Married 25 years. Handled bills. Have been living beyond means. Lied to husband about extent of debt. Confessed. Have talked to Financial Counsellors, Accountant and Credit Bureau. Going to have to take one of husband's IRA to pay off debts. He's angry - rightly so. Told me he can never trust me again. Says that he wants a divorce. He says I might as well kill myself because I have killed him. Asked him to go to counseling with me and get professional help. No response. What can I do?

Whew Barb. This is not anything that I will be very good with. Really just wanted you to know that someone cared.<p>I feel sure that his comment about suicide was just made out of that first blinding heat of self-righteous anger. So, please, for God's sake, do not take him literally!<p>You did not say how long ago you confessed the debt problem. If it was fairly recent, give him more time. And remember that you love him and act accordingly even when he is bitter, angry or hurtful to you.<p>If he will not go, then perhaps single counseling for you is an excellent option. Besides being good for you personally, it will also help prove to him your commitment and willingness to work on your marital problems.<p>Good luck, and hope that things work out.<p>Maria

Maria, thanks for being there. I told him about a week ago. At first he was okay - just well, we'll get out of it.<p>After having a week to brood on it, the anger is just getting worse. He worked today and came in - ate silently and then went to bed shutting the door in my face.<p>It doesn't help that I have to leave tomorrow for a week on business. He's a brooder and it will just fester and grow.<p>I'm definitely going to get single counseling. I don't know what else to do. Any prayers will be appreciated.<p>

Barb,<p>I know it's probably "hard" to tell you what your husband "should do", but he needs to realize that overspending - just like eating too much, drinking too much, or using drugs - is an addiction. Not to be insulting here, but your overspending is a sickness (not name-calling here, I have it too!) He needs to understand and treat you like someone who has any other addiction.<p> If you are already seeking counseling for your "problem", then I think you are doing your part. Whether he wants to go to counseling or not, he must come to grips with the fact that you were unable to control yourself, and did not do this to hurt him.<p> Would you leave him if he had a problem with alcohol, or food? Sure, these problems can be hard to live with, but if you admit your "sickness", and get help for it, he should be understanding and accept it as an addiction, not a personal slap in the face.<p>Just my two cents...<p>Val (The Husband)

<br>I have to disagree with Val on this one. I don't go for any of the whole trend of calling what was once (correctly I think) recognized as simply irresponsible behavior.<br>A person may become addicted to overspending, alcohol or a hundred other things. But to call any one of these a sickness or disease is, in my view, part of a very mistaken outlook that absolves the individual in question of responsibility for their actions.

Barb,<p>I know what you are going through. I lied to my husband for a long time about money. I knew how he was with money and and i was afraid to tell him when we were getting low on money. He also always wanted the bill paid on time. If i did not have enough money to pay the bills and he would ask me if they were paid i would tell him yes and though that i could cover it and get it paid with our next check and it always seemed that something else would always come up and it would not get paid. Don't ge me wrong my husband did not abuse me but i have always hated it when he would be mad at me. When things would come out in the open i would admit to it and tell him that it would never happen again but it always did. I did have good intentions of keeping all of the promises that i had made. I know now that I have a problem and i am working on making things better, but in my situation it may be too late. My husband filed for divorce in august and out divorce beame final on 11/19. I am working really hard on getting him back. Sometimes i think tha the is getting really close to coming back but he says that he is afraid that things will get bad again and that he will have to leave. He is afraid that i will go back to my old ways again. But i do not and will not go back that way again. I will do everything in my power not to. We have 2 girls and it breaks my heart to see them miss their dad. He comes around all of the time and even stays at the house on the weekends. I love my husband very much and do not want to hut him anymore. My family is the most important thing to me. so good luck and han in there.<p>angel

Bruce, (and Barb )<p> You're right. I didn't mean to absolve Barb, or anybody with a habit from ALL blame. (Generally, I too, detest the modern notion that we're not to blame for our actions.) But I would add that I would be very hesitant to look down upon someone who has a problem with food, money, alcohol or sex. (yes, I've heard there's people addicted to sex out there. Wish I could have the chance to see if I could resist! <g> )<p><br><Warning! Ramble-Mode is ON!><p> My brother is an alcoholic, I have a friend who is morbidly obese, and God knows what problems I have. (We have 10 cats, enough said?) My wife is a "workaholic". I think she's genuinely unable to work less than she does. <p> Maybe what I should have said instead of "sickness" or "addiction" is a weakness of willpower (in a given area) that makes it very difficult - if not impossible - to resist certain excesses and temptations. <p> The point I as trying to make is that Barb's husband needs too see her overspending as a condition that she may not be able to "just stop doing it". He needs to lovingly coach her through her "cure", as opposed to heaping blame and hate upon her. It IS his duty to support her emotionally through this and all problems. <p> Bruce, You and I are probably both quite "politically incorrect" as far as our "conservative" views on who's to blame for a person's actions. (I'll bet I'd like your view's on homosexuality, etc.) But since we all have problems, I think that a husband and wife should do their best to bolster the other wherever their "weaknesses" lie. Maybe Barb's husband is better at managing finances, and she is better than he is at some other area.<p> I'll also throw out the thought that maybe Barb's overspending is just a symptom, or reaction to something else that is going on her her life. (Maybe a need that is going unmet?) I know that I am more likely to spend money on a "toy" for myself when I'm feeling particulary unfulfilled - even angry at my wife. Sometimes you hear of women going out for "retail therapy" (shopping), or a man going out and getting a bit more intoxicated than is normal or acceptable. This is also why movies that take us away to a fantasy life are so popular (Star Wars, etc.)<p><ramble-mode off><p>Hope I struck more of a middle-ground stance with this addition.<p>Val (The Husband)<br>Vvetter@Tribune.com

Val,<p>Thanks for the clarification. I think we're pretty much on the same page. And, yes, I'm about as politically incorrect as you can get.<br>And I wholeheartedly agree with your point about not looking down on those with the problems described, or anyone else for that matter.

Thanks for the responses. Angela, you put our problems much more concisely than I did when I posted them originally. <p>The money has not gone on jewelry, wardrobes, etc. I wish it had - I could explain it better to him! It has primarily gone on just day to day living expenses. We have also helped my disabled mother. <p>My husband never wanted to hear that we did not have the money for something. My joke has always been that he thought there was this unlimited money tree growing in the back yard. <p>No, I'm not trying to shift the blame. I'm responsible for not pushing the issue when we needed something and telling him we were running too low. I'm responsible for lying to him and telling him that we were doing okay. I'm responsible for not telling him when I made a MAJOR mistake in our check book. I wrote down one paycheck twice and spent it. <p>We were holding our own until recently when his entire company was hit with a 20% pay cut and several weeks off work without pay. <p>I kept thinking that I could catch up and get ahead and pay the bills off. One thing after another and it never happened.<p>The bills came to the house and my H never opened or looked at one. I should have shown them to him. <p>While I was out of town this past week, he told me he wants a divorce. I came home last night - I just couldn't concentrate anymore at work. When he came in, he did not speak to me at all. Just ate his dinner and went to bed. He left for work a few minutes ago - again without speaking.<p>I'm seeing a counsellor at noon today. Just barely hanging on. God, the guilt is killing me. I accept total responsibility. Not trying to make excuses just trying to respond realistically with what has happened.<p>Please let me know if you - any of you - have any other thoughts for me. I'm going to explore all avenues with the counselor. How to handle my problems in all areas - including overspending, etc. <p>I don't know about this being a sickness (disease or addiction) but I do know that I am sick at heart and to the depths of my being about this whole thing.<p><p>

Barb,<p> I think I may owe you an apology. I was thinking you were spending on extravagant things, and you were only trying to run the household.<p> Maybe that's why your H is taking it so hard. He feels inadequate to earn enough money to support the home.(?)<p> In my experience, if you put your mind to it, there is almost always someplace you can get some money from. IRA's, loans on 401k plans, refinancing the house, etc. True, you hate to "rob from your future to pay off your present", but something has to be done.<p> Seeing as you were only trying to run the household, his wanting to leave you is really a huge over-reaction. He probably also doesn't want to fees up to part of the blame being his. If he stuck his head in the sand and never looks at bills, how can he complain when things go wrong? <p> Sure, you made a mistake with the checkbook. You probably weren't as honest with him as you could have been - by trying to protect him. The finances are HIS responsability too.<p> I think you should try to BOTH get to not only a marriage counsellor, but a financial one as well. (I would say the marriage counsellor first, you don't want to throttle each other in front of the financial counsellor! )<br> <p> Yes, he's hurt. He's being very short-sighted though. <p>Val<br>(The Husband)

Barb: I can really understand living beyond ones means. My husband and I have been married for 22 years and just like you for many years I paid all the bills, when they came my husband would never ever look at them. I had complete control of all of the money. However, just like you I overspent, mostly just to keep peace. I knew my husband didn't want to hear, "honey, we're running short on money and I can't pay this or I can't pay that", so, I used credit cards for way too many things. Finally, it caught up with me and I had to "confess" to my husband. He didn't handle it well at first but when I explained that I was only trying to protect him from any worry, he came around. <p>Now every month when I pay the bills, I discuss everything that's going out with him, what we're saving, etc. If he wants to do something and we don't have the money, I just tell him and he's become amazingly good at being able to handle it. <p>I think Val hit the nail on the head when he said, the situation makes your husband feel inadequate. Good Luck and I'll be praying for you. Lisa

Lisa, thanks. Sounds almost identical. I saw a counselor at noon today - mainly because I'm about to have a breakdown here! Nothing new that I didn't already know. The one thing that happened is that I told my husband I was going to see a counselor and asked him if he would go. (I sent him a message to work). He called me - which I totally didn't expect. Told me he couldn't go and kinda laughed and said well, I could go and check it out. I asked him if he would go with me later and he didn't outright say no. I made an appointment for us on Tuesday. I don't know if he will go or not.<p>Is this progress or not? Wednesday night - he just said that he wanted a divorce. Last night he didn't even speak to me.<p>Please keep the prayers coming. I have asked God to touch my husband's heart and to let him know that I didn't do anything evil or bad with the money, I'm not hiding the money, and I do not want a divorce. I asked God to send a miracle. I love my husband and am heartsick about this.<p>Yes, we have other problems too. And, this was just the straw that broke the camel's back. I had asked my husband to go to a counselor with me last summer and he refused.<p>The counselor was not a very forceful, strong personality - kinda soft spoken. I don't know how my husband would take to that. And, since he did not do anything - no real advice just that we would need to come up with options to pay off the bills (I already knew that), I'm not sure whether or not to try to get my husband there. I know that we need help on the financial front and the marriage front, too.<br>

Counseling will help with your feelings...give you a "safe" place to talk about them. Counseling will NOT tell you what to do. That is NOT what a counselor is suppose to do and a good one will not do that.<p>Debt counseling with a debt conseling specialist will help you establish a realistic budget. You must live by the budget for it to help you. The average American household can find money in their spending that can be saved, used to pay off debt, etc. We "think" we need more than we do.<p>You and your husband should do the bills/checkbook together. That way, you both know what bills are paid when, how much they are, how much money is spent on what. Then neither of you is dependent on the other to handle the finances. You can learn responsible spending habits and he can see where the money goes. This will also help establish trust again (which will take a long time).<p>I learned all this from experience. My husband filed for bankruptcy at 22 when he was unexpectedly discharged from the Navy for a medical reason. He was so upset by it, he became very frugal with money. I met my husband 4 years later and he was still very frugal. I, on the other hand, was 22 and $20,000 in debt and not keeping up very well. Together, we worked on a budget, found money by spending less on clothes, entertainment, food, etc. This meant we rarely went out for lunch or dinner, bought clothes only when we absolutely needed to, no dry cleaning (wash by hand), cut grocery costs (less meat, cheaper meat, store generic brands, grocery outlets), and moved into a small inexpensive apt. Six months later, we paid off the first bill ($80 a month). Three months after that (last March), we moved into a small house in a less desirable neighborhood to save rent. In August, we paid off his car and sold it (down to one car and we commute to work together - saving $250 a month on car payment and $90 a month insurance). We used the money from the car to pay two small credit cards. In the last 15 months, we have paid one loan, one car, 2 credit cards. During this time, we bought nothing on credit at all . Even our wedding last August was 100% cash but no honeymoon. Now 15 months later, we are buying our first house and we have enough money to live comfortably. Our goal is 100% debt free except the mortage and to pay an additional $100 a month to the mortgage. All it takes is looking objectively at what you buy and what you really need, setting a budget and debt repayment goal and sticking to both of them, creativity, and commitment. Show your husband your commitment to manage the money better with his help.<p>GOOD BOOK (we learned it all from this book)<br>Debt Free Living - by Larry Burkett<br>$10 at Amazon.com