My husband and I have not been getting along lately. MyDad is dying of cancer, I've been with him alot. Kids are acting up. A lot of stress in the house. I've always wanted more kids. We have 2, I want 4. I've miscarried 6 times. The last being 12/99. I'm 42, so I can't wait much longer. My husband knows this. We've been trying on and off, but I realy don't know why I wasted all those years since the last miscarriage. I mean I should have been trying every month. But we didn't. That's another issue. Anyway, friends of ours just announced they were having their 3rd. Yeah, the green eyed monster came out and my husband and I discussed it briefly. He told me he didn't care about them, that he doesn't want anymore. That's it. No discussion. Other things are going on in our marriage too, a lot of arguing. He blames me for everything. I can't seem to do anything right. I have absolutely no self esteem at all. I finally went to see a counselor on Friday. My husband sees her on Thursday. He thinks I trashed him there, which I didn't, so now he has a long "list" of things to tell this counselor about me. He told me today that he's already looking for an apartment, that he just needs to get together some money. He said that he feels there is no compromise. I want what I want, and he wants what he wants. He said we should end it so I can find a guy to get me pregnant, as that seems to be all I want. Like that's gonna happen tomorrow? As I said I'm 42, I can't wait much longer. He said the only reason why I want him here is to get me pregnant, which is not true. I feel resentment towards him for stringing me along these last few years. If he didn't want anymore kids, then why didn't he tell me after the last miscarriage? Maybe then I could have found someone when I was younger or have dealt with it somehow. But I've been wishing all these years. Every holiday when he
would ask what I wanted as a gift, I always said a baby. He just laughed. Just last month we were fooling around (without protection), and I was ovulating. I told him that, and he said "So?". I'm just getting mixed signals from him. He said he's 40 now and wants the rest of his life "smooth". I think it's just an excuse to get out and not have to deal with the wife and kids anymore. I'm not sure what to do. Sorry this is so long, but I feel like I'm losing my mind! Between my kids acting up, my father being so ill, having to pretend to everyone that I'm O.K., I don't know what to do. My father sensed something was wrong a few weeks ago when my husband went to visit. He made me promise him, like his last wish, that we'd stay happy together. Talk about pressure!!! Any advice would greatly be appreciated.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I am glad you guys are starting counseling, it sounds like a lot of issues going on. And, my sympathy on all the grief I am sure you have been thru with multiple miscarriages.

It does sound like your H is sending some mixed messages. With all that is going on, he may have mixed feelings as well. I don't think you can (or should) even go to the "should we have more kids" convo, until you settle the "do we even want to be married" decision...I cannnot imagine bring a child into such a rocky place. Once you have the marriage on a firm footing, it will be a better place for you, your existing kids, and your H. Then is the time to discuss this all more calmly, and decided together if you will or will not try for more children...and I firmly believe both people must want them for it to work well.

Finally, at 42 and 6 miscarriages, I am sure you know you are already in a high risk group...if you do both decide to try again, you will probably want to see a high-risk specialist, and even then there are no guarantees. Hard choices, I know.

Good luck-

Kathi

OMG!!!! are you married to my H? I want to reply b/c I just got the "no" response as well, maybe we could help each other thru this. I'll be able to write tomorrow night
hang in there! NGU

Ok this may be long and my little guy is napping so I will try to write as much as I can and finish tonight. I don't know if you have been back to check in so here goes.
First off a real brief history, cuz I can go on for days about this issue! I am 37 my H is 35 we have thre children, 2 girls and then my son. We have not had the perfect marraige but always thought it would be just us against the world, but then it began to be us against each other, alot of arguing and not much in getting anywhere. I thought it was all about him, he thought it was all about me. We hit a low point that I stopped trying and so did he. We existed, on the surface, but there was a great undercurrent of hurt and resentment. My H had an affair between our 2nd and 3rd baby, I however didn't find out till I was 5 months pg with our third.

Now to elaborate:
I have always wanted a large family, 7 just like my mom had. My H and I discussed it and we began having kids very early in our marraige. I was thrilled to have our first, and immediately began talking about my plans for a second, and much to my surprise a year later he said we could start trying. This was when our communication deteriorated and we fought. It started out occasional about big things, but then became more frequent, about small things and alot of pointing fingers .We grew very distant. When our 2nd was 2/3months, my H started the affair, for sex and affection, he didn't love her and it was a mutual "fix" for both of them...that is until she began to have feelings for him. Just before she began to show this we had hit our all low and had it out. He told me it was time to really think about us and if we truely belonged together. I came out of whatever fog I was in and decided to work on my marriage...however all the while still wanting more babies. He saw the changes and broke it off with her...(I was still unaware of the affair) and shortly after that she tells him she is pg. THEN (and this confuses the H#!! out of me) he gives in to my requests (begging) and we decide to have our last child. Really at that time it was all we could afford, he was already working three jobs to keep me at home.
Wow this is long winded! I think that I am trying to incorporate all I want to say in one timeline.
Anyway, my father is then diagnosed with cancer, and my H was afraid to tell me b/c I was then pg with our third, and trying hard to save my marraige, but he was so far away from me emotionally. I was put on bedrest at 8 weeks, end of march/00. My father passed in April/00, the Ow child was born 5/00 (his first son) and I found out 7/00 of the OW/OC. I also found out in May I was carrying a son...it was all supposedly coming together for me, but unbenownst to me it was all going to crash around me. The day I found out I became numb to all feelings and hated him for what he did...not only having an affair, but a child from it, a son no less, and deciding that in the midst of all that he knew, that he made the choice that it was a good time to have a baby, knowing that it was only a matter of time before I found out.

I have to stop here, be back tonite to finish.
NGU

okay hopefully I can wrap this up now...I was in such a "zone" writing yesterday, and had it all planned out in my mind...here goes...
I had my son and we began therapy. We have been reconcilling ever since, and we are 2/12 years into this nightmare. My H got an offer to move south, which would have been 9 hours further away from the situation. We discussed how to handle the OC situation, and without getting into all that he decided it would be better to pay CS but have no contact. We went to retrouvaille, individual therapy for me where he joined in when needed. He showed complete remorse and has been trying very hard to help me work thru the destruction of it all. But what did I zero in on? I want another baby...
We moved, he got an excellent job, and again my issue with the baby came up. We could afford it now, and we had a bigger house, and I was feeling very empty from what my last pregnancy was like. I was unable to set up my sons room, go thru the clothes, and think about all this. I was crying, and my sisters did it all. It was all so hard.

Here I will state my argument and his.
I am so angry that he decided to have our third with out letting me in on what was going to be happening. I find that to be very selfish. I also felt that my age was getting to a point that I risked miscarriage and birth defects, I didn't want the kids much further apart in age...
We were also better off financially. I wanted to feel that bond again, and especially with my H, it was all I thought about, and still do. We had agreed that we could talk about it but in Jan/03.
My H, on the other hand, felt differently. He felt the same things you stated about yours. That it was only the baby I wanted, why couldn't I be happy with the three we had, why just when we get in a good poisition financially I want to add another mouth to feed, all our kids are at a good age to be able to do things that you could not do with an infant (camping, cruises...) he wanted to move onto the next stage of his life and out of the diaper stages, experience life with the kids...but most of all he said that our relationship needed to be better. He didn't want to bring another child into a marrage that was still stressed. All such valid arguments, which if I think about it rationally makes me feel like I am now the one that is being selfish.
But that void is still there, and it still aches everytime I see a pregnant woman or someone says "I am done, but my H would have another in a heartbeat!" We had gotten pg last April, and with that the arguments started again about going back to work and other things, the arguments were emotionally violent, alot of stress and crying, yelling, and I am sure that I lost that pregnancy due to it. I can mark the week they told me the baby stopped growing to the week that we had our worst of arguments, and my crying was HARD. And then just recently I had a "chemical pregnancy" which I guess is also considered a miscarraiage. You know what? I can't go thru another one...and I guess the good Lord is telling me something.
My H and I after this last pregnancy in Jan had the "conversation" and I was told that he doesn't want a baby. I finally get it and I also finally need to address my void.
See, I may sound heartless right now, that all I am thinking of is my need to have another, but also in my mind I don't want to have one like that, where he is felt like he had no choice. In the past he too gave me mixed messages, I would always tell him I was ovulating, but also would be depressed and he would be intimate without protection. He said and did all of what you said about your H, pratically verbatim of how you decribed it. Even told me to leave and find someone who would give me that child I so desperately needed.

Sorry I need to go again, I will try to end this this afternoon, I hope this is helping, it is helping me just by writing it. I don't know why I am being so detailed and personal, I just could relate so much to what you wrote. Next I am going to tell you so far what it is that I have been trying to do to accept this.
NGU

NGU,
I appreciate you going into length and being so candid with me. After reading some posts here I feel even silly posting, as my problem seems so insignificant to what others are going through. I will write more after you finish the rest of your post. Thanks! jac07

Hey there, fell asleep last night will finish today.
NGU

ok I am back and my son is napping again. I will hopefully get this done now as of tonite I will probably not be able to post till next Mon evening( H is back in town, travels for business).

Well as told you in Jan he said that he didn't want more children, especially with our marriage the way it was, and that it was time that I needed to work on accepting that. He wasn't cold about it but he tried to explain, again his argument to me, and I realized that there was much more to what he was saying that I was hearing...
Don't get me wrong here...I am very resentful, hurt, and empty...and plain ole' p!$$@# off about it. After all that has happened, and I had oh so had my hpoes up about it...but the decision has been made.
It is strange though, we are still intimate, and unprotected, I am afraid to go on the pill, just in case he may change his mind, and I am afraid to ask him to get "fixed" as it seems so permanent. We haven't talked about it since Jan, but nothing has changed as far as making sure it doesn't happen, even another "oops" as he calls them...so I guess the mixed messages again.
But how am I coping with the fact that he really has said he doesn't want them...ok I guess...I am trying to do more for me.
See with the affair and the wanting the baby and ect, all my focus has been on doing for my kids(so that they could be least affected as possible with what we are going thru) and for him (as I was trying so hard after the shock of the affair to be the perfect mother and wife...supermom kind of thing, to prove I could handle a new baby and that we were on the right track with our relationship) that my focus was all wrong for HEALING.
Somewhere in the midst of our arguments before the affair, the way an affair affects a betrayed, and the way I tried to prove I could do it all I LOST ME...I am a shell of what I used to be, and finding myself, even the new person I need to be to continue my life with what I have been dealt, has been the hardest thing to do.
So I work out now, try to eat better, spend as much time as I can with my kids, and finsih projects that I buy all the things for.
Another thing that I understand is that he is being completely honest now...if we were to have another I would have to go back to work, and that is not something I want to do. Not that it hadn't been said before but I just assumed he would find a way to support us, another selfish thing of me.
I am going to color my hair today, and do more changes to my self in the near future...I am trying to get in touch with who I used to be and incorporate that into my life now.
I also am trying to listen to my H, not just hear the words...He cried out to me before the affair, I failed to hear him, I didn't feel what he was saying. And he was not hearing me either. He is trying so hard to show me he wants me for me, and all I keep saying is give me a baby...and you know what...everytime he would say go find someone else to give you a baby...the thought disgusted me...I wanted HIS baby. The bond between us during my last pregnancy was not there, and the bonding of me with my son was delayed cuz of my dealing with the emotions of the affair/marriage. If we divorced I doubt I would ever marry again, let alone have a baby. I finally had to step back and see myself thru his eyes and I didn't like what I saw. It all seemed so rational to me when looked thru my eyes and my emotions, but not pretty thru his.

Well there it is in a nutshell. I do not know much of what is going on with your situation. I hope I have helped in some way.If you like to e-mail let me know when you will be on today and I will put up my e-mail address for you. I do not like to leave it up for long.
I guess in some way I wanted to let you know where all the obssession took me and maybe I could help you in not going to that place. It is not a comfortable place to be and it is so d@#m hard to get out of...I am by no means there. I struggle everyday with the thoughts that if I give up now, would I be losing my last chance? What if...in a month if I had stuck with the expressing my needs he would understand and would have said yes?
It is a fine line to cross, and hard to jump over and move forward. At times I see his view and I feel good about coming to terms with moving forward, and an hour later I can be that green eyed monster of every pregnant woman or person who has more than 3 kids, or a bitter/resentful person feeling as if I am giving up what is so important to me.
Hugs to you, and God Bless...Let me know if you want to talk.
NGU

NGU,
I will post as soon as I can. We're all sick here and I don't really have the energy to write a long post. Hopefully in the next few days. jac07

Jac07, Your marriage has issues, and your dads dying, MORE KIDs is the biggest issue on your mind? your kidding, right? i'm sure you know BY NOW kids are EXPENSIVE and require LOTS of co-operation and committment on both ends, WHy would you even want more when your husbands on the fence so bad? IF two people cant agree on having children the best answer is DONT have anymore, OR, dissolve the relationship and try with someone else,Maybe you need a younger man who wants to start a family,I'm 41 and i can see your husbands point, I want to retire some day, HOW do you do that when you have YOUNG kids to raise and send to college? My advise, BE HAPPY with the kids you have and stop wanting things well past your grasp given your ages and your current relationship situation.

Hey there...take your time...Lord knows I am not going anywhere! I wanted to let you know that I completely understand where your feelings are coming from and offer to go thru this with you as we seem to be struggling with the same issues here...dreams, hopes and the letting go of things that we had so badly wanted. I may sound as if I have dealt and begun to come to terms with all this, but in reality I have just begun this battle as well, and also just begun to my road to recovery from the scars of the affair.
Like I said...take your time, hope all gets well in your home and I will check back soon.
Also let me know about the e-mailing also...if that would be easier for you...
NGU

fortyone...Not to be disrespectful or anything as I don't know your situation. However until you've been in my shoes or know what I am going through, I don't think it's fair to criticize whether I am "kidding" or not about having more children. I've never been more serious. Wanting more kids was there well before my father got ill. My age now is making me address the situation more urgently. Unfortunately, it happens to be during my father's illness. But rest assured I am not that shallow that I would only think of myself during his time of need. I am there for him everyday. Expense is not an issue in having more children, and I am not that selfish that I need to be free of kids in my golden years. I don't think that when I retire at age 65 my kids will go away and I will not have to worry about them anymore. Whether they are 10 or 20 years old, I will always worry about them and be there for them, so retirement really doesn't change the way I feel about having more kids. Sure, if I was 65 and then had a child, I would worry about death and if I would be there for my kids when they were older. But being 42, by retirement age, my children would be well out of their toddler years, hopefully in college, and I'd still be there to see them mature. We our going to an excellent counselor who is addressing both our needs and concerns and perhaps a compromise can be achieved. She was the one who told me, that I need to start putting my needs first, as I'm always thinking about everyone else. Until then, I will not give up on ANY dreams or hopes I have. It's a sad world when you can't dream...

<small>[ April 07, 2003, 04:13 PM: Message edited by: DriveTime ]</small>

Drivetime: I would like to say I think the more support the better we can all get thru this. Any help that I can be just holler...
NGU

Jac07: Hope all is well with your family now...lots of bugs going around..I swear I had strept throat today but it is just a sore throat...thank God! I will on the computer till Friday morning and then my H comes home for about a week so I will be reading but not repling until about a week later...keep posting and I'll check in!
NGU

Drive Time...thanks for the positive post. As NGU said, the more people that share our problem and truly understand what we are going through, the better support we can obtain. Although we all have our own set of other issues and problems, we are pretty much on the same page when it comes to having more kids. Hopefully we can all help each other.

NGU... I have not forgotten about you and posting. Yes, we are pretty much healed for now, I just haven't had the time to post as I'm trying to catch up on everything that was neglected when we were sick. I will post soon, I promise. Thanks again for your support. jac07

<small>[ April 07, 2003, 04:14 PM: Message edited by: DriveTime ]</small>

Hello all, this post is actually for both Jac07 & NGU,

Jac07, your in my thought's and prayers though my situation is much different than yours I understand the longing for a closeness with you H and wanting to put the marriage back together on firmer ground before having more children.

God allows things to happen for reasons - much easier to say to someone else but I'm having to swallow that pill myself too... If it's in His plan, then neither you, nor your H could stop you both from having more kids together.

Remember Genesis 21: 1-7.....

Where there's God's will, there's a way, and if it's not to be, then have faith that your 3 children will be somehow extra blessed by the time they are able to spend with you that you would have been spending on another baby... Either way you win and you have three great kids - 3 is a great number remember!

I'll keep praying for you for wisdom and peace in this, and hope for the best.

Anyway, sorry to yap on - like I said I also was writing to NGU -

NGU, you had mentioned in one of your posts that you had gone to Retrouvaille, we are considering going there but both have reservations about the program. Not knowing about it from anyone we know, I'm going by the website and my situation is..... well, quite different than I've seen on here.... it's posted already on this page under "whats wrong with this picture"... pretty numb, I know... If you can let me know how it works or even if it would apply - the words "God can change people, but they have to be a willing vessel" go through my head.... Well, any info would be great. Perhaps the last stop before signing papers.... Uggg - Thanks

Jac07: I haven't heard from yuou and wondering if you were ok. Also to you and the others I will reply soon. I am recovering from a surgery and will post as soon as I can.
NGU

HI,
I just wanted to encourage you to pray. God can change your H's heart about wanting more children. We have 8 now and my H is open to 12. I was thinking maybe a bakers dozen? LOL
We don't worry about the money because God has always provided. My H makes 5X more money then he did when we had 3 children.
I know exactly how you feel about wanting one more and your last pregnancy not being what you dreamed of. The same thing happened to me. I found out about the A the day we brought the baby home from the hospital. And I learned later that the OW had a miscarriage about a month earlier that was probably my H's.
We have now had that other baby, and he is so sweet. My H is more into having kids then he ever has been. He was a lot like yours and just went with it, and never used protection, but he wasn't overly excited until this baby.
Just pray and pray. God can change his view of it.

I am in the same boAt. I have always wanted as least 2 kids. (In fact, I have wanted to have kids since I was a kid!!) My H fully agreed (at least as to 2).

After the first child, he was actually concerned that I would be the one that would not have a second one. (I hated being pregnant.) Up until 2 or 3 weeks before his A started (several months ago), he was talking about our second child and at one point even said "as long as we keep having children as wonderful as our first child, we can have as many as you want." Music to my ears!

Then during the "talk" (would he stay or go after I found out about the A), he said one thing weighing heavily against staying is that he does not want anymore children. This crushed me more than anything else and was the one thing that made me really consider whether I can continue in this marriage! (OW claimed to be pregnant when he stopped giving her as much attention and I think he now sees pregnancy as a manipulation etc.)

I have asked that he not completely cut off the idea of another child and he has agreed. Then, two days ago he said, "Actually, I have been thinking, Katherine would be a great name for a little girl-- if we had another little girl." My heart skipped a beat and it was all I could do not to run home and starting trying to have that second child!! So, now I am trying to be patient and believe that there is light at the end of the tunnel.

I believe another factor in this whole issue for us is that my H is also concerned that one of the reasons I am willing to try to make the marriage work is so that I can have another child. I have told him that if we were not together, I would definitely adopt a second child. (This is true.) Maybe with some more time, we can get on the same page again?

It's funny, a few of the previous posts talked about having a child a little later in life. My mother is always telling me that I will regret not having children earlier because I will be so exhausted etc. For me, I loved not having children too early and seeing a lot of what life had to offer while I was young enough to really enjoy it. Now, I love this phase of my life and have no feelings of having "missed out" on anything! I don't think I would have felt the same way at 25 or even 30.

So, I am offering support to the others in this situation and hope we can all realize our dreams!