Bob,<P>What are the characteristics of a person with an alcoholic parent?<BR>Dana<BR>

This Bi polar thing has me thinking..does anyone have any links so I can read some more about this??<P>My x was always upbeat. He just lied to aviod any conflict. He does drink, I believe to excess.But he is never mean or beligerant. Those symptoms described here, however, fit him to a tee.<BR>- poor impulse control<BR>- over focused on self<BR>- over indulgence on pleasure oriented <BR>behavior<BR>- lack of consideration for the consequences of ones actions<BR>- increased sex drive<BR>All of these are him!!!!<BR> He is self centered, <P>------------------<BR>Susan

Susan,<P>I am trying to keep an open mind here. That is usually the case.<P>Those symptoms describe my ex husband perfectly. However, they also describe <B> most</B> of the men I either know, have known, and don't care to know. <P>I still can't bring myself to make excuses for his bad behavior. Sure, he's selfish, self centered, disrespectful, impulsive, and has sex on the brain nonstop, but until a doctor tells him and his wonderful OW otherwise, he still won't get any sympathy from me. <P>I am unfamiliar with Bi-Polar, but have dealt with mental illness my whole life watching my mom suffer. The main problem is you just can't help a person who doesn't want to be helped, or who doesn't see the problem. In the process, it is very painful to stand by and feel helpless. <P>Thanks for all the replies, am still hoping to hear more on the subject, just not ready to give him an excuse for the terrible way he treated me. <P>Sue, I'll look for a website for you. <P>Dana<BR><p>[This message has been edited by lonelymom (edited May 16, 2000).]

Sue,<P>Here is a website for you.http://www.askjeeves.com/main/metaanswer.asp?metaEngine=directhit&origin=0&MetaURL=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Egolden%2Enet%2F%7Esoul%2Fbipolar1%2Ehtml&qCategory=nc17&metaTopic=What+Is+ Bi%2DPolar+Disorder%3F+%28Manic+Depression%29&ItemOrdinal=0&logQID=CFE185D7492BD41180A9009027737D4F<P>Dana<P>PS I KNOW THIS LOOKS FUNNY, but I did cut and paste it and it works. If not, go to AskJeeves.com and search for bi-polar <P><p>[This message has been edited by lonelymom (edited May 16, 2000).]

Sue,<P>Try this link for info on bipolar disorder;<BR> <A HREF="http://www.psycom.net/depression.central.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.psycom.net/depression.central.html</A> <P>One thing you will read is that there are several variations of mood disorders.<P>Getting someone to accept help when they are in a manic phase is extremely difficult. After all, they feel great, never better. Why would they want to give that up? I wish you good luck.<P>Kenneth

Several years ago my nephew was diagnosed as bi-polar (my BIL is also). Shortly after that I had the chance to go to a seminar for family/friends of bipolars on understanding the condition. If anyone is interested, the notes I took are cut-n-pasted below...<P>One of 2 major mood disorders; the other being Major Depression. Both thought to be primarily biochemical in nature. While Major Depression is more common in females, Bipolar Disorder has equal incidence by sex and by races. Familial--incidence in first-order family member of patient is 35% (versus 25% for Major Depression). In identical twins, 96% of Bipolar patients had twin with the same diagnosis--very indicative.<P>Has many faces, but the manifestation of the disorder typically is more depressive in females, more manic in males. In males, the manic episodes tend to be more severe and of longer duration.<P>Diagnosis of manic phase:<BR>· Primary mood disturbance--euphoric, elevated, expansive or irritable.<BR>· Duration of 1 week, or any duration requiring hospitalization<BR>· 3 of 7 (or 4 of 7 if mood is only irritable) symptoms:<BR>Increased activity<BR>Decreased need for sleep<BR>Pressured speech (may talk a lot, loud, switch topics w/o meaningful connections)<BR>Racing thoughts or flights of ideas<BR>Grandiosity or inflated self-esteem<BR>Distractibility<BR>Poor judgment<P>· Other symptoms which may be associated with manic phase:<BR>Dysphoria (depression)--brief<BR>Loud voice, rapid speech<BR>Perseveration, echolalia, echopraxia (repeating things over and over, mimicking speech or mimicking physical motions).<BR>Outgoing, loquacious, over-familiar, ingratiating<BR>Hypersexual<BR>Insistence on bring center of attention<BR>Irritable, demanding, uncooperative<BR>Conflict with others<BR>Inappropriately excessive behavior in many areas<BR>Colorful, inappropriate or disheveled dress<BR>Antisocial behavior<BR>Drug abuse/dependence (CNS stimulants and/or depressants)<BR>Impulsive, radical changes in lifestyle<BR>Weight loss/gain<BR>Thirst<BR>Delusions (paranoid, referential, or grandiose). 75% of bipolars hospitalized in manic phase have delusions, primarily paranoid.<BR>Hallucinations (auditory)<BR>Dementia or delirium.<BR> <BR>Typically, age of onset is young--it is estimated that 28% of bipolars first manifest between 10-19, 59% by age 29 (actually, probably younger, as first episodes, if relatively mild, may be missed or written off as teen troubles, etc.)<P>Most patients untreated course is bi-phasic or tri-phasic (ie. exhibiting one phase, then the other), interspersed with periods of wellness. Poor compliance with medication is likely (there is a tendency to feel better and quit taking it). However, 80-90% will relapse within 5 years of stopping medication. With medication, virtually all bipolars have good control of the disorder. Due to strong evidence that it is genetic, the hope is that eventually the responsible gene may be identified and gene therapy available.<P>Growing evidence that most cannot be weaned off of Lithium (as used to be thought). Worst prognosis is for the few who cycle rapidly between manic and depressive phases. Mean number of lifetime episodes is 20, but range is between 2-100 (may differ due to compliance with medication--my notes fuzzy here). Lithium (esp. time-released) still the drug of choice, except for the small number who do not respond or tolerate Lithium--several alternatives do exist. Lithium stabilizes both phases of the disorder, whereas some alternatives seem less effective against depressive phase). Some "rapid cyclers" may do better on combo regimen--Lithium + one of the other alternatives.<P>Alcohol can be a problem--first because Lithium appears to exacerbate the effects of Lithium; secondly because alcohol depletes Lithium level in the blood.<P><BR>Recommended non-technical books: "The Unquiet Mind" Kay Jamieson (sp?); "Mood Swings" Ron Fieve.<BR>

Kam,<P>Thanks for all that information. Hopefully Sue will return and find it here. <P>Prayers and hugs to all,Dana<P><BR>

Dana,<P>The following says it all....... <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>The main problem is you just can't help a person who doesn't want to be helped, or who doesn't see the problem. In the process, it is very painful to stand by and feel helpless. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>It all boils down to willingness.<P>Bill<P>------------------<BR>BB<BR>

Thanks guys, I will check out the sites....<BR>Actually, I saw a book at Barnes and Nobles which seemed to fit my X as well...it was something like "The Adullt ADD and you Marriage", I guess I need to check it again. <P>My X is seldom depressed acting, at least where I saw it. But all the manic symptoms were there, for sure..<P>At this point, I just want to understand it.. he has made his bed, he can stay there now, but it would be enlightening to know if this had anything to do with his affair. <P>------------------<BR>Susan

Sue,<P>I feel the same as you. He chose the bed he wanted to lie (literally and physically) in , now GO, and don't look back. <P>But for us to learn as much as we can, to reassure ourselves, that it really DOESN"T take two people to destroy a marriage, and to be educated for the next time around, is always a good idea. <P>To Bill, wow, I got quoted for the first time, I'm amazed <P>Dana<BR>

I'm not too swift with this UBB I do a good job faking it and most times don't like to quote but your staement really hit the mark.<P>Any kind of recovery is not for those that need it but for those that want it.<P>Bill<P>------------------<BR>BB<BR>

Interesting thread.<P>Yesterday, I got hit with a BPD rage, which lasted 3 minutes, and then situation normal.<BR>There is a game in this called "Tag your it" whereby the person projects her (in this case) feelings onto you, and then you respond by being it, (taking responsibility) or not.<BR>I chose not to take responsibility for my W feelings, by saying "It's your issue, not mine". This turned into "you don't support me," so I got blamed. <P>The better response is to say "I don't have this issue." The book says these disorders are very sensistive to sentences with "you," meaning them, in it, and know how to turn it around against you. So one has to keep the sentences beginning with I, which deflects the projection, and the person cannot tag you. You are thereby establishing personal limits to them, and they cannot project into you.<P>Anyway, now that I recognize them more easily, I try to maintain these personal boundaries bery clearly. Once they know those boundaries, then it becomes easier for them.<P>Now if these disorders have abnormally higher highs and lower lows, then when a marriage becomes more comfortable, and EN are barely met, then they are likely to get very unhappy sooner, and affairs provide much bigger highs that the normal person would receive. That where the addiction comes in, as people who like romance, love the highs, but can deal with the wearing off and the normalcy of regular life. Thats where the addiction part comes in, because the high is magnified by the secrecy and the perceived EN satisfaction.<P>However, you have to listen closely and think or write down what the argument was really about.<P>thl<BR>thl<P>