Gonna get burned here by everyone I guess but here goes anyways..3 yrs ago W said she wanted to have an affair to explore her sexuality...upshot of talk was that she would leave me to do it if she had to...so my choice...go thru all the muck an stick with her or leave an get on with life...I loved this woman and wanted no other...so I went through the muck and when it was all over found it didnt hurt anymore and we had 3 sums with her lover and after 3 yrs have never been happier together...I have not read anything like this in here so wondered if I am on my own here....<P>------------------<BR>If here is the only place I can be...now must be the only time I can have...GM

huh, ??????? What the ???????<BR> I'm sorry did I read you right, you have no problem with your wife having a lover. Gad I'm sorry thats beyond me. It really is, <P>------------------<BR>Just call me - Deb<BR>------------------------<BR>The only day I can do anything about is today, yesterday is gone, tomorrow is not yet mine.<P>

Big diff between infidelity & swinging...<P>Where you drunk or high at the time you had your threesomes?

Perhaps there is suppressed homosexual urges and watching a man with your wife is a turn on. Oh well.<BR>

I think you are in the wrong BB. But no, i don't think that there is anything wrong with SWINGING, ONLY if BOTH partners agree to it, and you are being safe sexually. Who are we to judge!

Well, being a good Catholic, I personally think swinging (or extramarital sex) is immoral.<P>The bottom line here, GM, is that your wife used a selfish demand on you. You've coped and sacrificed, and found out that it's fun. But the reality is that the dynamics of a 2-person relationship (marriage) is complicated enough; it takes an even "rarer" set of skills to deal with a 3-person relationship. If you're successful and everyone is happy, then you've achieved something that's pretty uncommon. But I'd also think that the long-term chances of everyone's happiness in this relationship will be pretty poor.<P>So yeah, I think you're on your own here.

uhhhhhh.....o.k.?<P>------------------<BR>Rutger......One day at a time.<P><BR>

GM - Whether you think swinging is OK or not OK (I can appreciate both perspectives), it is definitely NOT the same thing as your W just having an affair. In your case, she TOLD you she wanted a lover, you were given a choice, and, ultimately, you became a "participant." Many of us here have the experience of a spouse who cheats on us, DOESN'T tell us, and, in fact (typically), actually DENIES anything is going on. This, to me, is the real definition of an affair.<P>I have to add that, in the glory days of my 1st marriage (I'm on my 2nd now), my 1st W and did do some swinging (and yes, including drugs) and, I have to say, there were times when it was a real hoot! (And I will testify that it CAN be a big turn-on watching another guy bang your W, even "helping him in," provided you're high enough on your drug of choice.) However. (BIG "however!") I feel our swinging was the beginning of the end of our marriage, because it did put the idea in my 1st W's head that it was OK to screw around, I think. Which she proceeded to do WITHOUT telling me. So be careful. You've definitely opened a Pandora's box where sex outside of marriage is concerned.<P>Regards and blessings,<P>--Wex

<P>Let's keep in mind we are at the marriage BUILDER's site. I feel this topic should be edited out of here immediately. It is not edifying to anyone who is here to build a beautiful, sacred, strong marriage. Please keep your deviant behavior to yourself. Thank you.

I agree with Abigail, I don't want to hear that smut, if you think your marriage will survive this your wrong, its a SIN and all of you involved will be punished.

Oh, give me a break! If we can't say what's really on our minds and have to censor everything just so some "sensitive" souls won't be offended, I don't really see any point in posting to this forum. And if this ever actually happens, it's definitely sayonara as far as I'm concerned!<P>--Wex

Now , wait a minute folks........<P>Although, I completely agree that this is not something that is moral or does anything good for anyone - married or not. I feel that this sort of thing should be recognized and dealt with.<P>Since my H became a cop, I have been exposed to all sorts of "decadent" behavior.<P>This stuff is happening out there in the world today and we can't bury our heads in the sand about it. <P>More and more people are straying from 'normal" male/female relationships and looking for excitement/fulfillment in other ways.<P>I am curious as to why that is happening. Is it the actual sex itself or is it a touch of running away from the pressures of life and responsibility. Or is it the ever more popular selfishness that is becoming dominant in our society.<P>GM - Can you shed some light on any of this for us? Why did your W want to do this and what was it that made you get into it also?<P>Sheba

gm, my first w and i did the three some a couple of times with a 2nd. woman. as i've written here, a few times, those acts remain at the top of my sexual memories. i've run instant replay a million times and the mental pictures retain the clarity of yesterday and the same excitement.<BR>my current w and i were with a lesbian couple that was very exciting to me but my w didn't particularly enjoy it.<BR>my situation is simalar to yours'. i have always believed that if one's spouse wants to have sex with someone they would someday do it. so i assumed the position that someday it would happen. i simply told my w that i could deal with her having a sexual encounter with someone else. one night she came home and asked me if i meant it and if i was sure it was ok. i told her it was. she went on a date w/ a guy i guess to have sex but he couldn't get it up. she told me this. later she told me there was another guy and i again told her it was ok. so she did. i didn't mind it too much. after a while, like a couple of months of staying home alone and looking after her two boys, i starting feeling like a chump. it never occured to me that an emotional affair might develop. i didn't know what an affair was. i just thought it was sex. anyway, about 3 months passed and she and he grew tired of each other and she stopped seeing him. that's it and that's that. it has never bothered me, i never lost any sleep.<BR>i have this outlook where i don't want to be held hostage to someones' sexual fidility. i decided early on that i wouldn't count on someone being sexually faithful and still feel that way. after hanging out on this board for over a year, i'm comvinced i did the right thing. so many on this board believed their spouse would remain faithful, after all they took a vow, but as you can read, many do not. i think it's an unrealistic expection.

Frankie,<P>That's a cop out. If you don't expect and/or intend to stay faithful, what's the point of making a commitment and getting married? <P>This whole discussion is a PERFECT example of the decline of moral values our culture is experiencing. We're so caught up in the idea that everyone's got to be happy ALL the time and with the concept of "If it FEELS good, DO it," that we don't have the moral decency to follow through with the commitment we make to our spouse.<P>We've bent SO far over backwards to protect that which is "different," that we can't see how far we've fallen.<P>I'm with K. I'm not Roman Catholic, and, in fact, I don't practice my religion at all, but I have a general understanding of what I think is just and right. Traditional family structure is what I truly believe in. It's what I aspire to have. If I wanted to "swing," I'd stay single. You can't have it both ways. You can't be a swinging single AND be a responsible parent and/or spouse. It's just not right, and it's one of the main reasons the moral fiber of our country is disintigrating before our very eyes.<P>JMHO.<P>------------------<BR>/// Lone Star * ///<P><BR>

Everyone - There is an amazing amount of hypocrisy around the so-called religious perspective on sex. I will agree that, in Christianity, a primary value is that heterosexual relations are only morally permissable with the context of marriage. I don't think there's really any argument on this, and it's one of the primary reasons I am no longer a Christian. Frankly, I simply do not believe that sex IN AND OF ITSELF has anything to do with morality. After all, God designed the [censored] and the [censored] to fit nicely together, like a mortise and tenon joint in carpentry. Morality enters the scene with regard to the cirucumstances SURROUNDING sexual behavior - whether a relationship contract (commitment to the other person) is violated, or someone is hurt (physically or emotionally) in the process.<P>Nor do I believe that there is anything such as "perverse" sex IN AND OF ITSELF. Sex must be consensual, because otherwise you are injuring someone with your sexual behavior. But I see no intrinsic reason why masturbation, anal sex, oral sex, homoerotic sex or any other form of consensual sex should somehow be regarded as a "perversion." I think doing so has resulted IN a lot of genuine (that is hurtful) perversion, such as a culture of rape, etc., etc.<P>I also wish that those of you who are coming from a religious perspective would at least RESPECT other perspectives and not go around telling people they're going to hell for certain sexual behavior or that certain types of sex are "perversions." That kind of VIEWPOINT is a perversion!<P>--Wex

What is so funny to me that on this very site one of the things one must NOT do is show "disrespectful judgement" by imposing your system of values or beliefs on another. One is showing arrogance by implying that your way is the only right way. And yet right here on this sight, the so called "religious" people or SOME who don't believe in swinging are passing judgement saying that it is sinful and it is disgusting. I thought that the only person who could judge him was GOD. I am not religious nor do i wish to practice swinging, but i have enough respect for someones sex life that i would not judge them and say they should not bring this smut onto this board. Let me guess, homosexuals and mixed couples should not be on this sight either, huh? People give me a break and GET OVER YOURSELVES! Can we give opinions without the judgements?

lone star, looks like my grand father was right, this world is going to hell in a hand basket.<BR>on the other hand, imho, things have never been better. just the other day the washington post reported crime, of all catagories is down to the lowest point since, as i recall, 1993.<BR>i too am an atheist, though my w pleads with me to say i'm agnotist. just the thought of having to follow some mans interpretation of some written document makes me feel trapped.<BR>there seems to be an infinite number of rules, people enforcing the rules, people interpreting the rules, and people punishing others for breaking a rule. and every rule is sacred.<BR>just think what it must have been like during the times of the puritans, witch hunts, scarlet letters. <BR>i'm still dead set against a woman staying with me if she wants to leave, or be with someone else, simply because she took a vow. she must stay only if she wants to. <BR>still, it's never been better.

.<p>[This message has been edited by Madelyn (edited July 30, 1999).]

GM, <P>Are you getting toasty yet? <P>It looks like there are two sides of the fence here and not many fence sitters. I have to stand with the others in saying this is wrong. There is no way, I mean --NO WAY IN HELL-- I would ever bring another person into my marriage bed to share my wife. How could you stand to see another man with your wife? I find it interesting that you said "...we had 3 sums with her lover...". HER LOVER. She doesn't consider you HER LOVER? maybe I'm old fashioned, but as a husband it is my desire to be my wife's lover.<P>I suppose if you and your W are happy, then good for you.<P>I am seeking a much different intimacy with my wife than what you seek with yours.

Things are getting a little off track here!!!<P>GM made this thread for a reason!!<P>GM - please post and tell us what exactly it is you want to say or know.<P>Are you confused that this is supposedly what's making you happier? I would like you to address my questions in my previous post if you can.<P>Please let us know these things.<P>Sheba