As me and the kids prepared to leave Sat for 2 days at my mothers and 2 days at my xsil, my d started giving me a bunch of lip about going to her grandmothers, 1 because she is mad at my mother for saying something about my x at Christmas and 2 because it is boring(and it is), well the more she talked backed and complained, the madder I got. When she finally said she didn't wanted to waste her holiday being bored,and that we wouldn't get to see any fireworks beacause we had to live in the evening,I lost it and started yelling(We weren't out of the driveway yet). <P>I told her she was acting like ....... her mother, that if she wasn't having fun, then no one was. D then said she didn't want to go at all and wanted to go to her mothers. I said her mother didn't care..... caught myself, and said......about anyone but herself and that she was working anyhow and probabaly wouldn't be home. D said she wanted to go anyway!<P>So I said fine, and that om could take her to the fireworks since her mother was working. I dropped her off, took her bags out and threw them on the porch and was ready to leave when x came out. She said it wasn't a problem for d to stay and I told her I didn't care, that she wansted to come any way. She said she would handle things so we left.<P>Needless to say this did upset my son as he was sitting there the whole time. I explained why I was so mad and that how I said some bad things and appologized to him. I cried while getting gas and that made him feel better for some reason. He slept most of the 3.5 hr trip.<P>I called d Sat nite and noone was home at X's. I finally got ahold of her on Sun, X had taken her out to eat and a movie(r rated of course) and they had gotten home late. We appologized to each other and talked a little and made plans to go to the local fireworks tonite. <P> She asked about having a sleep over and I said we would have to discuss it because I was considering punishment for her behavior and she said I needed punished too. I said I was open for discussion in that.<P>I found out she spent Mon at a friends while x worked all day. Then she left a message today saying she would be at a friends fathers house(whose parents just divorced too) or around the neighborhood. X was working afternoon shift so she took d over to the friends fathers house, he lives with 4 other men, all police officers, and she spend the day there. I got back around 9:30 tonite and we all went to fireworks, except d had to go meet some so it was just me and my son.<P>It was a tough day with all the crap to start the weekend. I guess I just should have dragged d along and not let her play me against her mother. I hope I'll know better next time and won't get so mad.<P>Also it felt kind of weird today at my x-SIL's today as my xFIL & MIL where there too. Everybody was there except the x. They are all hurt and angry as x has missed everyone's birthdays as well as her sisters and her parents (50th) anniversary. Her parents really don't know what to say to me. It get awkward after a while.<P>Also last 4th was when I pretty much realized my marriage was over. X had moved out on the 2nd to a flea bag motel and then to a nicer one that om ended up paying for. I knew at that time I pretty much had no chance.<P>Oh well, tomorrow is another day.

I'm sorry RWD.......<P>All I have to offer are some BIG HUGS!!<P>Emotions run high all the way around when having to go through such upheaval and establishing new practices in our lives.....<P>It will get easier with time. Along the way, I guess we can just muddle through the rough stuff. <P>I think that your response to D about your punishment was very good.....didn't take long for you to get back on track.<P>More BIG HUGS and Happy 4th,<P>Sheba<BR>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><B>Origninally posted by RWD<BR> I dropped her off, took her bags out and threw them on the porch and was ready to leave when x came out. She said it wasn't a problem for d to stay and I told her I didn't care, that she wansted to come any way. She said she would handle things so we left.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE></B><P>These are very trying and scary times for both you and your children. Angry outbursts affect children as well.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><B>Needless to say this did upset my son as he was sitting there the whole time.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE></B><P>Your daughter may be angry for you "driving" her mother to OM, and causing this upheaval. Have you talked to her honestly about the whole situation? <P>Personally, I don't think that Ds need an excuse to "give lip" (I have two), however you may want to explore some counselling options such as Tough Love or even support groups like Parents Without Partners for advice on dealing with the sort of behavioral cuisinart that comes with daughters and divorces. (isn't it so much simpler to be a man! )<P>Take a deep breath, and relax. <P>H

I talked to my minister friend today and related what had happened and he was of the mind that this may have happened even if I was still married. He didn't see this as a by product of the divorce but rather as a teenage byproduct. <P>At this point in her life, everything is centered around her life, so if its not what she wants to do, then she doesn't want to do it. I am talking about my d not my x although she seems to fit the mold too!<P>In this particular case, she had an option, her mother, and she chose that option. The fact that she is my x is my problem that I need to deal with and not feel that my d is chosing her mother over me.<P>My minister keeps pointing out to me and it is somebody's signature, that the opposite of love isn't hate, its indifference. I guess I still hate the x as I haven't quite reached the indifference stage. Still have about 25-30% more to go.<P>I also am trying to look at what is going on from the big picture. I was bothered by the fact that while x had my d, she let her run around with her friends while x was at work. You know what, I do the same thing, so what is the difference. I guess I try to hold x upto higher standard than I set for myself. I cannot be responsible for the type of relationship my x has with her kids. I can only work on my relationship with them.

That was a tough one, Bob!<P>Beleive me, I think that it is a teen Daughter issue, more tha a D issue. Too often, we look at any situation after D and feel "that wouldn't of happened if we weren't divorced." <BR>I have a 16 yr old, who thinks life revolves around her...totally!! It does get better, but these can be troubling times. Just make sure you treat her as loving as you can, but firm when you need to. I had one of those long talks with my daughter a couple of months ago. We seemed to come to an understanding of sorts. You may need one of those talks with your D as well. <BR>P.S. - My daughter is a great girl, despite being wrapped up in herself! She maintains a 3.8 GPA, is working this summer, and(knock on wood) doesn't have any serious boyfirend!!!<P>------------------<BR>Susan

Hi RWD,<P>this just gets harder and harder doesn't it. But we do get through it, and our relationships with our children are better for it. I'm glad you acknowledged what had happened with your son. Sometimes they get thoughts in their little heads, and they just get bigger and bigger, and are generally wrong. I find that talking about everything with my children (although modified due to their ages) really helps. It lets them know that their feelings and emotions are important too, and are something that is acknowledged in our little family. It sounds like you think the same way too. <BR>The other week my d (nearly 5!!) was cross with me as I had disciplined her. She was sent to bed with no icecream after dinner!!!<P>When I went up to turn her light out, she asked why I was being so mean to her, and that she wanted to go and live at Daddy's. I thought uh-oh, what do I do here.<P>We talked about why she had no icecream, and why she was sent to her room. She came back with<BR>"But I still want to go and live at Daddy's. I don't really want to, but I HAVE to!!!! I don't really want to leave you Mum, but I HAVE to" <P>It took everything in me not to burst out laughing. She was almost saying "you are so unbearable Mum, you leave me no choice..."<P>I told her she had to go to sleep now, as if she was moving in the morning, she would need a good night's sleep. I also told her I would help her pack her bags in the morning. We even went so far as to pick which suitcases she would take......<P>I know my situation is a bit different to yours, because of the ages involved, but it still hurt. When I discipline, she now says "well I want to go live at Daddy's"<BR>They pick up so early how to play one off against the other don't they?<P>I think the conversation about punishment was great. You are telling her that you did wrong too, and that you're willing to admit that. That for me was quite powerful. I think with comments like that, that's where the lessons are learnt. You told your D that you are human, you made a mistake, and you are willing to admit that. GOOD ONE.<BR>I have 2 girls, and boy, don't I look forward to their teenage years...........<BR>I hope by then that we have the most fantastic relationship (we do now) and that we'll sail through all those turbulent waters. I also hope Flora, Fauna and Merryweather come and wave their magic wands for me!!!!!!!!! LOL<P>Your relationship with your children will survive this little hiccup. And you will survive, and so will they, and you will all be bigger better people for it.<P>I'm sending you the biggest hug, I know how hard this is, (as we all do)<P>keep your chin up, and keep taking care of you and your children.<P>hugs<P>Jo

I also had a very rocky 4th. All I could remember was that a year ago my H and I was at Branson after we took our son to a Boy Scout camp in Arkansas...we tried to ride the boat and watch the fireworks that night but it was sold out...he took OW there a couple of months later and had their picture taken...<BR>My H had a party with the kids at his new place and I was invited but choose not to go but did end up to watch them shoot fireworks...all was going fine until NEW OW called and I told him to tell her he was with his family...anyway lots of yelling, me leaving slamming the door the kids leaving and yelling at their dad for yelling and kicking me out....<BR>I ended up having to aplogise to my kids and kinda to my H....<BR>We had orientation the next day for oldest daughter for college...we huged and said we were sorry and lets just be parents today...so for the next two days we walked around campus, ate, sighed up for classes, finacial aid office (yuk) and all we did was just be parents....we had a nice two days.<P>I know this is long...I was wanted to tell you it happens to all of us. I am not over the hurt and betrayal and my H thinks he can do anything...but...we have to remember we are parents and what we do effects the kids.<P>I think you are a terrific person...and father...<BR>It is like our children raises us in a way...LOL.<P>