Hey, you soon to be divorced people, WAKE UP! You better make sure you've put everything into it. Don't get me wrong here, I pretty well know most who read and write to the board are the spouses that are trying and you can't control what the other partner is doing. I'm talking to that rare person who might just be glancing at the board who thinks they have it so bad. My exH thought he was so sure he knew what he was doing, probably more to the truth he thought he would always have the option to come back. Well, after being seperated for 9 months we got a divorce. During that 9 months we tried to get back together twice, and then after the divorce we tried once more. He wasn't interested. That is until he realized that I really wasn't interested in giving him another chance to SAY he would try. For the last 5 months I have semi-got on with my life. I told him I wasn't interested and didn't do anything with him. After the first couple of months I thought he'd give up. He probably thought I would give in. Now five months later this whole last year+ has finally hit him. I see the change and I believe in the change, but I wished he hadn't waited so long. I had begged and pleaded with him to care for years and now, he wants the forever. The bad thing about most of this is that when I got on with my life I found someone that I am more comfortable around and I would trust with every ounce of my heart. I know there are some things my ex can offer me that are better than what the other person can. But this person has my trust, which is one thing my ex never did. That was mainly because he wasn't ever sure he was in the right relationship, and I felt it every day. Now because he wants to be here, I truly believe he would be. The main problem here now is that I could probably have the same relationship with my ex as the other guy, but the other guy hasn't hurt me. If my ex would have came to this conclusion years ago, I would still be married to this day. Because honestly, that's all it would have taken for my marriage to survive. IF, he just would have decided he wanted to be here instead of having to be.

Gin,<P>You are so right. They just don't realize the potential and how "new" it could be and feel if they would only come out of the fog. <BR>I know my W's affair is going to blow up in her face. She's moving back to her hometown (to her mother's house!) with our 4 year old daughter. This 42 year old PBFH has been having an affair with her old HS crush who's a well known derelict; only trouble is her Ma doesn't know it yet and all she does is lie, lie, lie. She went up last weekend and must have given her Ma some **** and bull story about where she was staying Saturday night. Her Mercedes was seen at his place Sunday morning. This is a house occupied by 2 or 3 guys. I don't think she's giving them advice on how to stencil their Living Room (our home is fully stenciled, thanks to her mother). When her Ma finds out who it is, she's going to explode!<P>She doesn't know how good she has it with me. <BR>If only she could remember all the nice things she said to me and how "I was so good for her."<P>Instead, she's partying her [censored] off with a bunch of old gigalos.<P>Sick man!

Man can I relate, I tried for 8 years to get my husband to realize the things that were wrong in our marriage and tried everything on my own to change them, but he couldn't see it - then he just assumed that instead of getting help, like counseling, that his following me everywhere and buying me a dozen roses everyday was going to make up for it - it only ticked me off more and made me realize he wasn't going to change forever it was just to get me back there... So any of you who are still together - trying TOGETHER is the answer, you can't do it alone.

DAlienated,<P>But he "was" trying wasn't he? I don't mean to attack you in anyway just want to give you an "opposite point of view". When we first began having problems over a year ago (or rather when my wife first approached me about our problems - I like so many other men, was blind to the problems and too focused on work and supporting our family), it was like someone hit me over the head with a bat. My knee-jerk reaction was to shift into over drive and show her how much I did in fact love her.<P>I too refused counseling, at first. Men tend to think that once they see a problem, they can fix it themselves (its just in our genes). My wife, like you, looked at everything I did as "fake" and "it wouldn't last". Well here we are a year and a half later and I feel the same I did the day after she "blew up" at me (and continue to do for her). We eventually did go for counseling, but that was unsuccessful because she did not believe in anything I did then, either. Truth was, all the things I was (and am) doing, I was doing from my heart. Looking back I can see how much I changed in such a short period of time and I can understand why my wife did not believe me. But, I knew that I "had" to change. I asked God to help me with that change and I began to change more and more everyday.<P>Back in January she even went on to say that "now you are the husband I have always wanted", but she still did not believe in my changes! All that I am saying is that if your husband is making any kind of effort, don't be so quick to "write it off". Take a chance and trust that what he may be doing may not be the exact "right" thing to help, but he is TRYING. Look at how many men don't even want to try.<P>If you accept his gifts and displays of love and reassure him he is doing OK, you may then be able to get him to the counseling you need. I know it is hard, but sometimes you just got to trust.<P>Ya hit a nerve with me, sorry if this came out confrontational.<P>God Bless.

So Tired:<P>I'm glad you responded with your true feelings. It is good to hear a male's perspective on this. <P>I was in a similar situation where I was going to counseling and my x would go unwillingly but do other things and I too felt he wasn't doing enough at the time. This was before I even knew he wanted out of the marriage. We are now divorced and looking back I see that we both were trying in our own ways. Unfortunately, neither of us saw that and it is now over.<P>I can only hope to learn from this and know that everyone is different in how they approach things. I wish we knew then what we know now.<P>Oh well.<P>Jennifer