I am 44, my wife is 38. We have been married for 12 years. I have known her since she was 4. This is my 3rd marriage, her 2nd. She has 2 kids, one 19 and one 17.

My problem is a constant string of lies and deception. The problem actually started the first week of our marriage when her first husband called me to tell me they were still married. Of course, I did not believe him. I confronted my wife and she too said he was just starting trouble. A few weeks later he called again. I started to have some doubts and started doing some digging on my own. It took me about 6 months but I finally confirmed my worst fear. They were still married.

I was crushed and tried to leave but she would not let me. We managed to get through it. They got divorced and we moved on, I thought. The problem is that I lost all trust and for the last 12 years, I have doubted just about everything she tells me and over the years, when I have doubts and dig deep enough, I find the truth.

We have had financial problems but not for awhile. We continue to have problems with her kids. Most of the lies these days have something to do with kids or money. Most of the lies about the kids involve money so I guess they go hand in hand.

I have not dealt with the lies well and have gotten more angry with each lie. Now, she tells me that she lies so as not to make me angry but this confuses me because I feel the lies make me more angry than the truth ever would.

Most of the time, she never even says she sorry for the lie or the action, simply tells me I need to "get over it" and "deal with it." What happens when I can't get over it and deal with it?

We are really trying to work this out and she has promised no more lies but I have a hard time believing her and I have promised not to get angry if she does lie.

We have numerous other issues as well and it would probably take me a week to put the whole thing down but this seems to be the biggest issue so that is where I want to start.

We have separated twice in the last 12 years, the longest time for 1 month. She is now talking about another trial separation, some time apart. I have never had any reason to doubt fidelity but I am wondering now, with all of the problems, if this is not a driving force behind the trial separation. Since I don't trust her, this is a problem. It would hurt much worse to loose her to somebody else as opposed to just losing her.

Does anybody else have a spouse who lies all the time?

What an awful story. I do not have advise except that your wife needs to get into immediate therapy. I just could not believe being in a marriage or any type of relationship where the spouse continuously lies to you and shows no remorse for the lying and merely tells you to get over it. The problem clearly is that she is an habitual lying that is at the core of her being. I seriously doubt that without major professional help she will ever be able to change. The question you need to ask yourself is that are you willing to put up with all of the lies and the anger it invokes in you for the rest of your life? If she refuses to admit she has a problem and is willing to seek professional help then your marriage is doomed because it can never be based on trust and respect. I think you need to talk to a counselor yourself and decide if this is how you wish to lead the rest of your life. I wish you luck.

Yes I too have dealt with a lying spouse. He tell s me that he tells a lie to avoid conflict but I tell him since he has a past of not being truthful then I investigate everything he tells me and when I find that it was a lie I explain it makes it much worse. I agree though you should seek a marriage counselor to try to modify her behavior of lies. Like I say why are you with me if I am supposed to be your best friend etc etc and all you do is lie to me. Also another great metaphor is "If you lie or hide something you know you are doing something wrong!" If you lose her to someone else as hard as it may be let her go because if it isnt that one it will be another, and intimacy nowadays is deadly and you dont deserve that.dont sell yourself short!

1anomymous1,

Thanks so much for the kind words. I guess it is just nice to know that I am not the only one who investigates everything my wife says or does. The lies have become so frequent that investigating all of them consumes a great deal of my time. No wonder I don't have enough spare time for her.

It has got to the point that when she says "I love you", I think that is a lie. How do you lie to someone you love? It makes no sense to me. How do you start to trust them again? Even when she promises she will not lie to me anymore, I think that is a lie. It is a horrible circle. I am trapped on the merry-go-round and can't get off.

She says that she feels it is almost useless for her to even try because I am not going to believe her not matter what. She feels like she doesn't get any credit for even trying. I guess I see her point but she has lied about so many things that I just don't know what to believe.

I feel in my heart that it is ultimately her responsibility to stop the cycle by stopping the lying, but when she does make the effort, how do I stop the cycle of distrusting? I tell her that I need her to go above and beyond what would be normal behavior, but she seems unwilling to put in extra effort. She appears to be willing to put in some effort, but not extra effort.

For example, we had a disagreement just this week over the mail and the telephone. She always gets home before I do and checks the mail and she is always erasing the caller ID immediately after a call like she doesn't want me to see the call. She has agreed to leave the mail in the box for me to get and not to delete the caller ID but my mistrust is so great, I think she could get home and sort through the mail and just take out what she does not want me to see and leave the rest. The same with the caller ID, it can be selectively deleted. When I mention this to her, that is when she responds that it is not even worth her trying.

Anyway, if you or anyone else have any advice on how to start trusting her again, I would appreciate it.

Well let me tell you how to handle this. With the mail and caller ID you can do a couple of things go to the post office and put your mail on a vacation hold for one week and see what comes up. Secondly with the caller ID if you have an extra phone jack buy a 10.00 caller ID box and hide it plugged into the phone jack that is not used or visible. Also by her saying it not worth her trying thats bull, she is the one who started all this and she should make it right. I told my husband that when I investigate a few times and don't find anything well then thats when I can start trusting again. But to be honest when she sits there and places the blame on you that is wrong but very typical to try to stop and make you think maybe it is you doing somethin wrong or making it worse. I tell the hubby dont try to turn this around be an adult and be responsible for your own actions and problems. i also let him know I judge everything you do on actions vs. intentions, meaning I judge what you do by your previous actions not what your true intensions are and that is not MY fault but yours by what you have done. I agree also with the time consuming investigating but that was not a hobby you picked up it is something they created but I was once asked why do you investigate when you already know the answer, but it is because I have to have specific details before I get a confession. So I stopped doing alot of investigating and started spending more time on myself, I figure well if they wanna do what they want so can I then they realize the depth of the hurt we feel when felt themselves! Oh and with the mail thing pick it up before you come home and say oh the mailman must be runnin late for some reason cause it was in the box???

This is a subject that i have been trying to deal with for over 2 years now and i don't feel any closer to trusting or believing my wife. after finding out about the lies i had been unknowingly living with for 12 years. She says it was something that did not have any effect on me and was her private business but it has effected me more than anything else ever has.
Finding out you've been lied to changes your feelings instantly and so far for me never to be forgetten about. It changes your whole perception of that persons character. And it hurts worse than the truth.

h

I wish I had read this thread a few years ago. Perhaps it would have helped me. I have lied to my wife about financial things for quite some time. I finally came to the realization that my lies were part of a pretty severe depression and self laothing and have started intnese therapy. I see a counselor once a week and have had to change the very nature of how I address just about everything. I have started keeping an "honesty journal" and treat it like addiction. I try to take one day at a time, and say things like "today is a day when I told no lies." My lying in the past may very well cost me my marriage. We haven't separated yet, but I feel that the day is looming when she can no longer wait for me to get better. I am putting a great deal of effort and time into changing my behavior, but it may be too little too late. Years of deception is something that can't be changed overnight and I don't know if she is ready for the long process. She has just had too much of my failings to keep trying. The pain of knowing that my actions may cost me my wife and family is tearing me apart. I feel so bad for her that I sometimes can't think about anything but my own guilt. I am constantly having to deal with her anger without responding. I am having to finally take responsibility for my own actions. This is the hardest thing I have ever had to face. I'm glad I found this place to help me cope. I just hope that I can stay focused on my own recovery and somehow save the marriage in the process. If I can't save the marriage, then I will have to keep up with the recovery (thorought he pain of the loss) so that this will never happen to me again. If I lose my wife, I want to make sure that if and when I find someone else that I will not repeat my own failings.

Everyone here has been very supportive and I appreciate that more than you can know.

tryingrealhard,

Thanks for this reply. It is nice to know that there is hope of her maybe admitting that she has a problem and will maybe one day do something to change. I have just about reached the realization that she will never completely change and that there will always be some forms and manner of deception. The not knowing for sure make life truly miserable and I sympathize with your wife. I commend you on all of your actions and hope that your wife will eventually forgive you. Good luck.

tryingreallyhard, does it feel better being honest?

<small>[ October 24, 2002, 02:03 PM: Message edited by: hol ]</small>

All I can say is that I'm going through the same devastation you're going through with a pathological liar and although thier intentions are good, I feel that a person can't learn from thier mistakes until they face some sort of consequences. I separated from my H for those same reasons because he was so deceptive I was caught in a similar predicament of having to investigate his wrongdoings because he refused to confess his adultery. Can you imagine how I felt when I found my worst fears were true and that he didn't confess them but lied to me after we were already trying to recover from a previous affair he had? I realized that life without him was preferable to the lies and deceit that I lived with. We've been separted for 2 months now and I'm lonely and confused as to what to do next but I assure you that nothing is worse than living with constant doubt and suspicion. I agree that she needs therapy to overcome this awful habit but it may take something drastic for her to realize how damaging her behaior is to you and herself.
Hang in there! It does get better, and be strong!

Tellmenoliesinsa,

I would advise you not to take the advice of one message saying you should invest in 'spying' on your wife (installing phone tracker, mail, etc.). All you'd be doing there is joining the 'liar's club'.
Even if it's hard, you know that trust is something to be earned. So, as she might be frustrated that you don't believe her anymore, even when she promises to be honest, she needs to realize that she has to earn your trust back, and that takes lots of time.
You, on the other hand, have to TRY to believe her. She needs to understand that she has to earn your trust by actually being honest. And if you help her see that you're trying to believe her, but at the same time refuse to be naive about it, then it can work out. She should really see a therapist, however, to work on this and to get neutral 'supervision'. You can't help her on that one.
And you know, she lies to you because she doesn't trust you either. If she says she lies to you because she afraid of upsetting you about certain issues (like money) then you'll need to be strong and not get angry when she does tell you the truth. But reward that behavior by saying something like "well, that's not good that the kids stole money from me - but thanks for telling me. I really appreciate it. Ok, so let's talk about how we're going to punish the kids for this together."

Something like that anyway!! You know - that builds up the trust that both of you are lacking.

I certainly have no right to tell you what to do -I'm pretty clueless myself to a lot of things in my relationship. But maybe it'll help to look at her issue as a real 'addiction' that you will help her with - with a soft heart and iron hand (figuratively of course).... You know like a coach. That might pull yourself out of the 'eye of the storm' and bring some objectivity into the situation.

Does that make sense at all??

Good luck. My thoughts and prayers are with you.