from me anymore but a little part of him is pulling him (hmnnn... could be our good buddy Satan). I told him " baby, let me know if you need help in packing ok, i'll help you" <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> hey, it is working my friends coz he said I've not decided yet, I don't want to do it. Then why did you sign the lease/application don't know which one? He goes coz I was mad at you and you at me and I thought that there is no more hope for us. Well, now you know that you don't make decisions when we're angry or emotional right? Yup baby...

So now we wait til Thursday, I have a feeling he won't do it but then again if he does I will still send him off with my love. Don't know if I will plan B or A i think I will stick with A since the OW is no longer in the picture I really believe.

Well, that's it folks keep your cool and love and don't give in to any LBs for a second or at anytime in your R or M. This is your only chance to get him back for good.

By the way, I went out with my dance friends and we had such a blast doing salsa and bachata. Will go again this Fri. Just feel a little guilty with my boy even if he's 16. WS said he's going out with the boys I said ok have fun baby. And then us on Sat. Ok we'll see.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Am having fun here BH and Awed because I chose to have fun with myself, put humor and some perspective in my life and this A. Am done with moping and crying time to relax and enjoy and just have fun...whatever may come.

Hey in parting I read that " We don't know what our future holds, but we know Who's holding it!" so this alone should be comforting to know. He's there, watching us always with his love.

Continue your prayers for all of us,
BF

Hi MBers,

It's now Apr1, Thur and this is the day that my partner has told me that he would move out few weeks ago. Last night while I was sleeping he kept pulling my face towards his to kiss me and told me "ILY" which he hasn't said since D-day and though sleepy i said Thk u me too. He said so many things while I was sleeping most of them I know were so sweet and endearing. So this morning he's the same sweet, and even saw me drive away while I was pulling out of the garage and I thought oh no maybe he's not here when I come hm.

But I think it will not happen. Why? because the LB devils have gotten tired of me and left me for good I hope although there are moments when I have to catch myself and bite my tongue and if ever there was some slight sarcasm (prob 1 instance) i would applogize right away. I've managed to always talk with him in a sweet and loving manner whether it's asking him if he's going out with the boys or what his plans are I've learned that this strategy can melt even the coldest of hearts and it WORKS!!!

So today I am happy that I'm seeing the results and he's whispered to me that 3 weeks ago he didn't think it would be possible to feel this away again towards me and our R has never been better. Awed my angel where r u? Just want to thk u fr the bottom of my heart and to tell u that I've gotten Page's book and it just reaffirms what you've told me that one can bring the two together by bringing in positive changes in their attitudes! Am just in ch. 1 but it's been great!
He saw it and ask me did u really order the book 4 us? And I said "yes because I believe in our R and I want to help us both achieve the kind of R we both wanted and desire. He kissed me so thoughtfully and appreciatively.

God is good Awed, and thks for listening and your great advices!
BF

I know this is not over yet but I'm seeing great progress that only can be had if I continue on the program and follow it to the letter along with Page's excellent book.

I'm here...I lurk...I post when I take a break from my crushing workload of the past few weeks...

you are doing so very well <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> ...I am so thrilled for YOU...this is not to minimize the happy, warm, snuggly, fuzzy feelings of good times with your F, but because it is a long road (ups and downs...ups and downs) I prefer to focus on YOU, and how you are doing...

I like to hear that you are getting a handle -- a long-term handle -- on yourself...

permit me to offer another suggestion: you've now learned a valuable lesson first-hand -- how hard it is to change a habit...you kept returning to your habit even though you knew it was hurting you, hurting the one you loved, hurting your deeply-cherished goals...

how crazy is that???

and yet you are not crazy, stupid, pig-headed, selfish, evil...you are human...

look -- FEEL...REMEMBER -- how hard it was for you to do this...to stop unhealthy, self-punishing behaviour...

remember this and apply this new-found knowledge to your F...he's trying to change many things, on so many levels...all the damage he's done to himself, you and your R with his unhealthy, self-punishing behaviours...

and in recovery, he still has it much worse than you...how could I possibly say that???

at the core, you always know that you are "right" you see...you know that you are doing something that brings you onto moral high ground but you already felt you were there for the most part because the A is inflicted on you...

whereas he feels like crap about himself...somewhere inside him, he knows this perfectly well...all WS do, although some have it buried so deep inside they cannot recognize even a tiny bit of this feeling!

use this new understanding to cut him slack, even when you don't feel like doing so, not one little bit! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> setbacks are inevitable too...highly unlikely he will not have some sort of setback...

this doesn't mean ignore or avoid confronting him with the setbacks (how you feel)...just NEVER revert to LBing again, and keep giving him love...it is really really hard to break bad habits, even if you know and understand how much they are hurting you...in addition to bad habit, we are talking about addiction too, which this applies to even more so...

your F is trying, I have absolutely no doubt about that...

finally: how wonderful that you got the book <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> ...you are the third person to tell me how helpful you are finding it...in particular, I think women can get so much out of it, changing our perspective and feeling empowered while doing so...

you have an awesome weekend...NO MATTER WHAT, keep the faith, stay positive, enjoy your life...you are worth it...awed

<small>[ April 02, 2004, 09:50 AM: Message edited by: awed18 ]</small>

Awed,

As usual thanks for the encouragement and support. I have to post today because I think my F has come to a decision to move out for 2 things. One bec. he signed the lease (short term 3 - mos) when we had a huge fight 3 weeks ago and now he couldn't back out of it bec they won't return the deposit, 2nd bec he still thinks that him being alone would make him realize that he can't live without me ever! See in our 5 years living tog. we haven't separated at all, he thinks that by taking this break it will make jolt him into action.

My F is a very "feeling" guy, he needs to feel first in order to act whereas I'm the exact opposite. I pointed this out to him that you can't decide on something like that "lease" when you're emotional but he thought that we were forever gone. He didn't expect his feelings for me to return (bec. I did a good Plan A - no control, LBs, etc.) so now he's more confused bec. he's got the apt and he can't back out but a part of him doesn't want to move out. He however feels that if he doesn't do this then he will have lost that chance to be alone and think things through.

I told him, go ahead baby if you think and feel this is going to be good for you. Your happiness is very important to me. But i'm not sure, do you think I'm making a mistake , and I nodded. In short, he can leave anytime now but his afraid to tell my S bec he fears it will crush him too. He loves my S very much and I said my S is a strong kid you just don't know.

I did tell him that when you leave I want a N/C so you can really experience not seeing me or talking to me. He said he knows he'll be back in a week. He wanted to "feel" that he can't go on without me so am I doing the right thing by doing a NC with him? There's a bit of a prob though bec. his office is in the house, told him u can come in the morning after I've left and you leave before i come hm? Think this will work?

I was sad yesterday and prob will be when I see him move out (in church he said "I can't do it" oh he's so confused!) but I have to be strong and stay calm bec. I have no control over these things. I've given it up to God and it's up to Him to work this out. It's out of my hands.

We'll see when he does make the move out. Awed, tried my very best and hope this is what he'll remember . I have no doubt though bec. he always says that I have given him and shown him what true love is all about.

Hanging in here,

BF

BF, I think that your attitude is good. Let GOD handle all these things. We human are too weak to that. Let's put out faith on GOD. I will pray for you.

BF:

sorry to hear the latest...actually I thought about NOT posting my last message because I realized you hadn't come back to say he had decided to stay after all... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

but you know, I re-read my post before adding it and thought: yeah...why not post it anyhow...because it is about YOU...and that is the most important thing to keep in mind...no matter what he does, the focus needs to remain on you...

as to him moving out and you going N/C, I am not a coach...I cannot advise you one way or the other except based on personal experience and observation...

I have LOADS of experience in the communications arena (in my professional life, not just here) and was the (former <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> ) queen of LBs which is why I can hit on target with most people, make effective suggestions, critique their communications accurately, etc.

but when it comes to a specific M-saving tactics like the intricacies of Plan B, that is where I normally suggest people call in the professionals...

have you considered a marriage coach? it is not that expensive and they can give you professional advice specifically oriented to saving your marriage...a plan of action for you to follow...I used Penny Tupy and can speak very highly of her skill and empathy...

you can e-mail me and I'll be happy to speak candidly to you...awed18@yahoo.ca...

in my non-professional opinion (given freely <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> ), I discourage anyone from openly encouraging your S to leave...and the experts seem to agree with me on this one even if other people here at MB seem to suggest that you should encourage your WS to leave if that is what they want to do...

remember that there are no professionals posting on these boards anymore...there are some people like myself who have skills and training (mine are in mediation/facilitation) that allow us to offer quasi-legitimate advice to others...and there are still a few mentors, people in training to be marriage coaches (although most have left here as well)...

so when you read the advice that suggests you support your S in leaving -- which I've seen posted many times here -- please keep in mind that's this is just one person's opinion...and while it may have worked in their particular case, it may not in yours...

the advantage a professional has is both training and experience...they've seen what works consistently, what needs to be tailored to a specific situation, or the same old same old (like a WS "script") that can reliably be discounted...

a long answer for sure...

short answer: staying, meeting needs, etc. is important and preferable

I'll let you in on a little secret Penny shared with me: TIME...that's the biggest thing, the most important way couples build intimacy...

hard to do that when he's out of the house...

that said, he's been on the fence for a while...cake-eaters need a sharp kick in the pants...

then again, he could truly be waffling...it is hard for someone in his shoes to make a decision...I know this first-hand from watching my WS go through it...

see? this is why a professional can advise you! I'll tell you now that Penny is a strong advocate for Plan B...but that has more to do with protecting you...she wouldn't advocate it as long as progress is being made...but I suspect that when he moves out, she'd support Plan B tactics...

these are educated guesses only though...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> He loves my S very much and I said my S is a strong kid you just don't know </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">actually, I would stress how hard it is for your S...at least I assume it will be hard...kids are not nearly as resilient as we assume...just because they are not breaking down does not mean they are not experiencing pain, confusion and often guilt that they do not, or cannot, articulate to you...

the whole point about kids is lack of stability these situations reflect...stability is what gives them security as adults...childhood stability is crucial...any break-up, while not his dad, is still likely to reverberate in his psyche...

as for what you say to WS, there is such a fine line between confident and clingy...

my own sense is to present confidence about the relationship and confidence that you know moving out and away from you is the wrong choice...not stating that but showing by your actions and words that this is your belief...

I don't believe this is clingy at all...hanging on his legs as he tries to leave...now THAT's clingy! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

but...and this is a big but...you know him best...you always need to factor in that knowledge...

last word: Plan B calls for professional input (in my opinion)...I always try to encourage people to seek help if they can afford it...doesn't have to cost an arm and a leg you know! but it gives you security at a scary time...

warning: Plan B is hard at first...especially given your increased love for him...if you do a wimpy Plan B, then you might as well not have done it...you need to see it as vital as Plan A (which you got downpat now grrrl! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> )

tell me or e-mail me if you want to discuss this further...I could write forever today...don't know what that's all about!

take care of yourself...awed

Awed,

Thks for responding right away, I think I might email you from work tom as I don't have much privacy and time at home.

I got home early today as I think I caught some viral headache but anyways, he took care of me let me go to sleep stayed with til I dozed off and I woke up to the aroma of his cooking. (btw, he and I are self-proclaimed gourmet cooks <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> which he's proud of and to me weighs in heavilybec. we're such a good team in the kitchen) and I heard him so busy at the kitchen below. During this time all I could think of was how lucky I was with this man though he's all this confused he still finds time to care for me and my S so when I came down I just hugged and told him how much I appreciated his cooking and can't wait to taste it. We had good dinner he was in a good mood talked about stocks and just watched fear factor and he's off to his buddy who lives a few miles from us to watch final four in basketball.

No talks of moving out just lots of affection and hugging. I don't know, he has that option to sleep in the other apt (no furniture yet as in bare) but he's not taking it so meanwhile am just going to put up a strong happy front and the best Plan A ever and yes I've told him that I didn't want him to move out. And next time we talk I will emphasize the impact of this to my S not to make him feel guilty but so he knows the effect which I believe he does that's why he's sluggish in his move. I don't see any packed luggages so knowing how he is undecisive I'm sure he's rethinking this 1000 times.

I hope u don't mind if I email you about Penny and all the details. I'm grateful for your availability Awed, you're Godsent!

L&H, thanks for the enouragement.

Am peaceful and calm still, no matter what I have conquered my greatest enemy, - my LBs! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I'll take this one day at a time! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />
Thks my friend,
BF