Sometimes I wonder if I had just gone along with his plan and not contested the divorce, which would have required perjuring myself in court because in this state they ask if both parties are certain the marriage is irretrievably broken, maybe he would not have continued to be so angry. But from what you have said your ex-H is still angry, even though the divorce happened very quickly. Did his behavior toward you and the kids change in either direction after the divorce was final? <P>My H got much colder as soon as he filed, and even more noticeable was his withdrawal from the children. Up until then, when he was visiting them here, I would come home to find one or more of them sitting in his lap. I don't think that happened even once after he filed - he would normally be on the computer playing solitaire or some other game. He was treating me cruelly before he filed, but he still displayed emotion. As soon as he filed he became cold as ice.

Nellie, <P>I'm so sorry I took so long to reply, my computer has been down and I just saw this post tonight. It's a little hard to answer this one, because actually I filed for divorce very quickly, only because if he filed first he could have gotten temporary custody of the kids and he was threatening to file. I look back now and wonder if he ever would have filed. I didn't know about this site then.<P>To answer, my ex displayed more emotion before the divorce was final. I honestly don't think the divorce has made a lot of difference in his treatment of us. He only contacts me when necessary, and is cold and brief when he does. He seems to be withdrawing more from the kids all the time. He doesn't look happy, he is with the OW more and more. I think he is trying to fill the void of his family with her. On the rare occasions he does see me, he cannot look me in the eye. The tone of his voice with me is almost rude. He never says anything personal to the kids at all, and I almost feel he has a hard time facing them, too. I think in both our situations this is guilt, and I don't think your fighting the divorce will have any effect on it. I think my ex is so caught up in all this, the divorce was barely real. He has gained about 30lbs. In the beginning, he seemed pretty happy, almost glowing, dressed to kill, acting like a teenager. I now see a man who looks miserable, but continues on his way. I didn't realize it until I began to answer you, but I really think the guilt is worse for him now than it was while he was still married. From what you said about your H, I think his guilt is getting worse, also. I think that is a major reason they avoid the kids. This reply has probably been confusing, but my answer is, the anger and coldness is from guilt and the divorce is just a piece of paper that I think has no effect on how they treat us. If you had agreed to the divorce right away, he would still treat you this way. It comes from their own guilt over what they have done to their families, and the only way I see for the anger to go away is if the OR blows and they are filled with remorse. Sorry I rambled.<BR>Another note I have for you. I notice a lot of people telling you to go on and I know how hard that is to do. I think you are a lot like me, I ask questions because all this seems so insane, and it does help to see that some of these things are typical of betrayers. My ex has made me feel almost crazy and when you can see a pattern in the things they do, somehow it brings you some comfort.<P>AD<BR>

Moving this post up for Nellie.

Up for Nellie

AD,<BR>Thanks for moving this post up for me. I haven't been on much in the last couple of days - I had to drive my daughter back to college.<P>Your description of your ex's behavior sounds so much like my H's (well, except that I have never seen him "dressed to kill" - do new sneakers count?). The avoidance of the kids is what bothers me more than anything - he also won't talk about personal things with the kids. He told me that he wants them to express their feelings, but the kids have told me that he acts like he doesn't want them to. I am somewhat relieved to hear that you don't think my contesting the divorce has any effect on his anger. He does not seem happy either, and almost never looks me in the eye.<P>A couple of days ago our son accidentally hurt his little sister, and instead of apologizing he started yelling at her, saying that she was overreacting, etc. It was a pretty clear demonstration of how easily guilt can turn into anger.<P>And you are right, that seeing a pattern in the behavior of betrayers does bring some comfort.

Okay, I know, I left. But I was just lurking around hoping one time I would see a post from someone already divorced that could actually put what I am going through in perspective. Thank you.....My stbx just gets colder and nastier. He also seems to be sadder and sadder everyday. I don't know if it is a good thing or not...but we have a mutual friend that works with him. (she is really mine) that tells me all the time that he is not the same person she has worked with for 10 years. He is very moody....never smiles......and is very brass to clients on the phone.....does that sound like a happy man to you? But he claims to be so happy and enjoying his new found life. And as sick as it might sound.....I enjoy hearing that he is so unhappy.....I haven't found that sense of closure I need, to want him to find happiness so hearing of his unhappiness somehow makes me happy. I know, not very nice, ecspecially from someone who supposedly loves him as much as I do.<BR>Nancy

Mental,<P>I don't think what you are feeling is at all surprising. My H does not seem happy either. I want him to be happy, but I want him to be happy without making me and the children miserable in the process. I worry that if his relationship with the OW does become long-term, the kids will have the perception that the way to be happy is to do whatever you feel like at the moment, with no regard for the ones who depend on you and love you.

Mental,<P>I too look for his unhappiness. I am always asking his mother does he look happy does he act happy. I think it has nothing to do with our love for them but I keep thinking that if he isn't really happy then one day he will realize it and leave the ow. Then I will have my choice. I think even if you are divorced you never give up hope because you do love them. If the are unhappy then they haven't found what they wanted. So maybe there is a chance.<P>------------------<BR>di<P>

My stbx doesn't show any emotion at all except anger at me. I guess it is the guilt as she is getting what she wants, out of the marriage, pretty much everything she wanted in the settlement and no responsibilities.<P>But everytime she gets a chance, she sticks it to me somehow. She makes it so hard to get over the resentment.<P>I know her well enough that one day the guilt will cause her to crash and then she will be so soory that she has done this to herself.<P>------------------<BR>"You can't always get what you want! But if you try real hard,you might just find, you get what you need!"<BR>Mick Jagger<P>

To all,<P>My ex has also told me he is much happier now. However, his father told me he is not happy and he can tell this whole thing is bothering him. My ex-FIl also said that of course my ex wouldn't let me see that he is unhappy. I really don't think that someone who has gained that much weight can really be happy. I think weight loss shows stress, but weight gain shows depression. <P>RWD,<BR>I agree with you on the guilt. If my ex has one bit of his old self left, I think the guilt will be overwhelming. I've mentioned this before, things are starting to get better for me. Do you think they will get over it, considering all the guilt they have to live with?<P>AD

AD,<P>I agree with you about the weight loss is stress and weight gain is depression. My h has gained weightsince he left. He had loss a lot before stress I am sure and guilt, but we were also trying to lose weight. Now he doesn't have any energy to walk and that is depression to. <P>I can't really see how any of our spouses can be happy they have too much guilt hanging over them. I think that is why the lash out and they lash out at us because we were/are the only good thing in their lives and they feel the guilt in leaving us.<P>------------------<BR>di<P>

I still have to post....I called my stbx because the girls said he needed to talk to me. Being the "happy" man that he is, he says....I have nothing nice to say to you....I'll deal with you in another way. Then when I called the girls at his apartment this morning, he gets on the phone and is so nice. Well, football is on and he wants to know if he can drop them off before the game. I told him I was leaving in about an hour so he would need to drop them off soon or will have to wait until 6:00pm ( the time he is suppose to drop them off). Boy he got them here in lightning speed. He never leaves his car and drives away real slow and just stares at the house and almost looks so sad. I guess that I am his babysitter. I can't make the girls stay there when they want to come home because he is such an angry person and he takes it out on them. But I would love, for once, not to be at his beck and call. It is funny how when they want something they can be so nice.<BR>Nancy