I'm hoping that someone can give me some advice. I'm 21 and my wife is 22. We've been married almost a year. She is from another country, and I'm in the military (that is how we met). She has only been in the US about 9 months and this is her first time here. She has no family that lives close enough to visit and only a few friends that she has made through her ESL classes, but doesnt really visit them except in their class.

Well, it started even before we got married that every time that we have a fight and it is over something the she obviously is at fault for, she either says or demonstrates that she wants to commit suicide. The first time was when we were still in her country and i caught her emailing an ex-boyfriend, which yes made me mad, but wasnt nearly as big of deal as she made it out to be. The next thing I know she locks herself in her parent's bedroom looking for their gun saying she wants to kill herself, so I have to break through the door to stop her, because I don't know if she'll really do it or not.

We made up and I paid her parents for the door and everything's fine for a while. That was the last time over there. But since we've been married and been back here, it's happened 3 times in only 9 months, last night being the most recent. Every time we fight (usually over stuff she does on the computer, which isnt very bad but just upsets me a little), there she is again, acting like shes going to take pills or slit her wrist with a steak knife. I'm really good at reading people, its part of my job, and I think I can read right through her.

I know she does it to get my attention and to take the attention off of what she has done wrong, and it works, because instead of continuing to ignore her or be mad, I am forced to follow her around taking away whatever dangerous objects she picks up, and eventually talking to her to calm her down and talking her into just going to sleep. She is amateur about certain things but she is a smart girl. I think she just doesnt realize whats important and whats not.

I think she is afraid to have her pride hurt by admitting that she is wrong about anything and just apologizing. Yesterday, when she started again, I thought, ok I really don't think she's ever gonna actually do it so Im just going to act like I dont see her. So she comes back into the kitchen a couple times to grab a steak knife or a glass of water to take some pills.

Finally she lures me into the bedroom and after i try to talk to her and explain to her that im onto her game (while being careful not to challenge her to do it, or say that I know that she wont) she grabs that steak knife and makes a shallow cut in her wrist. (the knife is sharp and had she wanted to cut herself deep, she could have easily done so) then I take the knife away and after a lot of fighting and her going back and forth from saying she just wants to die to she wants to go back hom, we finally go to sleep. Now, its the next day and we're not fighting but we're not talking either and I have no idea what she's going to do next.

The thing is, when we're not having one of our fights that come about every 2 or 3 months, we're great. We don't fight very often and she doenst seem depressed other than when she does something a little wrong. I don't get angry easily and Im not violent or anything when I do.

If anybody has any advice for me I would really appreciate it. I really don't know where to go from here.

Dan,

Why don't you call 911 next time she does this? Then she can get professional help to deal with her emotions immediately. Even if there's only a slim chance that she's truly suicidal, do you feel that you're professionally equipped to deal with someone who is considering suicide? It sounds possible that this is a convenient way for her to turn arguments around, but do you want to gamble on that?

I'd also highly recommend you get her into counseling now. You can get mental help thru your regional TRICARE number. For her to even threaten this when she's accused of things is highly disturbing.

Dobie

Dear Lobo Dan,

I have replied to a few suicide threads. I will post further ideas, but you must first read The Love Diet under Negotiations, posted by TOOMUCHCOFFEEMAN, at the end of the post 180 Degree Divorce Busters. There are some suprisingly simple, seemingly insignificant things that a husband can easily overlook, that make a big difference to your wife. Until you have read The Love Diet, you are as handicapped as a man in a wheelchair.

First, Thanks for serving the country, as you say you are in the military.

Dobie's idea of counseling may be a good idea. Counseling can take a step or two backwards, before going forward. I've been married 28 years to a Korean woman I met in the United States. My wife came to the US when she was about 27. About 12 years ago, I went to a Kaiser marriage counselor. He advised my wife and I to get divorced, and not spend the time or energy needed to make the marriage work.

I admit that I am subject to reverse psychology, but he did not have my MMPI, and there is no current MMPI. So be wary of counselors. With Magaged Care, some counseelors seem motivated to discourage you from seeing a counselor, rather than trying to save marriages.

One of my personal rules in counseling was to avoid criticizing my wife in counseling, and to let my wife decide what, and when, to bring things up. I would get on the counselor, though, if I did not agree with a statement or suggestion made by the couselor.

My wife pulled some emotional scenes, earlier in the marriage, really scared me some times.

You do not mention children. Where do you stand on children? You are still young, so there is plenty of time, theoretically. My daughter is 23, married, and has two cildren, almost 1 and 4. When my daughter was 15, she decided that my rules were overly burdensome, and that it would be more pleasant to party and stay with friends. My home is near several colleges, and there is a college party community. So my daughter left home at 15, and did not speak to me for 4 years. Now we get along fine. Some say the hormones kicked in. Once a woman has a couple of kids, she might settle down.

In the meantime, pets might substitute. There may be clubs or associations where her language is spoken. My wife would rent videos in her native language.

What I am suggesting, is to get ahead of the curve. While you are at peace, try to get things in place to create sanity for her, so as to extend the periods of peace between the trouble spots.

You may want to go over your approaches to her mistakes, that got extreme responses. You may want to make yourself a list of rules, to avoid suggesting a mistake of any kind. You may want to find ways to point things out to her in a way that is the presentation of your feelings, or an idea, and then only if it is really necessary. You seem to be saying you did nothing out of the ordinary, but I know how sensitve my wife, and other wives can be sometimes. My brother has a rule to never even make a suggestion to his wife.

180 Degree Divorce Busters comes to mind. It is under Negotiations, by TOOMUCHCOFFEEMAN. By changing some things, you can avoid falling into a routine, that might feel like a rut that she has fallen into, leavng her feeling trapped. Also, at the end is the Love Diet. I have overlooked things in the Love Diet, that were simple romatic things that most of us men would overlook if they were not pointed out to us.

There may be a time to call 911. It has happended that those situations have gone from bad to worse, upon the arrival of police and ambulances. Carroll O'Connor's son comes to mind. Carroll O'Connor, in LA, asked the police to stop by to check on his son, in Norhtern Californina, and the police stopped by, and some sort of misunderstanding took place, and a gunshot was heard, and the son committed suicide, from a situation prompted by his concerned dad.

Post back that you have read the Love Diet. That is the first basic you need.

I will look over my previous posts to try to put something applicable and coherent for you in the face of an emergency.

Welcome to MB, Marriage Builders. Avoid love Busters, and maximize effective deposits to the Love Bank.

Quipper
Husband of 28 years, raised 2 challenging kids, still struggling

<small>[ November 09, 2003, 06:26 PM: Message edited by: Quipper ]</small>

I am not saying this is the case all the time, but I have noticed that when someone's perspective is off a bit(atleast), sometimes they feel like their options are limited or zero. Loss of control, so the only way to have control is having control over whether they live or die. What is difficult is that sometimes people threaten this as a manipulation tool(because they can't be wrong or corrected or criticized). Other times, they just have an anger that they turn on themselves, and then just start trying to carry it out.
I am no expert, but I have personal hand experience with suicide in my own family, and know any threat should be serious. I found out my cousin was not threatening, but planning.
Time for some supervised professional help, I think, for your wife.
I don't mean to scare you, just help if I could.

Dear Lobo Dan,

One thing that may be important for preventing suicide is assisting your wife to build self-esteem. Feeling loved as a wife may be one way to build self-esteem.

You did not respond back about finding The Love Diet under Negoitating posted by TOOMUCHCOFFEEMAN, in 180 Degree Divorce Busting. Since I have not heard back that you have read it, and I don't know how to make a link work, I will copy the first part of The Love Diet here, so you can become intersted and finish reading it there.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


From Barbara DeAngelis book "What Women Want Men To Know":

The Love Diet: How To Feed Your Partner's Heart.

This is the "Love Diet". I've created it as an easy way to remember and practice feeding your partner's heart and being a wonderful lover outside of the bedroom. It's simple, it's fun, and it will make a big difference in your relationship.

When you study nutrition, you learn about the basic food groups -vegetables, grains, proteins, dairy products- and the importance of having each of these every day. Well, the emotional nutrition is the same -feeding your partner's heart means making sure you give him or her all of the basic "emotional food groups" each day. What are these? I call them The Three A's: Attention, Affection, and Appreciation. They are the secret ingredients contained in the Love Diet that will fill up your partner's heart: You pay attention, you show affection, and you express appreciation.

If I asked you right now how often you need to eat every day, you'd probably answer that you need to eat at least two or three times a day, with a few snacks in between. Well, I'd like you to think about feeding your partner's heart in the same way with the following Love Diet.

*Love Meals: Your partner needs three Love Meals a day. What is a Love Meal? It's a time each day for three minutes when you feed your partner's heart with one or more of the menu items contained in the Three A's: Attention, Affection, or Appreciation. I call this the 3X3 formula, three times a day, when you choose to actively love your partner for at least three minutes. Think about it as three minutes of intimacy. Maybe it is three minutes in the morning together before you get out of bed,or three minutes on the phone in the middle of the day, or three minutes after the kids go to sleep. These are Love Meals. Just like you'd have breakfast, lunch, and dinner, you have Love Meal#1,#2,and #3!!

*Love Snacks: Even when you eat several good meals a day, you need a snack once in a while, don't you? Well, the same applies to feeding your partner's heart. Along with the 3X3 formula of three Love Meals a day, give your mater several love snacks during the day. What is a love snack?:

CONTINUED:


Quipper

<small>[ November 10, 2003, 04:44 PM: Message edited by: Quipper ]</small>

Dear Lobo Dan,

One of the difficulties in suicide prevention is that the ordinary goal of therapy is to have the individuial feel competent, and able to do a wide range of actions. In trying to prevent suicide, you sometimes take steps to stop the person from one of their options, killing themselves. So generally, you want to try to encourge and empower the individual, but you need to convince them that suicide limits their power to do things.


Here are some paragraphs from another suicide thread in which I posted. I will work through the ideas and come back to edit over the next few days. Short of time this minute. Thanks again for serving inthe Military.

These paragrphs are from my post to a thread, in which I adressed a despondent wife of a man in the military. The wife was depressed upon separation from her husband. I will check it over to see if it is understandable over the next few days.

First I wish to again point out that your efforts are those of a wife of a serviceman, who is serving the cause of defending freedom, and there are a wide array of challenges to freedom in the world today, such as terrorism and semi-state sponsored terrorism, and emerging nuclear powers. So please feel the value of your service to the world, and to the many people enjoying freedom.

Scientology has developed a TONE SCALE, as a formula for helping people feel more positive. One way to use the Tone Scale, is to increase 0.5 or 1.0 number value points above the current feeling, and once you have the higher level attitude, then work on 0.5 or 1.0 above that. I carry the chart in my wallet, so I can refer to it. You can work on yourself, or with one ormore others.

You have said you cannot afford counseling right now, so I will try to give you some ideas here, but let me first recommend that you seek better help than I will probably be able to provide here. You can find Scietiogy Services in Europe. The Tone Scale is described in detail in SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL( $55.00) by L. Ron Hubbard. Tapes and CD's are also available. Feelings of suicide might be Hopeless, 0.07, at the bottom of the range of the Tone scale. O.5 above would be Grief (0.5). Certainly you can feel sad about your husband having difficulties, and your being separated from H. 0.5 above that is Fear (1.0). You can probably understand fear, as you are uncertain of the future, and it could be reasonable to fear extended separation from H, and fear D, divorce, and fear that the extensive efforts you made to make the marriage work, may possibly not pay off, at least maybe not directly.

Next upward by 0.5 is Anger (1.5). You can target anger at the world situation that keeps your husband apart from you. You can be angry at the U.S. and World Economy, which falls short of providing the money for the Armed Services to adequately keep husbands and wives together. You can be angry at therapists who do not give your husband the cure that he needs quickly. 0.5 above that is Antagonism (2.0). This is criticism, or poking fun, which you can accuse Fate of having you working for the good of saving your marriage, and it seems not to be working, yet you know that you are doing good, but fate is giving you illogical results.

Next 0.5 above is Boredom (2.5). You have been trying the same thing long enough, with enough intensity, that you can see the repition, and that you have settled into a routine of trying, and not getting the opitmal results you hope for, and putting forth more effort again without seeing much tangible resuts, has now become the usual. You have a feeling of your own self worth though, that you are being a good person, doing the right thing, but rewards are delayed. 0.5 above is Conserviatism (3.0) which is feeling comfortable with things as they are, and hoping that nothing cahnges. Cheerfulness is 3.5 and Entusiasm is 4.0, making things better, the top of life.

You can learn to recognize your feelings of the moment,and then work on thinking 0.5 above that, and once you have brought yourself up, then work on 0.5 above that, to bring yourself up again.

Usually, when I post, I give some details of my own problems. I feel that posting to help others, helps me with my own problems, since I have to consider following my own advice.

Quipper

<small>[ November 11, 2003, 04:01 PM: Message edited by: Quipper ]</small>