In answer to your question about the big "D"<BR>am I set on it? Yes, He hasn't changed..has he said he would..yes..but like I said..I don't trust him..he even asked me..if HE could quit his job and move home?? I was like..I don't know..CAN YOU?? I mean sure if he WANTS to quit his job..and look for another one..thats up to him..I can't make that choice for him..but I want him to do it for him...not me..He's already shown me I wasn't important enough for him to do that..<P>I was reading something today that really hit me hard..He keeps saying he's changed..<BR>(I haven't seen it) but..this book said something about when you call ppl names and come back w/ "I'm sorry I didn't mean to say that"..whats really meant is.."I'm sorry I didn't want you to know thats what I really think about you" and looking at it from that perspective..it's like..if thats how he really feels..(and I honestly think he does, since he's said them all before..thats more abuse..and I don't need it..I mean..the "slut, Whore, f* b*tch, I hate you's"..I mean<BR>I know he's hurting..but I don't need that..<P>He's like.."well I just hate to take money away from you and the kids, away from the household, but you'll have to give me at least so much a week so I can get christmas<BR>and birthdays and such, but I know what your struggling w/ and I don't want to put anymore<BR>burdens on you" and then goes on to say..<BR>"well, we can continue as things are now..I'll stay on the road and we stay married while you work on these things and you can call me when you need to talk" geeeeeee whats changed there???? and HOW is that HELPING ME??? It's not..its manipulative and trying to control by money..<BR>He STILL doesn't have a clue..I don't care about the friggin money..<P>He was saying something today about how he's going to need some money to pay for a storage shed so he will have some place to put his stuff since he can't leave it here..and how is he going to be able to support TWO households?? (he's been doing that for 9 years) I really wanted to scream..but I didn't I invited him to stay for dinner..<P>A girlfriend of mine came over today..she was in tears, she's been seeing this man whose wife had left him..and told him good-bye today..told him he needs to go back and work on his marriage..give her another chance..see if they can make a go of it. She hated to let him go..but it's something she's really struggled with and has tried many times over the past months..I hurt for both of them..knowing how much they both hurt right now..but she knows it's for the best..for both of them..I just hugged her..told her she'll be okay and yes I know it hurts like hell right now..but in time the hurt won't be so bad..and I told her to let God heal the hurt and comfort her right now..and to know that if she needs to talk..I'm here for her..<BR>I even gave her a teddy bear to cry on. so her and I both had one..<P>H asked me after she left..so what did you name your teddy bear that you were holding so tight out there earlier? I was like..it's not my teddy bear..it's our sons...he was like..Oh..<P>Anyway...yes..to me right now..D is the only option I feel I have at this point in order to protect me from the verbal stuff right now..

ThornedRose,<P>I hope I don't sound too confusing here, just got out of bed and I still have a little fog in my head.<P>I was just reading something about respect yesterday, <A HREF="http://www.family.org/docstudy/newsletters/a0011702.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.family.org/docstudy/newsletters/a0011702.html</A> , and while I realize that it speaks more to someone in my situation, it does talk about sticking to your decision and not caving in, therefore demanding respect from him that your are serious. Stick to your guns, so to speak, tell him that you're sorry, but this is the way that it will be. I don't know how often he calls or e-mails, but I would start limiting responses and discussions about the issue, for what more is there to discuss? He knows what you want and need, so instead of asking whether or not he should quit his job, if it's what he wants, then he should just do it. Not because you asked him to, not because he asked if that's what you wanted or asked for your permission, but because he realizes that he must. Period. Actions speak louder than words, right? Don't cave in, (this coming from someone that can't go 3 days without calling his wife, do as I say, not as I do ), but I've realized elsewhere that you can finally say NO!!, and feel good about it. I think that if you finally push him away, and keep him there, he will eventually re-evaluate what he wants in life and why. He needs to wake up and realize that he can't push you around anymore, hence his statement "well, we can continue as things are now..I'll stay on the road and we stay married while you work on these things and you can call me when you need to talk". That doesn't work for you anymore. Sounds to me like he has always been able to get his way in the marriage before, and it's time for him to learn that it's not all about him anymore. Stay strong.<P>I guess I didn't know of the verbal abuse that you've endured because of him in the past. In 12 years with my wife, I have never used any of those words towards her, not even close. Sounds like he too has some problems internally, not only with alcohol, but something from his upbringing that didn't create a sense of respect for others, could he be just like his dad? Is he recreating his parent's marriage? Did he have a childhood where his dad was never around, possibly always out with the guys at the bar?<P>Sounds like it's time for a change. Sounds like you need to withdraw from him as much as possible, and let things take their course. Let God work on him for a while.<P>Ever been here? <A HREF="http://www.guideposts.org/" TARGET=_blank>http://www.guideposts.org/</A> I like the positive thinking and dialy prayer, start my day here.<P>------------------<BR>I am in this situation for a very good reason, it just took time to get over my own self-pity and understand why.

He hasn't had a computer the past couple months at work. So there haven't been e-mails..or many phone calls..right now he's taking time off from work..to "talk"...<BR>he came over today..I made some major progress in the other area this morning, <BR>I wrote a letter to my dad..3 pages at last printing..but I've added more to it since then..this is what every survivor works towards..the ability to confront the abuser..<BR>and let them know the damage they caused..the hurt the anger..everything..H asked what I've been "thinking" this morning..so I handed him<BR>the letter..and let him read it..he cried..<BR>said he wanted to comfort me..but didn't know how..(didn't even come over and even try and give me a hug) which I really could have used right then..and I wasn't going to ask for..he said, I never knew how much pain you have had all these years..and since your dealing with this right now, I won't talk to you about whats On *MY* mind..since *I AM* the *only* one that seems to be *Bothering* Anyway...*'s used to stress words as he did..I told him..go ahead..lets talk about it..get it out now..he said no, you have to many other things you are dealing with I said..No, lets talk..so we talked..looking at it now..I should have just left it that he read the letter and let that soak into his brain..but he wouldn't have thought about it..because HE wanted to talk about the marriage..I told him I am tired of being condemned by him for every mistake I've ever made..and I don't trust him..and that right now I need to protect myself..since he can't..it was pretty emotional..and I still<BR>don't think he really grasps the pain and hurt, anger, resentment, I have carried all these years..but it was healing being able to write the letter..I still haven't finished it<BR>I want to read it again later..and write more..<P>I need to go..I'll write more later...right now isn't a good time..

Reading your post gave me a great feeling of sorrow, it sounds as though you're feeling pretty low right now, I'm sorry.<P>Writing this letter, although it is something that needs to be done, must be tearing you up inside. You must have great internal strength and conviction to carry through with it, but it must be done in order to go forward.<P>No offense, but you H sounds like a thick headed a$$. When I first read the "bothering" part, I initially thought that he meant talking about your feelings, but I guess he meant that he was the only one willing to talk about the marriage. What "he" needs, what "he" wants to do, that "he" needs answers. Doesn't he realize, that if he would comfort and support you right now, and think nothing of himself or his needs, until you were through this, that it would possibly be the single most important thing that he may ever do for you? Just the story of your marriage, huh? It's funny, as I was similar to him, but I really don't know where, when, or how I learned compassion, but I don't think I had it 4 months ago, and would have probably acted like him. Actually, I was given an eye-opening and thought provoking question to ponder over the weekend, in a forum #16 somewhere, that helped substantially.<P>Take care of yourself, and maybe take a break for a day or two with the letter, give your emotions a break. Immerse yourself in a book, or something, and try to relax mentally.<P>------------------<BR>I am in this situation for a very good reason, it just took time to get over my own self-pity and understand why.

StillPraying, you know..It's okay that he feels that way those are his feelings..and he has to learn to express them also. And even though yes I am hurting and could have used the support..I know that he's not capable of giving that..and I allowed him to express his hurts and anger and what have you..and I take mine to God..and allow God to comfort me..<BR>The way He always has..the way nobody else has..and thats okay..cause I am closer to God because of it..and I know that God wants to touch my h's heart..I guess had I not been here he may have turned to God. So for that I am sorry..I should have just let him deal with it himself. And me deal w/ what I need to..and quit putting everyone elses feelings first..grrrrrrrrrrrrr...one day...but I did stand strong when I felt the manipulation on the money issue..but inside I felt it was more going on..I felt the spiritual battle being fought..It was like God was saying..Which will you choose..trusting me to provide for you..or the money?? and when I stood firm and chose God to provide..I had such an overwhelming sense of peace inside..<BR>I felt joyful..and I wanted to laugh..<BR>Oh and the company H works for...is putting him on a local job..supposed to start next week I think..LOL...very ironic..but I know that "if" he is allowing God to change him..thats the only way I'll be able to really tell..and to see if he will be there as he has said..but I don't trust him..I trust God to teach me and give me wisdom..

Yes, he does have every right to express his feelings, we all do...even if our feelings aren't what others want to hear...they are our feelings. God always has and always will be with you...whether you ask Him for help...or just need someone to listen. He knows what you need before you ask, and what you think before you say it.<P>There is no need to second guess yourself about your H turning to God, all things will come to pass in time, but it isn't our timetable that's at work here, it's His.<P>You are taking a great leap of faith, and you will be rewarded. It may not be today, it may not be tomorrow, but someday you will know. Trust in Him and He will provide, let Him sort out your troubles, let Him guide you in life, and trust in Him. You are his child and He loves you. The feeling of peace that He provides is sometimes almost overwhelming.<P>Ironic? Coincindence? I don't feel that there are any coincidences in life, things happen for a reason. The local job for your H is happening for a reason. But then you knew that.<P>

SP,<P>Yes, I knew that <P>Read the post on forum 16.. <P>A leap of faith is it..stepping out trusting<BR>God will provide all things..

ThornedRose,<BR>So how are you? Talk to your siblings? H?<P>------------------<BR>I am in this situation for a very good reason, it just took time to get over my own self-pity and understand why.

I sent one e-mail out to my oldest brother..<BR>asking for prayer..and explained why I need to do what I need to do..haven't talked to the other two yet..but thats okay...I don't know if I will or not..talked to H a little bit..but not to much...he's out apartment hunting today..

Good for you. Hopefully you will get some support from those closest to you, even if not from everyone. <P>You know that He will always stand by you, and I'll try to help as much as possible in either forum.<P>Take care.

Those closest to me are in God's family..<BR>not my earthly family..and they are my support group right now..those I will spend eternity with <P>If my brother isn't ready thats okay..I can do all things in Christ which strengthen me <BR>

Again, I marvel at your strength in God, I have a tendency to become "wish-washy", (is that really a word? Sounds more like, "Hey my car's dirty, I "wishy-washy"!), sorry, I have a peculiar sense of humor. No one ever knows what I will say or do, or when, which is fine with me as I am far from the personality of most people. I have a tendency to always be happy, well, at least recently and before "the day", but life's too short to be in a bad mood. Now, where was I, got a little sidetracked, see the time? For some reason, I pop up at 4:30 a.m. Central everyday, here I am at 5:15 on a Saturday. Got sidetracked again...<P>Um, oh yeah, I was admiring your faith...He wants to be your parent and your very best friend in life. He wants appreciation and love, but he also wants to hear of your problems and sorrow. He is a very kind and loving God, and thankfully for me, very patient. For you, this OM may be one of his blessings, someone to support you and physically hold you when that's what you need, your H may not understand, but this man may be a gift for you in your time of need. If you ask for others, they will appear. I don't know where you live or the size of the community, but are there any support groups in the area? Your T may know of some, or there may be some and you aren't interested. He will provide anything that you need in life, and it'll be interesting to see how the situation w/H unfolds in the near future. Amazing how after 9 years, he was just coincidentally re-located close to home. This will give him an opportunity to be close to you, but not close to you. Should get the old gears 'a turnin'in his mind. Just sit back and watch God work His miracles! Looks like things may start going your way, you deserve it, be patient. It will take time to trust H and his intentions again, don't worry about it. You have other things to worry about, and if it is to happen, it will in time. Stay strong in your convictions and in yourself. You CAN do all things in Christ, and He will provide for you.<P>I currently have a new book that appears to be awesome, full of tests and exercises for H, very well written. I am watching this latest in #16, I didn't recommend it as I don't know this persons true affiliation with the person of topic, don't know how close they are, and this is more for spouses. Maybe I'll jump back to my thread and list it, if you want you can buy it, and have it for the day that H asks. I believe that he will start asking questions very soon, maybe it's just a feeling that I have, maybe it's a premonition, (? spelling??), but when he does, you need to send him away with a book, but you need to wait for him to start asking, and you will know that he is sincere, have faith in this. Tell him what my wife told me, that you need someone who truly understands YOU in life, if you have, tall him again when he asks what he can do, it will sink in. You must believe that things are changing for the better, even if you don't think that it is possible for H to change, God will work on his heart, touch him with the Holy Spirit, bringing him close to you geographically while you keep him away emotionally sounds like part of the plan.<P>I'm pretty chatty for the time of day. Must be all the coffee!!<P>Take care and God Bless, but you know He has and will!!

SP,<P>Yeah I have a wonderful support group..I have been going to a support group at church..it's a VERY LARGE church..and then I have my friends from other churches..as well..I am very blessed that way..<P>If you haven't read it yet, take time to go<BR>to the poem section in the other forum and <BR>read The Surgery..<P>And as far as my faith goes..yes, It has grown more in the past year than it has in <BR>the past 9 years..I feel like I have been starving to death and I was taken to a banquet feast and told to eat as much as I want to..or out in the desert dying of dehydration and given a well of fresh water<BR>to drink..and I don't want to go back to the desert ya know..<P>And another way I guess it feels is like..<BR>I have had stones being thrown at me for years..and finally someone (ME) has said..ENOUGH, I won't take it anymore..I will no longer be condemned for things God has forgiven me for..Not by myself, nor anyone else..yes, I have made mistakes..but damn..when you do stop paying the price for them?? Isn't that what the cross was for???<BR>God paid the price for our sins so that we don't have to??? <P>And I guess thats what I have really come to understand..yes I forgive my H for being gone..yes, that has been his choice to be gone..but I don't have to live with his decision anymore..just as I don't have to live with his always condemning me for my past mistakes..I don't need the stones anymore..ya know..they hurt..and I'm tired of being hurt..