Does Jesus Christ agree with Harley's Basic Concepts? Why? Why Not?
<p>I ask this because I'm going insane!
<p>Yesterday I received some information from a pastor on the subject of "What makes Marriage WORK?". From his response I got the distinct impression that The Bible puts 85-100% of the responsibility for the success of the marriage on the mans' shoulders. It is also unfair and selfish for the man to ask his wife to meet his needs.
<p>Please chime in on this. I need your input.

Robert,
<p>In my opinion Jesus does agree with Dr. Harley. It is my belief that everyone must do there part. One person can not hold most if not all the responsibility of making the marriage work. Even with a perfect Man if the wife is not working at it the marriage will fail. I think it is unfair for one to assume that one spouse is more responsible than the other. I have talked with leaders in my church about this and they agree with me. Don't put the blame on yourself.
<p>Steph

Please look at I Corinthians 7 where it discusses how to take care of eachother. Yes in my opinion the man should be the initiator just as in Ephesians 5 : 19 - 33 where the husband is told to love the wife as Christ loved and gave his life for the church. This is a sacrificial love that puts you second and your wife first. This takes great strength and wisdom that only God can give you. No joke!!! By loving her in faith she will begin to support (submit to) you and revere you because she is seeing the love of Jesus in you. This is how I responded to my wife's infidelity and it has paid off beyond my greatest expectations.
<p>I support Dr. Harley's opinion in the context of the Bible. I Corinthians 7:5 talks about defrauding eachother and its consequences. I rejected my wife in terms of affection and she found it elsewhere. Simple as that; the devil moved in for the kill and almost killed our marriage.
<p>Though it seems the burden is on the husband's role, both spouses are responsible for the other. Both have to sacrifice for the other and when this happens our marriages will reflect heaven and we will experience eternal living on earth. I also think it is crucial that we communicate our needs to eachother. Never underestimate this communication thing. If your spouse does not know the other's need how can that need be fulfilled. We have to discuss and appreciate needs.....or someone else will meet them. See the infidelity posts. For me it took 13 years to begin talking about and appreciating my wife's needs, because I didn't listen and probe, and she didn't say. If she doesn't meet your needs, you will end up a statistic.
<p>Robert, forget about the percentages and just love the woman. How can you love too much? When you are busy loving as Jesus loved, you will not have time to measure or keep score.

Eugene,
<br> Thanks again for a terrifically inspiring post. I copied it and sent it in email to my wife Lynn, along with some apologies and promises.
<p> I tend to be passive-aggressive. When I'm unhappy, I rarely scream (although I did when some of the first revelations of her infidelity came out). Instead, I get very overbearingly analytical, with a great scowl of gloom, wearing her down with ever-so-softly-spoken crushing judgments and unanswerable questions. A scream would probably be easier to handle!
<p> We were doing great in rebuilding, as you may remember from my posts last week, until a new set of horrifying revelations and new lies came out. The mother of all "love busters." I withdrew terribly, "feeling" I wanted a divorce and "feeling" contempt, but "thinking" and "willing" constantly that I wanted to get past that. Many hours of prayer, and time on the MB board, gained me some peace and serenity after about five days. Lynn was incredibly courageous the whole time. But now, this next week, it is she who is filled with fear and suffering. I'm going to do my best (which ain't that great, but I'm not too old to improve) to follow your great wisdom above.
<p> Regarding the question of whether Jesus would agree with the Harleys, I agree with you that He basically would. The Christian ideal is "unconditional" love, in marriage and in all our affairs, not the ever-conditional love the Harleys describe. But as our priest explained to us with great patience, the last verses of St. John (especially if you understand the original Greek, which he told us) show that even St. Peter, beholding the resurrected Jesus, was not ready at that point to have truly unconditional love, even for Jesus. But he persevered. He got there eventually, which Jesus could foresee all along.
<p>

**9/29 note: the last note above is really from "bruce", the artist formerly known as "Bruce"
<p>Hey! Anybody else want to chime in on the interesting question of how the Harleys' approach is or is not consistent with Christian approaches to marriage!?
<p>My wife Lynn and I think the Harleys' approach basically IS Christian, in kind of the same way AA is effectively Christian-- not in intellectual expressions of doctrine, but in teaching what is actually a Christian pattern of behavior and reformation.
<p>I think it's a lot smarter than it looks.