Where to begin? My wife of 9 yrs. has left me. We have been separated for a week now. We seemed to have a major communication block one year ago which led to my seeking attention from another woman. I left my wife then. It didnt take me long to figure out what I had done. She let me back in. Now, a year later, she says she can't get over what happened and she wants time and a separation to decide if she is "in love with me." She wants me to leave her alone but I cant seem to do it. I love and miss her greatly and I don't know how I can accomplish this and convince her that I do love her. By the way, we have two wonderful kids ages 7 and 5. They are hurting also. What have I done and how can I fix it? Please help.

chris2fur,<P>After reading your post I would like to give you the best advise that I can. Although you have made some past mistakes that you seem to regret deeply, there is no (quick fix)for a troubled marriage. Your wife has come to a point where everything is comming to the surface with her. This could be a positive sign of healing for your marriage, but it could also not be a good sign. What I mean by that is when things have happened in a marriage that have caused alot of anger and pain and resentment, if there hasnt been complete healing in your marriage regarding the issue than it will keep comming up again and again until there is healing. If your wife wants your marriage to work than she will allow the healing and forgivness to happen at some point. Trust is a big Value in any marriage. Thats where you need to begin. Your wife may also want to go the other direction and not put any more effort in trying anymore. Time will tell where she is at. Marriage takes two, your wife needs to work at it just as much as you. <P> It may be whats best for your wife to have some time away. As long as you continue to let your wife know that you love her and want her to Trust you again. Is not an easy road back to recovery when Trust has been violated in a marriage. Its a long windy road that can seem endless, but if you want your wife back you may have to wait it out until she is ready to come back. You want your marriage to be strong again.You may want to consider going to a Marriage counselor, for both of you at some point. <P> The most important direction you can go with your situation is to continue to let your wife know that you want to Build the Trust back into your marriage. You want to have a Strong and Beautiful marriage, and your there for her. Give her some time away if thats what its going to take.<P> Your marriage can become a strong marriage. Hopefully your wife will hold on to her marriage vows and come back soon.Since You mentioned that there was a big communication block between you and your wife about a year ago, then you both need to get a healthy communication flow going again. This is where a marriage counselor can be very helpfull. If you feel like there still hasnt been good communication between you and your wife than you will need to try to find ways of talking to each other more and understanding each other. Getting your wife to open up to you and for her to let you know what shes been feeling would be a very healthy start for communicating. If she does start to open up to you, than its important for you to listen with an understanding ear and hear her out. Hopefully she will listen also............Violet1<BR><p>[This message has been edited by violet1 (edited July 04, 1999).]

Thanks for the reply violet1. I talked with my wife last night after reading your response. We talked calmly, which can be an obstacle for me at this time. I told her how I felt, that we both neglected each others needs and ignored all the warning signs that we just werent able to see. Her response seems to always be the same. She doesn't want to put the kids through another separation again and herself. She just doesnt think shes in love with me anymore. I guess I have hurt her to the point where she feels thats the only out. I love her very much. I asked her last night to be thinking of a way to be able to verbalize the hurt and pain I have caused her. She needs to talk to me. Thats where we have a problem. Im going to give her some time and ask her another day, say in a week or so, how she feels about what happened and hopefully she will open up to me. She says she cant tell me because it would just hurt me. I can be strong and cope with it if she will just give me the chance to do so. I hope that we can salvage this. That its really not too late. Chris2fur

Just a note to let you know how things are going. My wife has been very receptive to my discussions lately. I dont know if I am getting through to her or not, but she seems to listen. I have to hold on and pray that she does. She came over to pick up my kids today and we hugged and kissed several times. I dont know for sure what this means, but it makes me feel great and that maybe, just maybe, all hope is not lost. I told her again today to be preparing to talk to me about our past and get it out. I want her to get it out in the open so we can work on it. Chris

Chris2fur,<P> Its great to see things looking positive for you. You are on the right track. I cant stress enough how important communication is in a marriage. Especially when there is problems that need to be dealt with. Just continue to be patient with your wife, as she opens up to you day by day.Your marriage can become strong and Beautiful in time...........Violet1

Violet1,<P>We have talked again tonight on the phone. Im a little more concerned than I was earlier. She keeps telling me that now she feels so much better to be out of here and away from me. She says it feels so right to be wrong. She is only right now doubting herself because of our children. She says she cant stay with me just for them. I know that, but they are an extention and living proof of our love for each other. They beg her daily for us to live with each other and it has only been almost 2 weeks. God love them. They are so sweet and caring. Atleast I have done that much right in my life, or should I say, WE did that right. My 7 yr old daughter was hugging her today when she came to get them and I was standing there and she pulled me over to her and my wife and said, "This is how I want my family to be. Happy together." Mighty powerful words from a 7 yr old. My wife tells her its ok, that some grown ups go through this and to think about all her friends that are from separated homes. Oh well, time will tell. My wife said she is afraid to tell me she loves me sometimes because she thinks I take it the wrong way. She says that there are different kinds of love and she will always love me. But in other words, she cant for sure decide if she is in love with me. Am I setting myself up or what? I know my feelings. I hate that it has taken this to show me. Guess I feel sorta hopeless and helpless right now. God, give me the strength. Chris

Chris2fur,<P>Its never wrong to hope for family wholeness and healing in a marriage.Especially your own. Your not setting yourself up by trying to resolve things. You have taken important steps forward, although your not seeing much progress in your efforts, they are steps being taken (and nessessary steps).<P> I know its all easier said then done,but you just can't sit there with all your feeling bottled up and not try,especially when you are so willing to work on the problems so things can be better.It may take praying alot for your wife.. that she will soften her heart and begin to respond back to you in a more positive way.I dont know whats going on inside your wife. Its hard to determine some eles state of mind or what they may be feeling. I do know that at some point she will need to repond and face her marriage. Right now she seems to be running from it and not wanting to deal with anything. Hopefully she will realize how much its hurting you and the kids and come to her senses.Just hang in there........Violet1 <P>

Violet1,<P>Today I sent her a couple of emails and she wrote something like this back "Ok, I know you love me. But do you remember when we were first starting to develop a relationship and you chased me all the time and I didnt want to go out with you? You can overdo somethings. Just relax and calm down." Theres my only hope right there. Leave her alone. No calls, which have slowed already to a minimum, no emails, no nothing. Make her wonder what am I up to? She calls me mostly now as it is. Usually something about the kids, but I think sometimes just to check on me and see what Im doing. Who knows? I want to date her again. Play hard to get I guess. Ill keep you posted. Your replies are so very welcomed. Thanks. Chris<BR>

Violet 1<P>Your last reply to Chris could have been to me. In fact as I read it, it ministered to me about my situation.<P>I have been married for 33 years this month and separated for the past 3-1/2 years. I have dealt with every issue that caused the separation, God has/is changing me. But my wife refuses to see the changes.<P>During the separation there have been huge gaps of no communication/contact (14 months, 4-1/2 months and several 2-3 month periods.<P>When we were dating, it wasn't consistent. We have 4 children (youngest 18) and my wife was gone overseas on business and missed my 18 year olds high school graduation and 18th birthday a couple of months ago.<P>She says she has been running and if she comes back, it will be next February. She says it is over and that 'the fat lady has sung'. However, on April 16th, 2 days before she left, we had breakfast that morning and she wrote me a note saying: "it ain't over til the fat lady sings and she ain't sung yet" and signed it Love,.........<P>Yes, less than 2 months later a total turn around in her letter to me. It is sad because we are both Christians and we love the Lord. She will be 55 this month and I wonder if she might be going thru the change of life?<P>You are so right and even my daughter has told me that I don't know what is going on inside her or how God is dealing with her. I just can't see giving up on 33 years of marriage.<P>Anyway, I receive your reply to Chris for myself (if you don't mind).<P>Chris:<P>I Read your latest post and please, please take it from me; with 3-1/2 years of separation under my belt I have learned somethings the hard way.<P>The absolute worse thing you can do is to chase or pursue your wife! Even my wife told me a couple of years ago when we were dating, "have you noticed, I have been pursuing you".<P>I don't like games and playing hard to get, but I have learned the best thing you can do is to NOT call your wife, NOT chase or pursue her and even avoid contact if necessary.<P>Make her wonder what's going on. Let there be an element of 'mystery' about you and what you're doing. I have seen this work in my own situation and IF I have had any success at all, it has been when I have taken my hands totally off of the situation, left her completely alone, didn't write, call or try to contact her.<P>I promise you, the latest e-mail from your wife is right on! Don't chase her...you will only push her away and prolong the situation.<P>It is becoming evident to me that women are funny in this area. If we chase/pursue them, they run. But, if we don't, they will pursue/chase us?<P>When I first separated, my son (age 25) gave me what I felt was some very practical and down to earth wisdom. He said "Let Mom do all the driving and you just sit in the passenger seat".<P>In other words, let her control the situation and call the shots. <P>Anyway....like you, I too 'screwed up' but always remember with men things are impossible, but with God ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE!<P>Every failure is redemptive, IF it has been dealt with.<P>[censored]<BR>

Chris:<P>I just re-read your post and something you mentnioned triggered another thought in me.<P>Your wife said to "relax". My wife has told me several times to "just rest and not expect so much".<P>As difficult as it may seem, most of the time the hardest thing you can DO is to DO NOTHING!<P>[censored]

Chris2fur,<P>Just would like to clear up any confusion that you might be feeling. [censored] mentioned that the worst thing you can do is pursue your wife. No that is really not the worst thing that you could do.You and your wife have just recently come to a point of separation. Its really not the time to sit around and play hard to get. Its vitally important that you let your wife know early on..that you want more than anything to love her and you see where mistakes have been made...and you want to work them out. <P> Like I mentioned in the earlier post, your wife will need to respond at some point.Chris you have made alot of important steps in trying to save your marriage. Its only human to do so. <P> Chris you will know how much you want to keep persuing your wife. There is alittle truth in Dicks comments, since you have tryed to get your wife back...the ball is in her court now.Its abvious that there is only so much that a person can do, now its up to her. You may at some point want to just back off completely,or for a period of time and see if she will respond back. Separation can be a Big waiting game until one is willing to deal with the marriage.<P> From a Christian point of view, this would be a good place to camp for a while on this scripture ......God is our refuge and strength, a very present help in trouble...Psalms 46:1 .........Violet1<P> Have a wonderful Day!!!<P>[This message has been edited by violet1 (edited July 09, 1999).]<p>[This message has been edited by violet1 (edited July 09, 1999).]

Violet1<P>Maybe the use of the word "worse thing you can do" was extreme. However, I have learned much wisdom over the past 3+ years and much of what I have read on this site + others, all say the same thing concerning leaving the spouse who left/departed alone and giving them time/space.<P>If I would have followed my own advice early on in the separation, I don't think I would still be separated.<P>You sound like a fellow believer and without trying to defend myself, you said there was 'a little truth' in my post....I feel there was 'much' truth.<P>But, then again I guess we can disagree agreeably.<P>That was a good scripture you gave Chris<BR>(Psalms 46:1) and again, your post to him still ministered to me.<P>CHRIS<P>Sorry if I did cause any confusion as each case is different.<P>Perhaps I was trying to make a formula out of what worked for me or what I know now I should have done.<P>Guess the best advice I could give you would be....."follow your heart"<P>[censored]

[censored],<P> I know that persuing a person too much wouldnt be good, thats why I did state that Chris will want to back down at some point for a period of time. I do agree that when one spouse or the other wants space,then you should give them space, but its not a time to play games either. Its important to get things out into the open when you feel the opportunity is there. If a spouse is willing to listen, then its time to speak, and listen like wise. Only Chris will be the one to determine when its a good time to persue or not. I guess you summed it up in your last sentance that Chris will have to follow his own Heart.Also I was glad to be able to minister to you also.Psalms 46:1 is a good place to live. ......Violet1 <P> Hi Chris....dont mean to be analizing your life..its just typical for different views and perspectives to happen on the marrige builders site......Violet1<P>[This message has been edited by violet1 (edited July 09, 1999).]<p>[This message has been edited by violet1 (edited July 09, 1999).]

Hey guys,<P>Things have taken a different route today. Just when I think I am doing so good, I do a major backslide. My wife came over today and we talked which turned into a big argument. I made a rear end out of myself and I know that. When at one point I tried to console her and back up from the tone it was taking, I reached and attempted a hug and BOOM....no hug back. It was like a slap in the face. She left and took the kids home with her for the weekend. I went by later to talk and we did. See if my suggestions are way off base or if I am taking a rational approach to this. I suggested a temporary unseparation. Keeping both apartments and move in for a limited time such as 1-2 months so we could show a change or if things would remain the same in a daily contact environment. My second suggestion was stay separated and agree that one weekend night every weekend we would "date" Just as long as the opportunity to see change or not still exists. This would hopefully be in the same time frame of 1-2 months. Just to see. Or option number 3, divorce now. I hope that wont happen. Im trying to respect her wishes to time with number 2 but at the same time she would be giving me a chance to show improvement, atleast on my part. No chase will ensue here. NONE. I realize I will get nowhere with that. However, I do still tell here I love her, but not on an every conversation basis. Not to push. That is my goal there. Ill keep you posted on what develops there. She wanted a night to think on it. That tells me she is atleast considering the options. Im I crazy here? Chris

New situation now.<P>I have discovered the OM. I trusted her so deeply. What now?

Now you know the "why" of why she doesn't love you, do you know how long it has been going on, and how did you find out?

I have been suspicious for a little while now, maybe a couple of months. But I never actually would believe it after seeing what another person can do to a marriage that she would do it.<P>I had too many people, some I know well, some I dont, coming up to me and asking me or telling me that they had seen my wife and OM out at lunch. I sorta dismissed that because they usually did eat out at lunch since they worked together but they most always went with a group. One day I was at her apartment to pick up the kids and he called to "check on her" because she had a "bad day," That raised my thoughts more. So I played Mr. Spy and went down to her apartment one night and listened in on her and him on the cordless phone with a scanner. BOOM. There it was. Thats all I needed to hear.<P>I confronted her and of course she says "we are just good friends." Yeah, right. Been there done that. She even denied talking with him. That wasnt me she said. I picked up the phone and hit redial and guess who answered? He did. I had a few words for him as well. She has a beeper and I checked it that night as well. A code system, which I suspected. I told her I was going to call his wife the next day and let her know. My wife panicked. "You cant do that. His family doesnt need to be split up and go through that" I said well what do you think our family is going through? She begged me and begged me not to tell her. That in itself proves my point. She is protecting her "good friend" <P>She never actually confessed to anything. However, I think I have enough information. I even have her phone records to show we call our good friends atleast 2 times a day or more outside of work. She would, out of guilt I guess, turn around and call me after she would talk to him. Those conversations have progressed more since April of this year. <P>She tells me I can believe what I want, that it is nothing more. She also says we were over long before that started. But my point is, I said all these same things and did all these same things. I love her more now than I ever have. Thats sad I guess. Who knows if this will run its course and I will get her back or not? <P>By the way, his wife knows, or so my wife says. She blamed me for calling her. But I didnt. Sure wish I knew who did. The ball is rolling now, so I guess I have to wait for it to stop again. What should I do now?

Dear Chris,<P>I normally do not come to this section of the forum, I am usually on the infidelity forum.<P>I would suggest you start posting over there immediately. <P>I have some questions, did you confront OM? or speak to his wife? You are now at a very emotional time - and need to get some support. Many times we make our worst decisions when we are so new to discovery.<P>I am sure you still want your marriage to work, and I have seen some success over in the infidelity forum with the Harley methods. <P>Confrontation with OM may or may not be a good decision right now.<P>You want to squash any lovebusters right now. All lovebuster's must stop, because if you don't you are running your lovebank on withdrawals only.<P>Read surviving an affair here on the site, and tell us how you are doing on the infidelity forum.<P>God Bless.

Chris2fur,<P><BR>Well I thought I would check back to see how you are doing?? After reading the previous post that you have written, I'm sure it hasnt been easy. Alot of times its hard to determine what your next move should be, sometimes when your wife goes about making her decisions, thats what will determine your next step or decision. There really is no easy way through, except to Trust in Jesus in everything you do. You can put your life back together with or without your wife. Be strong in the Strenghth of the Lord...........Violet1

Chris....I'm so sorry for what you are going through. I had a feeling that OM may be involved with your W, since she seems hesitant & reluctant to fully immerse herself in working on your marriage. But, what I can suggest is reading the book, "Surviving the Affair," by Harley. Also, if you can, seek professional counseling. It helped me with my H's betrayal. Although you initially had the affair a year ago, the book will give you guidelines on how you can try to save your marriage, even though you may feel like you are the only one trying to save it. Just hang in there, keep letting her know that you love her and will be there for her. Don't do any lovebusters. Be the ultimate H that you can be. Eventually and hopefully soon, she will open her eyes and realize that what she is blindly walking into (her own affair), is only an invitation for heartache & disaster. She will see the OM for what he truly is and not want to lose you or her family. Try posting on the "infidelity" forum. There are a lot of great people there who have gone through what you are going through now....both the betrayed and the betrayers. They will offer support and be there for you. I wish you well and much luck for a promising recovery. <p>[This message has been edited by NoTrust (edited August 02, 1999).]