Just a couple of thoughts after reading some of the posts the past few days...

I think there is a time when separation might be helpful in some cases.

Paul said once , 'if the unbeliever leaves, let him leave...'

In my case, while my husband and I were living together it created a bit of a problem in that we were a house divided, spiritually. There were things that he was doing that were contrary to Gods will, and we all suffered as a result, to some extent.

I believe, in hindsight, that my husband needed to experience consequences for his way of life, but that while we were under the same roof, this was not possible as I know that God was caring for my needs , providing for me etc.

Once we were apart it seemed in no time at all he found himself destitute and alone, friendless. He has done some hard thinking these past few months.

It was not my decision for him to leave, but I didn't get in his way. I think this was important-that it was not me who initiated the separation- it was his own choice.

By the same token, the door is open when he chooses to come back, just as God welcomes us back when we ask.

Which brings me to forgiveness. I am finding that the greatest enemy of love for me right now is self-pity. I am having to guard against thoughts of anger, bitterness and suspicion. I am learning that the only way to deal with this is by choosing an attitute of forgivness. There is a good chance that my fears are unfounded, and if they are, an attitude of suspicion will only serve to cause a deeper rift between us.

As hard as it is at times, I think trust is a choice we can make. At worst, we will get hurt ,but we have all been hurt before, at best they is being truthful. It may be that they are confused about their feelings, but our love will win them over, if we are patient and steadfast.

I don't know why I felt compelled to share this stuff this morning, but there it is, at any rate.

I wish you all a blessed Easter.

Shul,
I needed to hear that, that's why you shared it.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Once we were apart it seemed in no time at all he found himself destitute and alone, friendless. He has done some hard thinking these past few months. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Same for my WH, except for the hard thinking part. It seems that he hasn't had time to think at all. If I know him, he will do all he can NOT to think about the real issue. So he keeps himself busy with work, sleep, vegatating, or keeping the kids.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> It was not my decision for him to leave, but I didn't get in his way. I think this was important-that it was not me who initiated the separation- it was his own choice. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Wasn't mine either. It was his.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> By the same token, the door is open when he chooses to come back, just as God welcomes us back when we ask. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">My problem is that he comes back at least once a week for sex or to spend time as a family. He has stayed the night almost one night every week since he's moved out. Even though I enjoy him and love him, I end up feeling used after he leaves.

He visits the kids at least 5x/week. I think this is a good thing but I don't think it shows the reality of a divorced or separated life.

I feel compelled to move on and get away from someone that doesn't know if they love me. He either does or he doesn't. I am selling the house because I can't afford to stay here by myself and I don't want to stay in the house where he left me. I am getting my own place for me and the kids. I am seriously considering calling my attorney tommorrow and scheduling an appt to file for divorce.

{{Movingon}}


I would caution you to give this arrangement a bit more time. It has only been a few months since he moved out. And it sounds like in some ways it is not such a bad arrangement. He comes over often, sees the kids often. It is an opportunity for you to fill his love bank, but some space for you both.

I am having a bad morning myself, was up early appraising my own situation.

I know you feel like giving him an ultimatum, I feel that way myself at times, but something is telling me to be patient.

I know that if I divorced my H I would be losing ground that I have gained. As it is I get to see him, it is a chance to be with him and love him, draw him back, whereas if I divorce him he might very well decide to throw in the towel and start over with someone else. ( He said to me a few months ago that it would be easier to start over fresh with someone new, and he is right in some ways- we have alot of water under the bridge, alot of rebuilding to do). In which case I would probably never see him, and I would be no farther ahead.

(In any case, initiating divorce is not an option for me, nor is remarriage, while he lives).

This situation is not perfect, I have needs that are not being met, but it could be worse, and there is hope for things to improve.

You spoke of feeling used- I am in the same boat in a sense, but I choose to give him love in this way, (and I get something back), it is pleasure for us both, and it is filling his needs.

Jesus said, we are to love our enemies, bless those who curse us, pray for those who despitefully use us. We are to return love for hate, treat others as we would want to be treated. This requires some sacrifice on our parts and it is not always easy, but it is the way of love.

It might not feel like there is much progress, but don't forget that God is at work in this situation too, and in your husbands heart. It may be that he is thinking of coming home even now.

When I start to feel discouraged I imagine that we have just met, that we are dating, and I am happy when he calls.

I have not rejected him, but I am not chasing him down either, or calling or making demands. So when he does call or come by it is because he wants to, and I do what I can to make it so nice for him that he will want to come back. It working. It might seem like he has his cake etc., but I think he is starting to miss me.

Our previous life together was not very happy for either of us, and I don't want to go back to that. We are relating to each other in different way now, more like friends and lovers, and that is building a bridge between us. But it takes time to build a bridge. Until there is a strong foundation I don't think it is safe to work on the issues that would come of living together.

It might not seem like you husband is doing any thinking, but trust me, he is. He might not show it, he might be trying not to think about it, but he most certainly is wondering. If you want to do something proactive, start praying for him, that God will sort him out. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Shul

Shul,
Thanks for the advice. It is wonderful. I am not a very patient person. It has been two months since he said he didn't know if he loved me. And his lies and cheating have been for the entire length of our relationship - 10 years. I feel that he hasn't given me a chance. He hasn't been faithful long enough to work on the marriage. When someone has been cheating for 10 yrs - what will make them stop? I am just so fed up. My life was innocent and sheltered until dday. I am so hurt by what he has done all he sees is my anger. He doesn't want to be with me in my anger. I don't want it to end. I want it to begin again. But I can't force him, and when he comes home to spend time with me and the kids, once he gets to close (or gets his needs met) he feels he should leave. Why? I am reading the power of a praying wife but I am to the point where I feel that we are only legally married now and that he really isn't my husband. I really am so close to D. And I have already made arrangements to sale the house. I have decided against calling the attorney today but tommorrow I may change my mind...

Shul,

I am exactly in your position. My SO moved his furnitures out last Thursday but he still physically stays with me every night because he said he misses me and he already realized it was a stupid thing to do. So when he's at home I give all the love and show him that he's going to miss what I have provided him and believe us Moving On that it works!

Now I'm not sure about the 10yr cheating i think it will be double the efforts and trust in God and yourself. That's a tough call only you can know what will work for you.
God bless!
BF

MO,

You were asking what will make them stop the lying-

I think they have to get tired of it on thier own. It takes alot of energy to lie.

Even if it has been 10 years or 20, you won't be able to go forward until you forgive him for the lying. All the past stuff. I am finding out that when I do , I start to heal from the hurts and memories. But if I don't, those memories get in the way of the present efforts to love.

The other thing is dealing with mistrust. I have thought alot about this, the consequences. If I insist for example of knowing every move he makes, I will just drive him away, and he could lie anyway, how would I know. Eventually the truth has a way of coming out anyway. And if he is lying, it doesn't change anything for me, except if I know it will make it harder for me to be around him and be loving. At some point there will be a time for clearing the air perhaps, but not until things are stronger and he is really wanting a commitment with me.

In the end, I think it is wiser to take him at face value, and keep my fears to myself.

I would make no mention of attorneys to him at present. Give him time to sort himself out, and be as loving as you would be if he had never hurt you. Forgetting comes with forgiving. If I cancel a debt, I don't keep bringing it up, yes?

You also mentioned that he gets close and leaves- this too I have seen. He may be afraid to trust you, your loving ways, waiting for the shoe to drop, afraid of trusting you and then being rejected. He knows he has hurt you. I have been trying to reassure my husband in subtle ways that I am still his, that I want him, no matter what has gone on in the past. I have told him that I have forgiven him, and I don't know if he believes it, it is hard to believe isn't it? But my actions are lining up with my words. It will take time to reinforce this message, to be consistantly loving.

Shul

Yes, I definitely have trouble with the consistency part and patience has never been my best attribute. I am amazed that I stayed with him after I found out the first time. Now I can't believe that I still want him. It's got to be love. It just doesn't go away cause somebody hurts you, it only makes it hurt worse I think. I go back and forth with wanting to forgive and move on with him then getting fed up at him pulling away and actually wanting to be apart. I just can't believe this is the same man that covered up infidelity for 8 yrs because he was so afraid I would leave him. Now he can't stand to be around me for 24 hours even though I am nice to him the whole time he is here and there is no fighting. I only get mad when he leaves or is wanting to leave.

Yes, it used to really bother me when mine would leave. Sometimes he would be in a rush to go, when I knew he didn't have any place to be.

But I have a theory. I think it is a fear of being trapped .

So now I just smile and tell him how much I enjoyed being with him, and say good bye.

I never ask him to call or when he is coming back.
I think of myself as his mistress at those times. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Shul

Shul,
Your post made me smile BUT....I don't want to be his mistress. I want to be his wife and a family with our two little babies!
I did read something that says this has to quit being what "I want" and start agreeing with what "he wants". It's all about giving I guess. Also, what is the saying, if you love something, let it go, if it comes back to you you know it was yours to begin with?

Yes, I want to share my life with my husband too, to have a committed monogamous relationship, for life. I want that so bad it hurts.

But the only way to steal his heart is to love him, to be his friend, to support him, to give and not demand or expect anything back.

The loving him part is easy, putting aside my own desires is hard. Responding to rejection with love is hard.

But as a wise friend said to me once,

"I don't see any nails in the palms of your hands yet."

We can do this.

Just in case anyone is feeling discouraged tonight, there is hope.

I don't know what plan I am on, maybe plan C, lol, but I am seeing progress.

Tonight my husband and I were sitting in the car, out of the blue, he closed his eyes and said,
" Man, have I ever made a mess of my life!"

God is definitely at work!

Shul

Shul and Moving On, I wish I had some of the loyalty and patients you two are showing with your plan B. I love my wife and have the faith that God can change her but, I know God wants us all to not have to depend on the sinners for our self worth. Do not give up you body in that the spirit lives to someone who does not cherish it and is faithful to you. My wife has not moved out yet but is only with me for the children. She is an unbeliever and does not take to heart the marriage Vows we shared before God. My wife and I will be spending this weekend alone together but, if I feel that she will not be a very cheerful person and is looking foward to it I cannot let her go with him and look in the mirror and be happy and joyful as God wants me to be. I will fogive her but there has to be true repentance not just same old same old. Stop the back and forth and give him the choice because if he can have his cake and eat it to he will. His choice not Gods.

Shad,

You have an opportunity to simply love this person, and be a friend to her, to show her unconditional love.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I will forgive her but... </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Unconditional means there are no 'buts'.

Forgive as you have been forgiven.