I sent a reply but think it did not go through. I will wait a while to see if it got lost and if so will respond again. I have read all your updates/posts and wish you a good weekend.

Vibeke
No they did not get through. I would be interested to hear what you had to say. Tommorrow we have a soccer game at 11 am my time(I'm a hour ahead of the time posted here). But alas my two week vacation is over starting monday. I get up at stupid o'clock during the week and it will take some adjustment. The GF is amazed that I can getup right on time in the mornings with out a alarm. Well write me either tomorrow or later.
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Hey!
We went to the soccer game today, she was a little grump at first saying she was tired but she loosened up after a bit. She was OK after that talking about this and that. The game was tied and we left. I took her home cause she had work to do and had to get things ready for the kid when they returned to school tomorrow. She hoping to get replys this week for jobs,If that happens her outlook on things will improve greatly. Well I'll check in later before I go to bed tonight.
231

Just to let you know I'm still looking in. She called me at lunch at work today just to say hi and that she loves me.It energized me for the rest of the day
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Hello out there. Mucho technical difficulty. I keep posting memos to you and then it tells me I must be logged in to submit a post. So I log in (I thought I was already logged in) and then presto my entire post disappears. So before I reply to you.. I will send this short note as a test.

Hello (whoever),
It seems to be working now.
First, I am glad to see that you seem to be out of the dumps and takin care of business.
Second, let me point out that you're not getting much feedback on this website mainly because this site is mostly used by betrayed spouses or the betraying spouses. You, my dear, are technically the "other man" which makes you a pariah on this site to most people (although I have noticed an empathic supportive response or two to "others" occassionally).
Don't you find it interesting that you get yourself up and go to visit your daughters and suddenly your ex is making advances towards you and when you see your GF out and about she waves enthusiastically and then wants to see you? Hey, I remember the post - I know all about your ex and wanting to call the police. But you did the right thing and all ended well. Your daughters stood up for you and your ex knew in her heart that you were in a good place and trying to do the right thing. My point is this - when you shift your attitude and concentrate on giving love and expressing love in a healthy way to those in your life who deserve it - then somehow love comes our way. I think it was the famous Lennon/McCartney duo who wrote "And in the end, the love you take, is equal to the love you make". Keep up those brief "just checkin in" episodes with your girls. They will tell you years from now how much it meant to them. Honestly. I once read about how teens start frowning and pulling away when their parents hug them on kiss their cheek or even just say something nice about them. Don't ever let that stop you - teens need that more than ever. My Dad was not a very demonstrative man when it came to showing love/affection. You know I can still remember the ONE TIME I was in the kitchen whining to my Mom about my skinny legs and my thin hair and my tan was not dark enough (blah, blah, 20 something angst) and my Dad casually strolled through the kitchen and said "Honey you're much more beautiful than any movie star." I will NEVER forget that five seconds in life. My point is (I keeping trying to make points here - what's up) that no act of kindness goes unnoticed or unappreciated and when it comes to a father/daughter relationship the kindness goes a long way - up to the type of man she chooses to be with. You seemed to have tried my suggestion of channeling your anxiety into positive steps of kindness towards other and it has worked!
O.K. now some more verbal "attitude check". So you were married to a woman whose entire family thought you were worthless. And now you're dating a girl whose family doesn't want you in her life either. Do I see a pattern working here?I mean, it is obvious that you have successfully attracted these women but what is it that repeats this dynamic of family control that somehow pits you to be the "bad guy" in the mix? Now I can understand the GF's family cautioning them away from a man who would be with her while still married... but nonetheless you sure do find yourself in situations where you get undervalued. Humans don't exist in a vacuum. When you marry someone - you marry their family. Do you want an instant replay of your first marriage? Just think about it. Use your time alone to really look at this. No need to force answers to yourself or to me. Just sit in the question. You seem like a pretty nice, caring fellow with a job. Why all the heat from all the inlaws and outlaws? Puhleez... don't tell me you're just an innocent, misunderstood victim of circumstance. You are the common denominator in both of these scenarios. Something is workin here. Just think about it in quiet moments and even pray (hey, I won't minister to you - I noticed you believed in a Higher power so I suggest prayer)to become clearer on the situation.
Sorry, I did not respond sooner. I stumbled on this website as a friend of mine is going through a terrible time. She and husband are reconciling after a 7 year affair and this site has helped her. I am not a betrayed spouse (I don't think) or a betraying spouse (although I have been tempted) but just a person. I do have my fears, anxiety and marital woes and I'm trying to work through what's what. I will check in from time-to-time to wish you well.
V

Hey Vibeke;
Nice to hear from you.First of all this thing about being the innocent party here. I never said I was a choirboy here nor have I ever claim to be the sharpest knife it the draw ( but I ain't no butter knife either). I have my faults and the failed marrige is not all her fault and I do take blame for things that are my fault. The reason the inlaws never like me is because I was who I was and the fact there is money involved that I did not know about until after. I was a loyal husband was home for dinner every night and did all the things I was suppose to do, but you read what I had to put up with. The GF and I are planning to live together and get married, and yes maybe your right that I am the OM but I was that two years after the fact. The mother's problem is like the GF says "She wacko". We both beleive in God and angels and us, the mother is really religous to the point that she does not believe in separtation and divoice(mother's religion). She been trying to save the GF soul ever since the cow patties hit the fan a couple of years ago.The Mother thought I was just a freind until she found out otherwise.She lectures the GF on how she is going to hell for this and adultery is a sin ( which it is to a point) and that even if gets a divorce in God's eyes is still married to the EX. The GF said that in her mother's religion that what ever goes wrong in the house or marriage that it's the woman's fault never the man's. Though I have to admit that since the GF's sister gotten a beating that broke three of her ribs that mama has changed her tune a bit. The GF loves her mama but she will put her foot down and stand up for herself. I started out on this web site to try to build a good relationship and future marrige to this woman because we don't what to fail for many reasons. I was looking for advice but I needed to give people background as to what the obsticules we are dealing with here. Maybe I digrassed alittle here but I had alot on my own plate and this place has help me spring clean my soul alittle and you Vibeke have given me some good advice and the ocasional kick in the pants. There are people in the world worst off than we are and we both agree we can overcome any problem and give each other a good life despite our detactors.
Well keep those cards and letters come and tune in later to see whats new. Same bat time, Same bat channel.
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O.K.... O.K....
You seem to be feeling so good you're almost back to your good 'ol cocky self! (smile). That's the spirit! Well, I don't know that to be true about you but I'm sure with your great sense of humor there has to be some cockiness.
I do wish you all the best, really.
So, when you say that the marriage is two years history do you mean only emotionally? Or are they also geographically separated - living apart and all that stuff? If they are completely separate bed and board well then even I have to admit that this changes the landscape. I thought she was still in the same home with him and "torn between two lovers" so to speak and this is why I hated to see you so desperate (no longer) in what sounded like a futile situation. So... you really did not digress but completed the picture. Do you have postings elsewhere on this site? Are you getting the support you need to help you two? I hope so.
Stay in touch. I wish you the best.

Vibeke;
Yes separt house, bed, everything. I'm sorry I was not clear enough. I also have one posting titled blended family and I was asking advice on how to make it work for us. Yes I'm cocky at times, and I like making jokes, some not repeatable here, and generally like having a good time. My GF is 5 foot while I am 6 one. We were looking for work on the computer one day at unemployment.suddenly I said "I can't do this job, I'm too tall!" then I turned to her and said"Here you can do it" The job was a short order cook. Needless to say I got hit. Any ways I have to go to bed, but a bit of good news. I was informed to night by a freind that the GF is about to get a job interveiw sometime next week and her qualifications are just what they are looking for. Wish her luck.
Remember man who stands on toilet is high on pot.
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Hey Vibeke;
I will be looking in on the weekend from time to time but I'll be busy playing master mechanic. I have to put a rad into the van this weekend and I hope that Sunday is not too cold to work in.I try to do all my repairs myself but I do know my limits. We have three vehicals, a mini van, a
taurus,and a big bright yellow firebird(her car). I mean a blind man can see her car coming. Oh well I would like to talk to you about that car if you have the time. see you later
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vibeke;
Just checking in to see what's up. After work I picked up the GF oldest daughter today after work and we went out and had wendy's together. We talked or should I say she talked and we had a good fun time. When I dropped her off she gave me a big hug and said she loved me. She a great little girl and I enjoy having her around. she and my girls get along great together,like sisters.chech in later.
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Hi,<p>I just read your story and talking about emotional overload.....WOW! However, I have to agree with kam6318 and Vibeke in regards to giving sweetpea some time to take care of all of her issues with her family and her husband. I was once in her shoes. To give you a little history...right before I filed for my divorce from my HB, I met a wonderful guy. Nothing serious at first, just great conversations and a whole lot in common. Naturally from these conversations, a relationship developed. I went ahead with filing for the divorce and initially did not tell my friend, because truly he had nothing to do with my problems with my husband. A few months into the divorce proceedings, I decided to share what was going on with me with my friend. He was quite supportive and understanding and honestly if it had not been for him, I don't know how I would have made it through the rough times. On the other hand he also wanted to elevate our relationship to the next level and immediately begin pressuring me about what my next steps would be once the divorce was final. He wanted to know if I would be interested in another relationship, living together, getting married....the questions, ten phone calls a day (literally) and inquires never stopped. I felt totally overwhelmed and smothered and we live in two different states!! I could not comtemplate a future with him or anyone for that matter until I had resolved my present situations. Because he was such a geniune,loving and caring person it was difficult for me to finally tell him that I needed some S-P-A-C-E!!! All of his efforts made me feel as though he was was afraid that once my divorce was final, I would bolt and that he needed reassurance that we were going to be together soon. I finally did ask for my time alone and he gave it to me. After finalizing my divorce and taking time out for myself. I called him up and we started talking again and eventally dating. I say all the above to say this, don't smother her and pressure her, this will only make her feel worse. She is in a very vulnerable and emotional state right now and is trying her best to figure out how to get out of her situation. The last thing she needs is another person draining her emotionally and mentally with a barrage of inquires and future plans. Believe me when she is ready, you will know. Please give her the time and space she needs right now. That is the best thing you can do for her. Take this time to invest in YOU and get back to the basics of the things you love to do!!! You can't rush it, if you were meant to be together, you will be!! <p>Oh, yeah by the way........my friend and I got married and are expecting our first baby!! So keep the faith.......slow it down and give her all the time she needs, she will come around I promise!!!

Lovemonkey37;
Hi and nice to hear from somebody new. Yes I have been giving her space. We still talk on the phone but unless its something important I don't call her, she calls me. Usually twice a week and we see each other every other Friday for dinner and a movies, then on sundays when the kids play soccer.Mama went home and she has calmed down alot.Now the topic that fustrating her is her firebird. The EX wants the car and is threating to put it on the table when court day comes. She feels that she has no choice but to give it to him. I'm feel that its her car and she should fight for it. If a judge says give to him then give to him but don't give up on it until then. You see everything she as owned was either sold on her or wreaked ( case in point, he kicked the pop up headlight the last time she lent the car to him). I feel strongly that it's her baby and does have a say.We'll talk about it when the time is right. I don't know about you during the time you and your husband was getting it together but there are times I miss her alot during the week, her presence is always sorely missed. I told her the other day that she's the boss.Like a typical woman she told me I better remember that(smile)
Well I better get off she might be trying to call me, hopfully that she got another job interveiw.
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Hi Vibeke;
If you are looking in I have some good news. Yesterday the GF called me and told me she had a job interveiw for a shipper/reciever. They called her for an interveiw and it lasted three hours. After the first interview they sent her to the person who would be her boss. The lady told her that she was the first person that made this far. They chatted and hit it off. There was a tour of the plant and then some more chit chatting. The lady told her that if they want her they would call her today. I got home tonight and there was a message that the GF would be calling me at 8o'clock(7 on the site)She told me if she got it she would call me soooo I think she got it. I"ll keep you posted. If she got it you'll know.
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YAHOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HAPPY DAYS ARE HERE AGAIN
AND TOMORROW IS FRIDAY!Ho yah she got the job
231 [img]images/icons/cool.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]<p>[ January 17, 2002: Message edited by: 231 ]</p>

To live together before marriage, the odds of the marriage working is so low! As to having sex before marriage doesn't have a high standard either. I would let her solve things in her mind and marriage before you two decide to settle down. You are playing with a fire, and adding fuel to the fire. Do you actually think that you see this person for who she really is? My H had an affair with OW and from the detective I had, she had another sexual affair in her marriage in the first 10 years of her marriage, and there is a possiblity of her making a pass at a mechanic coming to the house to fix some equipment, and then now my H. You don't really know about a person until you are married to them and spend 24hrs. a day with them. <p>SNL has spent that time with me, and now is ready to move on. Look at this woman with caring and love. But really look hard, this woman needs to get herself sorted out, just like my H OW needed to sort her life out and to this day she has not told her H about her 2nd for sure sexual affair. She is a whimp and scared that her husband will kick her out, she has never worked in her life, and has always depended on her husband for money. She is a loser. <p>Not stating that your woman is a loser, but give her a few years to get herself under control, and talk with her family. Family is important for a relationship to keep going, I wish SNL would be more active in my family, but he chose to keep his distance from my family. I talk regularly to his mother, and keep in touch with his brother on e-mail, I find family a source of good connection.<p>Really think about what you are doing, do these kids deserve another divorce in a few years, no! They need stability and comfort and safe zone. Don't move in together, give each of yourselfs space and date after the divorce. She has already committed adultery, and look at the example she has set for the kids. Don't move in together!

Dear thinker;
I don't like being mean or rude but if you any more negative you'll probally end up getting hit by lightning. We know what we are doing, and thoses kids;at least the older two; where never treated right until I came along, the boy never got any thing for his birthdays and forget about christmas some underwear and socks don't cut it. She been hustling her butt to get that job so we can have enough to pay our debts off and be able to cloth and feed those kids. My own are planning to spend every other week with us. So we need the money to feed them too.We are going to live together for awhile until we can get married. Living together for us is a way for us to get going with our lives. We not only have to look after those kids but put them through school and save money so we can retire. I have faith in her and us, she has never let me down and has always been honest and done what she sets out to do. I have worked with her, spend alot of time with her, and we even carried each other when times where tough money wise. There where times I did not have money for food or rent(this is after her hubby left) and she came through for me. We where just freinds but when she was down and out and need money for milk and bread i gave her money and said forget it.She has done the same for me. Now that I work hours that does not allow me to do somethings she does my bill paying for me and never taken anything that she wasn't suppose to. If I sound defencive,I am. I'm a pretty good judge of character and I find her very honest. When its an apple she calls it an apple.
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Hi
I'm sorry for may angery outburst but I know all of the story here and I've only given you bit and peices here. I'm very protective of her when people start putting negative things into the mix. I'm happy she got the job cause with her job and my two jobs( one is only saturdays) we can make 60 thousand a year and we can live comfortable on this. Now we can pay up some of our debts both her's and mine.We wish we could get married today but curcumstances would allow us to do that and we just wish to get going with our lives and do the things normal families do. With her working it takes an enormous strain off her shoulders and mine.I forsee a better aditude from her towards the future.
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Vibeke;
Answer this question for me.How can I convince her she has rights? She was complaining that the EX just showed up at bowling on Saturday and disrupted her youngest game.He been pushing the envelop with her and I can tell she is getting pissed.But she seems reluctant to do anything about it stating he has rights.What about hers? I mean I agree he has rights but when he abuses those rights isn't there something she can do?
I myself don't like it when he thumbs his nose at her.I'm to the point where when we do get our own place that I would like to take him to the side and say here are the rules,break them and I'll do what ever(don't know what at this point).
Its like her firebird,he has a copy of the key and just comes and takes it. Her response is that the law says that he has that right until things are settled so there isn't much I can do she says.Yet I know that there is something she can do.I feel that it's her car in her name and she ahs the right to say no.My personal twist to this is that its her car don't give up on it unless you have too.I want her to keep the car for herself,something she and she alone owns.I would never take it without permission and I know she would let me drive it. I haven't asked cause I don't want it to be an issue with him.
231<p>[ January 20, 2002: Message edited by: 231 ]</p>

Hi There 231,<p>Glad to hear that your GF got that JOB!!!!!!!!! That's wonderful and one less pressure you both will have to worry about. As for your GF's sorry-$!(#&$^@%@%@^, she needs to get a restraining order on him immediately. Especially at the rate that he has been going with her. He knows in his heart that it is over so that's why he is behaving the way he is. Yes, he does have rights but these rights include scheduled visitations times and hours and are determined by their attorneys or a judge if need be. He should not be allowed to disrupt her life when and everytime he feels like it. If she has an attorney they can advise her on this and draw up the papers. During this legal separation she can definitely have parameters set and needs to do so immediately. She is probably trying to be nice to him and not upset him because she does not want an ugly divorce or feels that he will give her what she wants in court. WRONG!!!! He is going to act a fool regardless and the sooner she realizes that the better off she will be by putting her foot down with him and not letting him continue to intimidate her. She should avoid all contact with him when she can. Sure he can call the kids but she should put them on the phone. When he comes to pick them up, have them waiting at the door. He needs to understand that it is over and that she is moving forward and away from him and she will need to do that by whatever avenues she has. Also, I agree with you. Tell her not to give in to any demands that he is making. She needs that car for her and her children. He doesn't want the car anyway, just wants to aggravate her. Tell her to stand her ground and ask for everything that she does want and even the things that she doesn't want. Believe me, the judge will make the right decision. I got the house, furniture and the car in my divorce. All he got was the clothes on his back!! Tell her not to give in to him. Make his [censored] stand before the judge and say why he does not want her to have the car and a means of transportation for his kids. I bet you a thousand bars of chocolate when it comes right down to it he will back down. Sorry that he has keys to the car, I took the car keys and garage opener from my ex-husband the day before he was to be served his papers. So he didn't know they were gone until it was too late. HA! Tell her that the next time he pulls this stunt, call the car in stolen and have him arrested!! That should teach him!! Sorry if I sound a little pissed, but I just hate it when the scorned spouse uses manipulative stunts to hurt and caused unnecessary pain because they are no longer in the picture.<p>Anyway, didn't mean to vent like that.........to answer your other question regarding the time apart with my second husband. Yes it was very hard, but I knew that I had to be strong and move forward first for myself before I could move forward with someone else. Once we finally got together though, it was a bumpy start but we got over the hurdles and are now madly in love. We often reminince about the beginnings of our relationship and how far we have come, emotionally and mentally. (we were just doing that this morning as a matter of fact) He realizes that he almost lost me due to the constant inquires into our future and I realize that I almost let a good thing go.....but somehow it all worked out for the best because we both kept the faith and knew we would get together if it was meant to be. I'll keep you in my prayers too.