I have written on the prayer request forum and really have not had any reply- I have read and prayed for everyone in this forum and have no idea of how rampant infidelity is......<P>I need prayer and a miracle- we don;t have alcohol or drug abuse issues- we don't have any of the issues that I read about- but if you read my first prayre request you will see my story.<P>my husband befriended a person who will not stop calling and emailing him- he says he had had no affair of any sort but I can't get him to tell her or write her that this is innappropriate- we have gotten back together after a brief separation. He married me with 3 children- older - never been married, foreign and we had a baby and started a business immediately.......<P><BR>He exploded after a time of saying everything was great. His entire life changed from a fast paced international career to something he always wanted- a family.<P>At Christmas the email arrived. She wrote of what they had together-thanked him for his help- quite formal until she said that she would have followed him around the world- there was no love or sex referral- I wrote back and asked her to call me, quite nicely . She wrote my husband and stated that I was in denial and pulling some trick....we were together at that time and a new committment had been made. she said that she had left her children for him to move across the country but now she was back with her husband. Her next email came a few days later and said that she would be in the area soon and would be free for 2 days and wanted to see him. She is inconsistent- If we were back together- that is not denial that is a fact- my email should have turned the light bulb on- My h says she must be a little crazy because the emails do not match.<P>Would it be possible for my supporters to email her prayers and other messeges on infidelity? anonymously.<P>I am afraid that If I email her again it will start a mistrust with my husband. she will start up again....<P>Do I trust that my husband is telling the truth? I have tried to let go and let God...<P>I just don't want the whole family hurting again....<P>and I think that he may have not realized that anytype of opposite sex friendship can be inappropriate...<P>Please help with prayers, emails to her and your advice. I wish someone would respond.....<P>her email is cynatkins@yahoo.com if you care to send messages of prayer and to let her know she is hurting so many people...ask God to remove this evil and send The Spirit to my h and to her and to redeem and deliver them. We are so in love and get along like best friends that is why this is so confusing..........please help us.....<P>------------------<BR>Sad MOM<BR>

Welcome <B>sad mom</B>, to the Marriage Builders - Infidelity Forum.<P>I'll give you some general information first... then some specifics on your questions...<P>The people here represent both betrayed spouses and betrayers(waywards) alike and the occasional Other Woman/Man/Person (OW/OM/OP).<BR><B>All</B> of us are really here to try and build or rebuild our marriages... and we are trying to use principles and concepts that are espoused by Dr. Willard Harley of Marriage Builders(MB).<P>There is a wealth of information here at this site, starting from the <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/" TARGET=_blank>Marriage Builder's Home Page</A>.<P>If you're new to the ideas being presented here at MB start off with <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3000_intro.html" TARGET=_blank>Dr. Harley's Basic Concepts</A>.<P>Many of us need to start immediately working on our marriages and a <B>sound</B> understanding of <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan A and Plan B</A> is crucial! You need to be in <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan A</A> immediately!<P>You'll see a barrage of "terms" which you might guess the meaning of... but an alternative is to look up what they mean at this site... Words like (click on them to find out):<BR><A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3400_lovebust.html" TARGET=_blank>Love Busters</A>, <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3200_love.html" TARGET=_blank>Love Bank</A>, <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3300_needs.html" TARGET=_blank>Emotional Needs</A>, <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3550_give.html" TARGET=_blank>Giver and Taker</A>, <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3500_policy.html" TARGET=_blank>The Policy of Joint Agreement(POJA)</A>.<P>You'll need to learn more about, not just marriage building... but self building too! The learning isn't going to happen overnight though... look at the <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8100_article.html" TARGET=_blank>Articles</A> and <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5525_qa.html" TARGET=_blank>Infidelity Q&A</A>.<BR>The real learning is best aided by obtaining some of the books from the <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6000_bookstore.html" TARGET=_blank>MB Bookstore</A>... of most important for those who have affairs in progress, or soon to be, is <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6070_sa.html" TARGET=_blank>"Surviving An Affair"</A> by Dr. Willard Harley. <B>This is the 'bible' for this forum.</B><BR>Other books can be very useful as well... like <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6020_needs.html" TARGET=_blank>"His Needs, Her Needs"</A>, <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6030_love.html" TARGET=_blank>"Love Busters"</A>, and <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6010_give.html" TARGET=_blank>"Give & Take: The Secret to Marital Compatibility"</A>.<BR>There will be many other good books that the MB people will recommend... take their advice... they've been around. There is a post that lists many of these non-Harley book recommendations... <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum1/HTML/010158.html" TARGET=_blank>Books... books... books... (again)</A>.<P>Most of all... you will find <B>compassion</B> and <B>love</B> here. No judging... no demeaning... no malice here!<BR>The people here have all had their lives thrown into a whirlwind of despair, confusion, and sadness.<BR>We've all experience gut wrenching emotions that we though could never exist, in anyone's idea of humanity.<BR>Feelings of hatred, love, disillusionment, envy, rejection, emptiness, <B>deep depression</B>, and on and on...<P>Just the books and facts aren't going to get you through it all... not without <B>support</B>. That's where <B>we</B> come in! <B>We</B> care... because <B>we</B> know how it feels. Believe it... <B>You are <I>not</I> alone</B>! <BR>Come to this forum to vent... to cry... to laugh (a little)... to express your feelings... to advise others... or just to get away!<BR>You're probably going through H*!! right now... don't go it alone... remember... <B>you are <I>not</I> alone</B>! <P>We can give you help... to build back many vital aspects of your life and sanity. <P>Post... Post... Post... Reply... Reply... Reply... READ! READ! READ!<P>I've been speaking in behalf of some dear friends... as well as some complete strangers too..., when I've used <B>"we"</B>!<BR>But... if you're here... join in with them... they <B>will</B> join in with you. <B>We</B> do not always agree with each other on how to handle situations... but each of us is offering to you advice base on individual experiences. Search out those people on the forum that have experiences similar to yours... and ask... ask... ask! <P>----------------------------<P>OK, some specifics...<P>Praying we will alway do...<P>Sending e-mail to the OW is considered a <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3400_lovebust.html" TARGET=_blank>Love Buster</A>... and goes against <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan A</A>!<P>It sounds like you H is very willing to have you meet his <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3300_needs.html" TARGET=_blank>Emotional Needs</A>! That's great, because it is in line with <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan A</A>!<P>Prayers from me... <P>Jim<BR>---------------------------------<BR>Where two or more are gathered...

Thank you for answering and for constant prayer- this is at a crossroads-H business partner told him that he needed counselling and that he wants out of the business....so it is obvious that there is something wrong- hitting rock bottom is growth- hopefully he finds his way back to us...<P>did not mean to be vindictive when asking forum mates to email OW- if that what she is <BR>in fact- just to enlighten her by spreading the Word.....<P>thanks again for your constant prayers- life is a struggle these days, feel like exploding sometimes- 4 kids job no $$ all of the above but a love that is there so intensley but fear when he gets too close............<P><BR>please pray for a miracle of Divine Intervention today while I read your suggested articles- thank you for the bottom of my heart- you are the only one who is answering.......<P>------------------<BR>Sad MOM<BR>

sad mom,<P>Fridays, Saturdays and Sundays...<BR>you will find are fairly slow here...<P>Be patient... the replies will come... <P>There is a slight bit of turmoil since about 8 of the regulars/semi-regulars at the forum have reached a point where they see a need for a "break" away from the forum. It is disheartening to have friends move on... but a time will come for each of us to move on, even from such a helpful place as this. <P>About your point...<P>E-mailing the OW is really counter-productive. There are many things that many have tried on this forum... e-mailing the OP has <B>never</B> worked... in fact it has almost always, made it worse.<P>One of the best things about this forum is you can learn (if you want to) from the mistakes we make!<P>I will pray for a miracle of Divine Intervention... today... for you!<P>Jim

God Bless you- you made me cry- to know that someone out there really cares......<P>thank you for your continued support and love in the Spirit......<P>stopped wondering why I am being tested so- watched one of my children deal with a brain tumor and other things along the way and now the most feared imaginable- <P>whew thanks again I will continue to read this.<P>------------------<BR>Sad MOM<BR>

<small>[ January 24, 2005, 10:02 AM: Message edited by: hanora ]</small>

you are so right....it is so hard to write in a nutshell what is going on and what led to all of this and make sense of it all...<P>I have done so much in my lifetime and was looking forward to a peaceful future for with a spouse that I have waited for all my life.<P>I am a retired police officer/paramedic and have modeled and acted professionally in motion pictures.<P>I have kept a wonderful- not perfect home and been a devoted mom and wife forever.<P>many sacrifices we make- when my h is home I have always waited on him hand and foor- his needs come first- I do not play games nor do I go out (no time) with other interests..etc. I think that is what is saving us at this point.<P>I am showing him by actions what love really is and he has always been "self first". Apparently he is pressuring himself to conform and he is in major conflict of what is right and what he feels- I think it is fear but I know how much he loves us.<P>His past is colorful- international fairly famous race car career- married very late and he is adjusting- he will never admit it..just says I was always wrong...<P>now he has come around to say that he sees how hard I work , he feels bad that I do- he cannot do what I do and I think he is frustrated that he is not equal to me in that respect....I cannot second guess him-only try and keep lines open at a loving nuturing homw- all friends etc tell me to tell him not to come back- orto play those ultimatum games- I will not risk the relationship nor the baby's future by playing those games...just at wits end- but the love and passion is there- thanks for listening and you will never know how much I appreciate it..<P>I just give too much........... <P>------------------<BR>Sad MOM<BR>

<small>[ January 24, 2005, 10:00 AM: Message edited by: hanora ]</small>

I usually am....it is so hard tho when he is around to be so perfect , you know- keep praying.<P>It is amazing how many lives that I have touched through rescue and police work, the people I have counselled- lives saved....and one is helpless when it comes to oneself- <P>thanks for the help- keep asking God for a miracle , thanks!!! <P>------------------<BR>Sad MOM<BR>

need help fast!!!!!!!!!!!!<P>Just as things were coming together- big time he snapped and said he never wanted to talk to me again.....<P>we looked at houses- he was ready to buy...yesterday...somethng snapped and he accused me of looking htrough his things...snap he left.... now he says he never wants to talk to me again- we had planned a trip as well....do I get tough and play that game or what ? Do they get too close and snap - is he guilty of something?/<P><BR>Pleae help me- I am truly headed for a heart attack- or worse....<P>------------------<BR>Sad MOM<BR>

SadMom,<P>Unfortunately, the relationship with this ow is inappropriate. The hard part is your h does not realize it. Take a good look at yourself. You can only work on yourself, not your h. Read all of the basic principles here on the MB websight. Concentrate on Plan A. Try to figure out what emotional needs this ow is meeting for your h. You need to start working on meeting those needs. Right now, unfortuately, you are going to be the one that does all of the work, your h will probably do very little. The greatest thing that I have learned is that I was very selfish in our marriage. I wanted all of my needs met, but was unwilling to work on the things that are important to my husband. I am learning that by giving a little of myself, I get so much more in return. Find someone who you can really talk to that will support you. Go to work and become the best person you can be. A great book to read is "How One of You Can Keep the Two of You Together" by Susan Page.

{{{{{sad mom}}}}},<P>I'm not clear on everything here...<BR>You said... "all friends etc tell me to tell him not to come back"....<P>Does that mean he has moved out?<BR>To be with the OW?<P>You ask "do I get tough and play that game or what?"... the right answer is a resounding <B>NO</B>... stick to <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan A</A>... like you've been doing through your whole marriage!<P>"is he guilty of something?"... it's hard to say... One of the quotes from Dr. Harley is... <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Wayward spouses do not necessarily have a history of lying, but their affair turns them into masters of deception. (page 40 of <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6070_sa.html" TARGET=_blank>"Surviving An Affair"</A>)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>...does that mean your H is deceiving you... I can't say for sure... and only you can pull that information out of your H.<P>More prayers to you...<P>Do get the book <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6070_sa.html" TARGET=_blank>"Surviving An Affair"</A>... it will help you!<P>Jim

sad mom<BR>Right now you must do anything that you can to help YOU stay calm. deep breathing, a short walk, shower....anything.<BR>In these situations, unfortunately, there are many times that feel like "the end of the world". Hang in there. <BR>Your H is probably very confused. He may swing back and forth through these moods many times. He knows decisions have to be made but is probably doing anything he can to avoid them because of the state of confusion.<BR>It is quite common for major life changing events to trigger something like this.<BR>The best thing you can do is make it comfortable for him to be with you. That means avoiding lovebusters. Stay calm. <BR>You can't control anything he says or does but you can take care of you!<BR>My prayers are with you!

Thank you so much for your help- to answer some questions....<P>the ow - there is ro real evidence of an affair- lives out of town and saw H in a business sense- he helperd her with something. She continued to write and call him and some of what I saw could have been taken to read that she was falling for him as her marriage was unstable. H agreed that this was not appropriate and he would not answer her back ever. However I found her numbers (one had been disconnect) the other day after he said he no longer had her numbers. She continues to email him but I don;t have evidence that he is continuing this . As I said there is no real evidence and at Christmas he reaffirmed his loyality for us and the family.<P>The subject kept coming up- we are on the brink of living together again , buying a house and he snapped last night and said that I was snooping .. He never wanted to see me again.<P>I have met all of his emotional needs by the book.<BR>He has never met mine- It is not enough just to say it -I must see it or feel it and thiswill take a little effort on his part. And patience on mine.<P>Should I email him and let him know that I love him and I am sad that he thinks that I went through his things, and if that is what he thinks he should be honored taht I love him that much to stand by ..<P>His only emotional need that has been met by her is that of being the star. Rescued a damsel in distress. Now he says that she is unstable- master of deception? Who knows, <P>It's easy to get someone's admiration when they dont know that you are projecting who you wish everyone to see you as. <P>I am not so worried about an affair as I am this...does he snap when he gets too close to moving back? Responsibility, pressure, etc?<P>Do I email him today? His father just spoke with him to calm him down and said thinks will smooth out. He is a christian man who is a scientist in Africa.<P>My christian counsellor says not to call or anything- I feel this man needs support and love. I will not apologize for what he thinks to be true but just to let him know that I want to resume where we left off and to celebrate his birthday together. And to let him know in such a way taht our children are suffering everytime he walks out. Their worlds are shaken.<P>Can someone help? Should I not get in touch with him at all? Let Go and Let God? How - what does he want me to do??????? Please help- tears are streaming down as I try to work. I have been going through this supporting him for 9 months now. <P>------------------<BR>Sad MOM<BR>

anyone else out there??????????<P>------------------<BR>Sad MOM<BR>

Hanora- it is on page three-"help"<P>everything is so up and down now- he has put a contract on a home for us and then walked out an hour later as he thought I was looking thru his rolodex.....he is so afraid of intimacy- he has not withdrawn the contract but has not spoken much with me...<P>All I can do is wait it out and pray.......<P>------------------<BR>Sad MOM<BR>

He is using threats against you to scare you to back down in finding out the truth. It sounds like you are all over the place emotionally with this thing. You need to calm down and get a clear head. No one can ever make sensible decisions when there is anger or confusing going on. Take a breath and really think about the situation at hand. It sounds like there is a lot about their "relationship" that you don't know. And if it is as cut and dry as a simple friendship then this woman should have been included in your life as well as his. You can not force someone to tell you the truth, and it sounds like your H is taking the easy way out, by threatening to leave everytime you become curious. Yes, he feels no respect from you by your snooping, but you have to give respect in order to receive it. And he is not respecting you or your marriage by not letting this woman know that he is committed to you. The proof is in the actions. But first, GET YOURSELF TOGETHER EMOTIONALLY so that no matter what happens you can care for yourself and your kids.

please go to" emergency........"<P>I messed up.......<P>------------------<BR>Sad MOM<BR>

SadMom,<BR>I saw your reply from another post and wanted to remind you to stay grounded and focused.<P>I, too, was a sad mom, having met many, most of my husbands needs for along time and feeling blindsided by his actions. I kind of knew there were a couple of things he would have like differently but I felt the BIG Picture balanced those things out. <P>You know what, they didn't and we struggled for what is now a short time...but a year ago...every day felt like forever !<P>Do you need him ? Does he know you need him ? I quickly tried to get up to speed with your story so I may be prematurely guessing but you seem pretty well put together and you said from your post....he got a kick from saving/protecting....her.<P>Some of the earlier baby steps in our recovery came from me letting go and LETTING him help himself, me and our family. I made it really easy for him....but I've come to realize that for him ....easy...translated to not needing him which obviously meant I coulnd't or didn't care. It's not logical but it makes sense from his perspective. <P>The needing I'm talking about is not merely the "help with the chores" stuff. I'm talking about help making family decisions. What do we do on the weekends ? How do we spend our money, etc....<P>Believe me, you have time if you keep yourself on even keel. Don't push him out the door and into someone else. Please read all the stuff mentioned in NSR's post and move all over this site if time is permitting. If you err, err on the side of caution...and post back with your thoughts and your status.<P>Much good luck !<BR>-Tina

Oops...should be a new posting<p>[This message has been edited by Dazed and Confused (edited January 18, 2000).]