Hello, my name is Julia. Randy and I have been married for 3 years (today's our anniversary). I'm a Polish woman.
After reading the Marriage Builders pages I found out how many mistakes I made. But here is the story:
We got married and I had to go back to Poland to wait for the immigration visa. In the meantime I was working on my PhD. We tried to visit each other as often as possible. After a year of such a marriage I noticed my husband does nothing to work on the visa for me. I focused even more on my PhD. I missed him badly and he was writting me the same. Every time we met, we were trying to catch up time without each other. We were living on writting e-mails, sometimes phone-calls, sending packages, visiting each other. Funny, but everything seemed to be all right all the time, I thought he was honest with me, we shared every thought, fantasy, problem. We were so happy. Now I wonder if it was only me waiting so much for being with my husband.
My husband is a military man, after 2 years he was transferred to another place. Since then he's been living here alone. After another half a year he sent me an email, that our marriage makes no sense (still did nothing for the visa) and stopped writting, calling. I wanted to talk about it, find out what happened, but he just cut all contact.
Finally, three weeks ago I proposed him, that I would come to live with him as long as my tourist visa allows, so we could try to build back up our relationship. He agreed, telling me he still loves me.
I've been here for two weeks and this is a nightmare. At the beginning, when I tried to kiss him, he didin't kiss me back. While walking together I held his hand, but he didn't response, when we were having sex it was like making love to a piece of wood. I know two weeks is a very short time to do anything, but I tried to be patient. Finally I found out my husband is flirting with a woman, I'm not sure if this is something serious, but she didn't know he's married. I wrote to her that I know and she apologized and promised never contact him again (I don't trust it).
I told my husband I know about the woman, he denied and said she was just a friend.
We also had a talk about us and I proposed that we could try to build back up, what was ruined. I proposed going to a councelor and trying to do our best for us. My husband told he doesn't want any councelling. After he moved here and is living alone he found out he likes to live alone, without nobody around. He told me that he doesn't like me being here and instead of coming here for six months I'm leaving after two weeks, because my husband cannot stand me being here. He told me he looks forward to when I leave. My husband tries to work up late, sometimes he doesn't come back home for night. He asked me to sleep in another room.
In another talk he told me that he thought he would be happy in marriage and that's why he got married - because he thought it was a right thing to do.
He says he still loves me and cares, because I'm a good person and a prefect wife. But he behaves completely different. He proposed that he would go to a councelor, to check if his feelings are true (about wanting to live alone life), or it is just something wrong with him (so after a therapy we could try to be together again). He says that is why he wants me to leave as soon as possible - "he wants to be completely honest with himself, what is not possible with me around".
I see there is something really wrong and I don't understand it at all. First of all - if he wasn't happy in our marriage, if all that affection he had been showing to me was fake, why in the past was it so easy and now is so hard to him that he prefers spending nights at his office? (is it really office?) Second thing - sometimes (and maybe it's only my imagination running on hope) I see "my normal Randy", a gesture, something he says, does, looks like - sometimes it looks like he's coming back. I am afraid that if I go back to Poland, I won't hear from my husband anymore.
I there any chance to save my marriage? What should I do?

<small>[ August 26, 2003, 02:15 PM: Message edited by: sikorka ]</small>

Dear Sikorka,

In your post, you seem to understand that there are at least two possiblities of reality.

You also seem well aware that people sometimes avoid unpleasant confrontations by softening the truth.

You basically have two choices, either give up at least for now, and go back to Poland, or try to do something to change your husband from a piece of wood.

If you are going to go back to Poland peacefully, please accept my sympathy for your feeling of sorrow, and disappointment, and suspicions of betrayal. At the same time, to the extent that you have given favors to a western military serviceman, my thanks to you on behalf of freedom.

If you want some ideas of how to compete with whatever changed your husband into a piece of wood, the I first suggest you read 180 degree Divorce Busters, which gives a list of ideas of things to change. So try changing things, as you can.

Next, I suggest you look at your blocks to any marital sexual options. Your blocks are going to be different from a possible other woman. One of your options is to compete with her, by expanding your marital expereince beyond what your competition can even dream of.

One weakness of many men is for ponrnography. Pornography can be used within the marriage, as a stimulator. Pornography has caused problems in many marriages also, by a husband using pronography privately, so this is not co-letely without risk.

You have a history with your husband, and you must know some of his fantasies, and he must have pressed against some of your boundaries, and you must know what additional things you could do to get him excited about sex, primarily, and as a consequence, then interested in sex with you.

You must have in your memory, comments you have made that have disappointed your husband, and you can take from those comments how to build up your husband's ego.

Your description of your husband as a piece of wood, is not very detailed. I have massage tapes, and I watch them with my wife somtimes, and try out some of their techniques. Basically, wherever there is a muscle, you can rub the muscle and create a sensation of relaxation. Be careful of where the muscles meet the bones. If you don't have massage training, chiropractors or other people in the phone book will give you an appointment, and give you a message, and you can ask them questions, so you can learn quickly. Federal express a book or video.

I have not given you much detail of what to do, but have tried to create a basis for new ideas. Post back, as others may provide more help if they see you are responding to replys.

Welcome to Marriage Builders

Best wishes,

Quipper
Married 28 years and still struggling.

Dear Quipper,
First, thank you for your reply. It gave me something to think about.
I have to go back to Poland, because it is my husband demand. He booked my flight very willingly, trying to find the date as soon as possible. He said that I could stay here longer, but with this he was going to arrange things at work in the way he would work up really late and stay at night in the base, so he would be hardly at home. He is doing this now, I mean he says he has to think about something and disappears for all night long. Ocasionally we go out for a dinner and after coming back home, my husband goes for a walk. I propose to go with him, but he refuses. On weekends he disappears somewhere, trying to spend as little time with me as possible.

I'm afraid that if I go to Poland I will lose him for good. But I have to go to Poland, because my husband demands it.

I'm trying to change thing as much as I can. I remember things my husband told/wrote me about
his sexual fantasies and things he wanted to try, which seemed weird to me. I'm not a fan of porno "movies", but mu hubby has a whole collection of them, so I sat one day and looked at some of them, trying to understand, what is so appealing in there...
I dared to watch such a thing having my husband around and it ended up with making love, and my hubby didn't seem to be a piece of wood at all (but still he's not kissing me, nor touching affectionately). By "a piece of wood" I mean he doesn't try to touch me, doesn't kiss me, or cuddle up.

I am also trying to learn things my husband likes, so maybe I will start liking them too.
I'm not much of a beer drinker (I prefer good wine ocasionally), but now I sit more (much more) often with my husband having a beer. Guess what, the beer doesn't taste yucky anymore...

I try also to "investigate" my husband's work. I know there's a lot of pressure, hard work, stressful situations and I believe that talks bring relieve sometimes. So I stopped accepting "it was a hard day" thing and started asking my husband about more details (this will also give me an opportunity to understand better where the stress comes from). I show him my admiration in how well he can solve problems and appreciation he works so hard.
This all gives us also more topics to talk about. As my husband doesn't ask about my days at all, I put my disappointment away for now and tell him myself things about my day, my thoughts and so on.

My husband seems to be trying to avoid things I could do for him. It is like he is trying not to be "dependent on me". He refuses when I propose to do something for him, but sometimes, when I dare doing things without asking, he seems to be pleased.

Some things I'm trying to work on my husband with seem to be giving first tiny results. But I remember what my husnabd said: "I don't like you here, I force myself to be nice to you, and I look forward to when you leave".
My husband told me that he discovered he lokes lonely life. He like to come home to an empty, quiet place, with nobody around. That's why my presence annoys him so much. He says he feels happy being alone. I don't know if this is his choice (of life alone), or this all is a result of stressful work with many people and expectations around. My husband even told me I should try to find another man for me to live with (so he could get rid of me)...

Are there things I could do from Poland to restore my marriage? I really love my husband and I care about our marriage. I am a strong person, with lots of patience, but I'm loosing my hopes. Where can I read about the Divorce Busters?

Julia

<small>[ August 27, 2003, 07:11 AM: Message edited by: sikorka ]</small>

Dear Sikorka,

Ordinarily, I try to think over my posts to be considerate and thoughtful, but you seem to be short of time, so please forgive any abruptness.

180 Degree Divorce Busters can be found under the NEGOTIATING category, posted a month ago and updated a few weeks ago, by TOOMUCHCOFFEEMAN. Any post by TOOMUCHCOFFEEMAN has the reference at the bottom of his post, and you can just click on it. I have not yet learned to put a link in a post.

Let us suppose that your husband realizes that you are going to leave again in a while, so the last time you left was painful for him, and he has decided to avoid the pain of your leaving, by having you leave sooner.

Let us talk about POJA. Poja is not doing anything without the entusiatic agreement of the other spouse. Your going back to Poland is a violation of POJA because this does not have your enthusiasitc support. Try explaing POJA to your husband, and present the idea that your leaving is a violation against your rigths, just as staying is a violation of his rights. Except that when you get married, you are commiting to spend as much time together as possible, so your right to stay supercedes his right to ask you to leave, and your leaving could be viewed as legal desertion by Court of Law. Bluntly, you can refuse to leave, but agree to give him space, as best you can.

But let us shift gears from a power struggle, and look at love. Please excuse the abrupt change, without a smooth tansition. My wife asked me not to leave the house and walk away when things get beyond my boundaries. She asked me to ask her to go to another room in the house, or ask her to go to her mother's or whatever. My point is that you can ask when he first comes home, if he needs some time alone, or is company OK. But read about the 10 emotianl needs in marriage builder articles. You are not mentioning what his needs are. Under QUESTINAIRES, top bar of main Marriage Builders Home Page, you should identify your needs and his needs, and see where you are less than ideal, and how you can take steps toward becoming more ideal. You have not described what your husband likes to eat, or how much trouble you spent preparing it just like he wants it. Is his mother or father alive? Get recipes, a sister maybe.

When you go out to eat, you can ask him the questions of what is the ideal marriage qualities. The fact that he takes yo out to eat, indicates that your cooking may not be using the optimal ingredients and recipes.

If a Military man is to be away from his wife for periods of time, pornography is often a good, safe release. Unfortunately, pornography and self stimulation can set up patterns of behavior that are habits and difficult to change. We were talking in my last reply like there might be another woman. In this reply let us address the issues of pornography habits. Let us explore what you can do to provide a smooth transition from pornography self-stimulatin to having a woman as a partner. There may be a period where you can cuddle and you can assit with his self-stimulation. The idea could be to give him confidence that when you leave again, that he will not be faced with a massive re-adjustment.

Some men have been criticized by women for self-stimulation during marital relations. You have not disclosed your feelings about this issue, nor your husband's practices. One reason I keep my present wife is that she goes along with my self-stimulation in foreplay. How are your stimilation skills? Do you know that the tip is senitive? Do you know that you can sqeeze the lower shaft real tight? Do you know that you can stroke downward with full force, but up-stroke with a limited range of motion? My wife and many women I have dated really did not do very well.

Apparently my idea mentioned in the last reply, of watching the videos with your husband is a workable idea. You did not say if it worked again, or what problems you encountered on subsequent tries. I had a live-in girl friend years ago, and we were in a loose culture, and we visited a gay man once in his apartmemt. So we were straight, and we were suggesting that the guy go stgraight, and we did not get very far with the concept. But after we left, my girl friend commented that she was willing to have participated in showing the guy the advantages of straight sex, and we were a team, and I did not feel jealous. What I am suggesting from my girl friend, is to use the porno videos as team members.

I have posted some wild ideas on marital sex, just to get people thinking. Everyone has some foibles, not all will be appropriate for you. One idea is to squirt baby oil all over all the body parts and see what creative things might happen. Slither together like snakes. Trim the hairs on your private parts. Keep a stock of vasaline and KY jelly on hand.

You have not told me of your massage skills. Baby oil is good for massages. Basically along the back are two alluvial canals, full of muscles, on each side of the back bone. The muscles go up the neck and back down to the shoulders and up to the base of the skull. Presssing with your finger tips on an area for 3 to 5 seconds and releasing creates a feeling of relaxation. You can use your knuckles with one hand upside down, and press the hand, knuckles down, into the middle of the muscles by leaning on the fist, with our other hand.

Sex toys should be segregated by orfice. You should have three different vibraters. Have you tried anal stimulation during intercourse? Chinese marbles on a string are supposed to be pulled out during climax. Are your arms long enough to reach around for your husband? Do you have a good mattress pad? And an extra one to change frequently? Personal lubricants can keep you comfortable longer. Does your husband have confidence in your birth control? Is that an issue for him? Is there a way to give him more confidence?

If you are leaving, have you offered to go shopping for a life-sized doll? Have you offered to have a doll along as a partner in teh bed? I needed to use a doll every few weeks when I was a bachelor. Self-stimulation did not combine the hip movement, taht was necessary for a satisfying climax. Having pornography visible during sex aslo makes the male climax more effectively satisfying, especially with a partner.

My wife feels that it is my job to undress her, and always wears clothes to bed. I would prefer a bathrobe, or something easy for me to get into.

At the end of TOOMUCHCOFFEEMAN, there is a post Link to the Love Diet. Print that out, and give it to yout husband. You may feel blocked because you do not feel love from him. Show him how easy it is to get your love going.

These are some scatterd ideas, if you reply, others may be able to give you more focussed responses. The Emotional Needs forum has a lot of people willing to post ideas, but they are an opinionated bunch up there, and they take pride in being blunt.

God Bless,

Quipper,
Married 28 years and still struggling

Hi Sir

I keep reading your post. I feel so deeply for you, but can't for the life of me figure out how to help.

All I know is... I don't know how distance will help. It doesn't appear to have helped yet.

If you leave now, you'll never know if he's what he says is true or not. You'll always be filled with questions and/or regret.

Personally, I don't beleive that anyone is meant to be alone, at least not for long, without extenuating circumstances.(military is not one., okay) So, bluntly, I think he is either lying or he needs counseling. Either way, he needs counseling. There is no reason to put your life in question; he should be willing to be firm about what he feels. Otherwise, he has a conflict that doesn't really involve you, maybe just HIS head, ego, what-have-you. I just don't think I could leave unless I felt sure about what was going on and I was willing to live with it.

What would you do if you weren't afraid?
Tenbo

Tenbo, thank you for your post.
Well, one of reasons my husband wanted me to leave as soon as possible was that "he would be more honest with himself going to a councelor" than with having me around, which is something I don't really believe/understand. He seemed to be willing to go to a councelor "to check if his feelings come from his nature, or there is something not ok with him". I am really afraid my husband may find a councelor, who won't consider the case seriously.
With the advice of Quimper I told my husband about Poja (it was kind of difficult to explain that to him) and that I didn't want to leave. My husband didn't accept it and he almost forced me to leave (took my things, put me into the truck and left at the airport).
This what I want is to be with my husband, because I love him and I saw our relationship good and harmonious. Just eight months ago my cooking was great, my massage abilities were perfect, my husband missed me and couldn't wait for us being together for good. We had great sex life, more and more things in common. It was my husband who has taught me that we need to talk about our needs, problems, joys and everyday life to make our marriage better and avoid conflicts.
I see something is not ok with him and I'm willing to help him.
I talked to him and proposed counceling for both of us. He refused. So I proposed we could try to work on our marriage ourselves. He even refused to work on the needs questionaires.

I've read the 180 degrees divorce busters. Some of them seem to be exactly what my husband wants from me. In general: move on in my life without him. He even proposed me to find another man to live with.

This, what I am/was afraid of was that if I had stayed there my husband would have hated me.
If I wasn't afraid of that I would stay there (I'm in Poland now :-( ) as long as my tourist visa allows (I haven't got the immigrant visa).
I refused some really good post-doctoral job offers just to be with my husband and to be able to work on our marriage. Now I'm without means to live and I have to find a job, what means I can't travel back and forth if something happens to my husband.

I am all in pieces. Sometimes I have suicide thoughts but so far I have been able to control them. I know it's not a solution to my problems. I guess I am in a kind of depression, but having no job I can't afford counceling/psychiatrist/whatever I need.

I am not giving up, but I am loosing my hopes and I really don't know what this all may end with.

Assuming my husband is really going to go to a councelor: should I keep writting and encourage him or just wait (not write) to what happens (kind of according to the divorce busters)???

<small>[ September 02, 2003, 05:39 AM: Message edited by: sikorka ]</small>

Dear Julia,

I did try to support your staying near your husband, and express sympathy for that concept not working, and for any difficulty that trying to make it work, caused.

Perhaps you can take comfort in knowing that you made a good effort to stay with your husband. Many men feel that they should be in charge of important decisions in a marriage, so POJA is not 100% their ideal. Having introduced your husband to POJA should not be all bad, hopefully.

I tried to give you a large number of ideas. I hope you will feel no hesitation to reject or delay any suggestions I offer you.

As I recall, 180 Degree Divorce Busters, it recommends not calling your spouse too often. I suppose the same idea could apply to E-mail. Your E-mail could range from how much you miss him, to just letting H know what you are trying to do for yourself. One guideline I try to use with my wife, is how much support I am feeling from her. If I am feeling less support from her, then I contact her less often.

Depression can be partly not obtaining what you were expecting, or obtaining less than what you were expecting. I will pray that you receive what you were hoping for, or something even better.

I have had Silva Method training, which teaches to visualize someone you wish to heal at a distance, and envision your healing energy going into their body. It is sort of a method of prayer. You can also envision directing God's healing energy, as if you were an Angel. I envison all the cells, starting at the top of the head, and going downward, being processed by healing energy.

Tell us someting nice about Poland.

God Bless,

Quipper
Married 28 years and still struggling

Dear Julia,

I have been thinking about your situation, and I have not been able to come up with very definitive ideas of what is going on with Randy. Taking him at his word, he has a problem that needs counseling. My yesterday's reply mentioned sending him help, spiritually. We can discuss more about that if you would like to.

First I wish to again point out that your efforts are those of a wife of a serviceman, who is serving the cause of defending freedom, and there are a wide array of challenges to freedom in the world today, such as terrorism and semi-state sponsored terrorism, and emerging nuclear powers. So please feel the value of your service to the world, and to the many people enjoying freedom.

Scientology has developed a TONE SCALE, as a formula for helping people feel more positive. One way to use the Tone Scale, is to increase 0.5 or 1.0 number value points above the current feeling, and once you have the higher level attitude, then work on 0.5 or 1.0 above that. I carry the chart in my wallet, so I can refer to it. You can work on yourself, or with one ormore others.

You have said you cannot afford counseling right now, so I will try to give you some ideas here, but let me first recommend that you seek better help than I will probably be able to provide here. You can find Scietiogy Services in Europe. The Tone Scale is described in detail in SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL( $55.00) by L. Ron Hubbard. Tapes and CD's are also available. Feelings of suicide might be Hopeless, 0.07, at the bottom of the range of the Tone scale. O.5 above would be Greif (0.5). Certainly you can feel sad about your husband having difficulties, and your being separated from H. 0.5 above that is Fear (1.0). You can probably understand fear, as you are uncertain of the future, and it could be reasonable to fear extended separation from H, and fear D, divorce, and fear that the extensive efforts you made to make the marriage work, may possibly not pay off, at least maybe not directly.

Next upward by 0.5 is Anger (1.5). You can target anger at the world situation that keeps your husband apart from you. You can be angry at the U.S. and World Economy, which falls short of providing the money for the Armed Services to adequately keep husbands and wives together. You can be angry at therapists who do not give your husband the cure that he needs quickly. 0.5 above that is Antagonism (2.0). This is criticism, or poking fun, which you can accuse Fate of having you working for the good of saving your marriage, and it seems not to be working, yet you know that you are doing good, but fate is giving you illogical results.

Next 0.5 above is Boredom (2.5). You have been trying the same thing long enough, with enough intensity, that you can see the repition, and that you have settled into a routine of trying, and not getting the opitmal results you hope for, and putting forth more effort again without seeing much tangible resuts, has now become the usual. You have a feeling of your own self worth though, that you are being a good person, doing the right thing, but rewards are delayed. 0.5 above is Conserviatism (3.0) which is feeling comfortable with things as they are, and hoping that nothing cahnges. Cheerfulness is 3.5 and Entusiasm is 4.0, making things better, the top of life.

You can learn to recognize your feelings of the moment,and then work on thinking 0.5 above that, and once you have brought yourself up, then work on 0.5 above that, to bring yourself up again.

Since you seemed down, I thought I would give you the formula for feeling better.

Usually, when I post, I give some details of my own problems. I feel that posting to help others, helps me with my own problems, since I have to consider following my own advice.

I bought a new adding machine for $22 yesterday, and I have some bill paying and accounting work to do, and I discovered that my trusty printing calculator had stopped working yesterday.

Please post back, sometimes, and let us know what is changing for you. You are our Polish representative. Tell us about your PHD.

God Bless,

Quipper
Married 28 years and still struggling

Thank you, Quipper, for the method. I'll try it.
I think that right now I'm feeling hopeless (rated 0.07). I thought that maybe some success in my "science life" would help. I applied for a post-doc position in Dallas, Texas. This week I'll be talking to a professor, who maybe will accept me. But there is no enthusiasm in me. My marriage was a really good thing for me. Being with Randy, believing he loved me, thinking I had support in him I'd been feeling more and more confident. I started to believe in myself. With that confidence
I have grown more and more succesful (my "career"), felt more and more attractive physically (I'm slim, athletic-built person). I guess my rate in the scientology tone scale was 10.0...
Now when I hear about people getting married, being happy with each other, having children, I feel more and more hopeless. It's getting worse and worse.
I'm looking for something that will stop me thinking about suicide and better life beyond life. Maybe I should just focus on killing my love to my husband? Are there any techniques to do that?

My PhD. I defended my thesis two months ago. My field is high energy physics. I do particle research. I was engaged in one of LargeElectronPositron collider experiments at CERN (European Organisation for Nuclear Research, the world's largest particle physics center). Now I have a chance (if accepted) to participate in another experiment on even more powerful particle collider.
I do recommend you to visit Poland some day. It's a beautiful country. The best time to visit is end of May to beginning of July (warm and green, bushes and trees are blooming like crazy). Poland is Central-Eastern European country. More and more people speak other language than Polish. You would probably love pierogi (one of famous Polish dishes) and maybe bigos. If you're coming here some day, please, just let me know and I will take care of you...

<small>[ September 09, 2003, 03:27 AM: Message edited by: sikorka ]</small>

Dear Julia,

Your reply gives me a feeling of relief, as I was concerned for you. Of course it does not sound like you have everything sorted out just yet, so there is still an opportunity to offer some encouragement.

Certainly popular television shows and movies provide models of success, by which you can measure yourself short. The goal of marriage and children is fairly common.

The ability to find enjoyment in your surroundings is also a gift. So if you radiate out appreciation for your surroundings, that should increase your self-esteem, and your magnetic powers of attraction. A situation should open up for you to be able to make creative contributions.

If you focus on issues over which you have significant control, such as your aura of enjoyment and exhuberance, then other things should fall in line. You can look around you, where ever you are, and find something to admire, embelish and cherish; and your aura will brighten with your opinion.

You did not mention trying to send Randy healing help long distance. Has anything come up as workable for you?

Keep the faith,

Quipper