Well, X moved to Calif, even thogh he was offered jobs around here. I went to lunch with a friend of his on Wed and found out, yes, the fairy tale is over. He went to see her unannounced and she told him to leave, she was seeing someone else, and never to contact her again!!No wonder he has been so mean with me lately.<BR>So the kids and I are going to Vegas for our summer vacation. He asked if he could come over and see the kids. I said, yes, for lunch, but this is my time with them and not for the whole day. Then about a week later he calls and asks if he can take them back to LA with him and fly them back up here?? Now, remember he was here the whole month of May and June and did not aske for them other than a night here and there. He has not paid me any support, either. I tols him why didn't he use that money to pay for child support instead. That he had ample opportunity to vacation with them in June. That made him mad. Did I do the right thing??<P>------------------<BR>Susan

Hi Susan,<P>It's been a while...<P>About your question...<BR>..."Did I do the right thing??"...<P>The "right" thing is to hold each parent up to their responsibilities... without harming the kids or their relationship with the offending parent. The children (no matter what age) need to learn about responsible behavior.<P>Gee... another unclear answer from me...<P>Well... anyway...<BR>...if in following the spirit of the visitation guidelines...<BR>...and in the spirit of how your children would appreciate this...<P>...I would say... it would be cheaper for him to fly up alone... to visit the kids...<P>...if this his real intention...<P>...and yes... the saved airfare money could/should be used for child support payment.<P> <P>Jim

Sue:<BR>It is a case of damned if you do and damned if you don't ...well sort of anyway.<BR>You have always sounded so level headed and a clear thinker. It is "their convoluted logic and lack of common sense" that makes us sometimes question the right thing to do vis a vis the children.<P>With that long preamble....<P>In my opinion there are 2 issues, visitation and money (the usual things to fight over)<P>As far as tying in visitation with money...all I have read...this is a no no!<BR>The questions I have are-do you children want to spend time with him...overnight etc?<BR> -do your children want to go on holiday with him to whereever?<BR>If they do then you have to weigh up the following:<BR>Let them spend time with him in your town.<BR>Until he can be more responsible in your opinion (and get advice from professionals perhaps) as regards not being a bozo in terms of the kids and communicating with you about their whereabouts etc. i.e. can you trust him to be as good a father to them as he was before, then do not let them travel with him. <P>I would also tell him that he can see the kids during his visitation times, but if he does not use the minimum, then how can he ask for more!!!In other words let his actions portray how much he genuinely wants to be there for his kids, before you are more accomodating. <P>I would get your lawyer to deal with child support....you will not get through to him on that level by yourself and cannot punish the kids because he is an @@sshole.<P>

{{{{{{{{{{SUE}}}}}}}}}}}}}<P>You'd think by now it wouldn't be so damn complicated right?? <P>How do you feel knowing that the affair is finally over?? What does it feel like?? <P>If it were me, I wouldn't give up too much of "my" time for "him" only for the fact of all the missed opportunities in the past. <P>And the issue of support, definetly not allowed to be mixed with visitation, but I certainly hope you are going after the support you are owed.<P>Write to me, its your turn on email!<BR>Dana<BR>

Thanks, all. <BR>Jim, <BR>I want him to be a father to them, this taking a job so far away when I know he had offers closer really bugs me. And I have already paid for their tickets to fly back with me, and theyare not refundable..so I have wasted 200.00. Plus I know he is working,(he is only 1 wk now into new job, so I can't imagine he can take time off yet). So they would be left alone( but they are 14 and 16) and he would prob let the 16yr old use his truck and I am concerned about her driving around LA by herself. <BR>Wilbok, <BR>Guess I answered your Q about his maturity in having the kids. I know he loves them, but he does not make the best choices in dealing with them, IMO. Of course, ask him and he does. <BR>Dana, <BR>Yes, it isa never ending circle. <BR>How do I feel about knowing cyberchick shut him off? I knew it would happen, her H and I talked and he told me as early as April she was seeing another. I did not tell him, none of by bus, he is a big person and can make his own relationship choices himself. <P>There is a part of me that wants to say, "see I told you so", another feels a little bad for him because of all he has given up, another is glad that he is in such a state. Serves him right. I was always there for him, no matter what, until this. It was just more than I could handle. <P>I have not contacted a lawyer about the support. I am getting along without it, and when I sell the house (in 4 yrs) I have to pay him his equity. My thought is unless things get really bad for me, I will take it off of what he owes me. Which right now is over 3,000. <P>------------------<BR>Susan

Sue<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR> I know he loves them, but he does not make the best choices in dealing with them, IMO. Of course, ask him and he does. <BR><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Love is great, but sometimes can be used to justify illogical and irrational actions.<BR>Is he of the personality NOT to return them to WA from LA? That was the first question that ran through my mind? especially if he is mad at you? <P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR> There is a part of me that wants to say, "see I told you so", another feels a little bad for him because of all he has given up, another is glad that he is in such a state. Serves him right. I was always there for him, no matter what, until this. It was just more than I could handle. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Yes, there is that feeling, but don't hold onto it too long. Holding onto it too long can warp any "good" relationship you can establish for the sake of the kids, meaning being able to negotiate with their best interests at heart.<P>I would say that he needs to show responsibility in meeting his times so that you can feel free to allowng them to leave the state. Over that state line stuff gets complicated, because of legalities, and the reach of your lawyer. <P>It would depend upon your view of his responsibility in making sure they come back, and then secondarily, how they would be treated. Of course, while they are there, he may try to convince them to stay, especially if he is vindictive in any way.<P>good luck, <BR>this is a tough one, but I think starting out conservatively is most responsible for the kids, both to see and understand.<P>thl<P>

Sue,<P>How wonderful that you can get by without his support!! Hopefully I'll get there some day!<P>Even though you want to say "I told you so", you know what? He knows your thinking it! I can't believe it went on for 2 years. Although, a few people here are at that point. It makes me glad I didn't Plan A that whole time, or I'd be a miserable wreck right now.<P>Even now, that I'm having some other issues to deal with, and me and ex have tried to resolve much of the conflict, I STILL wouldn't go back to him. My expecatations are way too high now!<P>Prayers and hugs,Dana<BR>

Hey Sue,<P>I guess since your kids are older, ask them what they want to do. As for the tix already purchased, ask him to reimburse you for them if he wants to take them and then fly them back(get money first!).<P>Has he said anything about the cs at all? As Willbok said, everything I've read you aren't supposed to use the child support as a bargining chip against visitation. <P>HE may try to have you held in contempt of court saying you are denying him visitation because he hasn't been able to pay child support. <P>Best of luck,<P>Bob

Bob, <BR> We have not even mentioned the CS. I have not bothered him about it, he did say that now that he is working he would start sending me some, and I said I would appreciate it. <P>As far as the trip, I did not deny him seeing the kids, it is just that this is our vacation, the kids would be alone there, and they both have obligations here at home. And I had to get a dig in about a better thing to end the money on. I am a little uncomfortable with the other state thing, too, though I am pretty sure he would not want them all the time. <BR><P>------------------<BR>Susan

Sue,<BR>I talked to a friend who is divorced and how does she handle visitation with her x husband.<P>She said it is tough, but they have set priorities/boundries. For instance, if he calls at the last minute and they have plans, she tells him no. But if they don't, then she lets them go.<P>She also has to put up with her x always having a woman with him. These women sometime end up watching the kids while he is out drinking. The friend also says her girls end up liking these woman because they take the girls shopping and buy them makeup and jewelry. She doesn't like it but there is nothing she can do. The father also does more with the son than the daughters.<P>The x is also behind on his child support. He was supposed to pay $1000 for 3 months in order to catch up. She received a check for $180 so far in July. He works as a sub-contractor and basically hides all his money.<P>She has not used this as a reason to prevent visitation.<P>So, what I'm saying is that since you do have plans, then tell x that plans are made and while you would love him to see the kids, other arrangements need to be made.<P>Best of luck,<P>Bob