I have posted for about two months on the Infidelity board. But, I think that I belong somewhere else. The affair my wife had was merely as symptom of her overall issues.
<br>Our bio - Married 16 years, 2 kids (13,10). I thought happily married.
<br>She has been a homemaker for 13 years. In the beginning of the summer, she had a short affair. I found out. She was besides herself at hurting me and wanted to work things out. After about a week or two, she admitted that she had been unhappy for about two years. REALLY UNHAPPY. And she could not tell me, for fear of hurting me. We are in separate counseling.
<br>She feels that her entire life has been dedicated to doing things for others, not herself. And now she wants to do things for herself.
<br>She tells me she loves me, but does not know if she is IN LOVE WITH ME. I keep depositing love units. She either ignores, or treats with resentment, everything that I do.
<br>She is trying to get a job as a substitute teacher. I have helped (whatever she would let me do).
<br>In the two months since all this happened, I am a nervous wreck. She treats me like s--t. Usually no yelling, but just indifferent. She says she wants to try, yet I am unsure of believing her (this goes back to the affair).
<br>Every time she previosly wanted to get a job, the kids would cry that their mom would not be home, and she would stop looking.
<br>She admits that she can not talk to me. Small talk has ended.
<br>I am at my ropes end.
<br>She also has an eating disorder. She binges all day, complains a night, and goes to the gym for 1.5 hours in the morning. She is stunning, always has been. I have told her this for 16 years. But, she eats very little GOOD food, and lots of candy and stuff.
<br>All she wants to do during the day is lay in bed and eat.
<br>This has affected my job performance and overal personality. I feel that if I don't get out, I will go nuts. I am already on anti-anxiety meds and sleeping pills at night. I feel I have to move out or go crazy. Help!

Way to go Brenda!
<p>If you haven't already, check out some of the articles and books availalable on this site. They are great! I'm glad you're relying on God for help! (It's a lot better than wishing people "good luck"!)
<p>Val

To All,
<br>I started a new thread (topic #4) since we have been growing steadily. I hope everyone is doing fine. My weekend was pretty bad. Open conversation with my wife has hurt tremendously. She has finally opened up that she has not felt love for me for several years. She said that she resents my acceptence of responsibility outside our home. When friends ask for help, I am usually the first one there. She feels that I should have been taking care of her instead of being outside. She said she wanted me to fight MORE with her about important issues (I admit I avoided most conflicts). But, in all arguments we had, she would never give in. So, I think she is reaching for excuses why she is not in love with me. She does not like to say I LOVE YOU, or be intimate, because she does not want to give me false hope.
<br>She said she probably would have left years ago if she did not feel she was letting her mother down.
<br>I told her that we have to tell the kids that we are having problems. She is against this, but I insisted on it. She feels that she knows where we are headed (divorce) and wants to avoid the problems with the kids.
<br>She thinks I will eventually tell the kids about her affair and try to turn them against her. I can't get through to her that doing that would serve no one, especially the kids.
<br>Yesterday, she lost her temper with my daughter (13). Really scared the s--t out of my daughter. I had to send her(daughter) to her room, and let my wife know what she was doing. I felt she was venting at the kid for feelings she felt for me.
<br>The rest of the day she was quiet and moody. Last night, she asked if she could go away for a few days. She said she needed a break. I will arrange with work to work from home, so she can take off. I don't know where. When it comes time, I will ask her. I will also let her know that I would rather her not leave.
<br>I think, if not for what she thinks her family and friends might say, she would want to leave me and the kids. She said she never wanted to be a Stay-At-Home mom, but was afraid of telling anyone for what they might say about her. She could not even tell me.
<br>How is it that even through all of this, I still love her? How, after being hurt so much, do I still want her as my wife? I have to admit, that some of it is because we have a family to think about. But, mostly it is because I want her back. I hope I do not give up this feeling.
<br>

Bill,
<p>It's always a rough day at work the day after you've had a slump at home. It's like carrying a load of bricks inside you all day.
<br>Today was particuarly busy as I had numerous people with computer problems. I sat down at one guy's desk to install some software and noticed he had a book opened next to the keyboard. It was about minimizing the effects of divorce on the kids.
<br>Nothing like a positive sign to make your day go even better.

Nah, Cheetos are better!
<p>What I mean is that you (I) THINK porn will somehow satisfy your unmet needs, but in reality, it just makes it worse.
<p>KS - I didn't mean to give you the impression that porn is something to be taken lightly or ignored. (If I did give that impression.) I just meant that it could be a "sign" of your husband looking for something "more".
<p>How's that for not-much-help!
<p>Val

Bill,
<p>The only thing that finally made my husband better was for him to get on zoloft. He couldn't have done this without it. Before his psychiatrist put him on it I used to pray that my H was being totally honest with him in how he was feeling. I think because it does seem to cause your wife so much pain she may be holding back and her therapist may not know all that is going on in her head. Of course some think that people don't need medication. Is her therapist the same one that you are going to? One thing we have come upon is that same problem. We were going to different therapists and they both had their idea of how we were based on our own stories. My H is keeping his original therapist but he is also going to start seeing mine for single and joint counseling. We had a breakthrough this morning which has given me hope. Not only can he see what his depression has done to him but he now sees what it has done to me and how much it has drained me. Instead of feeling guilty and unworthy (which would have been his normal reaction and seems to be where your wife is) he just said he was sorry and what could he do to make up for it. It was a "where do we go from here?" talk. I understand what you are feeling on the days you have wanted to leave. They get very good at saying things to hurt us. It is there way for if they are mean enough to make you decide to leave then they don't have to take the consequence of having made the decision. It makes you the bad guy because you left. It is their way of avoiding the responsibility of what they are doing. Not all do it out of spite. Many are just not emotionally capable of dealing with the problems or decisions and so in their way they push it off onto us. Everytime my H offered to leave I would say "NO" out loud but inside I would say yes. I knew in my heart that if he ever left that would be the end. That is just the kind of person he is. For years I have asked myself why I am still here but like Eugene I believe that in God and through God I can have a great marriage. Just right now I seem to be in the refiners fire but soon my marriage will become pure and whole and unbreakable. Hang in there.
<p>Kathleen,
<p>I agree with Bill that your H needs counseling and now. An internet affair is so much more interesting than the real thing because on the internet you can be anyone you want to be. A dishonest person will be even more so on the internet because the chance of being caught in a lie is less. She is probably very good at telling him what he wants to hear because she doesn't have to look him in the face. I would try to hold strong. Like others in the forum have said. Let him know you love him, if he still chooses to leave give him his space but try to hold off on the divorce if this is what you want. If he wants to be with you then demand that he never has contact with the OW ever again for no reason. From what I have seen and read that is the only way. I wish I could be of more help but I have never been through the pain of an affair and don't really know how I would handle it. My prayers are with you.
<p>Steph
<br>

Steph,
<br>My W's counselor is different from mine. Her counselor has said that she is not nearly ready for a joint session yet. It may be a month or two away. I don't know how her therapist feels about medication. A psychiatrist is available at the office (I have seen him for myself). My W has said that she likes her therapist, but it goes slow. I also have reservations on what she tells him. I plan to call him next week and let him know of the depth of her depression. I know they are working on her guilt and self-hate. Because some of it has now been directed at me (I understand that this is normal).
<br>I will be seeing my therapist tonight, and plan to ask her opinion. I will also see the psychiatrist on Monday. I am asking him to change or eliminate my medication (Buspar).
<br>The BAD GUY thing is true for my W also. She constantly says that SHE is the bad guy. She plans to tell her parents about the affair this week. Her comment was "You must be happy, because that makes ME the bad guy". I try to tell her that there is no BAD GUY. She has said that she will NEVER leave the kids or the house. I assume this would enforce the BAD GUY title on herself. She also said she would never ask me to leave. But, she does make it unbearable. Like your H, she has gotten very good at saying things just to hurt me. It is at those times that I seriously question the marriage. But, even then, I won't give up on her. She is sick, in pain, and does not know where to turn. This is what my vows were all about. Like you, I plan to stay as long as I can.
<br>Thanks for your input. I am truly glad that I have moved over to this forum.
<br>

Bill and Steph,
<p>Thank you both for your replies. Divorce is not what I want and I truly do not beleive that is what he wants. He has gone to counseling once and has another appointment next week. I know to get thru this I need to do the same for myself and that will be my next step. But part of me feels that my H is in a mid life crisis and having done what he has done is now in severe depression. My thoughts are that in order to move forward I must attemt to make him well again. In that way a counselor can help me to see what I need to do. But since I see that he is in a depression I don't honestly feel that his seeing some separate from me will do. My beleif is that you only get out of a session what you are willing to give and take away what you are willing to hear. Such as in his last session (only session) he came home and told me that according to the Dr. he spoke with the Dr. felt that since he did not have a track record of affairs in our 20+ years of marriage and did this for the first time now that there most definetly something wrong, missing in our marriage. That begs the question how much of the dynamics of my marriage could this person be being told to make a statement like that. I have found that in this area my husband has selective conversations, and hearing. Am I wrong to feel that both persons in a relationship need to be put out on the table so to speak or am I truly just trying to protect my own desires. I don't feel the latter is so but would be interested to hear someone else's perspective.

Kathleen,
<br>You are right. A person hears what they want. Our rabbi's sermon on Monday convered the topic of Bill and Hillary, the new year, and building a new future, forgiving the past sins. He discussed Family Values, Marriage and morality.
<br>My wife interpreted this to mean that she can close the book on her old life, and walk into a new one to make herself happy. Nothing about Marriage or Family values. I interpreted it to be that we now have a new year in front of us, and to make the most of it as a family. Start fresh.
<br>As for your husband's therapy. Give it time. It takes a while for your husband to talk as if he's not threatened. One session is nothing. This can take months.
<br>My wife and I are also in separate therapy. Remember that the depression and midlife is something THEY have to come to terms with. We have to learn to deal with them, and find out what WE did wrong in our marriages to let it get to this state. They have to find out that there is nothing wrong with life, and that happiness is where you look for it (I sound like a movie, again).
<br>Our therapists recommended joint sessions in about 3 months (once a month). I felt like you, at first (all joint sessions). It took some convincing to make me understand. It takes an awful long time to get through this. Dont give up. Also, make sure you get counseling, FOR YOURSELF. You are important in this too! Take care of yourself.

Bill,
<p>I am now in the sixth year of going through this with my H and it has just been in the last six months that he has been able to come around. I don't want to discourage you but I do want you to know that this can take some time. I was encouraged to see in your other post that you have started to play tennis again and to exercise. The friday night card game is also a great idea. One thing my therapist has made me learn is that you can support them but you don't have to give up your life to do that. I'm glad you have learned this earlier than I did. I took back my life two years ago, but it was almost too late. Support her and help her but make sure you don't get dragged into it. I would be careful about calling her therapist. I wanted to do this but was warned not to. I was told that this may make him feel that I was controlling his therapy and thus controlling him. It is a very delicate road you are walking on. Think three or four times before you do anything.
<p>Kathleen,
<p>You are probably right about his counseling but the only thing you can do about it is to get him to go to joing counseling. That is the only way that both sides can be seen. All you can really do for your H right now is show him how much you love him and try to do it in ways that don't bug him. One things I have said before is unfortunately our lives are subject to others decisions and then we have the choice of how to deal with those decisions. Get yourself some counseling and hope that some day he will join you. As long as you love him NEVER give up.
<p>My prayers are with both of you. Good Luck!
<br>Steph

Steph,
<br>Six years. I don't know if I would be able to take this torture that long. I think that I have to clarify something. I believe that my wife has been in this state for over 2 years. She had complained for over a year how unhappy she was, and she had wanted to change some things in her life. But, she always said she loved me, and would never leave me. This summer, she had the short affair. My finding out blew her away. The first two weeks after I discovered it, she was remorseful, and caring. Telling me she loved me and wanted to work on our marriage. Then the repressed feelings started to come out. It started with the guilt and self-hate regarding the affair. Then, the low self-esteem. Then, lack of love for me. Wanting a new life, feeling her life has been worthless. On and on.
<br>Over the past two years, she has stopped doing everything she enjoyed. Tennis, school events, hobbies. The only thing that increased was her exercise, and dieting.
<br>I am hoping that this is the complete low-point of her depression. I take daily verbal abuse from her. It breaks my heart what she says with such anger. She is also that way with the kids. Not always, but a lot. There are plenty of times I have to get in between her and one of the kids to protect them from her verbal assault. They often ask me if "Mom hates them".
<br>If her attitude toward them does not improve, I will have to get them into therapy.
<br>You did not say how old you, your H and kids were when this started. I'm 41 and my W is 37. Kids are 13 and 10.
<br>Like you said, I will stay until I cant take any more without serious damage.

I NEED ANSWERS. I'VE BEEN WITH MY BOYFRIEND FOR 2 1/2 YEARS. I'M 21 HE IS 25. I KNOW I'M READY TO GET MARRIED AND HE SAYS HE WANTS TO BUT HE IS JUST NOT READY RIGHT NOW. WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? I NEED HELP. I DON'T UNDERSTAND.
<br>WE TALK ABOUT IT ALL THE TIME OR SHOULD I SAY I TALK ABOUT IT. I DON'T WANT TO PUSH HIM INTO SOMETHING HE IS NOT READY FOR, BUT SOMETIMES I WANT IT SO BAD.
<br>WHAT CAN I DO TO MAKE HIM REALIZE HE WILL BE DOING THE RIGHT THING?
<br><p>[This message has been edited by HAPPY.]

Happy,
<p>First, why so defensive? you have to understand that most everyone here in this forum has gone through what you should want to avoid like the plaque. Divorce, or losing someone you love.
<p>Just don't jump into marriage. Too many people do that and the numbers speak for themselves.
<p>If he says he loves you, and you love him, give it time. When it's right it will ne right, but if not then you have done the right thing, but to push him into anything would only serve to alienate him in the end.
<p>Try to listen to people who have been there, done that. You might learn a valuable lesson.
<p>We do care.
<p>John

Bill,
<p>First off, don't give me too much credit. I haven't stayed the whole time out of love. If money and kids weren't a factor I'm sure I wouldn't still be here. Looking at it now though, I'm glad I am.
<p>As for what you can expect, it could be a number of things. My husband made the same threat of leaving and not being able to take anymore almost weekly for this past year. When we would talk about it he would then say he didn't know what he wants. Your wife seems to have wider mood swings though and with her being female and him being male I think it would not be fair to compare because men and women do think differently about a situation. I was told once that all the threats to leave were to test how much I was willing to put up with. Don't know how true that was but it made me think about it and know that until it actually happened I couldn't waste my time thinking about it. Living in the situation fills your mind with what ifs and wouldn't it be nice thoughts that make it hard to see the real picture. Sorry I am rambling on now. As for tonight I would try really hard not to expect anything. Listen to her and try to support her in what she says. I know you will do this because you have been. I hope it goes well for you. Extra prayers for you today.
<br>Steph

Hi Ryan,
<p>No need to apologize for venting. We all have to do it sometimes or we may explode. I am hear if you need.
<p>I just spoke with an attorney and you are right, except there is a form that if both parties agree will anull the divorce. Needless to say I am scared because I want to make sure he is being honest with me, and wants to come back because he loves me and not because of jealousy.
<br>

Bev, I wish I was in your position. My H is leaving me because 1)he believes he no longer loves me and 2) he is having an affair. He is *not* willing to even think about reconciliation or trying to learn to love me again...
<p>That said, with your H's attitude and yours, I think it sounds as if you both could benefit from the counseling that the Harleys offer - this site is filled with information and the books are wonderful. Yesterday I got the three I ordered (through this website) and already I am halfway through "Give and Take", a very good book that really explains how couples can lose their love for one another. I highly recommend this site and its resources.
<p>I am hoping that once my H leaves he misses my companionship enough to be willing to try to see if our marriage could work again. I am certain it could.
<p>You need to be certain, too!
<p>thinking of you ...
<br>terri<p>[This message has been edited by terri.]

Bill,
<p>After today I'm not so sure I'm the one to help you. I've given your post some thought and it occured to me to ask if you have read Dr. Harley's article on co-dependency in a marriage. The part that interest me is when he explains that co-dependency is bad when it enables the other spouse to have and continue an unhealthy behavior. If this is the case then tough love is required. I have found out today and realize for the first time that in all my support and good intentions I allowed my H to have his depression and survive and never really feel the full force of it. Now I am being blamed for this. He likes the way things have been and refuses to change. Sorry I am bitter now but I put in six years of support and I am now being told live with it or get out. So much for being thankful, so much for love leading the way. I pray for you to have better results. Take better care of yourself than I did because you and your kids are all you have anyways.
<p>Steph

Steph, I could not help but feel the bitterness, understandably in your last post. As you know things seem to go up and down in this business of trying to get right with our spouses. In the past few days things have improved somewhat in my situation, and I'm not about to forget the encouraging words you've offered.
<br>One of the things that strikes me about the intensity of our marital problems is that we go through them just the same as if there was no one else on Earth. You know, in the sense that you feel so sharply the magnitude of your problem, yet that pain is yours alone (friends help if you have any close enough) as if you were the only person alive.
<br>Sounds like you've run into one of those walls that seem to be, at least for now, immovable. All I can say is that if you've hung in there for as long as you have (6 years or more)you are a good lady to have. I hope that realization dawns on your husband and that he learns before it's too late not to take that for granted.

Steph,
<br>After your words of encouragement, I would not want you to lose focus. Tough decisions are what we are making every day. The easy way out (or less painful) would be to leave. None of us here want that. I know that six years is a long time to hear something like this now. But you've put so much effort into your H, you have to do what's right, for both of you.
<br>Take care of yourself. Remember where to come when you need to talk.

Bruce,
<p>Yes I have hit a wall as you say but I am not the one giving up. I should have stuck by my resolve not to post things when the pain is so fresh in my mind. Thank you for your words of encouragement. They do help.
<p>Bill,
<p>I'm sorry about that last post. I know this is a place to vent but that is not my style. My only problem now is that when this all started my well was full and now there is not a drop left. I try to find ways to refill it but I'm not as fast as it gets drained. Could be that with three kids I just don't have the energy anymore. I'm not giving up yet but I do feel in my heart that the end is near. I have one last chance as I see it when in two weeks we will have our first counseling session together. Everyday he changes his mind whether or not he will go so we will see what time brings. I wanted to tell you to take heart in the fact that at least your wife has feelings about what is going on. No matter what the feelings are, at least she is seeing it and not ignoring what is there. Take care.
<p>Steph