This is a continuation of a thread dealing with going through the actual process of dissolving a marriage. The original thread was located at a site no longer in operation. Many of the folks here have read Dr. Harvey's books, and they are a great source of help. <P>This topic addresses the issues involved in maintaining an honorable, good relationship with an STBX or X. In many cases, between kids, financial issues, etc. you just can't move on and leave the past behind. How to work on this is what's discussed here. <P>My personal story is that my W asked for a separation last June, and after many twists and turns along the way, asked for a divorce. We've been in counseling, etc. and the real issue is that she wants to be on her own. While we've had the usual communications problems and so forth, it appears she doesn't have a major problem with me, it's more that she wants to find her true self (without me). We've talked to lawyers and are in mediation, taking it slowly and sensitively. While she has been clear that she wants a divorce, it appears that she may be reconsidering things and I am keeping the door open to staying married and working on finding happiness together.<P>I like the public forum because it not only provides a means to get input from others, but also documents the territory covered as things evolve. Its a diary of sorts for me. <P>Over time, this thread has evolved into a chat area for a bunch of us that are in the process of divorce, married and trying to avoid it (or not repeat it), or are just interested in the whole issue. <P>The subject matter runs from the serious to the silly. We all cope in different ways, and there's some pretty good friendships that have sprouted over time also. Feel free to join in, we're always happy to have new people join the discussions. <P>Any helpful suggestions are welcome!

Damn thing lost my post! This is a TEST!!

OK....that's better. I typed a whole page and it refused my new password. THANKS!! Well, Chuck, I was just venting about my STBX being stupid with me last night and getting on my nerves. He was over to do something and was being rude to me. I called him on it and told him he has no right to be that way in my home, and he apologized. He asked if he could come over tonight and this weekend to use our shed for a side job, and I said fine. (He has visitation anyway.) He asked if I had plans this weekend...if I had a "date".....and if I needed him to get me one! I just glared at him, calmed down and told him that it was none of his business and that I did NOT need his help, as I could do fine on my own! He thinks he's funny, but I really resent the way he thinks he can speak so intimately with me when HE LEFT ME!!!! I'm pissed...can you tell, Chuck? Then I made the mistake of asking a question to clarify something with my "date" friend and pissed him off this morning too! I can't win. I'm going to go find a hole to crawl into somewhere. (OK....I'm laughing now.) I'm actually going to go cut the grass. Some lunch break, huh? Ok...I'm done venting for now. Talk to you later!

Wow! I don't blame you for being angry, he sounds pretty insensitive. Of course, he just doesn't get it anyways..... so what else is new. Do you think there's a jealousy angle there?? Even though he walked out on you, he probably still has some deep seated feelings of 'ownership' (poor choice of words, but you know what I mean). I he dating at all? Not that it should matter to you in the boy-girl way, but maybe he's finding the 'wild singles scene' is not the fantasy he probably thought it would be. I find when people make 'odd' cuts at someone, it often reflects what's actually going with themselves (that old saying about how when you point at someone, you actually have three fingers pointing back at yourself..)<P>Do I understand you also had a bump-in-the-road with your 'date' friend also? Well, these things happen..... hope it was nothing serious. Any next 'date' in the works?<P>Cutting grass already?? Its rained here non-stop for several days, first sun today, and the green stuff is suddenly pushing up everywhere. Fortunately, my older kids fight over who gets to 'drive' the lawnmower, so I'm covered there!<P>Well, the STBX even stopped by the office today to tell me she wouldn't be home at lunch. You know, if I didn't know better I'd think she was trying to act like my girlfriend/spouse or something! <P>Glad to see you made it to the new site!

Okay...here I am! How long do you think we'll be able to post before running into glitches? : )<P>Kim--sounds like you STBX is trying to ring your chimes. I wonder if it irks him that you're not "grieving" more openly....

Chuck: Did you get bumped off Michele's site? I new they did some updating. If so, that's too bad!<P>Have a great Tuesday! Beautiful sunshine here.<P>Missy2

Yes Missy, and it was a rather disconcerting process. A good four pages of postings were lost, and when I inquired I was told to start a new topic in the Prayer section (which is not really the topic area of this thread). I've also noticed that there are links within the site that are flat-out pointed to the wrong page, it really looks like they have some potentially major software glitches brewing. To top it off, the site we were on prior to that had similar problems.... and the DB site broke within two weeks of our arrival there! (Is it bad karma?) Hopefully this one will do ok!<P>What's your story in the grand scheme of things? Obviously you're looking in the Divorcing/Divorced topic... so might you have some related wisdom to share?

Hi guys. I'm sure my STBX has some issues with my social life, but he would never admit it...too proud. See, when things got bad and I gave up on him showing me love anymore, I let myself go big time. Well, after he left, I got back in shape and look about the best right now I have in years. He hasn't even mentioned it, yet everyone else I know goes crazy when they see me, commenting on how I look. His loss! If he had made me happier, I would have done it a long time ago. I think in a lot of ways it was my defense mechanism to keep him away from me sexually too. <P>Well, another sad note today....looks like the friend is going to be just that....a friend. We both were in tough situations and there was an age issue AND a distance issue (not many issues there, huh?) More issues than he's willing to deal with. I just wish I had known that sooner. I invested a lot of time and emotions into this guy before I ever agreed to see him. I told you, Chuck. I am going to be SO bad at this dating thing. It is so much work. (Gee...sounds just like a marriage, I know.) I haven't dated since I was 23...13 years ago. So much has changed. Dating at 36 is so different. I'm afraid I'm either going to get hurt left and right or I'm going to become "numb" to it all and never know how to connect with someone. You know....we've talked about this issue and the sex and keeping things casual, etc., etc., but I still can't figure out the secret. I'm just not sure I can learn to be so casual about it all that I can see someone and not get attached to them. I went through one brief stage early on where I was unattached and dated around so to speak, but I never felt good about myself and never felt fulfilled. It was a very painful time in my life, and I can only imagine that would be more painful at my age. (Where's that UPS man when I need him! LOL) Am I making any sense? You know, I was out in my car yesterday, and I passed by this group of young guys in a car (I could guess they were about 20). They did everything they could to get my attention, and I couldn't believe it. So I can attract a group of young-uns on the street...but where do you meet a more realistic match? I prefer the "friend-of-a-friend" method, but I haven't had my phone ringing off the hook with offers! I wish I was happy being alone for a while, but I'm just not. I've been alone for 7 months, and I'd like to have a little excitement. I need more than working and being mom. I need to be a woman too. Sorry, this isn't exactly a serious issue today.....just par for the course today. Well, I'd better get some work done.......

Kim, Men! aren't we the same always? LOL Just want you gone and still want to own you. We fish for answers with the dumbest statements. We act like we want to help you add names to the list so you can rate them when we truly are churning inside at the thought of you even seeing them. We are so scarred and know we could be making the biggest mistake of our life and still would refuse to do a thing to change what we have started. We of course will find reasons to hang around and not want to be there or maybe we do want to be there, we just don't know. We want to say we have done a very little something wrong {not to big of a something} instead all we do is start a fight. We certainly can't figure out if it is what we want, or if now we have a chance for the hunt and pursuit again. Have we about lost enough where it is worthy of the chase again, or is it that we really want what we once had? We do ask ourselves over and over, do we only want what we don't have. Kim I think you may now be faced with a few days of your STBX questioning himself on all these things. Good luck and remember he's just a man and what a mess we can be. <P>------------------<BR>Married Man Trying & doing better day by day.

MMT,<BR>That was good. Can I copy that and send it to my stbx.

Kim,<P>You sound like my STBX. She 'let herself go', but as she led up to telling me she wanted to separate, she lost weight and this completely sexy creature emerged. (Her taking up smoking again helped too I think). It interesting, but the simple fact is that us guys don't respond well to a less than trim and sexy spouse... its a not something I'm proud of but it happens all the same. Dr. Harley (the guy who's site we've just invaded) has a really good chapter on that reality in one of his books.<P>That's not to say guys prove themselves worthy of the trouble when a spouse does keep trim and sexy.... we are far too guilty of taking things for granted!<P>So, you have 20 yr old guys scoping you! !! I'm pretty sure all the 20 year old girls that see me think 'Oh, what a funny looking old guy!'<P>Sorry to hear about the 'date' becoming a friend. Hang in there and just take it a day at a time. It SHOULD take a few years to find a new mate. But I hear you, I know I'm just as much a potential 'easy target', I simply want to have a spouse and don't like the idea of being single! You know, when I would be 'looking for love' I always was disappointed, but I had my best times when it caught me by surprise. Just look for friends... the rest will fall in place when it should. <P>Insofar as 'needing to be a woman', I find it somewhat perversely satisfying to know that: here's a female in the prime of her sexual life (the books say its 35 for females), and feeling frustrated. I spent my male sexual peak (late teens, early 20s) frothing at the mouth and being ignored by women... so I guess we'll be even now! Hang in there, your time will come too!<P>Hey MMT, glad you made it over! You do have a point about guys being indecisive and all that. We want what we can't have and don't appreciate what we do have. I think Kim's STBX is probably experiencing a bit of that himself!

Kim, oh wow you have to go posting more questions while I try to work through getting this new site figured out. I think you can now see how if we reduce then to a tally sheet on a list we force ourselves to stay at a distance. They are just a number. What a mess wanting to get close enough to find someone for happiness yet staying far enough away to keep from getting hurt. I felt like I had some of them planning a wedding just because I said hello to them. Others were so paranoid when you ask if you could call them at some time you just as well ask to do unmentionables. I always felt bad as though I had made a promise or as though I wanted something. After the teenage years are just tooooo old for this? LOL Quit turning those heads Kim you naughty girl you. LOL Buckle up and enjoy this new ride I'm sure you will have a great number to chose from soon.

MENTAL, Yes you may and I am flattered. Thank you.<P>------------------<BR>Married Man Trying & doing better day by day.

Kim: I feel for you! I'd be in exactly the same boat if I were divorced, except mine would be a heck of a lot leakier: I'm about 10 years older than you... (From my perspective, 36 is pretty young!) And I sure don't have scads of "available" men my age in my life! (I treasure the few I have, but they seem closer to brothers than love interests.)<P>Maybe the key is just to get out and do things that interest you (volunteer work, clubs, classes, etc) with the idea that you're not out beating the bushes for a man, but are interested in meeting some new people and trying new things. And hey, you never know when a new woman friend will come up with an unattached brother or male friend! I know it's a cliche, but you're not going to "find love" unless you're out where love can find YOU. You can't bet on serendipity, and my "psychic vibes" tell me that your UPS man is already in a relationship. (Which, if he looks anything like the one our office has, is a damn shame. Now that the weather is warming up, I'm hanging out in the package pick-up area with the hope he'll arrive in shorts--what a bod...)

Thanks guys for all the kind words. I needed it today. I'm still pretty sad about the whole thing. I'm sure I will be for a while. I attach to people pretty quickly in general anyway (present company included), so you can imagine how I feel. I know I have to get out there more, but I just have to figure out what exactly I want to do. I'm just so busy now getting ready to move and working on all these stupid details, details. It doesn't leave much time for outside activities. I have to figure that one out. Summer close by will help too. OK...I've got to shake this off! Talk to you all later.<P>PS - Chuck, you asked earlier about my STBX dating. That's a big negative. He's like a zombie right now. Empty....emotionless. His eyes are dull, and his face is droopy and sad-looking. Speak of the devil..he just called. I guess I'm not so perky sounding today...he asked what was wrong. I perked up in a hurry and told him nothing, that I was just tired. But he won't stay alone long. He probably isn't dating right now out of guilt (over our son, I think..not me), but he'll get over it when he sees me actively dating and then he'll get out there. I'm sure of it. He has always needed someone in his life. Guess I do too, come to think of it.

<P><BR>Kim...how about a cheer? I've recovered from the last one, and I don't guarantee a back flip, but...<p>[This message has been edited by KateB (edited April 25, 2000).]

Cute Kate! However the link didn't work, I had to cut and paste it to bring it up.... <P>But it is a great way to start Page 2! And in less than 8 hours no less.... we need to start a support group for support group addicts.....!<P>Wow Kim, the fact that your STBX picks up on things and asks how you are has got to be difficult to deal with. I don't feel right asking this, but do you think he'd still want a divorce if there was a graceful way out??? And I know you've suffered a huge slap in the face with his dumping you.... but would you ever take him back? Don't answer if you don't want to.<P>I think this really boils down to the whole thorny issue of remaining friends and coparenting and all that.... but stopping being partners like before. My problem with my STBX (and maybe her problem too) is that you still can read each others moods and minds and all that.... and thats a special link that just doesn't get switched off. Like it or not there's a connection that's there regardless of each party's intent.<P>Sorry to babble and ask impertinent questions, but you know me... the hopeless optimist......

"Thanks guys for all the kind words. I needed it today. I'm still pretty sad about the whole thing." - KimP<P>And Kim..... here's a big hug, {{{{ }}}}you're cared about and going to be just fine!

Chuck, you know you can ask anything you want. I DO!! Well, I think my STBX may doubt his decision at times, but he would never change his mind. I'm sure of that. Regardless, I wouldn't take him back. I could never trust that he wouldn't do this again (leave). I know that's wrong and many would argue with me, but knowing him the way I do, I could honestly not trust that it wouldn't happen again. I couldn't live with that hanging over my head. Also, I just don't feel anything for him anymore. Honestly. What love I had for him is gone forever. We're still close, of course, and we can be friendly, but there is no love or passion there. No, the best thing for me is to move on. I'm sure of that. It's not easy. The easy way would be to take him back, but nope...not gonna happen. I even had my lawyer include in my papers that if he were to drop the case, I would proceed anyway. <P>So what's think link you guys are talking about? (am I blind or stupid??)

Kim: I'll add my hug to the others!<P>Wish my image link had worked, but you know, right after I did it, I saw the little notice to the left of the reply box: "[IMG] UBB Code Not Allowed!" so I felt like a complete newbie and idiot! I went back to edit--actually delete the whole thing--and then got a notice that only the "forum leader" could delete messages. Sheesh. <P>Maybe it's just as well that I can't use UBB [IMG] here--I can see myself getting compulsive about tracking down the perfect gifs to post...<P>"A support group for support group addicts..." By jove--I think you've got something there! Where do I sign up?