Well guys here's how things stand at this point.<P>I had Mike read the am I insane thread. He saw all answers, execpt Shebas.<P>He then went and disconnected the ICQ, he said.<P>He is very angry with me, I tried to talk to him , to remind him that when he let me know it bothered him for me to be on the phone with a friend of ours and my sisters h , both of whom 's so's had just left them, I stopped talking to them.<BR>His answer, <BR>"I didn't FORCE you to" well no, because he didn't have to force me, all he had to do was let me know it bothered him, and I stopped.<P>He left here angry with me. This isn't what I wanted, I wanted him to stop because he realized it was hurting me and becaused he loved me enough not to want to keep doing that. Not because I FORCED him to. <P>Now I have the joy of waiting to see if he comes home. <P>I may have blown it big time guys. <P>------------------<BR>Just call me - Deb<BR>------------------------<BR>The only day I can do anything about is today, yesterday is gone, tomorrow is not yet mine.<P>

I am so sorry Deb.....<P>I don't understand what goes on in their minds sometimes.....I really don't!!<P>Why don't they think like we do? What you said about you're not being forced is sooooo true. Why would they need to force when we consider their feelings and that is good enough reason for us to do something. What else is needed - I don't get it!! <P>If my post bothers you on the other thread....I'll delete it. Just let me know OK?<P>Love Ya and love him too!! Hope he walks it off and thinks it through!<P>HUGS, PRAYERS AND STRENGTH,<P>Sheba

Deb,<BR>You did not do anything wrong by what you did. You were being honest with him and you tried to get it across to him before. If he cannot handle what you ask him to do I guess he has some introspection to do. He can't live a double standard, you were correct in not talking anymore to the people he has a problem with. You did it out of love and RESPECT. He needs to do the same. Anything else is just selfishness.<BR>Would he rather have you on the path of constant fear? I don't think that lessens with time. It's an oppertunity for your mind to create images. The longer you are there the bigger it gets unless there is reassurance to the contrary. If he would've stopped when you first asked him to perhaps that would have helped in your confidence and after a while of such reassurances you would have enough confidence in the relationship that it would not bother you.... as much.<BR>Best to bring things out and that is what you did. It's not a matter of winning the battle, it's about repairing a marriage. He needs to realize that...<BR>Boy was that long.... sorry<BR>mkn

Sheba,<P>If you delete that post I will be mad at you for sure !<P>He had left for work when I saw it. Please don't do anything to it, maybe he will see it in the morning.<P>Why does this have to be such an issue with him? Oh yeah, because he says "You want to control my life".<P>Once again , AAAAARRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!!!<P>------------------<BR>Just call me - Deb<BR>------------------------<BR>The only day I can do anything about is today, yesterday is gone, tomorrow is not yet mine.<P>

mkn,<P>I just don't know what to do now. Mike is very diffrent from me. He rarely says anything about what he feels. Over the years I have noticed he just lets things build up<BR>and then looks for someone else.<P><BR>I wish I had just kept my big mouth shut and let him do whatever he wanted to. At least if I had I wouldn't be feeling guilty for "FORCING" him to do something he did not want to do, and wouldn't be waiting for the next shoe to drop with my guts in a knot, fear in my heart and with my head pounding.<P>I think I need a good cry now.<P> [img]http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/images/icons/frown.gif[/img] [img]http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/images/icons/frown.gif[/img] [img]http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/images/icons/frown.gif[/img] [img]http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/images/icons/frown.gif[/img] [img]http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/images/icons/frown.gif[/img] [img]http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/images/icons/frown.gif[/img] [img]http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/images/icons/frown.gif[/img] <P>------------------<BR>Just call me - Deb<BR>------------------------<BR>The only day I can do anything about is today, yesterday is gone, tomorrow is not yet mine.<P>

OK - I just didn't want him to get madder if he saw it.....<P>You know....I was leaning towards this being about control....<P>Anything happen or going on that he might be feeling a little dominated by you on? Or maybe at work? Something has him a bit insecure with himself..<P>I think that this is a side issue....the one to use to assert some "pride" control over his life.....<P>What do you think? Is there anything or anyone contributing to this mindset?<P>HUGS,<P>Sheba

Oh Heck Sheba it's probably me, <BR>it's always me, trying to control his life. ::<P>I just wish I knew a way we could have worked this out w/o anyone being hurt (me) or angry (him).<P>He let me know the only reason he disconnected the ICQ was because he was tired of the fighting, not because he didn't want to hurt me anymore. He still says there is no reason for me to feel hurt.<P>Where can I go to get my feelings removed ?<P>------------------<BR>Just call me - Deb<BR>------------------------<BR>The only day I can do anything about is today, yesterday is gone, tomorrow is not yet mine.<P>

Oh Deb,<P>I am soooo sorry! I hope he thinks about how unreasonable he is being! Please don't blame yourself! That is what I tend to do! It really isn't about you, I think it is about his own insecurities. He should realize that it is wrong to carry on relationships in that matter with other women. If he sees it hurts you, that should be enough to make him stop. I wish my husband could see that. If my husband can't get it figured out after this time, I am going to have to leave. I am not going to live my life in despair because my husband can't stay faithful to me. He has known all along how hurt I am by this and yet he has continued to see her. No matter how many times I asked him not to and explained why I didn't want him to, he kept doing it. I don't believe anything he says anymore! <P>I am really sorry and I hope your husband does come around and come home. I think he owes you one heck of an apology!<P>Take care and my thoughts are with you!<P>~Woozy

Hi,<BR>I'm soooo sorry things aren't going well for you. The truth hurts and when faced with the truth, you H got mad. He's turning it around and getting mad at you when in fact he should be mad at himself! Please don't beat yourself up! You sound so much like me. I have taken on my husband's blame and his shame for everything he's done. It's not your fault sweetie. You said, "I may have blown it big time guys". You did not blow anything Deb! He's the one blowing it.<BR>WS- you mentioned your and Deb's H might be twins. I propose their actually triplets and my H is brother #3! Deb- your H's statement,"you want to control my life", is almost exactly what I hear from mine!<BR>WS & Deb, our H's are either jerks OR we ARE b*tches...lol I get called that ALOT! If I'm honest I'll admit I AM one sometimes <BR>Anyway, like I tell my H in an eerie vampiric voice,"you created this monster".<BR>Deb- hang in there and keep us posted.<P>------------------<BR>For I know the thoughts I think<BR>toward you, saith the Lord,<BR>thoughts of peace, not of evil,<BR>to give you an expected end.<BR>Jeremiah 29:11<BR>

I believe this is what they call the "blame game". I really don't think you were wrong in what you felt and asked of him. But he doesn't wnt to see it that way so nothing you can do will change the way he feels-at least right now. I think all you need to do at this point is focus on you-marriage is about working together. He isn't working on this one with you at all-from what I read here. So you just do what you have to!<P>Hugs and prayers-<P><P>------------------<BR>*heartache*<BR>"Loyalty Is A Two Way Street"<BR>

OH, my, I never got the chance to post your other thread and now this....<P>It's not your "fault", Deb. He's probably angry b/c he knows somewhere in there that he SHOULD be thinking of your feelings but he doesn't want to and that bothers him. The only thing left to do is get angry with you.<P>He'll calm down. Maybe you guys can talk a little. <P>Lots of hugs for you.<P>Lori

Having had a good cry and a nap I'm back.<P>First let me say that as far as I know nothing inappropreate was being said betten him and these women. It wasn't the content that bothered me so much, it was , partly, that he spends hours of his off days online and when they are on he's talking to them.<BR>And not to me. If was talking to men too it might not be so bad. Or maybe it would I don't know. Maybe this is about me and how insecure I am, and I really am. Gee I wonder why <P>I don't know what the answer is.<P>Woozy,<P>Look at what you are going through, and here you are comforting me. You are someting else lady . And I won't hold my breath till he says he's sorry. He's just not going to, it's not his way. After all I am trying to control him <P>Kyra,<P>I believe all people are related to each other somewhere down the line, but this is rediculi (plural rediculas ?) You are another of the wonder ful people who is reaching out of thier own stom to help. ,<BR>maybe we are being those things, (Mike tells me I'm being "one of those things" instead of call just calling me a b****.<P>Heartache,<P>Do you know my h? I think you are right.<BR>and a big smiley to you too, it's not like you guys don't have problems of your own. <P>Lori,<P>I doubt it because you see I am not one of his female friends that he can play knight in shing armor too. You too get a big smiley my friend. <P><BR>I just wish the absolute trust would come back, but maybe it's better this way, ::shrug:: I don't know.<BR><P>------------------<BR>Just call me - Deb<BR>------------------------<BR>The only day I can do anything about is today, yesterday is gone, tomorrow is not yet mine.<P>

Deb - You know I love you.....<P>Why are you taking a legitimate problem - and the basis of a bigger problem like this ICQ - and minimizing your reaction to it? Cuz he got mad?<P>Hon - You have learned about infidelity!! You have learned how things happen!!! You have comprehended what to do and not to do to have a fulfilling relationship!!! Am I right?<P>Your reaction to his doings came from those learnings.....from a woman who recognized the signs of a misstep in the renewed course of the marriage and you took action to avoid any further traveling of the wrong road!!! Mike is the one who hasn't seemed to LEARN anything!!!!!<P>Stop chewing on the GUILTIES!!!! I will not let you go there!!!! Do you hear!!!<P>Yes, there may be some residual insecurities mixed in - and there should be!!! It's your warning alarm in your brain. His should have been going off also......maybe he needs new batteries!!!!<P>You are not going to slip backwards with the selfworth issues that you have fought so long and hard to gain some ground on.....I won't let you Deb....<P>So, KNOCK IT OFF!!!!! I love you and Mike loves you - even if he is being a nincompoop!!!!!!<P>Go back to thinking logically here!!! Don't get scared cuz he got mad....what - you want your life to be pussyfooting around what makes him mad? I don't think so Deb....that is not what a relationship is about!!!!<P>USE WHAT YOU HAVE LEARNED!!!!!!!<P>Remind Mike of what he has learned!!!<P>HUGS,<P>Sheba

Deb, remember the POJA ... and remmber what the definition of an affair is!<P>Granted, it's not really and affair, but it is definitely something to which you have not enthusiastically agreed!! Heck, you have adamantly <B>disagreed</B>!<P>You didn't <B>force</B> him to do a darned thing! You expressed the way you felt about something hurtful he was doing and then he made the decision - feeling resentful because he <B>knows</B> it is wrong. And perhaps guilty, too.<P>Remember - we cannot force them to do ANYTHING. ALL of their actions are their own choices.<P>------------------<BR>terri<BR>I believe in miracles...<P><BR>

Geez....<P>Forgot to ask if you think there could be a better approach in communicating this - <P>Was mucho LB'g done? Or was it a calm statement of fact from the learned do's and don'ts? Could there be a better way of speaking with him when he is in this frame of mind....not a weaker one - but a common sense one that he might receive better?<P>I ask so that you can be better prepared for when you do talk with him.....<P>It's good to have a plan on your approach to him.....<P>MORE BIG HUGS,<P>Sheba

First, those new big smileys are ugly ewww, I wouldn't have given them to Y'all if I had known what looked like .<P>Terri, and Sheba.<P>I just don't know. I am sorry Sheba, but pussyfooting seems easier today than this big knot in my chest.<P>As far as the talks about they have been from calm talks , half joking remarks to yes full blown stop that bs yelling on my part.<P>I can't even really say there have been many fights. He usually just says nothing at all. Clams up , stuffs.<P>I really am afraid of what will happen because of this, Mike has a creed, don't get mad, get even. He may not do anything for a long time but I am sure he is mad enough that i will pay for this emotionaly, sooner or later<P>------------------<BR>Just call me - Deb<BR>------------------------<BR>The only day I can do anything about is today, yesterday is gone, tomorrow is not yet mine.<P>

HI Deb, is bozo slipping back into noncommunicado mode with you? He was doing absolutely great for awhile there, and now seems to be holding back again? <BR>Something struck me as I read your post...th icq takes time, and it takes communication but it is more on an impersonal level. So he wants to talk, but not deep and serious as with you? And you two have such a small amt of time together that I can see why you would be annoyed. I might be downright pissed!! <BR>Bozo, i bet you read this....your wife wants to be your best friend and she is reaching out to you. I can see why you were angry, and maybe there is a control issue going on, but if you look at it simply, I think she is trying to say that she loves your company and wants to spend more time with you. Pretty frustrating situation because it is soemthing you like that is making her fearful and feeling neglected. <BR>Where can you compromise deb? Do you trust him? Is the issues trust, time, control, or ??? Try to nail it down, then you can come up with something that will work for both. If it is time, then agree on certain day or times-like whe you are not home, or for an hour in the eve or ??? As long as it does not keep him from coming to bed with you!?!? If it is trust, then maybe all icq couls be with both of you? Cuddle up in front of the computer together and 'talk' to whoever. You will come up with something deb. YOu always do. (((hugs))) cl

cl,<P>Hey, hmm, you ask some interesting questions. My issues are the time and trust. To be honest, no cl I don't trust him. I just don't dare, been there done that and got hurt everytime. I may be wrong, I usually am.<P>Yes he read this thread this morning, he read the "Am I insane " one yesterday. He just doesn't get it.<P><BR>NOW FOR AN UPDATE,<P>We talked this morning, I am still wrong to feel the way I do, according to Mike . He kept talking on ICQ hoping things would just calm down ( Mikes brain "hmmm, I'm doing something that hurts my wife, that makes her angry and upsets her, but if I keep it up maybe she will stop being upset about it" ).<P>Of course he is going to email these women telling them he can't ICQ them anymore because it is causing problems. I don't care , if they get mad at me, they get mad.<BR> <P>Oh and joy of joys now I find out that one of these women is seeing a MM, of course "he's getting a divorce" yuck ! <P>But there is NOTHING for me to be upset about. <P>AAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!! <BR>Oh he did say I love you and I'm sorry if I hurt you, I didn't mean to, before he went to bed. <P>IF??????????????<P>Please does someone, anyone have a clue I can give this man ? I am sooooooooo <BR>------------------<BR>Just call me - Deb<BR>------------------------<BR>The only day I can do anything about is today, yesterday is gone, tomorrow is not yet mine.<P><p>[This message has been edited by Bozos_ Deb (edited January 13, 2000).]

Just bringing this to the top for the update.<P>------------------<BR>Just call me - Deb<BR>------------------------<BR>The only day I can do anything about is today, yesterday is gone, tomorrow is not yet mine.<P>

Oh Deb,<P>I hope things are working out for you! I hope your husband will come around! I do wish they could figure it all out. My husband was a great husband until 2 and a half months ago. Now I don't even know him anymore! I am starting to think I don't want to know him anymore. He is treating me horribly and he knows it. The worst thing is that he is so good at lying to me. BUT, I am catching on to the lies! Basically, I don't believe a word he says!<P>I hope your husband snaps out of it! Take care!<P>~Woozy