Hello again.<P>My wife is lying to me again. Although she is home, things have turned for the worse. Well they have been bad, but I once again haven’t been in the loop of information.<P>This is going to be a long posting.<P>I guess the last time I posted to this board, she had returned home back in September. We have been in counseling up until December 1st, because our counselor has been on vacation. Alot has happened with the OM over the past months. I know that I am going to get so smoked for NOT following most of the male’s advice that I have received here in the past. I guess I am seeking some sort of redemption before I finally let go of my marriage. <P>A lot of things have happened and I will TRY and put them in chronological order here although my memory is foggy about some of the dates. My “reference” material is not in front of me.<P>Late August-<P>~ My wife came home from Dallas and moved back home with the boys.<P>~ The OM moved back home to LA.<P>~ The OM posted a lot of messages here on the board trying to stir things up.<P>September-<P>~ I caught my wife lying to me and discovered the OM was back in town, living less than a mile away from us. She was seeing him again.<P>~ My wife went to the women’s shelter 2 times during this month, saying that she was trying to get away from me.<P>~ My wife left again and was gone off and on for almost a month staying at home with the boys and I and staying over at the OM’s apartment.<P>~ The OM came to my house one night around 1:00am and that is when my wife’s finger nearly got cut off in the front door as the OM was trying to enter the house. My dog and I protected our home and she went to the emergency room. (SUPPOSEDLY), he chased her to the ER and ran her off the road several times before she got there. <P>~ She came home for good that next morning and never went back to stay the night at the apartment.<P>~ My wife and I started counseling one day a week. My counselor also suggested that I leave Marriage Builders Forums, because she said that it was causing stress between my wife and I. I quit posting to MB on the condition that she quit seeing the OM. I have followed the condition set for me. She didn’t.<P>October-<P>~ I paid for a ticket for my wife to travel to see her two older children in KY for a week. Her ex husband coerced her to sign all of her parental rights over to him for the two boys. <P>~ My wife returned home and was emotionally depressed and very sick because she thought she had lost her boys forever. I tried to be there for her as much as possible. The OM was her savior during this time and was blaming me for losing of her children. <P>~ My wife was only seeing the OM about 2 times a week, sometimes more. She was on a dart team with him and she felt the need to be gone out of the house several times a week. There was nothing I could do to see that she would stay at home. <P>~ One night (SUPPOSEDLY), on the way home from a dart tournament, she told him it was over and he told her to get out of his car. She did and as she was walking home, he pulled up behind her and picked her up and forced her back into the car. He then (SUPPOSEDLY), broke his front windshield with his fist, busted his dashboard out as well as the moon roof in his car. About 2:00 am that morning, the OM’s roommate came by the my house and told me that he was paying for the divorce and she had an attorney. My wife later told me that the OM sent the friend over to the house because he wanted me to come over and “end” everything. She also told me that he (SUPPOSEDLY) dragged her into his apartment and ripped her clothes off, having sex with her all night long, against her will. She told me that he (SUPPOSEDLY) made her sleep in a closet the rest of the night. The next morning, I drove to the apartment and she was running from the apartment and told me this story. I told her that she needed to press charges against the OM for what he had done. She told me that she would end the relationship.<P>~ The OM had written all over her body with magic marker putting his name next to all of her private’s. <P>~ She and I later that day had relations. Not sure why we did, but we did. Maybe because she felt guilty for the night before, or because she felt she needed to be with me because of what he did. We went to counseling that day and had separate sessions with the counselor. Our counselor told me that I shouldn’t be having sex with her during her affair. It was too late.<P>~ My wife became pregnant by either the OM or I during this period of time (SUPPOSEDLY). That was the last time that my wife admitted to having sex with him.<P>~ (SUPPOSEDLY) She got pregnant 2 weeks later when she and he were together again. I was being told at this time that they weren’t being intimate.<P>~ The OM was driving by the house all the time and leaving notes in the mailbox for her. <P>~ The OM called me at work and tried to tell me a bunch of things to cause dissension between her and I. I mostly agreed with what he was saying because I knew that he was also seeking information that he didn’t have. We played each other, I knowingly to what he was trying to do. She went to talk to him at a Denny’s several times that week because she was (SUPPOSEDLY) scared of him.<P>~ Several times when she would come home, she would drive up into the driveway quickly, run in the house and lock the door. She would say that he was chasing her (SUPPOSEDLY). A couple of times he would drive by the house afterwards, “proving” her fears.<P>~ My neighbors told me that they had seen him driving up and down the street on several occasions and even standing across the street from our house and looking into the living room.<P>~ We remained in counseling and even had a large group session with our counselor, her and I and about 10 other counselors. At the end of that counseling session my wife got up and left angry because I was “playing” the role of the victim as she said later on the way home in the car.<P>November-<P>~ My wife saw less and less of the OM and was going through what I thought was withdrawal. She would cry all the time for her 2 boys in KY and at times I could tell it wasn’t really that.<P>~ She was going to the OM’s apartment for 30 min again and seeing him “because” she was now pregnant and didn’t know whose it was or what she and I were going to do. She had had an abortion before, but her sister told her that she shouldn’t do so because God would never forgive her and it was against the 10 Commandments. I wanted told her to quit seeing him because adultery was “also” one of the 10 Commandments. <P>~ She kept telling leading me to believe that we were doing well. She only had to see him because of the baby and because she couldn’t keep the baby from him if it is his. She also kept saying that she wanted him in her life “as a friend”. I told her that I can’t and won’t do this much longer.<P>~ She at times would become very angry and blame me for her pain over eight years of marriage. She wanted to give up on rebuilding our marriage because she didn’t see any results. I kept telling her that we couldn’t even begin to start rebuilding our marriage unless he is totally gone from her life. She argued that it might be his child and couldn’t do that to either of us.<P>~ She went to the OM’s apartment one night and hadn’t come home for several hours and I walked to the apartment and found her and him sitting in our car. In disgust I walked away because my boys were with me and I didn’t want things to get nasty in front of them. My wife got out of the car and called me over where she was crying and he was guarding her from approaching me. He was whispering to her in an “angry” whisper. We tried to leave and he wouldn’t let her close the door to the car. I finally drove off and she closed her door. We got home and she called me into the bathroom and she had bruises all over her. She had what appeared to be blood blisters on her back where her shoulder blades where as well as “Indian burns” around her neck. She had bruises on her knees, shoulders and a really bad one on her thigh where she said that she and him were wrestling for the keys to the car that he was trying to take from her so that she couldn’t leave and got stabbed in the thigh. I told her that she needed to end all of this. She wanted me to take her to the Sheriff’s office where she did press charges against him for assault (SUPPOSEDLY).<P>~ She was freaking out the next day and wanted me to drive by his apartment and see if his car was there so she could go and get her things. His car wasn’t there and she against my wishes went to his apartment. She came racing home about 45 minutes later and ran into the house and locked the door. She was saying (SUPPOSEDLY) that he had actually been there at the apartment and when she walked in poured campfire fuel all over himself and threatened to burn himself alive. She made it out of the apartment and ran to the fire department next door where she said that she pounded on the door to the fire station but no one answered. She says that there was a teenager boy that saw them and that she was screaming for him to leave her alone. She made him back up so that she could walk to her car to come home. She wanted me to go to a pay phone and call an ambulance and the Sheriff’s office to go and “save” him. I went to a pay phone and did call. The ambulance and deputies got there as I watched from across the street and I left when they got in the security gate. Later that evening around 11:00 pm, she wanted me to drive back by the apartment and see if the emergency was over. I parked and had to look over a fence and didn’t see any emergency vehicles. On my way back home, I got pulled over for suspicious activity. Nothing came of it as I explained what I was doing. The deputy that pulled me over called the deputy that took the assault report from the night before. He talked to me for a while and then followed me to my house and also talked to my wife and I together. The deputy said that he had responded to the call of the attempted suicide and couldn’t smell any fuel inside the apartment, but that in the apartment there were a lot of broken things. This all (SUPPOSEDLY) happened. The OM wasn’t arrested that night because the DA hadn’t issued a warrant yet.<P>~ I found out the next Monday that the OM wouldn’t be arrested until they actually stopped him for something or when he renewed his license. I was looking forward to the day that the OM was going to be put in jail. I wanted to call the deputies several times and send them over to the apartment when she continued to go see him, (SUPPOSEDLY) at Denny’s.<P>~ We went to her mothers for Thanksgiving and things seemed to be going great.<P>December-<P>~ My wife was still going through an emotional time because her boys wanted to come home. She learned that the boys admitted to there father that they had been lying about the abuse that they alleged that I had done to them. But her ex still didn’t want to give the boys to her. <BR>~ My wife the following week was told by her ex’s new wife that she was sending the boys home and we needed to pick them up in Dallas that weekend. My wife went to (SUPPOSEDLY) went to Wal-Mart one night and on the way home the OM had been following her. He got pulled over and was arrested. I went to the parking lot to where he go pulled over and saw that he had been arrested as they towed his car off. <P>~ She later told me that she had gone to the apartment and told him that the boys were coming home. He became angry and tried to have sex with her. He followed her to Wal-Mart and waited for her to leave. That’s when he got pulled over.<P>~ She told me that she hated to see anyone in jail and the next week she had tried to go see him in jail but couldn’t because her license was expired.<P>~ We drove to Dallas and picked up my stepsons and came home. I asked my wife not to interject the older boys lives into the mess that was going on still. My wife promised that she wouldn’t. <P>~ The day that we were going out of town to see her mother for Christmas my wife wanted to know if he was still in jail. She wanted to go and tell him behind the safety of the glass at the jail that it was over. I allowed her to do so, because she promised me that it was over now.<P>~ We went to Dallas and had a great time. We came home and found out 2 days later that he had posted bond with the help of his roommate. He was in jail for 7 days.<P>~ The OM’s roommate came by at 3:00 AM one morning and told my wife that the OM was gone and had left. The roommate was worried about the money he had put up for bond and my wife, “being the concerned one” decided to go looking for the OM with the roommate and some other guy. My oldest son had seen this guy and didn’t know who he was.<P>~ I found out several days after this that she indeed did let the oldest go and see the OM after the night the roommate of the OM came by. The oldest stepson was asking questions and allowed him to go see the OM. The OM and the oldest stepson are “best friends”, and she made the mistake of letting them see each other. She promised that she would keep the older boys away from the OM. My oldest stepson and my wife got in several heated arguments about the OM and why she was home.<P>~ On New Years Eve, a neighbor told me that the OM was seen twice in the neighborhood. One day last week my oldest stepson told me that he was going to a friend’s house and my 4 year old told me that he saw his oldest brother with “BOB”. I told my 4 year old “no he went to bob’s house.” The OM’s roommate came to the house and gave me his cellular number and wanted my wife to call him immediately that some “urgent” was going on. My wife came home with my oldest stepson and everything seemed okay. I didn’t know everything that had happened at this point in time. I found out when she got home that our stepson had been over at the OM’s apartment for several hours when my wife found him there as she was (SUPPOSEDLY) coming home from the store. My wife told me that the OM had found pot on him and that he had gotten it from a neighbor boy. But, worse, the OM told my stepson that my wife was pregnant with his child and that she had had an abortion back in June. He told my stepson everything about the affair over the past 10 months. How he loved his mother and told him all kinds of horrible things that he didn’t need to know. My wife told me that she was going to go back to the apartment and threaten the OM with kidnapping and to leave her son alone. She was very angry that the OM told her son all this graphic information. She came home and told me that he agreed to leave us all alone. <P>~ After all of this was said and done my wife was still going to let our oldest go to an all night skate party for New Years. She left to take him and didn’t come home for about an hour and a half. She was in tears when she came home and began yelling and screaming at our oldest. She had taken him to go skating but he decided not to go, but instead wanted to go and talk to the OM and tell him goodbye for the last time. The OM became angry and walked to a pay phone and called my wife’s ex husband and told him that he was going to let our stepson stay at his apartment as a safe place because he didn’t want to be at home with my wife and I. My wife at and my stepson got into a screaming match while they were arguing and she admitted to him out loud that all this abuse had happened and my stepson started screaming at her about the “perverted” things that we had done in our marriage. These “things” that he was screaming were told to him by the OM. She and my stepson got into this huge fight. New Years was approaching and I took the other boys outside with the neighbors and shot off fire works. My wife came out and told me that she was going to go get a hamburger and would be back in 5 min. She didn’t come home for nearly 40 min when I saw her sitting on our front porch from our neighbors yard across the street. I didn’t see the car so I walked up and talked to her and she said that she had gone to the apartment and that she (SUPPOSEDLY) ended the relationship. I asked her where the car was and she said that the OM had taken the keys from her and threw them into a field of grass. She looked for them but couldn’t find them so she came home. At about 1:00 AM on New Years Morning, I walked to the apartment with a spare set of keys and got close to the car where I found him going through it. I told him to get the F*** out of my car and he proceeded to provoke a fight. I got in the car and was trying to start it as he started calling me names and stated that during lunch for the past several months that he and my wife were seeing each other. He also said that they were still having sex EVERY time that she came over, and I told him, whatever. I started to drive off and he spit on my 4 times. I got home and told my wife what happened and what he had said and she denied having relations with him for at least since October. She also told me that she hadn’t seen him during the day. Later that morning she told me that she had gone to the apartment and he had ripped her pants off her and tried to insert into her. She says that she fought him and then he bit her nipples. <P>~ After she went to sleep I checked her pants along the inseam and found what I thought to be semen and I put it up to a black light to check. I was shocked when I discovered that it glowed, not proving that its semen but could be.<P>Yesterday, I was totally and completely depressed. She asked me what we were going to do with the baby and how I wanted to handle it. I told her how I felt and she said she needed to go tell him what she and I were going to do if it was his. We won’t know until the baby is born. She won’t do a prenatal paternity test. She came home 2 hours later and she and I talked about what he wanted. He wants to start paying for doctors visits and going with her. She told him that he could pay for them. I told her that I didn’t want him paying for anything, that I just wanted him to sit and wait like me. In our state, I am the presumed biological father until OTHERWISE proven. He has no rights to the child until I am adjudicated of the parentage. <P>She told me that she needed to be honest with me. She began by telling me that she has been F***ing him this hole time. She also told me that she has indeed seen him during lunch hours. She also told me that she made him to be this HORRIBLE monster that she wanted me to think that she hated. She said that I was the enemy because she was only home so that I wouldn’t take our two youngest children from her. She started packing and then stopped. Said she was going to leave. Then she couldn’t because her second son can’t stand the OM. She says that is the last place that she wants to run, is to him. She doesn’t want to be without me, but she just CAN’T be with me intimately. She wanted me to think that all these horrible things have gone on, but instead admitted that she just wanted him for the sex, because she can’t be with me intimately. <P>She says that the last straw with her was when he telephoned her ex husband and tried to swoon him by saying the things on the phone that he said to him. She told me that the only reason that she moved out back in April was because she was having an affair. She told me that she had sex with him while she was over there earlier and the day before was consensual. She says that she knew that she just wanted him for the sex, when she was saying her goodbye’s and she asked him if she could come over anytime in the future. We spent last night talking about all the lies that she has told to him and I. She said that she would never be able to have sex with me again. She said that he makes love to her like she has never been made love to before. She said that I use to be that way with her but somewhere over 7 years stopped. At the very most, she would only be able to allow me to do the oral thing on her. Hours went by of talking and she and I somehow ended up being with her orally. I woke up at 04:00 AM this morning and she was asleep and I asked her to hold me. I lay there and she kept saying that she couldn’t. She told me that she actually hasn’t been with him intimately since the boys have been home, almost a month now. She said that she almost did the other day. She said that the only reason that she told me that she was with him last night was to make me angry. We talked for a few more minutes and I turned over and was almost asleep when she said that she was sorry for all the lies and held me as I went back to sleep.<P>I woke up this morning and got ready for work and was about to leave and she asked how I was doing. I told her I was somewhat okay. Still hurting. I pulled my Surviving an Affair book out and opened it to a section on the four rules. I asked her to read Sue’s and John’s stories. She was as I left. <P><BR>I don’t know what to do at this point. I have been telling her that we need to move and she has agreed to on several occasions. I know that she doesn’t want to be without me. I know that she is really addicted to this guy and has a horrible way of dealing with the truth. I don’t know if the abuse is true or not. She still says its not, but I’ve seen the bruises. I don’t know what I am going to do about the child. I can’t really leave her now, because the child “might” be mine. I don’t know how I could successfully start a plan B without moving out. I don’t want to be her financial needs supporter if this is how she is going to treat me.<P>I am once e m p t y again.<P><BR><P>------------------<BR>"S t o n e h e n g e"<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>"In the valley of the blind the one eyed man is king"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>

Stonehenge,<P>Sorry to hear that things have taken a turn for the worse (and bizarre).<P>I would suggest that you sit down and work with your wife on the Rule of Complete Honesty, and the Policy of Joint Agreement. See if she wants the marriage. Sit down and discuss moving. Discuss the child, and what you will do about it if it's the OM's. Do this in a non-threatening environment if possible. Perhaps with your counselor. You might try to get the plan in writing, so that you both realize what you're committing to.<P>And then execute the plan.<P>Based on what you've said, I think that I would go to a strict plan B mode until she agreed to sever the affair, move (far away), and start counseling.

I am so numb today. I don't know what I am doing. Its the second coming of discovery for me. We haven't initiated any plans of recovery, because my wife feels violated that I put our lives here on the internet. I don't know how to go to a plan b if we are both living in the same house.<P>I don't want to tear my kids from there mother and I don't want to leave them. I don't know what to do. I am typing her a letter that I am going to suggest using in counseling this week.

Anyone else have any ideas. Thanks K. Just polling the crowd.

Stonehenge,<P>Lord, what a story!<P>I don't know what to say except that your W needs to think about what she wants and to begin to tell the truth. You have no idea what you are dealing with because the story changes by the hour! <P>Until she is honest about what she is doing, you can hardly plan to do anything at all. I realize you don't want to take your boys away from their mother, but I am not sure she is such a great influence on them right now.<P>Yes, the child might be yours and then again it might not. What kind of commitment is your W willing to give to the kids she already has???? Bringing them around this OM and his sordid history (abuse to your W, jail time, etc.) is very UNHEALTHY for those boys. No wonder the older boy is getting mixed up with pot.<P>Think about how you can support yourself and the kids first. Your W is mightily mixed up and you can not make the decisions she needs to make for herself. But, you can set a better standard for yourself and the kids. K is right...Plan B might be your very best bet.<P>Good luck!<P>Roll Me Away<P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

Did she read the stories in SAA?<P>I agree with K. She needs to make a commitment to honesty at this point, or go to plan B and move far away and get counseling. <P>Stonhenge, this is a really really sad story, and you have survived this. Yes, you are empty, but look what a survivor you are. You can do what needs to be done, you must be the strong one right now.<P>No lovebusting, okay? I know you are empty, but you must not lovebust.<P>tnt

Stonehenge,<BR> Whew! WOW!! UNREAL!! Here's my suggestion. Sell this story to hollywood (with the happy ending of course) and you'll be so rich W will follow you around like a puppy. <BR> I admire you man because, although I am a peaceful patient man, I would have taken this guy out to the woods and tortured him for hours until he died. Really, this guy is mental!! Unfortunatly, your W is acting like she needs SERIOUS help too. I know they ALL act crazy during this but she is really LOST right now. <BR> I would find another state to live in, get an apartment (quicker) and set it up without W knowing. Then, once it was ready, I'd wait for the abuse of OM towards her and THEN I'd tell her and drive her there THAT DAY!!<BR> And if you EVER see bruses on your W again. Call the police and tell them to meet you at his house and BURY a golf club in THIS GUY's forehead in (self defense of course)!!!<BR> YOU my friend have my PRAYERS. FRANK<BR>

Stonehenge - I hate to say this, but frankly I think you should just divorce her and be done with it. You don't need this kind of sh1t in your life and it doesn't sound like she has any intention of changing in this millenium. My God, man, I don't see how you live with this kind of abuse from her. (Yes, it IS abuse, emotional abuse, pure and simple.) There are plenty of other fish in the ocean. Divorce her and find yourself an honest woman who really cares for you. Regards and blessings,<P>--Wex

Are you out of your mind. Lose this woman ASAP. (sometime in the next 5 minutes) change the locks on your doors and get a restraining order. This behavior is beyond belief.

hi stone, long time since I saw your name here! I missed ya!! <BR>First I will send you some strength and some hugs. You need them.<BR>Your wife seems like she is more distrubed than previously? I am sorry she feels so violated that this is on the net. Perhaps she will come by for a visit? If she reads this, I hope she is not hurt, but she needs some professional serious intervention. <BR>The abuse is, quite frankly, GROSS. This is no way to raise children-the current ones or the one on the way. <BR>I know you love her dearly, but she needs help and you cannot give her that. You have tried. Plan b, do it lovingly and in writing, send older boys back to KY (they need counseling), get a restraining order and MOVE.

Stonehenge...this story is unbelievable! As one of the other's said...sell this story to Hollywood. I'm sure you will become rich from it.<P>You have endured so much abuse. The kids are suffering from it also. Your W needs serious help, but I think she need to hit rock-bottom before she seeks that help herself. I think that you have done more than anyone could ever do.<P>This is my opinion only...I would get a legal separation and move away. You & your kids don't need this chaos in your life. This OM sounds like a psycho, but your W sounds like one too. I say get the legal separation before she destroys what's left.

Hey Buddy,<P>gee, I know you love her, but please stop and think a minute , this has got to be horrible for the kids, all of them.<P>As for this being on the net well none of us would know either of you if we saw you face to face. Thats the beauty of a messageboard, you can be open because noone knows who you are. <P>And she needs to remember OM put it out here for all to see too. I was here, I remember, I also remember he went back and edited his posts out so she wouldn't know what he had said.<P>You have to make a decision, not easy with all thats going on and all the lie's that have and likely are going on. <P>email if you need me<P>dkohb@yahoo.com<P>I'm praying.<P>------------------<BR>Just call me - Deb<BR>------------------------<BR>The only day I can do anything about is today, yesterday is gone, tomorrow is not yet mine.<P>

Hi Stone -<P>I read your update last night and couldn't reply just then...I had to go use the earphones and punching bag cuz I got so frustrated about this whole thing!!!! The Lord is with you - that's for sure....you're still standing and they haven't carting you off to the loony bin yet!!!<P>Got some good licks in on the punching bag for ya though!!!!!<P>Jeez Stone....what a nightmare.....<P>My gut says that you have to make the kids and yourself a priority....not later - not soon....but NOW!!!<P>I know you don't want anyone separated in the family.....but you know what? YOU have to get those kids away from this lunacy!!! What is this teaching them? They will end up as messed up as your wife is? Plus - I am sure that it is very difficult to keep your own emotions from showing.....<P>You're wife has taken things way beyond reason here.....time for the games to stop!!! It's bad enough to have the "normal" infidelity games....but these are DANGEROUS ones!! Please Stone...you have to do something NOW!!<P>Do what K suggests....try to sit RIGHT NOW and devise an honest plan....at the slightest infringement of the plan - you MUST be prepared with the backup plan of moving WITH THE KIDS away from this chaos that has ruled all of your lives for so long.... hopefully she will come with you!! Even if not at first - later.<P>No more allowing the hemming and hawing from her Stone!! Your kids can't emotionally afford it and neither can you!!! This recent inaction reason of being mad or embarassed about your posting your lives.....TOO BAD!!! She needs to see it....needs to realize what ridiculousness she is bringing into your lives and family. <P>She needs help...OK - so time to start the help. No problem...people need help all the time!!! It's the procrastinating on getting it that is the true time waster and added problem!<P>Take the reins Stone......<P>BIG HUGS, STRENGTH AND PRAYERS,<P>Sheba

Oh, Stonehenge. It had been such a long time since we heard from you I had so hoped that things were going well.<P>I'm a diehard for marriage, but she needs help that you can't give her. And she can't give your children the security that they need.<P>I'm not advocating divorce. But you must take some sort of action to protect yourself and those wonderful boys. You are really all they have.<P>And, you know, in the long run, it may be what she needs as well. You really can't enable her any longer. She will never get the help she needs until she decides to do it herself. And she won't the way things are.<P>You must remain healthy and sane to be what those boys need. Please take care of them and yourself. <P>Sending loads of hugs and prayers your way.<P>Lori

Stonehenge,<P>Your wife's lying is a core of her problem. She can't face the piper.<P>Remember when she lied to the shelter and the counselors there? It is like reality is too hard to face? The fantasy is better?<P>I know she doesn't enjoy being abused. So, don't think she does. She has a problem, a real real sickness - just like a cancer is to a physical body - she has a cancer in her emotions. That is what abuse does to you.<P>She needs help, and she didn't finish getting it. Let her get the help she needs. Don't defend yourself anymore, instead protect yourself. Protect your children, and your legal rights, and the future that you want to have - but not getting drug down into the mire of the cancer.<P>Let her get help. You can't force her, but you should not prevent her either. By thinking she is at all capable to give to this marriage at this point is totally unrealistic and too high of an expectation. She is SICK right now, Stonehenge. She is emotionally SICK. She needs to go get help, and you can't do it for her. <P>Do NOT stand in her way, by enabling or trying to make her work on the marriage. It is a deeper problem than you think. Her problem is worse than adultery, and worse than divorce. <P>Now stop thinking of yourself right now, and start thinking of a future - that you need to create. Do what you can, not what you can't. You can prepare the road for a good future for you and possibly your wife - if you do this. <P>I hope I am making sense. It is 6 below, so I'm not going to go outside and see the stars tonight - but you will be in my prayers.<P>Pamper yourself, too. You are a man, but men need pampering, too. <P>Take a nice warm bath, and light some candles, and put on your most soothing music, and take care of you. You are the biggest investment you have. Be good to you.<P>tnt

What a horrible story. Really.<P>I think I remember reading your posts before I even started writing here, and thinking the same thing. And you received the same advice then as you are now...please take it this time. I feel so horrible for your poor kids who have to witness this. Take yourself away from this mess and give those poor kids a break. I guess that's the first thing that comes to mind when reading this is your kids, how are they handling all of this?? Don't you think that this will affect them later down the road? <P>As the others have said, get away from that situation (and you've heard this so many times I am sure) and concentrate on your kids. Be selfless now, your kids need you. Your wife is majorly messed up and you CANNOT help her, she needs to seek help herself. Enabling her will only perpetuate the problems. I'm praying for you.

Get out. Get out. Get out.<P>You can deal with fallout later and try to make a plan. You are dealing with insanity, so no reasoning will suffice. What strikes me is her running to the doer and and slamming it as if she were afraid. A master at minipulation.<P>You are shadow boxing with lies upon lies. Get out and when you have some time: regroup.<P>Max out the cards, go to friends, families or even aquaintences. If you want to preserve some form of reality for yourself and yor sons. Go into retreat.<P>Melissa<P>Yes this is not MB principals but long before I was betrayed I was excposed to this kind of web weaving mind warping behavior. Get out.<P>How did the exH pressure her into signing away any rights? Her behavior. He finally saw it. But he stayed too long and his judegement is still warped. That is how he readily beliees allthat stuff about you. He lived too long inthe world of ilusions.<P> <BR>Get out.<P><BR>Y

Get out. Get out. Get out.<P>Get away and regroup. What strikes me is her runing up to the house and slamming the door. She s playing out some drama that has nothing to do with you or your sons. The side effects fall out is ugly. Go somewhere safe to reflect. <P>I'm eztremely serious. Max out the cards. Or call family, friends or aquaintanences. (Somstimes the last ae surprisingly what you needed the most.) But get away. You cannot think. She is a web spinnr. Get out.<P>Melissa.<P>Yep, not mb principles but this case is an exception.

Get out. Get out. Get out.<P>Go somewhere and reflect. Most of the people on the site can't help as you are dealing with somehting that goes beyond the experience of most of us. She is a web spinner. There is no reality at this time. What strikes me is her running up to the house and slamming the door to cast him badly when she was with him. <P><BR>Get out. Go and think.<P> Max out any cards. Call on famiily or friends or aquaintences. (The last are amazing-sometimes the peole you hardly know are willing and are just what you need.)<P>But get out. Get away. Think.<P>No contact with her for three weeks.<BR>And even after you'll have a hard time because she is VERY good at what she does. Which is illusion. You and the boys appear to to be wisps of smoke to her. Go and think.<P>Melissa

Get out. Get out. Get out.<P>Go somewhere and reflect. Most of the people on the site can't help as you are dealing with somehting that goes beyond the experience of most of us. She is a web spinner. There is no reality at this time. What strikes me is her running up to the house and slamming the door to cast him badly when she was with him. <P><BR>Get out. Go and think.<P> Max out any cards. Call on famiily or friends or aquaintences. (The last are amazing-sometimes the peole you hardly know are willing and are just what you need.)<P>But get out. Get away. Think.<P>No contact with her for three weeks.<BR>And even after you'll have a hard time because she is VERY good at what she does. Which is illusion. You and the boys appear to to be wisps of smoke to her. Go and think.<P>Melissa