I feel like a doormat. How can this snap her back into reality?? It simply doesn't make sense to me. It seems that the nicer I am to her, the more she backs away. If I tell her that I am giving up, she asks me not to and is nice. I have a tough time believing that this is reality. I feel that she only wants me to be nice to her so the divorce isn't angry, that she is merely buying time until we just agree to divorce and be friends. We live in separate houses and she still talks to him daily, even though she told me she hasn't seen him in over a week.

Very confused!!!!

Have any of you felt this way? How did you deal with the ups and downs? How long should the negotiations go on? What about living together again?

Going through the same. Yes, it pissed my wife off too. But I think it pisses them off b/c they think you are doing it just to get what you want (a form of control). I am still not sure how to get around it, but I think that only lasts for awhile. It makes them feel bad and conflicted, if they have any conscience.

But my guess is that the hostility it generates doesn't last for 6 months.

Right, she tells me that I am selfish and I only think about what I want instead of being respectful about her decision...

Not only that, but it is obvious by it's vary nature that she doesn't respect me, how the heck am I supposed to regain respect when I am nice to her while she continues to betray me and refuse our marriage?!?!

Well, Plan A is meant for both of you to be living together. WS cannot see the changes you are going through if you're not in the same house. I have heard of doing Plan A while separated, but I'm not an expert at it.

Also, when you are in the same house, you can see glimpses of the person you married and it gives you hope to continue Plan A.

Not sure what you guys should do in your case. But if it were me, I would write the most romantic Plan Be letter ever and go dark.

go to the General Questions section.

Do a search on posts by Justahusband, Ark, Bob Pure, TDVA and others.

You'll find we are all struggling with Plan A. Understand that you do Plan A with the expectation of nothing in return and that is a good start

Hi Thatsall and Snoopwell !

I understand your concerns. I have had something of a 'microwave' plan A in the last three months so I have the luxury of the logic of it all falling into place pretty quickly ( although it didn't seem that way).
Old heads please swat me : this is Bob opinion !

* Your instinct as a BS is to be angry, indignant, sad, fearful, reactionary etc and no-one could blame you. However actions supporting these emotions will REINFORCE the fantasy in your WS warped mind that you are a worse bet as a life partner than the OP and that the A was justified.

* You may feel 'better' by venting, doing the vengeance dance etc, but this will almost certainly fatally break your relationship.

* Plan A is a carefully calculated response to the fact of an affair that recognises the strengths and weaknesses of the BS position at this time, and who wants to save their M. It is NOT instinctive, in fact it is counter-intuitive, but it works if adhered to. To use MaddyKs analogy :scratching poison ivy rash feels SO GOOD but causes nothing but grief. Instinct does not always help in complex situations.

* FACT a BS cannot directly stop an affair unless they kill or kidnap one or both infidels, and thats not usually recommended by MC <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

* FACT NEITHER is a BS as helpless as they think they are, and has an armoury of weapons to use. Plan A bundles these for use in a proven strategy.

* Plan A recognises the uncomfortable reality that although the BS is IN NO WAY responsible for the A and that an A is NEVER JUSTIFIED or OK the BS HAS contributed to the marital environment being ripe for an A. This is a major thing to choke down for most BS ( it was for me!) , but its also a major enabler to recovery. Once you know what broke in YOU you can start fixing it.

* Using tools such as exposure the affairs bindings can be exposed to the light. Typically A's only make sense in a by-the-hour highway motel for two hours at a time when only the lying infidels listen to each others fog drivel and 'lets pretend' sex. Exposure to OPs significant other, and carefully targeted family and friends and colleagues forces this shaky, sex-justfying bag of fluff to the scrutiny of the real world. In MOST cases, the bindings disappear like vampires in the sun leaving the infidels 'love affair' looking like the tawdry, cowardly alternative to fixing a flagging marriage that it truly is.
And YES exposing is counter intuitive too, but it WORKS !! see now ?

* So when the A is exposed as a shabby thing, Plan A also makes sure that you, the BS have ALREADY and PROACTIVELY recognised the failings in your behaviour and demeanour that led to the marriage flagging and made a start at fixing them. You have also patently disarmed your WS by not being violent, disrespectful, unforgiving nor any of the other things that they expected and FEARED you would be. In fact you raised your game SIGNIFICANTLY as spouse material and they begin to notice it, really.

* WSs fear that with the death of the A, they have no safe place to go, not the OP and certainly not home to face the judgment and wrath of the BS they have hurt do much....except the BS has done everything possible to provide a place of calm safety for the WS to return to. My own FWW thought it was a trick! She couldn't believe the loving and non-hudgmental "nest" I'd made for her when she felt she deserved it so little...through Plan A I'm a better Dad than I've been in years, a better listener and more thoughtful of my FWWs needs. Plus MUCH slimmer, fitter and more buff ( GgrrrrOOOWWWLLLLL ! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> )

* SOME A's bindings are stronger than others and SOME WSs find it harder than others to return home, so plan A may not always work at killing the A and providing a sanctuary for the WS to recover in. Thats when plan B kicks in. Plan B REMOVES the sanctuary , love , forgiveness and support so carefully built and demonstrated in PLAN A from the WS. You do a good plan A and you will be REALLY missed, while OM looks everyday more like the unreliable, lying betrayers they always are.

* See how it works ? By choosing to lay down your righteous indignation in plan A you are in NO WAY a doormat any more than spying for the Allies made brave intelligence folks in WW2 Nazis. You are bravely and deliberately overruling your primal instinct in support of the marriage God gave you and you gave to God and each other.

* STUDY(not just read) SAA, HN/HN , this site, the old heads stories and become aware of the dynamics of affairs. Deconstruct your own situation and apply the principles to it. Knowledge is power. Understand that affairs are JUST LIKE medical conditions, the symptoms, prognosis and cure are all utterly predictable in most cases. Your sitch feels unique BUT IT AIN'T ! THIS STUFF HAS WORKED FOR THOUSANDS OF COUPLES IN EXACTLY YOUR SITCH !

* Finally I have said before that Plan A is a heroes gig and I still think so. For a 'silverback' like me the easy way is to go crashing around hitting people , suing people and making lives bad. Instinct isn't bravery.

Bravery is doing what is needed, however uncomfortable, frightening and counter-instuitive to rebuild a stable loving platform for all involved in the mess of an affair.

Even if Plan A and Plan B doesn't recover your M , it will leave you a much more "examined" person able to move on in life and not repeat the errors that contributed to the problems in the M.


I hope I have helped explain my take on Plan A. And to close, Plan A has worked UP THE WAZOO for us so far so I'm not talking theory.

All blessings folks.

<small>[ September 18, 2004, 03:19 AM: Message edited by: Bob Pure ]</small>

Bob has done a marvelous job of describing Plan A and how it can, and will, work for you. You've got to believe in it, and carry it out without but a few stumbles.

The only thing I'd really like to add pertains to the fog a WS lives in and how ugly they can be to the BS while they dwell in this cantankerous fog.

One of the most important components of Plan A is teaching yourself to EMOTIONALLY DETACH from your spouse while he/she is in fogland. It truly is NOT your spouse speaking. It is an intellectually disabled person who does not even resemble anyone you have ever known. Lies, mistruths, rude thoughless remarks that can lay your chest open and immerse your heart in acid.

This is what you emotionally detach from. Make it a game, disregard all of what they say, so you can protect your love for them.

Learning to do this enables you to do a stellar Plan A, which is critical in ending the affair, so you can begin recovery with your WS.

Lastly, Part of Plan A is EXPOSURE. It must be done and it must be done correctly. Read about HOW to EXPOSE through the links on this website. Failure to expose is condoning the affair and your WS's participation in it.

Plan A coupled with EXPOSURE will end most affairs!

SD

So, she tells me that she loves me. She hugs me and we spend a little time together. Sometimes we talk about nothing and sometimes we talk about us.

Two nights ago, she came over to my place and cried while I held her. We didn't say much, she just fell to sleep. I went over her house last night to drop off flowers. She was the wife I know and love. At one point, she said that I should buy her a ruby (while in my trip to Korea) and aask her to marry me again... WHAT?!?! She said that she was sorry for hurting me and that her words and actions continue to hurt me. She said that she knows that I am a good man and will be a good husband to her or someone else. We hugged and she kissed me for the first time in months. It wasn't passionate and it was weird.

She told me that she is still talking with him. We are still living separately. I don't know what to do. What would Plan A tell me to do? Should I continue to reach out to her? Should I not contact her and back off?

It's times like that when my expectations are high and I don't want any expectations because I only get let down again.

Is this her way of letting go? I feel as if she is saying good-bye and moving on....

TA you appear to be FAR too eager. the fog lifts in patches, and you must keep your taker caged for a while yet. Enjoy any gestures that you like, but understand they are filtered through the same fog as the bad stuff.Crying as you hold her ain't good. I done my cryin' in the car, walking the dog, down the bottom of our garden...anywhere FWW can't see me.

Crying evinces strong responses in most onlookers and its very unpredictable how it will work with a WW in fog. It might make guilt so great she either withdraws from you or lies to make you feel better, ot it may make her think you are a weakling as OM didn't cry. I dunno. Never good though IMO in plan A.

Do NOT be eager so soon in plan A. Wait it out. I KNOW this is hard I AM DOING IT but it WORKS.you still ned to plan A your steely buns off as teh AFFAIR IS STILL ALIVE while she sees/contacts him.

Do you want a facsimile of your old M with your WW with the A still active or do you want the A dead and WW working with you up the road to recovery ?

If you want the former, carry on as you are. You'll have it soon it seems. If you want the LATTER, steel yourself, detach yourself emotionally from WWs responses and PLAN A like mad.

All blessings, sorry its a 2x4 but its hard for me to watch someone waver in plan A when it has worked wonderfully well for me and so many oters IF ONLY YOU ARE CONSISTENT !!!!

When my FWW said 'nice' things to me ( no so often!) I replied by saying those words would mean more to me if you were not seeing OM). Do that.

I wasn't doing the crying, she was. Is it Plan A to comfort her? Is Plan A to ignore her?

She called me this morning at work, 'to say hi' I said that she was very friendly last night and she said I was very nice also. She said that she hopes I have a wonderful day. She was extremely nice on the call, as if we are still married and OM is out of the picture. But... Am I to let this behavior continue? Is this what Plan A is?

That is what confuses me. How can she act so kindly. Do I tell her it's not fair to call?

I am so lost...

Hopefully my book arrives today. In the mean time, thanks for helping me try and Plan A this....

Is it ok to give her tastes of what it is like to be with me? Or is that inappropriate?

TA ,it will not help if I rewrite plan A again in slightly different words for you.

* sorry I did not read it was WW crying. of course you comfort her if she welcomes it. She is the source of her unhappiness though, remember, not you. *

Responding eagerly/desperately to every bone she throws trough the fog WHILE THE A IS STILL ACTIVE is not plan A, it is (IMO) your long-caged taker desperate for action.

You will be smashed when she is next mean to you or you next realise she is with OM.

As I said I responded to my FWW " That hug was nice, but I cannot fully enjoy it while I know you still contact OM."

Yes it 'p1sses on her nachos' BUT she has to know you aren't tolerant of her continuing the affair, and you will not be bribed into enabling the A by hugs and sweet talk.

What you're doing isn't plan A , its 'sitting like a puppy waiting for a bone even though its master is still kicking it'.

I ask again, is your objective to have pleasant behaviour from your WW WHILE THE A IS ACTIVE or to kill the A so you can rebuild your M together ?

Do as you feel is right thatsall, and good luck.

<small>[ September 21, 2004, 11:10 AM: Message edited by: Bob Pure ]</small>

you're right. I appreciate the insight. Of course I want the affair to end.

Thanks again BP