The Ex-wives I've been reading about who use children, personal property, cars, clothes, houses, health, etc., as weapons of endless guilt and threats of financial devastation are not unlike my husband's ex-wife. <P>I just have one request to make of any man who either has a serious girlfriend or is thinking about marrying, but who also has an EX-wife with children......... if you're not willing to give your NEW wife (or serious other) the respect, honor, priority, importance, support, encouragement, loyalty, commitment, and respect you would any life-partner, than I suggest you get a cocker spaniel instead -- or become a shepherd.<P>The phrase, "But she is the mother of my children" carries about as much weight with a new partner as, "There's a blood stain in my white dress shirt." Both situations are unfortunate, but both have solutions that can be implemented without the guy remaining a frustrated, shirtless bachelor until the children are old enough to tell him he was crazy for letting his EX wife (their mother) run his life for so long.<P>Children are born to leave home. Wives and life partners are there to help you change your DEPENDS every day and help you wash your teeth when you can't find the Mentadent. Children maybe call you on Sunday, if they're not too busy, or beg for money until they finally get their college degrees. Life partners are there when your prostate is sagging, her breasts are requiring pulleys to keep them off her knees, and when sitting on a porch, watching a beautiful sunset is about as much excitement as you can stand for one day.<P>Put your marriage or your life partner first, and your children will be taken care of, loved, taught respect, honor, and integrity. Put your marriage last, and you'll wind up trying to find another white shirt while your EX-wife runs off every new relationship you will ever hope to have.<P>But then, that's just my opinion....I could be wrong.<P>Katherine<P><BR>

Katherine,<P>Cute name (pesky wabbit) I haven't seen you yet around here, but welcome.<P>I want to comment on your post. Myself I am a soon to be ex wife. I do not use these items as leverage, but I do know several people who are now in second marraiges and feel the way you do.<P>I personally have an ex, who uses those things against me. He treats his OW better than me and I get not a bit of respect whatsoever.<P>I do agree with your comments, and I personally have said "but he's the father of my kids" a few times. I didn't realize this excuse actually hurts but then again, if I hear it, I would be a little mad too.<P>Thanks for sharing, and yes, I do agree with you, although I am not a second wife yet, I still can't get rid of this first bad mistake.<P>Dana<BR>

PW,<P>I'm not really sure what your point here is. Those of us in the position of becoming x-wives are doing so against our will. I loved my H very much, but while he was away on an extended business trip, he had an affair. And this woman pursued him to the point he finally left me and the kids. I was devoted to being his "life-partner" and changing his Depends and had no problem with that. But he found something far more exciting apparently. I personally want absolutely nothing to do with him, but he helped bring 3 children into the world and he damn well better put them first, regardless. They are more important than anything else, IMHO. I have decided that I will definitely NOT be pursuing a relationship with any other man until my children are grown and out of the house. Step-families are notoriously unhappy and stressful and I would rather not put my kids through that since I have primary custody. Affairs like my H's are usually based in fantasy rather than reality. When real life intrudes they seldom stand up to any long term scrutiny. Were you the OW in your H's first marriage? The people on this forum don't need to be told that their X's will undoubtedly put the children at a distant second. They need to be supported as they are going through tremendous pain right now (as am I). Most of the people here did not ask for what is happening to them. And I am wondering why you are here in the Divorced/Divorcing forum? Is your marriage falling apart as a result of your H's X-wife? If so, then I am sorry. But I don't feel any sympathy for my H or his dilemnas because he had an affair. He deserves exactly what he gets. As for being Rambo with PMS...I have been mistreated far more than you could ever imagine and I WILL NOT belittle my pain. I hurts like he!!. I try the best I can to reserve my depression and crying jags for when the kids are with their father. I haven't said one negative thing about their father to them. In fact, I encourage them to have fun, call their dad, invite him to PTO meetings and award ceremonies at school, etc. Just because your H's X is doing things you don't like, don't assume everyone here is planning on sabotaging the stbx's future. I have no such intention. But I won't cry any tears when H & OW's relationship goes down the toilet either.<P><P>------------------<BR>Blessed be.<BR>****************<BR>Keridwen<P>Keridwen_7@yahoo.com

I do understand the things you said about about your life partner...many of us seem to put our kids first all the time. But even though the marriage is over, many parents, especially when involved with another, put the kids last, which is not right either. All kids need the love and attention of BOTH parents, whether coming from a divorced home or not. <BR>I have not said anything bad about my kids' Dad. And, unfortunatley, when he was here, and we were trying to work things out, they probably heard thing they shouldn't have.<BR>But, I will be truthful to them when I am asked a question. I do not use this in any way to get back at him, but they need to know the truth.<BR>The truth is that, while he loves them very much, he doesn't love Mom anymore. And that happend sometimes in a marriage. But it is not their fault, and Dad wants to be a part of their lives. I have kept that door as open as it can be. <BR>Now it is up to him. Yes, children grow up and leave. And we only see or hear from them occasionally. But it is my responsibility to give them as much love and attention as I can while I can, to make them the best they can be. it is also my X's responsibility as well. <BR><P>------------------<BR>Susan

Hi,<BR>Love your sense of humor!<BR>Personaly, I've come to believe that if you marry a divorced person, then all (or at least most), of the issues your finding so heinous, just come with the territory.<BR>Divorce doesn't end a family, it just creates two messy ones.<BR>Your H has a prior commitment to raise children with his ex. If he can't do that in a way that is to your satisfaction, perhaps you might consider getting a dog?<BR>Also Keridwen had a really good point: If you got *in the middle of* a marriage that wasn't quite...done...for whatever reason, the consequenses of that are bound to nasty and lasting.<BR> <p>[This message has been edited by Girlfriend (edited May 26, 2000).]

I hear you....<P>loud and clear....<P>your H's ex and my H's ex must be long-lost siblings...<P>and yes, the 'new' wife and/or girlfriends should be warned....cripes, even a dog should be warned....I leaped into this, their marriage had been over for 5 years, but I had no idea that when my H said that he and the ex had 'some' problems that it would degenerate into court/custody cases, personal bankruptcies, arrests, a disturbed child, physical attacks, personal character attacks, false allegations, brainwashing their child against me, youth services, social workers, extreme poverty, and the continued bitterness and resentment of a woman who was married to this man for 4 months (and who blames me for sticking with him for 5 yrs)...!!!!!!!...the list goes on....<P><BR>so I hear you....<P>actually, I hear you and am standing on my chair applauding....<P>because I know exactly what you mean...and there comes a time, when we '2nd wives' get tired of being 'low-man' on the totem pole....<P>now, where the heck is my H...he has to read this.....<P>Dylan<P><P>------------------<BR>"The journey into darkness has been long and cruel, and you have gone deep into it."<BR>~ A Course in Miracles

PeskyWabbit,<P>Do you have children who have moved out and rarely contact you? Is that the kind of relationship you have with your parents? It certainly wasn't the kind of relationship I had with my parents (who unfortunately died when quite young). My children are not money-grubbing, selfish people. Children are forever. They are not just a tiny blip on the screen of life (especially when you have as many as we did).<P>Why on earth do you think that you have to make a choice between putting your spouse or children first? This is not a competition. Do you have to make a choice between putting your first, or your second, or your tenth child before the others? Of course not. You do your best to balance all their needs.<P>

Although I can sympathise with you....Can the "2nd" wife sympathise with his children? I know that our children have been put through so much because of his "bad" choices. They had nothing to do with his choices....so why should they fall way down on the list of priorities? <P>I agree with Keridwen....I will not get involved in a deep relationship until the girls are grown. I'm sure it is the least I can do for these beautiful children who I and my stbx brought into this "ugly" world of people with no morals...no values....no sense of commitment.<P>I do not talk negatively about their father....In fact I would rather make excuses for him instead of telling them the "cold" truth about their fathers actions. I am much bigger than that...I love my children...why would I want them to hurt for something they had no control over.<P>When you marry someone with children from a previous relationship....you know up front who their priorities should be. Children from a marraige or a loving relationship are products of love, respect and caring. Even though many walk away because they no longer love, care or respect the other adult...the children still remain and deserve to be treated with love, respect and care.<P>Love is not an obligation...it is a gift.

I agree with everything being said here. I want nothing to do with the OW my ex left me for, but unfortunately, if my children want to see their father, they have to be around her, and they do not want to be. My daughter has asked her father in front of her counselor to spend 2 hrs a month alone with him, without the OW, just so they can talk, etc. He took her to breakfast once three months ago, and that is it. He has made it clear the OW insists on being included. Its funny because when we were married, he would take each of the kids someplace alone just to spend time together. It didn't bother him to leave me alone. I wanted him to have a one on one relationship with his children and I have encouraged it as much as possible. I grew up without a father, so I know what it feels like not to have one around. My children are resentful of the OW, because their father seems to answer to her demands. In a divorce, no one wins, not even the OP.