Hi friends,<P>I remember reading in one of Dr Harley's books that most affairs die down within six months of being exposed. If I didn't read it there , I read it in True Lies, by Dr Pittman.<P>When my ex left on xmas, I had absolutely no idea that was coming or he was capable of such cruelty. Each month that rolled around, I was very upset. Unfortunately each month there was some sort of crisis in our family around the 25th of each month, whether it was court, my daughter needing stitches, daughter falling down the stairs, and various other relatives being injured. <P>Each month, I feel has gotten better and better and this past month, on the 25th, I actually FORGOT it was the 25th! That is very good progress on my part. When I realized the 25th had past, it didn't feel so bad like it used to.<P>I discovered the affair on January 7. This past Sunday, July 2, six months later, my ex wanted to talk to me.<P>Our children were going out of town without us for a week and I thought he wanted to talk to me about the kids. As it turned out, I was very shocked at what happened next.<P>He basically told me that he did not want the divorce. He never intended this to go so far. He tried to tell me this on the way out of court but I refused to speak to him. He asked me how come I didn't fight for the marriage like I fought for everything else over the years. He felt that it meant I didn't love him because I walked away. <P>He actually appologized for what he had done. He still doesn't understand exactly how he got where he is. He is hurt that I didn't fight for him for very long. He asked me if I could ever forgive him. He also asked if we could be friends. He went on to ask if we could get through this.<P>I had no idea this was coming. I was extremely shocked at all this. He didn't cry but he was definetely in pain. I felt bad to see him in pain but I couldn't believe he was saying all this. <P>Without a doubt, and without hesitation, I told him that I too, didn't understand why he did what he did. I felt he had a very good life and I thought I was a good wife. We had problems like everyone but I thought that past year was our turning point. I told him I'd like to remain "civil" as we are since we will face each other for a long time, but I just can't call him "a friend" at this point. I did take responsibility for my part in what happened. I can think of a few things that I know now, I should have handled differently, BUT I never cheated and I never thought about it, not once. <P>At the very end of the conversation, he tried to hug me and I did back away. The strange thing was, I felt "disgusted" by his attempt. I am sure a lot has to do with the fact that I am just not feeling anything for him these days. I wish I hated him. I wish I could be mad at him, but I'm not. I just don't feel anything for him at all. <P>I waited until the end to tell him that he and I will never be together again. I know if I told him what he didn't want to hear in the beginning he would have never listened past that point. I went on to tell him that I do care for someone else and that I am very happy right now exactly where I am. I asked him to please respect that and not talk bad about the person in my life to our children because I have not done that about his girlfriend in front of the kids. I also told him that this was the life he chose. Now we both have to live with the consequences and I have spent a lot of time working on getting over him on my own. <P>He said that the person I am seeing now is a very lucky guy and that he wishes me well. He told me if there were anything I needed to just ask him, so I tested him and asked him to take our other daughter overnight later that week and he did. I was shocked. He also felt I am much happier overall these past few months than I had been with him in a long time and he wishes he hadn't hurt me so badly.<P>As far as the other woman, I can call her on the phone if I need something or to ask a question and she is friendly. She attempts to talk to me like we're friends, again not something I consider at this point but knowing me, I'm sure her and I will talk one day about this whole thing. The only good thing I will say about her is that she takes excellent care of my children when they are there and I don't worry about their health or safety, I just miss them when they are gone.<P>In reality, I know he and I will still have disagreements. We disagreed when we were married, we'll continue to do it now, but I do think we hit a turning point and I am feeling at ease more each day.<P>All in all, I felt like it was some closure to this whole ordeal. I think the worst of it is over. For some strange reason I feel like HE has put ME on Plan A. He doesn't know I post here, but he read two books for me when this happened.<P>So that is my update. If you told me a week before xmas, all the things I'd face and where I'd be in July of 2000, I would have never believed it. Looking back, I can say I worked hard to get past this. I learned a lot about relationships and love. I definetely learned a lot about what causes affairs and I learned that I have needs too, and I spent many years worrying about his and he didn't bother with mine. <P> I believe I have a much happier life now than I did with him. It wasn't easy. It took a lot of late night talks with friends, counseling,lots of tears and pain and researching all of this butI was determined that I would not sit around and sulk and take pity from anyone. I knew I could support myself and I knew that I was strong enough to handle this and when I was losing my strength, I got it back from the people here, my friends and family and ultimately now, I get it from being with someone now who shows care and respect for me.<P>I hope that everyone here will find comfort and acceptance one day like I have. I hope that you realize there is life after divorce. Its a whole new world, and it takes some work, but I find that I appreciate everything good that happens so much more now. I don't take anyone or anything that makes me happy for granted, and I am thankful everynight for all the good things I do have.<P>Prayers and Strength to everyone,<BR>Dana

PS To Cat, Brenda, and the others I talked to in the past on email, I lost all email addresses when my computer was reformatted. Be sure to contact me at Angel9472@yahoo.com in the future.

Dana, <BR> He is finally realizing what he has given up, it sounds to me. Just make sure you are truly ready to move on. There is life after divorce, but making sure you can move on without regrets this the tough part. <BR>It just took me a lot longer to come to the same place where you are. I knew about the affair for two yrs. After many attempts at reconciliation, I finally realized my love was gone, he wanted out, and the OW, at that point, was more important. <BR>I made it very clear to him that once the D was final , for me there was no turning back. So, if he had any thoughts about trying to save the marriage, he must say so before the D. He told me this was what he wanted, so I went ahead. <BR>I now have no regrets. Life is going great for me, and I truly feel the best is yet to come!<P>------------------<BR>Susan

It took me a long time to come to peace but I wouldn't go back to the life I had before.<P>My x still hasn't admitted he had a role in the end of our marriage - he was just so unhappy (well, excuse me, excuse me, just whose choice was that - certainly not the choice of the woman who was doing all she could on the wife, lover, friend, mother, housekeeper, fronts)......And he is still unhappy.<P>DanaB, I am so glad you get along with the OW. My x is getting married this fall (unless his new OW wises up) and I hope and pray that she and I will get along famously. X and I can't. He's either too ugly or too condescending. I just go crazy trying to deal with him. Maybe wife #2 will be what I need - a more pleasant person with whom to deal. I could handle that!!<P>I once heard a man named Joe Beam (I think) speak. He apparently does/did a lot of work with Harley. joe and his wife are on their second marriage to each other. One of his major points on marrriage is that any marriage, no matter whether intact or ended, is worth trying to rebuild until one of the parties remarries. In other words, no divorce is final until one party marries someone else. That remarriage is the end of hope for a marriage. <P>Would I consider working on my marriage to my x - only under certain circumstances. I certainly wouldn't expect miracles unless they started within the two of us. I can't allow myself to return to the marriage I had before. I've learned to never say never. So, if something miraculous happened, I might explore the possibilities. <P>But short of miracles, peace is pretty good.<BR>I guess it's miraculous in it's own way.<BR><p>[This message has been edited by cinderella (edited July 07, 2000).]

Dana,<BR>It sounds like you may have gotten some closure afterall. <P>God Bless,<P>Bob

Dana,<BR>I'm stunned. But it goes to show the Harleys know what they are talking about.<P>I'm not going to tell you that you should give him another chance, but do think about this...you were probably "disgusted" with his attempt to hug you because of your other relationship and your feelings for that man. I know you were served with divorce papers nearly right away and had no reason in your mind not to date, but what if you weren't emotionally tangled with someone else and your H had come to you? <P>Of course, I am looking at this from my perspective, having ended the EA I began the last time my H moved out, I've halted the divorce and I'm living with my H, putting the pieces back together. <P>In the midst of our other relationships, both my H & I thought our lives would be wonderful with this other person. Maybe, but we'd still see each other as our kids would be shuffled back & forth, and I realized that when I saw my H, I would feel regret.<P>As you've said, Dana, this has all happened so quickly to you from D-day to being ensconced in another relationship. Don't be in a rush, don't be in a hurry. If your guy is a decent guy, he'll want you to be sure.<P>All the best<P><P>------------------<BR>Lor<BR>"Let love be genuine...hold fast to what is good; love one another." Rom 12:9-10

Dana,<P>WHAT????? Well, I can't say I'm shocked, because I'm not. Dr H says that most betrayers start to realize their mistakes around 6 months. But I honestly thought it might take your H alot longer.<P>Mine's still being the same. BUT you know what? He's calling the boys more often and when he does, he wants to talk to me. I'd rather not talk to him, but I do. And he hasn't mentioned the financial agreement in almost 2 weeks. <P>There is no way I will go back to that life. Life was just too bad with him. My safety and my children's safety would be at risk. It's just too scary to think about. <P>Good luck to you Dana!<P>Mitzi

Cinderella and Bob, thank you for your support. <P>Sue, as usual you and I have some of the same views on so many things. Yes mine moved along quicker, but my situation was a lot different, as I will explain.<P>Lor , so I take it , that it was the Harley book I read that in. Yes I am sure that is the average time period. Some people realize it within a few weeks to a few years but 6 months seems about right from what I have been through. Thank you for your honest opinion, I have followed your situation since I came and haven't seen you on in a while.<P>I agree, the feeling of disgust, could have been because I am feeling for someone else. I don't really think I am capable of fully loving more than one person in the way I loved my h and I am sure that I wouldn't love as well without getting thru this. <P>It certainly is fast, 6 months, and in all honesty, the last year we had together was one of the better, the first few were good, but in between I had 6 years of drug abuse, gambling, strip bars, money obsessions, him leaving for another woman to go on vacation to Jamaica, and ultimately, this was the 3rd time we had been down this road.<P>Once when we were 17, I forgave him on that, we were both young and didn't know what we got ourselves into. At 21, he left for "space", 6 months down the road I found out he was with someone else that time and on his way to Jamaica. He was very cruel to me back then too. I went back with him in the beginning of that period for the sake of my kids. It sounds good on paper, but its not good for the kids for two people who are so incompatible to disagree so much. We did counseling, it worked to an extent. And yet again, 5 years later, he left on Xmas. I know you went through EVEN more than me. I can't give him any more of my life than the 12 years he had. If he wasn't damn certain that I was the one for him by now, then I am not the one for him.<P>More importantly, I don't want his headaches and grief anymore. I don't feel like saving someone from a drug addiction. I don't feel like being last all the time. I also don't want to be with someone who is not capable of showing me affection, admiration or commitment. And he never gave me that in 12 years, I don't think he is capable of it now. Mainly because of his childhood, but I do feel in my heart, that I sacrificed and tried my best. He is damn lucky I gave him a third chance in January. I don't miss him anymore. I don't think about him like I used to. I don't trust him and I don't like all the rotten things he did to me.<P>I am working in counseling and on my own to be sure that the new person is not really a part of my decision in a way that you may think. I know it sometimes seems too good to be true, yet, at the moment, I am going to be thankful and happy. I think I suffered enough this past year and I deserve it for once.<P>I am going to continue to work hard on keeping issues seperate and not compare the two. I am also going to continue to work on being civil to the other woman and also to him. I know I am better than them both and that I can do it. I don't have time or energy to waste on any more negativity from either of them.<P>Prayers and hugs,<BR>Dana<BR>

Dana, <P>Thanks for more info....I would agree, you can leave this without any regrets...you and your kids have been through enough!!<P>My x was never abusive to me, just treated me like his mom. He was just another kid, who enjoyed drinking too much, partying too much, and knew I would always be here to pick up the pieces. He would always say exactly what I wanted to hear, but NEVER followed through. It was a painful lesson to learn, going through this affair. I may have stayed in a marriage that would never be what it could be.<BR>But I will never, ever share my H with another woman.I must be #1, and I wasn't with him. <P>------------------<BR>Susan

Dana,<P>I'm happy you are moving on. And what a vindication for you! I am not anywhere close to where you are. If H came to me right now and said what your H said I would stop the D in a NY minute! But I don't see that happening. My H hasn't followed anything that the Harley's have described. Leave it to him to be different. I don't really think he'll ever admit regret. He is head over heels in love with this woman and she feels the same about him. The hard part is that I still love him too despite the pain and anguish of the last 15 months. Oh well, maybe someday I will be able to move on, but I honestly can't imagine myself with anyone else. He was my life and I thought I was his and I miss it. But, that part of my life is over. I just have to face the future alone. I think that's the hard part for me. Not having anyone to grow old with. Not having anyone to talk to about my good/bad day, etc. I just don't see myself ever finding anyone else. I'm glad you have. You do what's right for you, girl.<P><P>------------------<BR>Blessed be.<BR>****************
**edit**

Sue,<P>Thanks for the reply. Your h sounds a lot like mine was PLUS the added bonus of too many addictions to list. I do feel no regret for my decision. I feel that I gave it all I could and for as long as I could and here I am 27 years old, 3 kids, ages 9,7 and 2. I have been through a lot and I have a lot left to live! <P>I am smarter now. I know that my STBXH and I are totally incompatible. We don't share any of the same dreams, goals, money outlooks, nor do we even like much of the same foods. We don't enjoy the same recreational things, (why would I want to stuff my money down some nude woman's pants?), and we certainly are one sided. He is the taker and I am the giver. I think one day, he might grow up in about 15 years . He is only 27, 26 when we went thru what we did. He has a lot of growing up to do. <P>{{{{{{{{{{{KERI}}}}}}}}}}}}<BR>sorry to hear your still not doing well. I can't believe you have been on 15 months now. Well I can, I did it almost a year last time around. You will not spend the rest of your life alone, you will recover from this one day and go on to be a stronger person for it. If H loves OW, your grief and suffering will NOT bring him back. It might even turn him off totally from you. Try to be strong in front of him at least. Don't let him see your pain. I say that, but I break down a lot too. Life is what you make of it. WHen you are ready to let go of H and accept divorce , and let yourself heal, you will go on to bigger and better things. It may take a lot longer for you and thats fine too. Don't compare yourself to me because I have been through WAY to much for my age and I know things I'd rather have NOT learned the hard way. Do what makes you happy and keep the faith.<P>hugs to all,Dana<BR>

Dana,<P>Sorry about being slow to reply.<P>You are a very strong woman. You have grown alot the past 6 months. I remember your first few posts.<P>As far as your STBX...too frikken bad...he now has to pay the tab and that is not having a wonderful caring woman (you) for a wife.<P>Me personaly...I will resent that goddam Little Rat [censored] the rest of my life...at least today I feel this way. I will never accept him as my D's steppdad EVER. The next guy sure no problem, but, LRB is the man that DESTROYED D's home. Can you tell I disslike him....LOLOL<P>I don't like this word closure (sorry Bob). IMHO there is no closure. It is over sure but there a questions I will take to my grave because A: I don't want the answer and B:STBX is incapable of GETTING honest. I do see what I contributed to the demise of my marriage and am learning how to have those defects removed from my character. I also see my assets and I know what I want in a relationship. I am ready to apply what I have learned here to my next relationship and I have faith it will work. I only hope she (the next Mrs. Bill) can learn with me. I will readily admitt to being lonely but I am not alone...make sence??? My problem is this....I like a couple of ladies to the point that I want to ask them out but I have never done this clean and sober (FYI...I haven't used a mind or mood altering substance in 4 years) so I have a very awkward feeling inside, pretty close to terror...LOL I am not ready for rejection but my need for companionship is starting to outweigh that fear...yeah!!! Anyhoo...best wishes in your endevores and I know the next guy will be getting someone very special...any tips for a lonelyguy wanting to ask someone out?<P>Bill<P>------------------<BR><P>May the roads rise to meet you,<BR>May the winds always be at your back,<BR>May the sun shine warm upon your face,<BR>The rains fall soft upon your fields,<BR>And until we meet again,<BR>May god hold you<BR>In the hollow of his hand.

I just want to tell each and every one of you thank you. I can't believe the strength I see coming from you. I know I have my own, but you've shown me that I will continue to get stronger and life really will get better, day by day.<P>You're a terrific bunch!! May sunshine continue to shine into your lives.<P>2sad

Too Sad : Thank you for replying! I often wonder about posting when I am in my "happy" mood. If I can bring someone hope, than that is the best feeling I could get. If you ever read my earlier posts (like Bill), you would know that I have worked very hard and been through so much. It was a LONG road that is far from over, but things truly are getting better everyday. Much from the help of this site, in ways no one could ever imagine.<P>To Bill, <BR>No LONELYGUY names for you!! By the way, don't ever change your name, your password will never be stored again. LOL<P>Thank you for the compliments and encouragement. I am glad some of the original people that were here when I got here are still around. Its almost like an extended family being on this site. Checking in every few days to see who's ok and who's not.<P>I am happy to see you aren't afraid to be in search of your Mrs. Bill. This ordeal is enough to make anyone stay single the rest of their life, but truly there is more to life than pain, sorrow and loneliness.<P>I agree with you. I learned a lot about myself. I know things now I only wish I knew before. I know what caused my marriage to fail and honestly it wasn't all the affair. I didn't understand that Ex's needs were different from mine. I struggled to meet needs for him that meant nothing. And on his end, he was so selfish he only met his own and will blatantly tell you that my needs meant nothing. <P>I believe in my case, my divorce was meant to be. When I met my h, I was only 17, what did I know about love, life and eternity? Not a damn thing. At 27, with 3 kids, I am much wiser but I still have a long way to go.<P>I now have to learn how to be treated with admiration, affection and sensitivity that I never experienced before. THis is not easy after being screamed at for many years, but its now a new stage in my life that I am working to learn about.<P>Congratulations Bill on the 4 years, that is wonderful. I know a lot about all the addictions that there are. That is not easy and you should give yourself a big pat on the back. Of course, things are going to feel so REAL and much more intense to you now. <P>I don't know if I can give you advice, but coming from a former "lonely mom", I know that you can't be afraid to get out there and take a chance. I truly don't think failing at dating is going to be nearly as bad as the affair we suffered. Dating means different things to different people, BUT taking someone to dinner and a movie, is not all that bad. Its like a job interview, after you been on enough of them, you truly get used to them.<P>Take all the things you have learned through this horrible ordeal and turn it into something positive. Recognize that we the betrayed did play some part in the end of our marriage. No we didn't deserve to be betrayed, we didn't deserve to be emotionally destroyed and devastated. But we can learn from it and go on to a much better relationship next time. <P>Remember this quote that I look at every day. "you must do the things you think you cannot do". I have read that every day since xmas. Don't be afraid to live and be happy again. You deserve it, and we all deserve it.<P>One last thing, you mentioned about not accepting LRB. I don't blame you, your situation is much different from mine and LRB has no part in your daughter's life. In my case, I have learned to accept Laura. I am proud that I did it before I was involved in a new relationship. I did it on my own and I did it out of the kindness of my heart, which I never thought I had that in me. THe ONLY reason I did it was for my children.<P>Keep your strength and prayers to you all, Dana<BR><p>[This message has been edited by DanaB (edited July 11, 2000).]

<BR>Dana,<P>Its tough watching your marriage end, but I know that some marriages just don't make it. I know you did everything you could to save it, and I wish you well in the future. I am somewhat concerned that you might be currently in a "rebound" relationship right now, so don't be in a rush to remarry. Just a thought.<P>Bystander

Bystander,<P>Thank you for the wishes. I am NOT in a rush to remarry, I may NEVER remarry. I don't know that for sure, but its a strong possibility.<P>As you get further into divorce, it becomes clear that the divorce is definetly affecting you in ways you never thought possible. <P>With that in mind, would I want to take a risk on marriage to wind up here again?? Sure I have learned a lot, and I think I will go on to a much brighter future, but marriage, just might not be so easy. <P>By the way, I waited 7 years with my ex, before we married, so I didn't rush there either.<P>Rebounds are possible yes. I certainly hope I am not in one now. I know that I had one already. I am paying close attention to a lot of things in the hopes that I am not in a rebound, or the person I am seeing for that matter. I do go to counseling and I do try to keep everything in the right perspective.<P>All I can do is take it one day at a time, and pray for the best. Which is what I am doing right now. If I make it thru today, thats what counts.<P>As an update, I had a long discussion with my STBXH today. I felt we needed to figure some things out regarding the children, and he knew this. When I called him to discuss it, he came right over.<P>We discussed support, visitation, and the divorce. We are working on cooperating and compromising on certain things when one of us may need a favor. Let's face it, if I need a sitter, why not ask their dad first, since he hates our kids being with anyone other than he or I. We actually compromised on a few things, and both walked away feeling comfortable with what we accomplished. We have a long road ahead of us. We just have decided that we need to try and put this whole mess in the past as much as we can and only focus on the children. STBXh is starting counseling soon as well. He is trying to figure out why he did what he did. I think he is waking up now and taking a long hard look at what he did.<P>Our marriage is over, but we will remain connected for many years to come. We both are just trying to make the best of the situation at this point and for now, I think its a big accomplishment we can even agree on what we have.<P>Prayers to all,Dana<BR>

Dana,<P>I wish my H felt that way about childcare. He used to say he didn't really like the kids being in daycare, but when I asked him to care for them so I could go to the mandatory parenting course he told me that he was not their babysitter, and finding and paying for childcare was entirely my responsibility. I can never get a job that requires any travel, because he won't let all of the four younger ones visit at the same time, anyway. I guess I should be grateful that he does not ask for visitation on the two holidays we celebrate as a family - Christmas and Thanksgiving, but he only had two of them visit on Father's Day, and late on Easter eve he brought back the two who were visiting supposedly because the OW's child was sick and he didn't want them to catch anything - apparently it was ok to be exposed during the day, but they were going to catch something overnight in separate rooms. All this from a man who used to say how important his family was to him.