THe sick part of this soulmate idea is that it is used by people to justify what they have done. Use of "soul"mate makes it sound as if the relationship is ordained by God. The mate part of the word is the secular explanation of the relationship. People don't mate, animals mate and we are not animals. The word soulmate is contradictory.<BR>I had a friendship several years ago with a woman at work that shared the same interests as me. Interests that my wife did not share with me. Once when we were getting along well she had stated the we might be Soulmates. I said that was nice but I am a husband and a father. Two titles that were given to me by the will of GOD. While we shared common interests and found each other to be interesting, soulmate was nothing more than a good friend. We remained friends but it never went there again.<P>You hit a chord with this Titanic story. THat was the story of my W and the OM. I was vilified and he would save her from the misery I had imposed upon her. Of course he cowered away and did not take her with him. Tell that story Hollywood. The plot was too simple (predictable). Here is my rendition if they survived and got married:<P>Rose: Will you stop painting and get a job?!<P>Jack: I thought you loved my sensitive understanding side. Work and responsibility grind at my soul and don't inspire me. Look at the bright side, I could have died.<P>Rose: (thinking to herself) Too bad you didn't, I could have married that rich guy.<P>THis script of course would be rejected. Hollywood does not deal in the real world and has no interest in showing the human cost of the effluent they put out. <P>Thank you all that posted here I thought I was the only one that did not like the plotline of Titanic.

trustntruth,<BR>I think most people think that the marriage is a covenant between the man and the woman. Even in the secualrized versions of the vows it still says let no man put asunder what God hath brought together. Our vows are a covenant with God, the man, and the woman. <P>The man is to love the woman as Christ loved the church in that He gave His life for it. This is how I view my relationship with my wife. I have been told by almost everyone I have told about the way my W treats me and what she has done to leave her and cut my losses. I am merely doing that what the Lord has directed me to do. <P>I KNOW THAT I AM RAMBLING, PLEASE BEAR WITH ME. I AM STILL HEALING FROM THE FIRST AS WELL AS THE LATEST BETRAYAL.<P>I still love her and understand why she feels the way she does. I am convinced that I have been able to understand her only because God has revealed to me the logic that she used. Furthermore, I am concerned with my relationship with Him. My vows were to him concerning my marriage. The one thing I can't do is violate my relationship with Him for anyone (which is covered by scripture where we are to forsake everyone: mother, father, brother, sister, wife for His love because if we are right with Him all things will fall into place in His time.<P>We often are impatient and want things to happen in our time. We must perservere (misspelled I'm sure) and pray contiually. He did not say that we would not endure pain in this portion of our existence. The pain and suffering aren't going to exist after the second coming. Oh the joy we will experience then.<P>God has blessed me to get to know you all. I know He is helping me to heal even though the worst of it is not over yet. <P>I just got off the phone with the Mrs. She shows little signs every now and then that shows she is getting closer. I revel in those little moments because I know God is busy taking care of business.<P>God Bless you all,<P>------------------<BR>Rob<P>

fighter:<BR>Well, I must have liked it or I wouldn't have seen it five times and wouldn't be writing.<P>But this topic of "What if Jack had lived" has been going on in Titanic kook circles (and they are as bad as Star Wars kooks) for over a year.<P>That the fiance was such an obvious villain made it easy, and sure, I got caught up in the whole thing too. And I still feel that an engagement is not the same as a marriage, and if an engagement doesn't feel right, you don't proceed with the marriage.<P>But the fan fiction started immediately, and most of it dealt with "Rose marries this kindly but clueless schmuck who has no idea that she's spending her life carrying a torch for someone else." I couldn't buy that notion.<P>So I wrote a different one. In not too long a time, I'm going to be dealing with the infidelity issue in my story as well.<BR>

Sorry DnC, didn't mean to be a wet blanket for your Titanic. The movie was their movie and told their story but nobody died. I am a bit cynical about it for that reason. It's just that the plot in my opinion was too predictable as most of the movies that come out today are....<BR>You're taking a big risk writing about infidelity. I can barely stand to watch it on tv and in movies. Before all of this I rarely paid attention to it. If you would do the script of mine and others it would be very difficult to express the kind of pain we felt and have someone that has not had this happen to them understand it. The months and years instead of hours. I wish you well in trying to articulate this. The other problem would be making it unusual so that its' not the same plot that we have seen before in these matters. <p>[This message has been edited by fighter (edited June 15, 1999).]

You're not a wet blanket, you have an opinion that goes beyond "Titanic sux!" There's a difference. <P>What's going to be interesting is that I'll be writing from both points of view. Having been on both sides of the fence (tempted, but didn't proceed) and threatened by an outside presence, I think I can write on the subject. I'm sure at times it'll be hard...but worth it. If I can create an interesting story that ends with a romantic reunion/revival occurring WITHIN a marriage, so much the better.

Would Hollywood be interested in such a story? Husband and wife ending up together? Who ever heard of it? THey don't even show husbands and wives kissing each other. Do us a favor and the scene where they talk about soulmates, make them look silly.<BR>You may have to add another dimention like make them vampires to sell this one. <BR>Again, good luck.

Not writing for Hollywood...writing for me, and those who want to read.<P>Remember back a while ago, when there was a thread on "getting those feelings back" and I suggested writing one's "dream mate" -- and you'll be surprised how many traits that person has with one's spouse?<P>That's how it happened to me.<P>But re: married lovers and Hollywood. Remember when Warren Beatty and Annette Bening were in the remake of some movie about an affair a few years ago, and no one saw it because the actors were married? Apparently there are the same concerns about the new Kubrick flick, EYES WIDE SHUT. No one wants to watch REAL marrieds go at SIMULATED sex on screen.<P>Bizarre.

You all know how Dr. Harley would define a soulmate: it's the one who meets your most important emotional needs. I agree! When most of us first married, we were soulmates with our partners. Then the stardust wears off, and if we've not learned that NEEDS CHANGE OVER TIME (another Harley concept) and that COUPLES MUST CHANGE IN ORDER TO STAY COMPATIBLE (Harley), we've lost our soulmate. And sadly, many of us go looking elsewhere.<P>So yes, I believe there IS such a thing as a soulmate, but I think it takes WORK to maintain soulmatedness if you marry. Part of the reason new lovers look tempting when you're miserably married is that they are unavailable: yearning adds to the illusion that you've finally found your REAL soulmate.

DnC that is a trademark of the industry. When John Lennon was first married, they kept it secret for the same reason.<P>HollyAnn, I am going to take a departure here in that I don't think that it is necessary to have all of your needs met by another person. We're not babies.<BR> If you can't take care of your needs, how can you expect someone else to. And is it reasonable to put so much importance on your needs to destroy your marriage<BR> over them. My wife rarely ever met my needs and I had no desire to find them elsewhere. This is part of maturity. <BR> There have been plenty of relationships where a persons needs aren't met and they manage to stay and come to some kind of peace with it.<BR>What about Christopher Reeve and his wife. I doubt if their needs are being met. But they have adjusted. <BR>I don't want to spend the rest of my life worrying if I'm meeting her needs. She can tell me what she wants, I will get it for her.<BR>This search for the perfect soulmate or trying to change your spouse into a soulmate or trying to be your spouses soulmate is a never-ending quest that will take up the<BR>rest of you life. You need to be improving yourself as a person by trying to be a better parent and a better person in the eyes of god. If you succeed in being a <BR>better soulmate, good for you. Spouses need to accept the imperfections of each other, unless they're doing bad things. Make mention of each others perceived <BR>shortcomings but don't expect the perfect spouse. If my wife were to seek meeting all my needs, there would not be enough time or effort for the kids. <BR>For reasons mentioned in my previous post, I don't ever want to be referred to as a soulmate. Husband and father are the only titles I seek.

Well, you guys are making me feel bad, I have always felt my husband was my soulmate from the first time he held me in his arms I felt comfort and warmth knowing this is where and who I should be with. I think soulmate goes beyond the infatuation stage though it goes through the thining hair and the bulging belly, your soulmate grows with you and you nuture each other. I have sat with many a couples married 50 or more years when one of them are losing the other to death, they are losing a part of themselves, they know each other inside and out. That's why when one needs a kleenx the other hands it without even being asked. Where has that kind of commitment gone? But as I read thru your post I begin to change my thinking because if I was my H soulmate and knew his every whim, Guess I would have known about the OW, huh and would have to been able to head things off at the pass, instead of here posting thru tears.

Soulmate vs. Covenant<P>There is some place in the Bible, that if a husband isn't taking care of his wife, that God doesn't listen to his prayers...<P>So in regard to God not listenint to husband:<BR>Malachi 2:14 "Yet you say, 'For what reason?' Because the Lord has been a witness between you and wife of your youth against whom you have dealt treacherously, though she is your companion and your wife by covenant.<BR>and 15: "..........Take heed then, to your spirit, and let no one deal treacherously against the wife of your youth." <BR>and 16: "For I hate divorce, says the Lord, the God of Israel, "and him who covers his garment with wrong," says the Lord of hosts. "So take heed to your spirit, that you do not deal treacherously." <P><p>[This message has been edited by trustntruth (edited June 15, 1999).]

I never heard of the concept of soulmate until my W brought it up during her first affair which became physical. My ex-girlfriend, who was my first real relationship, was the only other person I have made love to. She didn't mention it.<P>I just know that when I hear or see the term it breaks my heart over again because there is nothing like being betrayed. I had it happen with my ex-girlfriend when she left me because her friends who had never met me said that I was cheating on her so she did it and left me when we met again. It took me 2.5 years to get over her.<P>I have stayed with my wife because I have a covenant marriage even though my W may not se it that way. When she first said that she wanted to leave, I gently as I possibly could let her know that if she were to leave she would be the unbeliever. She is a professed Christian. I am still looking for the fruit. I do know that one day she will be saved and go to heaven because He told me so and gave me the general situation concerning her becoming saved.<P>------------------<BR>Rob<P>

Any if you ever watch 'Forget Paris'? Well, I watched it many many times before I get married to remain my self that's married life would be.<P>During the dating period, it feels like things are falling to your lap, at first, that you are both meant to be together. Our biggest problem were only either he comes 10 minutes late or he forgot our monthly anniversary. His biggest mistake was forgetting my 17th birthday (urgh!). and yet I am dating my boyfriend for 9 years, broke up for 3 months and dating him again, got engaged and got married...we feel that we knew each other by heart. When I held my tongue, he knew what I was going to say and why I paused it and vice versa. And I guess this come from years togetherness, years studying together, and many many Saturday nights together. Yet I felt that the fact we are meant to be together CONFIRMED by God when we vowed our selves as husband and wife and we should keep it that way.<P>I agreed about trying to meet each other's need not because of the end result. Whether your need is really met is number two for me. I think is the effort, seeing that your spouse is trying, and knowing that your self is also trying, that would be the one that build our marriage. I really appreciate all the effort my husband done to make me feel safe, loved and comfort. And I my self also learn not to take it for granted.<P>Well, that's my 2 cents, I'll stick to 'Forget Paris' rather than 'Titanic'.

Hi trustntruth et al,<P>I'm responding late on this post...sorry I missed it when it was hot because this is such a lightning-rod topic. I've often mused over this concept.<P>Soulmate....hmmmm. Means different things to different people. Almost by definition. I'd swear it's all about something more than the classic 5 senses. Something's going on that we can't quite explain. It's more of a feeling that we get. And...that's different for different people. Always hard to describe.<P>Funny thing about the "soulmate" concept: ever feel like you just *knew*??? The lightbulb going on? Music welling up in the background? LOL! Then again, ever feel like you knew and you were *wrong*??? What's with that? <P>I really liked reading some of the perspectives you all wrote. Yup, Dazed I do agree there's this whole "romantic crap" ideal we've been fed as a culture since certainly the Age of Reason. And...btw...thanks for trusting a little here in the forum. I admire you for that. <P>And Maya? Oh yah! DEFinitely agree that the soulmate thang is RARE. May never even happen. Is it an ideal which can never be reached? Guess that depends on the definition. <P>What I do think (and Suse agrees) is that once in awhile we bump into someone with whom we just "click" somehow. Blammo! And, I believe that there is no predestiny or karma to that. There's certainly more than one.<P>But, I also believe that it takes a lot of work and trust and experience to reeeeely get to the "soulmate" level. Well, at least by my definition (again, Suse and I share that one).<P>In summary...we might get all starry-eyed over meeting someone. It may be all magical. But, it take some real effort to keep it going and nurture it to the "soulmate" status.<P>Any other comments? Nice topic!

This Has been an interesting topic, and it is funny how we all look at the word and definition of "soul mate" - from our own perspectives. <P>It would be so interesting to see each person's meyers-briggs score was in relation to their view on "soul mate's"!!!<P>Thank you all for responding.

Okay, I know I'm in the minority here but I'm going to stick my neck out anyway. Laugh if you will but I asked my H (the betrayer) and he said he still thinks I'm his soulmate. He said his definition of soulmate has changed from happily-ever-after-ala-fairy-tales to we-were-meant-to-be-together-to-learn-from-each-other. (I might add that his affair was not emotional for him). I personally believe we can love more than one person in a lifetime, but that doesn't make me eager to divorce either. Some connections seem more special than others...<P>Just my 2cents.

I couldn't resist one more shot at this. To bring in a Biblical view....<P>In Genesis...it says that God "brought the woman to the man (Gen 2:22)<BR>How many of us were willing and patient enough to let God bring the "right" mate into our lives. After all...If you believe He is our Creator...certainly He knew who would be the ideal mate for us.<BR>Probaly one of the most important decisions we could ever make in life...we made based on what "hormones,emotions, and visual senses" told us.<P>Keep in mind that once you did "take those vows"...regardless of God's orignal choice for you...that mate you married is now God's choice for you. And He can pour a lot of grace and make it work for you.<P>Also...once you are married...don't even think that God is going to "tease" you and at some later point bring your "real" soulmate into your life. It won't happen. He is not that kind of God. <P>Well....is it time to pass the offereing plate yet? :-)

When I first saw my H, I knew that we would be together forever. I didn't know what a hard road we would have but I guess if we can make it though this and become strong, then we are soulmates. I think you do have some choices as to who your soulmate is. OW told H that they were soulmates, I really don't know what H said (typed)back to her. But if they were true soulmates then wouldn't he be with her right now and not me. Monique

Hi trustntruth, hi Jenny,<P>Jenny, precisely!<P>I'm with you on this one. That's exactly how I feel. Hope that came across in my post of last nite.<P> "I personally believe we can love more than<BR> one person in a lifetime, but that doesn't make me eager to divorce either.<BR> Some connections seem more special than others..."<P>That quote of yours is worth more than 2 cents! It may be priceless. <P>I'm so glad to be with Suse. While both she and I understand how each of us could have strayed during times of despair, here we are after 20+ years looking forward to a long lifetime of intimacy. Yes...soulmates. <P>Be well.

Pastor Tman:<P>You word it so eloquently - that's just how I feel.<P>When are you gonna start that thread on soul ties? I did a search - and didn't come up with much....<P>God Bless