Hi friends,<P>Well here is an update on me.<P>My baby Taylor is getting sick again. I hope its a passing thing, but I am really concerned today again.<P>My ex has been helping out around here a few times this week as my house is pretty much the MONEY PIT.<P>Anyway, these are the comments he's made to me this past week.<P>I think I jumped the gun on that divorce thing. I think next year we'll come together and work this whole thing out. I am leaving OW in Oct when my seasonal job ends. I still love you. Lets have sex, we're still married. UGHHHHHHH<P>He has grabbed and kissed me twice now. I have struggled away and now I am really getting pissed about it. <P>My opinion is that he is done with OW and wants me back as the easy way out. I am not second choice damn it!!!!<P>Also, I think he is missing me and the kids and unfortunately for him, I am interested in someone else. Is it fair>? What do you think??<P>I fear that IF I weren't seeing someone he'd manipulate me into working this out with him. I fear that he is really getting obsessive with me too.<P>He is stopping here tomorrow to drop my child support off and told me he needs to talk and to be ready for an hour and a half.<P>UGHHHH> This is unbelievable. I have asked him why he left. He to this day, doesn't know. He maintains he can't figure out how we got here. He appologizes over and over, but words mean nothing after the hell I've been thru.<P>This is my one chance to say all I wanted over these past 8 months. <P>I don't want him back, but its hard to see that sensitive side of him and its hard to physically fend him off, he's stronger and bigger. <P>I fear he won't sign the divorce papers that will be here any day now. I fear he will do something stupid when they come.<P>But most of all, I am afraid of slipping into a depression or bad place because of his attempts to reconcile. <P>I worked so hard to build up my strength to forgive him and forget and move on. I certainly don't trust him and can't be with him again. It would be easier if he would just leave me alone.<P>I guess I am rambling now, I am going away for the weekend but I suppose I just need to hear my friends who know all I have been thru to tell me what I know is right.<P>Did I mention I am extremely attracted to someone, and that I can't stop thinking about him??? I don't dare tell him what is happening because I don't want him to lose faith or not trust me, but this is very hard.<P>Have a great weekend to you all, Dana<BR>

Dana,<P>All I can tell you is you hold the cardsw as far as a convesation w?ex goes. You don't have to listen to him nor do you have to telol him all your junk either.<P>If you want to hear him then listen...Maybe he can <B>GET</B> honest about everything....but don't expect it.<P>Say a prayer before he comes.<P>Bill

Hey Dana;<P>Woah!<P>I guess you need to look deep inside and determine if there is any part of you that might want him back. If so, I think you should read over the principles here as to what exactly you should do. <P>If he wants back, why is he staying with the OW until October? If you want him back, I think that has to end now.<P>If you definitely do not want him back, hear him out if you want and say what you need to say. Or, just tell him that you don't have anything to talk about right now.<P>This must be very tough. I would hate for someone to play with my emotions like that. It's not fair.<P>Also, I think you need to try to figure out exactly how you feel about this other guy. It sounds like you really like him. But, I wouldn't figure him in the picture when you decide what to do about your husband.<P>I will pray for you. Hang in there!!!<P>Jen<P>

Hi Dana,<P>I think the first thing you have to do is to figure out what you truly want out of life.<P>I believe that there is alot of hurt and animosity to clear before you can even consider going back into this relationship with your S. I know I have it!<P>I don't know if you have the energy to fix the hurt. It would take much more of your self and tears to humble to this point. <P>Dana, look at this situation, truly look at it. You will have to start to see things for what they really are. Look at your actions. You are only responsible for your actions. Look deep into your heart and with your heart look at each moment of this relationship. You must decide what you are willing to give and to accept.<P>Believe me, I know about the trust issues. How could I ever trust her again? How will Brian ever trust her. She cheated on me with him. <P>I would suggest you hear him out. Let him vent and get it off his chest. If you are not interested, this may be a way for him to move on as well and not bother you in the future.<P>Just me rambling. <P><P>------------------<BR>"It's not over till we say it's over! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? H*ll no!" Blutto...Animal House 1984<P>Wishing us all the Best.<P>Medic

Dana - <B>Do Not Allow him to invade your comfort zone </B> <P>Yes, they are bigger and stronger - that doesn't mean you have to respond. If you feel like a broom straw, act like a broom straw. Do Not Melt if you do not want to do so. AHHHH, I hate this!!! I am going through the same thing, but the difference is that my divorce will be final (barring my stbx doing something unforseen) on Thursday!! He invades my comfort zone every chance he gets. Do it for <B>you</B>. Not because of what used to be! If this is what you want, then Wonderful!! But, if you need the space then <B>TAKE</B> it. It's <B>your</B> space. Do not succumb if it is not in your best interest.....is this what you really want?

Dana,<P>What more can I say? Do what you feel is right. Listen to him if you want, don't if you don't want to. He can't force you to listen.<P>(((((((((HUGS)))))))))<BR>Mitzi

Dana, <BR>Everyone has been telling you to look into your heart and you will know what is best. That is good advice, but also look with your head. <BR>Rationally think about what he would want to say to you. And what you want to hear. If you are truly wanting out of this marriage, then I would not waste much time in talking. If you think you may want him back, then follow plan B to the letter. Let him know you still care, but until OW is out of the picture and he is truly ready to commit, SORRY!!<BR>In my mind, as long as the OW is in the picture, there wuld be nothing he could say to me that I would want to hear. I would not even talk to him! Just make your position known and let it go at that. <P>------------------<BR>Susan

Ok Dana, I'm waiting!!! What happened??<P>Mitzi

DanaB,<P>(((((((( HUGS )))))))))<P>This is really a tough thing to have to go through.<P>I do agree w/what everyone on here has said!<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>UGHHHH> This is unbelievable. I have asked him why he left. He to this day, doesn't know. He maintains he can't figure out how we got here. He appologizes over and over, but words mean nothing after the hell I've been thru.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Ok......this is my thoughts on this.<P>If he has no clue as to why he left and how you all got there.......then to me he hasn't thought hard enough about it.He hasn't done the soul searching and looking at him self as the role he played in the down fall of your marriage!!!......<P>I think that if is a MUST for both people to do this.You have to know exactly what you both did for you to move forward and fix it.<P>My 2 cents his he is just blowing smoke and is wanting to see what you will do?.....to me it is a EGO game for him.<P>I would think really hard as to what it is you want.......<P>The main thing that you should remember is that you are the one IN CONTROL.If you want him back than you need to listen to what he has to say and then lay it all out.<P>Set some guide lines......like getting rid of OW.....NO CONTACT!.....he can come back,but no touching .....no sex.......he has go to counceling!.......and so on!!!<P>I did do this w/my stbx.......one he wasn't going to go to counceling....he even said that he knew that he should.Gee what does that say to me.....I guess I am not worth it.<BR>I knew that he wasn't going to put the effort in trying to degotiate and make compromises......that gave me my answer!!!<P>I hope that Taylor is doing ok.......my prayers are w/you!!!!<P>Take it easy Dana,just go w/your GUT,not your heart.<P>Hang in there!!!<P>Gina <P><P>------------------<BR>"If we deny love that is given to us,if we refuse to give love because we fear pain or loss,then our lives will be empty,our loss greater!"-----Anonymous----

Hi friends,<P>Thanks for your replies. <P>First off to clarify, when I sent this message I was very confused and pretty much in panic. <P>I DON'T want him back, but I just wish this weren't happening. Its not fair. I feel like I went thru enough that I just want some peace.<P>So here's the scoop.<P>He came here Saturday morning. TO "innocently" drop off my child support money (which he is never late on anymore). We talked for over an hour. I had the radio on, a song by Dixie Chicks came on and he started getting tears in his eyes.<P>I maintained to him that I am not interested in a relationship with him at this time. When he is near me, I don't feel much of anything. When he kisses me, I feel like I am going to puke. I certainly don't feel attracted to him, much less want to be more than a friend.<P>Well, we talked again and he thinks there is something wrong with him. (I knew that 8 months ago). I told him, that he knows what he has to do to get his life in order. He needs to leave OW, and get out there and live and be alone for a while , and figure out who he is and what he wants.<P>He thinks that in a year or so, he and I will get back together. I don't understand this method of thinking, but I am not going to argue with him either. He is distraught enough.<P>Well, OW came later that day to pick up MY girls for HIS visit cuz he was working half a day. Do you know, I felt GUILTY that he keeps making passes at me, when she thinks he is all hers? I felt like I did something wrong to her. This whole mess stinks. She is the one who came in and helped break my marriage up. WHy I feel bad for her, I have no clue.<P>I am going to steer clear of my ex, til these papers come and try and keep him off my back (literally) for as long as I can.<P>Its clear to see that this is all hitting him right now. I only know this from being with him for 11 years, this is the first real sign of remorse he's displayed.<P>He makes me feel guilty that I am the one who wants the marriage to be over. LEts not forget, it should be over, the papers should have come by now. Nor that he sued me for divorce, nor that he had the affair and rubbed it in my face.<P>Anyhow, I feel really guilty for so much and now I'm actually mad about it. I have always maintained that I'll take blame for what caused him to stray. But I have worked hard over the last 8 months to recover from that trauma and now its all thrown in my lap for a final decision again.<P>I thought about the MB principles before he came . (I hadn't had replies yet before he came) and I don't think I am capable of fulfilling his needs because I resent him for hurting and abandoning us on xmas. I have no desire for him to meet my needs because I feel like vomitting when I see him. <P>I know this will sound bad, but I am seeing someone right now, and I am happy with my life right where it is. Its not too complicated. I have my kids and when their gone, I have someone to spend time with. No making dinner by a certain time, no stress of taking care of anyone but me and the girls. And for once in my life, I am taking the easy way out, to me, its easier to trust someone new than trust him after what he's done anyhow.<P>There is a song I heard today on the radio, I don't know who sings it, its a country song, and its about a girl who can settle for the love she has (the ex) but doesn't want to settle for love that she can live with, she wants the love she can't live without. I can't think of a more perfect way to describe how I feel than that. I could deal with him til my kids are grown. I could go back to having a financially easier life. I could even stomach him for the sake of the kids. But what about me, and the love I deserve? For the first time ever , I am taking a different path from him .<P>Thanks for letting me vent, hugs and prayers, Dana<P>

Dana,<P>sometimes the path of higher growth is the hardest. And maybe he will change, but the chances are slim, and he will have to convince you otherwise, not through visions of grandeur, but by a Plan A attack, which WS don't have in them.<P>good luck, hang in there, and you will survive just fine.<P>thl<BR>

Oh, {{{{{{Dana}}}}}}<P>I have <B>sooooo</B>been there. <P>I'll try to respond with an appropriate amount of decorum.......<P>It sounds as though you have decided to make a go of life on your own. Please, don't look back.......if you do, do it only to learn from the experience and not to hold on too tightly to what was, because it won't be the same ever again. Man, I said earlier to another post that I was being a wet blanket--I guess it's my impending divorce that makes me want to warn others of the heartache. Nothing would have pleased me more than to have my <B>husband</B> back again. But, he is no longer the person I married......maybe I'm no longer the person <B>he</B> married. I know, I'm rambling.<P>Oh, yeah, my H cheated on his girlfriend w/me too. I don't think this is uncommon....."We're still married, there's nothing wrong with it"......right?<P>Just do what feels right from the gut - as Gina said. Your heart doesn't always know what it's doing.<p>[This message has been edited by RCoaster (edited August 27, 2000).]

Thanks RC and THL,<P><BR>He is NOT the man I once loved and he never could be. I am just going thru some rough times personally right now and sometimes it seems easier to give up and go back, but I'm NOT going to do that.<P>I've been thru worse and I know I have the strength and support to get thru it.<P>Its just a matter of doing it without killing him first!!!<BR>

Hi Dana,<P>I never posted to this, I saw too many similarities in the manipulation that I had with my ex. I knew that would cloud my objectivity.<P>It took me along time to see my ex for the person he became (or maybe always was?) rather than what I wished him to be, or to return too. I am getting to the point that I am mostly remembering the good things we had, and feeling sadness that it is over - but a very healthy acceptance that it is over. <P>You are a very strong person.

You've been in my prayers lately. Even befor I saw this thread. Sorry this has been going on. <P>Who knows what goes on in these people's heads. Stay strong. You're gonna make it.

Dana: I know this is a difficult time, but your vision for your family is clouded by that other person you are seeing. There are many people on this board who would have felt it was a dream for their husband to make a turn back towards his wife and family.<P>IMHO, the relationship with your husband is the one you should pursue because that has the most potential of any because of what you two already share. Certainly there is a lot of pain and mistrust (and you want it to all be over), but he is making a turn, and it is possible to make things better than they were! I would just hate for you to completely give up on him just cause something else looks better right now. <P>When my husband was coming back I would get sick to my stomach when I would think that I needed to trust him again, and I felt as if I was under this great pressure to do it. It takes a long time. I ended up on an antidepressant to help alleviate some of my anxiety, and eventually I could reach out to him again, and that was 15 months after he first left. I wish I could convey to you the satisfaction there is of having weathered that storm. If you can look five years down the road, wouldn't it be nice to have your family together as opposed to your children trying to get along with their step parent?<P>I will pray for you in this struggle.

Dana - First of all, please do not feel guilty. The guilt belongs to him. You're right - he needs to end it with OW, be by himself for a while, and really look at himself, what he did and why, and what he wants for his life, and what kind of person he wants to be from now on. To tell you that all of this depends on you is not loving behavior on his part. He needs to deal with his own guilt by himself. You continue on with your personal growth and put him on the back burner. Who knows how either one of you will feel in a year - he may come to realize he doesn't want to reconcile, and that the divorce was for the best. Keep the relationship cordial and confined to friendship if this is what is comfortable for you. You're right - you don't have to be second-best. Having your H back by default is not a solid basis for a marriage. He needs to get his act together first, and demonstrate such to you, and if you have not already moved on with someone else, or just plain moved on, then you can consider what kind of future, if any, the two of you might have together. You are a strong woman - do not give up your hard-earned independence and peace of mind. God Bless you, Dana. Lady M<p>[This message has been edited by Lady M (edited August 28, 2000).]

Dana,<P>Just reading your post. Relationships are so difficult, always something when your in them, awful when their troubled, hurtful when they end, and then when you feel like you've come to a good point in your life, they up and come at you again. As mentioned in a previous post, go with your gut feeling, hearts are NOT always the best judges of what is right. Hope things get better for you and you're allowed some peace!<P>Lori

Hi friends,<P>Thank you for the replies. I signed on this morning and thought, "Where did all those come from"? Sometimes the board goes in spurts and there aren't many replies. Luckily any time I have been in a bad spot, its always been a good time for replies for me.<P>Thanks to all my friends who replied, and I am sorry I haven't been personally emailing these past few days, I just can't think straight.<P>Thank you to the new people who posted, I don't recognize all these newer names lately, and it bothers me how fast this place continues to grow. <P>My ex called here 3 times yesterday. I didn't answer it, I have caller ID. He called again after he knew the kids were in bed and I knew he'd keep calling if I didn't answer.<P>I tried to sound "normal" (what on earth is that?? ) but he could tell by my voice something was bothering me. (ya him). I got off on the old PMS excuse for the moment, but he's onto me, that something is up.<P>The thing is, I will admit that a long time ago, I did love him tremendously. I would have died for him. I have sacrificed so much thru our relationship. I really did meet all his needs that I knew of and that he asked for, he rarely met more than one or two of mine. He has cheated 2 other times, once we were 17, I gave him the benefit of the doubt, we were young, but even at that age when love and life is so much more "real" feeling, it was hard. He did it again at 21. He did it the third time at 27.<P>This is a pattern. A scary one. one every 4-5 years. I can't do this again in 5 years. I can't do this again ever. I have given all I have to give him and I can't feel deep down enough right now to think of giving again.<P>I have never been selfish, I have always been the most giving person any of my friends know. Right now, my problem is that I feel incredibly selfish and guilty for this whole mess.<P>I didn't sleep at all last night. I keep thinking of all the rotten things he's done. I keep thinking of all the times he purposely hurt me so badly. I don't dare go back to that lifestyle ever.<P>To Lor, if your out there, I sure wonder how your doing right now.<P>There was a time, when I fantasized about this day. Very early into the break up. I thought about how happy I'd feel for him to want to come back.<P>In the early stages, I can see myself having that will to fix this. At this point, I feel so emotionally drained that I don't think I could do it. <P>Aside from all that, my birthday is just around the corner. I'll be 28 next week. I have been feeling rotten about the fact that each year at my birthday, I have always had goals and I have always accomplished my goals way ahead of schedule. This year, I have no goals, and I certainly feel I've accomplished nothing the past year. Its a crappy feeling for someone who is normally very outgoing and goal oriented.<P>Well sorry for rambling, I can't even imagine how long this reply must be. I hope that this reply doesn't convey that I am feeling this way solely because I am "seeing" someone else. That aspect is very minor compared to this whole "big picture" and honestly, I can't mix the two.<BR>I know, it sounds as if the new person would be the reason behind this decision.<P>All I can do is compare my ex, to the many different types of men I've met over these 8 months. Don't forget I was a teen when he and I met. I never knew there were so many different and great types of guys out there. I assumed all men were losers, abusers, hurters and jerks. Thank God, I have come out of this knowing that I was wrong.<P>There is a certain type of person who I feel I'd like to share my life with. One that is very giving, and affectionate, respectful and kind hearted. My ex has never displayed these traits in many many years. He displays them to get what he wants then when he does, he turns into that selfish arrogant person that I don't get along well with.<P>Ok, now I'm really confused. I'll end this before it gets worse!<P>Prayers and hugs to you all and sorry that I am not replying to other posts this week, I am just very confused.<P>Dana<P>

Hi again Dana,<P>The guilt is tremendous, oh my ex used it on me, that suddenly I was the bad guy. Like you, I had all the fantasies that everything would somehow work out, that he would come back showing remorse, that he understood how wrong it was, and that he didn't understand how important the family was to him until he lost it. A true, "I'm sorry, I really didn't understand but now I do" is all I wanted from him - I would have done whatever it would have taken to get the marriage back, if it could truly have been a marriage again.<P>But my ex and his girl were getting ready to part, when he started to talk to me about "working things out" - there was no lightbulb that went off in his head, just the thought that OK, I've had enough of playtime with this one, I'll go home now to the house, the kids, the money, and the maid (me). It was always about him - nothing had changed, there were not regrets on his part.<P>He went through the phases of trying to make me feel guilty, then the tears came and he tried to make me pity him - the thought also went through my mind that he wanted to come back to better his position legally - I had irrefutable proof of adultery, which was my legal ace - which if I hadn't had, would have made for a very very messy divorce, and I would have lost the house. My husband could be a real hateful cruel bully - I didn't trust his motives, and decided to divorce. I figured if he were sincere, we could always remarry, I started having those little daydreams. Well, needless to say, when I didn't stop the divorce, the crocodile tears dried, and he was vicious in his attack. There was even an incident at my work involving security, which was extremely unpleasant, to say the least.<P>I am very thankful that I remained objective at such a critical time. Trust your instincts.<P>