I had just finished responding on my other post when the phone rang. It was a friend of mine who has a friend who goes to HER yoga class. SHE is a yoga instructor and has a following. That has been very hard to deal with too. So my friend's friend had finished class and overheard her talking to some other people in the class and she was talking about having just gotten back from a trip with HER fiance! Of course she does have a huge diamond that he bought her before I even knew about her. And she has some other kind of gold band that looks like a wedding ring that she wears with it. One time I confronted her and I saw them. So now MY husband is HER fiance! One of the class members asked her when she was getting married and she said oh, not for years and years until she raises her kids. This would be at least 7 years if I am correct about their ages. How can I live with this torment any longer? I haven't posted some other things. One is that my husband bought her and her brats a house. And it is five minutes from where I live and where he used to live with me for over 20 years. So he cared so little for what this is doing to me that he planted her right in my backyard! I asked my attorney about the house because I swear I would love to have her kicked out of it and when I found out I would have done it if I could. But he is too smart for me. My attorney asked him about it and he told him that his company bought the house and his company is owned by he and his brother equally. Oh and my daughter works for the company and will inherit it someday so if I divorce him and go for blood and destroy the company then I am destroying my daughter's future and she has asked me not to do this. She loves it and her work. Of course he never discussed work with me. I was just the little wife at home, taking care of our social life and raising his daughter and washing his underwear and picking up his dry cleaning. So to make a long story short, there is no way I can get the house back from her even if I do divorce him because his brother helped in do this thing. His brother who I have known for 35 years and who I thought was a brother to me too. But this business of her calling herself his fiance is too much to take. We live in a suburb of a very large city but he is a well known man and very successful. So, if she is telling people in her class it will get around soon enough. I really can't take this any more. I really feel that the disolution is the only way out. But how do I disolve a marriage that is a part of me? Even after him being gone 18 months I still feel like his wife! When will I be able to deal with the fact that I have been replaced? When will this pain and humiliation stop?

I know I shouldn't have done it but I just called and left a message on HER answering machine. Of course, SHE is out of town with my husband for the weekend. I asked her how it was possible to be engaged to a married man? I know I shouldn't have done this because every time in the past I have confronted her, she runs to my husband and somehow I always come out looking like some nasty person. All our married life my husband always looked out for me and would never have stood for anyone insulting me. But this woman can take my husband and flaunt it and I'm bad if I say one word against her. It's so hard to understand and I don't feel any better anyway. I wish I could take the call back.

Are you really sure your daughter will inherit this company someday? If he can dump his wife of 35 yrs., he seems pretty capable of leaving her high and dry as well. You might want to point this out to your daughter. Apparently, she's pretty self-centered herself. If my dad did to my mom what your H is doing to you, I wouldn't want his friggin company. <P>What is to keep him from giving the business to his "fiance" and her kids? Besides, it is not up to you to spare him (or anyone else) from the consequences of HIS behavior. If I were you, I'd go after him with everything you've got. You've taken care of him for 35 years. This is your only opportunity to see anything come of it. It is now or never. Don't listen to people who want you to "make nice". Time is long past for that if you ask me.

discarded,<P>That woman is just making herself look ridiculous. Yeah, right, she's engaged, but she isn't going to marry for 7 years? What kind of engagement is that? Nobody in their right mind is going to believe that she is engaged, even if they didn't know that she was an OW.

You said in another post that your H said he would never divorce you. Okay, if you want to stay enmeshed in this and not give him up, let that be your revenge. As long as you are married, she never will be, right?<P>I have a friend who's parents were separated for 20-30 years. The H was a traveling musician who was notoriously unfaithful. He had girlfriends everywhere, but he always came home and visited with his daugthers and wife. There was obviously no one more dear to his heart than his wife, and I believe the mistresses knew that too. Anyway, when he died, the main mistress (younger, gorgeous, and dressed to kill) and maybe a few others were there along with the wife. Even though everyone knew who they all were, there was never any lack of respect for the wife because she never acted like a victim. The wife always felt like he was her man- at least in his heart. Anyway, I guess this arrangement seemed to work for everybody.<P>As for whether or not you can take the house, well you can take something. you can find yourself a nasty little personal injury lawyer and file a Intentional Infliction of Emotional Distress suit against her. You can ask for pain and suffering awards and since she is willfully causing you emotional distress and telling everyone she is your H's finacee, sounds to me like you have a case. I'd get a creit report run on her first and find out what she owns and what she is worth, and go for it. 35 years of marriage should be worth a whole lot of pain and suffering. <P>Give her some of that humiliation she is spreading around. OW's have no shame!<P>Of course, this could make your H change his mind about the whole "I'll never divorce you" thing.<P>Guess it all depends on how you want to take your revenge.

The settlement I have asked for is very large. My daughter just can't see why I would cause a huge problem when I have no need for the money. She already has a big stake in the business and she and her Dad are very close. He still spends lots of time with her. They work together every day and travel together. He is taking her to business and social functions some of the time in order to get her more involvedin the community. I think she just wants the problem to go away and since she thinks he's never coming back she just wants it to be solved without more fighting. She's seen a lot of fighting between us these past three years after a marriage of no fighting and I think she just wants it to stop. She is very loyal to me in other ways. She has never met the OW and she never will. She will never go to anything where the OW is present. I am sure there have been things the OW wanted to go to with my H but since my daughter wanted to go, she couldn't. So if I tell my daugther that I am going to go through a bitter divorce when she knows I would probably not end up with much more then what he is offered in settlement, she will be upset as she thinks that is senseless. She goes to my attorney appointments with me so she knows what he has said. She has told my H that she expects him to take care of me for the rest of my life and provide for me fairly and her opinion of him means a lot to him. So she does stick up for me in some ways.<P>Popeye I will talk to my lawyer about what you said but since he is doing all this of his own free will I can't see how I would have a case against her. She has never called me or confronted me and on the few times I have confronted her she would barely say a word. Later my husband told me that I was the one who screamed at her while she wouldn't get involved in such a scene. Once again I'm the nasty one. She did say that she has never once asked my H for any of the things he has done for her and I asked my H this. He said it was true. I find it hard to believe but how could I prove it wasn't true? <P>I have been thinking of moving. I love our home. It is beautiful and isolated in the woods. But it is very large. I have done some redecorating since he left and I am happier here. The problem is running into or seeing her. I see her at least a few times a week because we both have to go through the same major intersection to get to our houses. I have already had to change where I shop and run errands and now go out of my way. After this latest, I am dreading seeing her again. My therapist says that I am risking just getting more and more bitter by hanging in there when it looks more and more like he is not coming back when I should be focusing on myself and my own happiness. He feels my focus is still far too much on him. Well, I have been married to him for 31 years! How can my focus not be on him! He is my husband! I have finally in this last two or three months started facing that he probably never is. That has been so hard to accept! Did I tell you that they went away for the whole month of July while he paid to send her kids to a fancy camp? I'm not sure where they went but somewhere overseas. At least I got a month of not running into her. They were away together on the anniversary of my finding out about the afair and also our 31st wedding anniversary (not the same day but a few weeks apart.

It sounds like you are still in the stages of trying to make sense of things. So, slow down, take a deep breath and take as long as you need to think about things.<P>I know what it feels like to want to move. The OW is firmly placed in an office almost in view of my house! How can I not see her? I know all the nosey neighbors know what's been going on and my H has been notoriously uncaring about who sees him. I hated this house and couldn't wait to leave, but it made more sense financially for me to stay, so I have for 9 months now. And guess what? I am glad I did. It forced me to process every nit picking little thing inside of me. Every idiosyncrasy of his, every accusation against me, every betrayal, every unknown, every dream. It wasn't easy. It wasn't pleasant, but the worst is behind me.<P>When I was at this stage, people could say whatever they wanted, but I wasn't going to do anything until I was ready and until I knew what I wanted to do. Logic didn't matter. Nothing mattered but feeling the pain and making sense of the madness.<P>What gave me back my sanity was learning the truth, accepting the truth, and taking some power over the situation. I felt like this thing was done TO me without my permission. By getting a job, spending time doing things that made me happy, and kicking the OW the hell out of my life, I regained my self- respect and stopped feeling like a victim. <P>For a while it seemed like there was no way out but divorce, and my H and I were in agreement about that. Today he just left here officially asking me to stop the divorce. He's hinted around before, but he came straight out and said it today.<P>So is there hope? There is always hope, but I wouldn't wait around for it to come to you. A successful woman is much more attractive than one who is feeling sorry for herself. <P>As for the law suit, well, it's worth checking out. I'm not a lawyer, but my understanding is that the suit is against her not your H, so it doesn't matter who pursued whom. Although she may not have done anything to you directly, in my opinion if she is calling herself his fiancee that is willful conduct designed to hurt you and succeeded. I don't know if the law will see it that way, but I think it's worth finding out. A suit against her would not affect your settlement with him, so take his offer and get it in writing. Once it's official and legal, THEN sue her! ha!

I have always been a very private person. Even posting here is very strange for me. I cannot stand the thought of all our details of our finances and our marriage being in public record for everyone to read. If I get a disolution it can be done in another county and no details will ever be printed. It will only be with the attorney and someone would have to request it. If I was to sue the OW then she would have to testify and I would have to testify and so would my husband. I can only imagine everything that would come up. That is just too much for me to think about even though I think she deserves to go through hell for what she has done. If I go through a messy divorce I don't get any more than if I just settle. I do have a good attorney who I trust very much. My daughter is also an attorney and she goes to the appointments with me. And my husband is right now being very upfront. This is a no fault state and he is really offering more than he has to. He is not trying to hide assets or anything. But I know him very well and if I was to dig in and fight he would hide assets and become vindictive and I might end up much worse. I am also thinking that maybe it is better for them financially if we don't divorce and maybe that's why he is in no hurry. I know that he would never marry HER without a prenuptual agreement. He has told our daughter he never would remarry without one and without her seeing it. Anyway, one of my friends said she hated to say it but it's cheaper to keep her and maybe that is what he is thinking. In the meantime, she gets everything and I get nothing more than I would have if I was divorced. Either way I can't keep him from spending money on HER since there is more than enough for both of us but it should be OURS and none should be HERS! I guess I am just leaning more and more towards going with the disolution and trying to live some kind of a life without this constant pain and humiliation. You see it didn't take HER long to report my phone call to my husband and of course he rushes to her aid. In 30 days I could be divorced if I go with disolution. Something must feel better than this.

I can see your reasons for wanting to keep things clean and private. I am also a very private person, so I've had to weigh the options of revenge, punishment for the OW, and hope for a successful case so that other wives could have a chance at some fairness or keeping my shame private. In my case, the H is pushing for me to sue the OW because he hates the way she has disrupted our lives, so that makes it a bit different. The truth of our situation can't really be hidden, so taking it to court is just a matter of degree. Is it a matter of public record where anyone can see it (which I didn't mind because it shows the world what a jerk my STBX is) or do just our friends know?<P>I wanted a quick divorce, as I think we all do, but it's dragged out for one reason or another for 11 months. It was supposed to be over in 90 days! I think it's usually best to wait. What do you have to lose? You may have a clearer perspective on things if some of the pain has subsided and some time has passed. I know i see things a lot differently than the day I filed, three months after I filed, and even six months after I filed.

Sorry, but I agree with your daughter. The drug out revenage divorces actually end up hurting you more then your husband or the OW. My ex went for one of these divorces and the Judge reacted with anger towards him, not sympathy. It was definately NOT to his advantage to go this route. If you were to pursue a bitter divorce the same could happen to you, not to mention the relationship you have with your daughter could be strained. My guess is that your spending a lot of time obsessing and checking into what your husband and the OW are doing and that is causing you greater pain. I do think it's sad that he moved her so close to you.

It is true that I am still having a lot of problems with obsessing over what my husband is doing with HER. It hurts me to know and sometimes I manage not to do it, but alot of times I don't. When I find out they have gone away again or someone has seen them out to dinner again or he's introduced her to someone else again it still hurts like it did at first. It's like every time it happens, I feel him slip away a little bit more. Why can't I get it through my head that he is already gone?

It just takes time. I think we all had an obsessed stage where we are wondering about every single detail. The not knowing is a killer! For most of us, it does get better. I don't even think about what my H is doing anymore. Don't even care.

Bonnie,<P>Thanks for agreeing because I really value my relationship with my daughter and feel I have to at least try and respect her views on this. She has been really supportive in so many ways but she just doesn't see why I would go through a messy divorce when I will get no more money if I do. I agree with her but there is still a part of me that wants to make him and HER, especially her pay for what they have done.<P>Popeye,<P>He has been out of the house for the final time for 18 months. Why can't I let it go? Should it take this long?<P>

I think it would be unfair to say, " 'This' is how long you have and if you are not functionally normally after that period of time, there is something wrong with you." Everyone has their own time line. Your support network, your family dynamics, the presence of an OP, your work commitments, your past life experiences, your moral views, your level of commitment, the length of your conflict, all these things play a part in the recovery phase and will influence how long it takes. <P>For me, I couldn't even begin to rage or heal until I knew the truth. Once it was out, I was on an obsessive rampage. I had to know everything. Then it got to a point where facts didn't make a difference. I decided it was time to look at my options and Do something. When I got into that phase, it just got better and better. There were hard moments and days, but it is that "small step by small step" mentality that saw me through.<P>And you will get there too. <P>I didn't want to make it easy for my H to walk out on me. I told him I was going to drop the divorce action and he'd have to file against me if he wanted it. I thought he should take at least some of the responsibility for ruining our marriage, but in the end I felt it was a petty thing. It didn't serve anyone really and just dragged things out- and like in your case, it wasn't going to get me a better settlement, maybe only more resentment.<P>I'm glad I did this because it's hard enough to deal with the mess he created. Why add to the bad feelings? My STBX and I have a pretty good relationship now. We can talk to each other and (mostly) trust each other. He is wanting to come back home, so I think my Plan A did what it was supposed to do- preserve good feelings.

Popeye,<BR>I am so happy for you that your husband is thinking of moving back in. How I wish mine was! At least I do have some good days now. For two years I had none.

Discarded,<P>your situation is by far worse than mine, my x had a fling with a teenage girl - I was 40, he was 42 at the time, she was 19. But I do know the feelings of betrayal, and I recognize the rage, and the obsession. It is so hard to deal with, and so so self-destructive.<P>You have alot to work out, but I would highly recommend one of the DivorceCare groups for you - I looked forward all week to those meetings - frankly, everyone in my group was dealing with infidelity. You need that kind support right now - face to face. You need to be able to vent like this with people in your situation, and see what other people are going through too - it really helps. I can't stress that enough - and the videos explain the stages. It is a heck of alot easier to deal with your feelings, when you understand they are normal.<P>And as far as the OW goes, you keep your head up high there and don't give her the upper hand. Look at it from her perspective.<P>Frankly, people are gossipy, and can be very cruel. What do you bet it was a catty thing that the woman mentioned the "engagement ring" to her - what a better way to point out, that she is being paid to be a mistress by a married man? Here is this woman, who for 8 years, has been waiting around for him to leave you. She has accepted being a mistress, and being pointed at, laughed at, and snubbed, yes, you KNOW she has been snubbed by decent society. His family would have to accept the woman your husband claims to love - but how uncomfortable must it be for her, to have all the wives of your husband's business peers give her an icy reception. Every single wife would view her as a threat, and think "my God, she may go after my husband, if she sees financial gain." She has let her children know, that a person can be bought and paid for. I hope she doesn't have any daughters. Not a good life lesson for them.<P>She is not a person to be envied, I would venture to say, she is panicking, she may be 20 years younger, but she is aging - and she seems to be the kind of woman who has always relied on her looks. My guess is that she has given your husband an ultimatum.<P>Keep your head up high. YOU are still the wife. Keep your dignity, whatever you do. She wants the respectable comfortable position of being your husband's wife. She is dreaming - she can never have that - no matter how many baubles, or fancy cars - and even if she does become his wife, she will never have the respect of your husband's business peers, of your social network, nor the trust of his family. She will never be fully accepted, and will always be laughed at behind her back.<P>The respect will always be yours - people right now may be uncomfortable around you, that is typical, but not permanent, but I'm sure they have to bite their tongues around her - and I bet any unavoidable conversations are short and icy. Remember that - this may be a situation that you can't do anything about, but you can control how you deal with it.<P><BR>Take care, it will get better.

Thanks so much for all you said. I am sorry for you sitation. Posting here has helped me to at least keep my focus on that it will get better. I don't think it will ever get all the way better but I think it can't stay this way forever. I am still really thinking of moving. I wish what you were saying about how SHE is received were true, but I don't think it is. Many of my H's business associates were on their second wives. Some I outright knew for sure had been their mistresses. It didn't make any difference. And before this destroyed my life even I tended to ignore it and I don't think I was ever rude to one of them. I wish I could say I had been! And they were just as accepted as anyone. Who cares anymore? People just say it's not my business. Or they say who knows the whole story? Or worse yet who knows why he left? You see people do always seem to assume that they must have left for some reason. Especially if the man is well liked and successful, they just don't think a man would dump his loyal wife without a good reason, even if that is exactly what he did. Even before I found out the reason so many people knew is that she didn't exactly hide things. The reason why, and she told me this was that she said she wouldn't live a secret life! And once I found out she was just totally open with it. Told her side of the story which was, oh he has been unhappy for years and years and he just desperately wants to get out but his clingy insecure pathetic wife won't let him go. Can you see why I feel so humiliated? And the way that I acted after I found out reinforced HER view some poeple such as his family. I did beg them over and over to help me and leaned on them a lot. They started to tell me to just move on, he isn't happy and you have to let him go. And others started to tell me that too. This tells me that they at least believe some of what SHE says. And they don't have to vacation with her for God's sake! Oh well, just rattling on.<BR>

Hi again,<P>Discarded, when a man goes for a yoga instructor, 20 years his junior, I doubt anyone is thinking there is something wrong with you. And it is just a line "he was unhappy with her for years" everyone knows that.<P>I truly believe she is panicking, discarded, I am 43, and I see my looks fading - I won't say it is difficult for me, but I am aware of age taking its toll. I am also very thankful that I never relied on my looks, and feel sorry for the women who do. The beauty of youth is so fleeting. How horrible it must be for her, to have "invested" these last critical wrinkleless years landing a big fish, and starting to get desperate that maybe he will tire of her. This is the game she is playing. For eight years, athletic sex wasn't enough to make your husband leave you - remember that.<P>Who knows, maybe it isn't time yet for you to throw in the towel? But you really do need to take care of yourself and your mental state. Make decisions when you can think more clearly. You really do sound in your emails like I did - I remember that horrible desperation. And you feel like an idiot after you do these things. Don't let it make you feel humiliated. I almost called my girl's mother "to tell on her" - she was my age. Can you believe I was going to do something so pointless? Now, I wonder what did I want her mother to do? Ground her??? I see I shouldn't have focused my rage on her - but I did for a long time.<P>Your ego is taking an undeserved beating here. And it affects everything you do, every thought you have. I'll be thinking of you. <P>

No I truly do think it is hopeless. The fact is she is not pressuring him, I dont think about marriage. I think she is too smart for that. She took great pleasure in telling me several times she she never asked him to leave me or do any of the things he did for her. She wanted to rub it in that he did it all on his own, I guess. I won't say that she is not very beautiful because God help me, she is. But she also seems very confident. Says she doesn't need to be married and won't even think about it for several years but if she ever does marry it will be to my H. Now she is saying she will marry him but not for seven years. I think that maybe it is true that this is what attracted my husband to her. I think it is a source of a lot of her power. I have tried to show him that I can be too but he isn't paying attention anymore. I really expected people to shun her. What hurts the most is that life just goes on without me in the picture. Did people shun your H? How have they acted?<P>

Hi again,<P>Not overt pressure, maybe, but you are right, she is smart. I am making sweeping generalizations here, but I do think that someone strong and successful like your husband obviously is, would be smitten be someone in her situation, young, fit, lovely and supposedly so independent. But Discarded - strong, confident, self-reliant women, don't go screw around with married men for years, and don't accept being setup in houses with cars. Mothers who care about their children, don't introduce a marriend man into their lives. A woman who isn't planning on being married as soon as the ink dries on the divorce decree does not sport an engagement ring, and talk about her fiance. I can hear it now, "But, giggle, I didn't want to get married for seven years...giggle, he MADE me! Aren't I wonderful?" Discarded, she is as manipulative as any 1940s Joan Crawford Jezebel can be. SHe has milked your husband, and he doesn't see it. He may be so smitten that it is hopeless at this time, but don't think it was about you. If you called her bluff, and told her you will divorce him in seven years - and point out how that would be good, since he will be on Medicare by then, and you know, it might be good to have someone so young and healthy around in case his health fails, and he needs a full-time nurse, I bet you'd see a different side to her; or that you would remain the respected married-to-the-end, Mrs. Tracy, and let your husband play Spenser to her Kate Hepburn, you would get another story - this is not a love story that transcends its beginnings. There is a shallowness to her, that motherhood usually knocks right out of a woman. But not in her case. And I understand how you, as a scrupulous woman cannot compete with an unscrupulous one when the husband is the willing pawn. Just don't let her manipulate you, or let her callousness get to you (I know its easy to say, and very hard to do).<P>And my situation was a little different, my husband flaunted the girl all over the place - I was livid over it (my parents described me as "bonkers") - but it hurt him in the long rung. Of course it helped that she looked about 16, but people were aghast that he could be so stupid. Our boys were 3 and 5 at the time, so that made him even more of the bad guy. <P>She was using my husband, it made her feel grown up. It did wonders for her ego that she could actually "win" my husband - thats all it ever was to her. They were together for 18 months. <P>I didn't think I could be happy again, or that I would recover. And I do know it is easier being younger, as it is easier for each decade younger, like there is more of a future to look forward to or something. I don't really know. But this is going to sound trite, you are as young as you feel, and as my 95 year old grandmother said, "oh, to be 80 again..." your life is not over. It is just changing. And you do have alot to be thankful for - if you go to one of the groups, you will see how much worse it is, if there are financial woes. You don't have that. God will take care of you - you are a good person going through a terrible time.