At my Divorce Recovery Workshop last night the gave the following statistics on remarrying after divorce.<P>90% number that remarry after divorce.<BR>25% remaining married after 5 yrs in second marriage.<BR>15% those that have a successful marriage.(No frame given)<BR> <BR>No source was given.<P>Their point in this is that it takes time to recover from the divorce and since the odds are stacked against us, we need to take the time to improve ourselves to correct our faults, and to heal so that we are not dragging our old marriage problems into our new marriage.<P>They said the worst possible thing people say to us is "Get on with your life" because it usually means get into a new relationship right away. <P>They pointed out we should be "moving on with our healing" instead, again with the bottom line being improving our odds for a succesful second marriage.<P>Bob<P>------------------<BR>"You can't always get what you want! But if you try real hard,you might just find, you get what you need!"<BR>Mick Jagger

I seem to remember them giving stats out too at my divorced parenting classes. Only they said something like 75% of the divorced re-marry within the first 5 years of divorce. They said that proved that people were still willing to give love a shot again even after divorce. Maybe getting married so soon after divorce (rebound thing) is the reason that the divorce in second marriages is so high?<BR>So how long should the divorced wait before they start dating? How long before they have the desire to want to date?

Bonnie,<P>You are right about the reason for for the second marriages failing. They are usually for the wrong reasons such as financial, emotional, or retribution( I'll show my ex!).<P>As for lenghth of time till dating again, they pointed out that you need to be "healed" from the hurt of the divorce. How long that takes depends on the individual. The numbers I have heard are from 2 upto 5 yrs.(ouch!) Again it depends upon the person.<P>Bob

Bob...<P>The last 3 men who I spoke to...<BR>...said that it took them 5 years...<P>...they all are now very happily remarried.<P> <P>Jim

Does it matter whose decision it was to divorce? Would the healing time be shorter for the one who was unhappy with the marriage and wanted the divorce to begin with?

TruthSeeker,<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Would the healing time be shorter for the one who was unhappy with the marriage and wanted the divorce to begin with?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I doubt it very much. It is probably those people who are putting the numbers so high in the failed second marriages.<P>If you look at most of our situation on this board, the ones who want divorce are the ones who were unhappy with the marriage. They are the ones who believe happiness begins with someone else & do not look into themselves to see what they did/did not contribute to the failure of the relationship<P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>Marriage & Relationship Resources</A>

I wouldn't consider that healing time, though. If someone is unwilling to look inside themselves, no amount of time will change their minds. I was thinking more along the lines of avoiding a rebound type of situation where the divorced person falls for another too quickly and hasn't taken the time to adjust. It wuold seem to me that the person who didn't want the divorce would have some hurt feelings that needed to heal through sort of a grieving process, whereas the person who did want the divorce wouldn't be hurt over the divorce would still need to grieve the loss of the realtionship. The grieving process is probably necessary for both parties, but I think the healing time would be faster for the one who wanted the divorce simply because there is less hurt for that person.

Chris,<P>You said:<BR>"If you look at most of our situation on this board, the ones who want divorce are the ones who were unhappy with the marriage. They are the ones who believe happiness begins with someone else & do not look into themselves to see what they did/did not contribute to the failure of the relationship"<P>I totally agree!!<P>The one who initiates the divorce doesn't have to grieve much because they already believe that they will find someone better. What is to grieve? I hear this "oh, it just didn't work out" crap all of the time. Like, working it out is supposed to happen magically. So, so many feel this way about relationships and life in general. <P><p>[This message has been edited by TheStudent (edited May 07, 2000).]

Those statistics seem perfectly logical to me given the nature of the divorcing spouse to look for someone else to make him (or her) happy. They rarely look inside themselves to see where any fault may have been. Of course, people who divorce their spouses for reasons such as abuse are another story. They, I think, have a right to seek a measure of happiness somewhere else. <BR>As for the betrayer/leaver feeling guilt, regret or remorse later on down the road I think in many, many cases the remorse or regret they feel has little to do with the heart. My husband, for instance, will undoubtedly be regretful over the money he lost during the divorce settlement, also he will probably be lamenting the fact that his kids want little to do with him as they grow older. But he will never place the blame on himself. He will continue to carry the "Poor, pitiful Pearl" mentality which has nothing really to do with introspection or self examination. If his second marriage doesn't work out it will be because, alas, he is a victim once again of someone who refused to make HIM happy!

Moving On,<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Of course, people who divorce their spouses for reasons such as abuse are another story. They, I think, have a right to seek a measure of happiness somewhere else. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>If abuse is present in the marriage, then yes divorce is very reasonable. However, the abused person <B>STILL</B> needs to understand what went on in the marriage and understand that happiness does not come from someone else, it comes from within. I’m not saying the abuse was in any way their fault.<P>If you cannot be happy on your own, then there is NO WAY someone else will “make” you happy.<P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>Marriage & Relationship Resources</A>

Hi RWD -<P>Oh, I like that "moving on with the healing" phrase!!!!! YES, YES, YES!!!<P>That is so correct!!!<P>I also agree that we must learn to be happy with OURSELVES and not jump to others to fill that role for us!!!<P>BIG HUGS,<P>Sheba

In answer to where the marriage and divorce stats come from; divorce and marriage are public records. In the county I live in there were 4,500 petitions for divorce filed for the month of April. I live in a small county, so you can imagine what the national number was. In my job, we get the stats on a month basis because the organization I work for is grant funded. We have to have the numbers to get the money. Unfortunatly, business is good.<P>I think some people are in a hurry to marry again because the thought of being alone scares them more than a bad marriage; at least that is what I see. There is a workshop offered called, Love the Second Time Around, and when it is offered, there is always a waiting list to get in. <P>I know most of the counselors I have talked to recommend that you wait at least a year or two before getting married again after a divorce. I quess it is hard for people not to bring baggage from their old marriage in if they don't let themselves heal first. <BR>

MovingOn - You must have been married to my ex-H's clone!!!<P>I think the reason so many second marriages fail is because a large number of them are between people who married their affair partners. How can a marriage that starts with lying, cheating and at someone else's expense be truly a blessed thing?? Dr. Frank Pittman, in his book "Private Lies" says that 50% of people having affairs divorce. Of those that marry their partner in infidelity, 75% end up divorced from the partner they left the first spouse for. Not very encouraging, is it?? I think that people who are unhappy in the marriages, and who have not examined their part in it, are more prone to thinking that a change of partner is all they need to be happy. These same people are the ones who were only concerned for their own needs, and thought little or nothing of the first spouse's feelings or needs, or they would not have callously cast them aside for someone new without truly giving the marriage a chance. So what makes them think that they will be more likely to make another marriage work? As Dr. Pittman says, it is unwise to think that you can make your life happier by changing everything in it except yourself, when you are the most important determinant of what you make of your life. Affairs and changing of partners changes people's lives, but does not change them as far as their basic personality and dysfunctional behaviors and attitudes. Also affair partners are chosen during a time of confusion, and delusion, which is not the case when the first spouse was chosen, when no other person was in the picture, and both parties were single and free to pursue a relationship. All of these things make second marriages that result from affairs a very tricky business, indeed!!<P>Happiness is not about what you have, and unhappiness about what you do not have. It is about who and what YOU ARE.<p>[This message has been edited by Lady M (edited May 08, 2000).]

I agree with Lady M and for anyone who finds this topic interesting, Private Lies is a great book that goes into a further detail on the statistics of I believe 100 couples. It may be more, Lady M, let me know if I am wrong on that.<P>I am curious of the statistics, because I think that it would be more relevant to know if those failed marriages were the betrayer's failed marriages. I believe a big portion of those numbers might be affairs that rushed into marriage with the affair partner. Also, some people divorce and remarry the same person. <P>I can see a betrayer going on to another bad marriage . (especially my betrayer). A betrayer who struggles to learn from their mistake, can go on to a good marriage and deserves to be happy just like us. I can see how the betrayed, like many of us on this forum, go on to learn as much as they can, and grow to a better person. I believe those people will definetly have a much better chance in the second marriage.<P>I know a lot of people who divorced and remarried. The betrayer, in each case, did wind up divorcing a second and third time. The betrayed, wound up going on to a new marriage that was way better than the first, and the betrayer, ALWAYS wished they could go back.<P>I still believe that everything happens for a reason, and there is a better life for me out there. The only thing I question is that 15% figure though. <P>Prayers are with you Bob , Keep us posted on this workshop, it sounds like it will be interesting.<BR>Dana<P>

I think it's also very likely that when betrayers marry the OP, the marriages fail because they were never based on anything positive or "real". It's all fantasy. It's all achieved at the expense of other people's feelings. It's done with a cloak of secrecy and sneakiness and "trashiness" over it. I think ultimately it comes back to bite them in the butt. I've always believed that what goes around comes around. I just hope I'm there to see it.<P><P>------------------<BR>Blessed be.<BR>****************<BR>Keridwen<P>Keridwen_7@yahoo.com

Keridwen 7 - ME TOO!!!! I admit it - I am anticipating the day when I hear that ex-H marriage to OW crashes and burns. She has been married twice previously. I am not waiting or putting my life on hold, or hoping to get back together with him, though. I would just like some vindication!!<BR>I am so wicked - I have been referring to her as my ex-H's next ex-wife!!!! Or, maybe I should refer to him as her next ex-H - after all, he is number three!! <P>I do not wish any real harm to come to either one of them, but if and when their marriage breaks up (I'm giving it about 4-5 years at most), I will throw a big party and invite all(our, now mine)friends who stood by me through this horrible nightmare, and who stood up to him and told him that what he was doing was not only wrong, but foolish and stupid. As for the two of them, they deserve each other. He (ex-H) had better hope that what goes around does not come around, because if he were forced to endure even one-half of the pain he caused me, he could not stand up against it.

Frank Pittman's book is the best. I kept that book as my bible to remind myself how stupid and unlikely success under those conditions are, but also, he does a good job at analyzing betrayal. Betrayal, or living up to certain agreements, comes in many forms, and one can never tell exactly what any one person will become after marriage.<P>One can never be quite sure, I was surely surprised what happened withon one year of getting married, the whole relationship changed. Although I didn't understand why<BR>then, although I knew something was wrong,<BR>I do now.<P>

Lady M...I too feel like you do. I don't wish any real harm, I just want some vindication. Although, I can't deny that I would love to see OW put through the same he!! I've been through. She has also been married twice before. My H and I had what I thought was a very strong 15 year marriage. Just goes to show you it can happen to anyone. I know H is NOW conversing with another woman he is interested in. Wonder if OW knows about that? It'll be interesting to see what happens.<P><P>------------------<BR>Blessed be.<BR>****************<BR>Keridwen<P>Keridwen_7@yahoo.com

Anyone interested in this post, should read the book Private Lies by Dr Pittman. Dr. Pittman, places more of the blame on the betrayer (WAYWARD in his book) and not as much on the betrayed. <P>The statistics are much more of a comfort when you are grieving and in pain because of an affair. However, now that I am almost divorced, I still go back to it and read it again.<P>It was my "bible" too during the Discovery days, and I even got my STBX to read it and he actually read the whole thing. <P>Prayers to all,<BR>Dana<BR>

I have a lot of books on the subject, but not that one in particular. It sounds like I went to the same divorce recovery group as RWD (or maybe something similar - it was through my church - DivorceCare).<P>It's not just a stat for betrayers and affair partners only. I'd sure like to see a stat on that breakdown tho, that would be interesting to see how much larger the divorce rate is for betrayers than for the faithful. However, the reasons go beyond that and into all the small intricate things like step-parenting (which no matter what you do, the step never gets any respect from the other's children!!!), extended family, blended incomes, money/time/kid/life in general disputes with EX, etc. There is a whole huge incredible list of new things that have to be dealt with that just make a second marriage so much harder than the first one. I agree with the time factor. You have to re-find out who you are again so you know what you really have to offer another person. If it's too soon after divorce, what you are is still part of your old relationship.<P>The timeframe I heard was wait 1 year for every 4 years of marriage. Ya right!!<P>I know it's better to wait. I think it's just easier said than done, especially when the new world of dating opens up and you find there are actually people out there and they are interested in knowing you. And man, don't forget about the horny factor! Just kidding, that's definitely not a good idea. But it's hard when you find men hooting at you again (mostly because you've lost about 25 pounds on the infidelity diet and look great again) - but really it's flattering and it been so long since that has happened. I'm not even divorced yet (should be Sept.) and somehow men have this automatic sense that I'm semi-available already. It's like they have this radar or something.<P>I'm definitely not ready and won't be for a long time, altho I know a man I am very interested in - however, I also know I'm carrying to much baggage and confusion. I will let myself grow - and let God take the lead. He's never let me down yet.<P>Kathy