I told him that i cared for him and that i wished him well. ...as the father of my child.<P>I told him i would like to say the past 10 years were good but truly i wasn't happy and that i was sorry for not coming clean earlier.<P>I was honest and straight to the point.<P>I told him it was amazing how both of us worked on a relationship that neither one of us was actually happy in.<P>I told him sorry for taking ten years of his life knowing that i held him accountable for my unhappiness when the truth was he doesn't fulfill me as a friend, lover or husband.<P>I thanked him for letting me go .."releasing me" because i feel better now.<P>I guess he didn't think much of the letter because he called me the very next day insisting that we work things out after he spent the last 4 days at his girlfriends house. I gave myself to him one last time. I told him i loved him, and even brought him a present that night. To show my love. But only as a friend. I was trying to reach out to him to let him know a friendship is possible<P>Difference being i know that i am not IN love with him. I told him that a year and a half ago. But i do know that a year ago i made a choice, and i can stand before God tomorrow, tonight or years in the future and say i know that i did the right thing. <P>I believe God knows this too. Just like death and tragic events happen in our lives for a reason. I met my ex and stayed with him for a reason<P>I remember telling him 18 months ago I would be better off alone then spending the rest of my life with him. I was right. <BR> <BR>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>he doesn't fulfill me as a friend, lover or husband.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>And that was supposed to make him feel better? And you want him to be your friend? I am sure the part about not fulfilling you as a lover would do wonders for a man's self-esteem.

Nellie,<P>You must of missed the point.<BR>I wasn't looking for his feelings or a reaction.<BR>As a lover no he wasn't fulfilling the last couple years I've become an actress.<BR>As a husband, well he quotes the vows we took. There was no honor, no respect, and as far as love goes, well God and my ex are the only two that know. Love isn't, hitting someone, shutting them out of your life, lying to them about simple things, non-communication. I could only try so much before i began to feel numb.<BR>As a friend, friends worry about you and take care of you when your down, they don't ignore you. Even if i don't have the time to spend the day, when i know a friend is in a bad way i call just to check in.<BR>Heck! I can't make him do anything. If i could i would get him to take his child on a regular basis so she wouldn't feel so hurt.<P>Lastly, I know what his life is about, I've seen the bruises, I want to help. But i want him to know the boundary. <P>Just because he let's me down, doesn't mean i have to return the favor. I'm better then that.

Why did you write the letter then? If it was supposed to be to "thank" him, or to apologize for taking 10 years of his life, telling him that he wasn't a good enough husband or lover kind of defeated the purpose.

I wrote him the letter for closure.<BR>I wrote the letter to thank him for<BR>releasing me. So that i may have better experiences in life.<BR>There's nothing worse than feeling like your floating through life... for me that is.<P>Besides, after trying things with him for a second and third time, i released no matter what he says, he really isn't capable of making me happy. <P>He is who he is. Needing someone to change so a relationship can exist is wrong. (i mean with the kind of changes needed for him and i to be happy together)<P>Sure little things are different.<P>Do you understand now?<BR>

There are lots of things worse than feeling you are floating through life - having your child's family destroyed for one thing. <P>No one is capable of making another person happy. <P>People who have time or inclination to worry about whether they are happy or not will never be happy.<P>Life is not about seeking happiness. Happiness is not a goal to be sought - it is a byproduct of living a good, responsible life. I think Frank Pittman did an excellent job of discussing this in his book, "Grow Up." <P>Marriage is forever. You do whatever is necessary to make sure it is sustained. There is nothing wrong with changing behaviors in order to maintain a relationship. There are very few reasons why two people could not live together, and almost all of them would have shown up long before marriage, generally early in the dating process. <P>

looking ahead,<P>I can completely understand the purpose of the letter. I told my stbx much of the same things in person. I thanked him for leaving, for moving out so that I could see that I'm fine without him. Actually, I'm great without him.<P>Nellie,<P>Why worry about whether LA's comments hurt her H's self-esteem? I doubt he worried about her self-esteem when he was hitting her. There are times when a marriage is just not worth saving. Mine is one of them and so is LA's. It's very difficult for abusive men to stop hitting and if they don't see it as a problem, they won't stop. <P>I have no regrets about ending my marriage. I feel no shame in divorcing my H (which should be final this week). I tried for 10 1/2 years to make my marriage one that I could live with. And abusive characteristics don't always show up before the marriage takes place. My stbx was fine before we married. But then...guess what?? 2 months after we were married, when I was 8 months pregnant, my stbx held me down, slapped me, got up, and kicked me in the side. Things like this happened repeatedly thru our marriage. Should I regret divorcing a man like this?? I don't think so.<P>Mitzi

Mitzi,<P>If she left him because he was abusive, why wouldn't she have told him that, instead of throwing the psychobabble of "not fulfilling her" at him?

Nellie,<P>I'm sure she could have told him that, too. I know I told my stbx every reason that I was not fighting for the marriage anymore. <P>Abusive relationships are so much more different than "normal" relationships. No matter what they do to you, you still love them for some reason. Or at least you think you do. It takes a lot of time to come to the realization that love isn't hitting someone. When my stbx first left, I still loved him. And it took not seeing him for 2 months to help me get to the point where I didn't miss him or want to be married to him anymore. <P>I know that you didn't want your divorce. But your situation was so different. Your H was good to you and your kids. I can completely understand why this is difficult for you. I would probably feel the same as you had my marriage been good.<P>(((((HUGS)))))<BR>Mitzi

looking ahead and mitzi,<P>I am one for "doing all you can to save a marriage" except for cases of violence and abuse. I only wish my wife, who often tells people there was abuse in our marriage, could talk to you both. I will be 100% honest here - If I was abusive to her, there would be no reason for me to lie here on these boards. Truth is, there was no abuse. At times I was "short", and stressed-out. Not as loving as I should have been, but no where near how your husbands treated you. I could never even fathom grabbing, striking or hitting my wife - I did/do cherish her so much more than that. As far as mental abuse goes, I would say at most I was "unloving" sometimes and if that constitutes mental abuse than I guess I am guilty. But I never demeaned her, disrespected her, cursed at her, put her down - none of that. It was more the lack of emotional deposits into her love bank.<P>I only wish she could realize that our problems could be fixed without that much effort on both of our parts. But she will not even give us a second chance, let alone the third chances you gave your husbands. Granted she is young and does not have too many other experiences with guys that are truly "jerks". Many people tell me that "her leaving" will only hurt her in the longrun once she sees "what is out there" and that there are very few truly "good men" (although I do hope you both find a couple).<P>Unfortunately that makes me feel even worse - to think that her current decision is only going to cause us both pain and sorrow for a long time to come.<P>While I don't believe in divorce, I have to say that I admire you both for "trying" to save your relationships for as long as you could. There are many of us out here that wish our spouses gave us second or even third chances.<P>God Bless you both!

ST 2000,<P>I really feel for you. There are some women who say there is abuse in a relationship to make the other person look bad. <P>My stbx insists that there was no abuse. Even when a friend of ours saw him hitting me and saw the after effects, A*S said "Hey man, I didn't do this!" Amazing!!<P>I'm glad in a way that I went thru some of the things that I did. It made me a lot stronger and a lot more determined to never get in that type of relationship again. And the funny part is, it hasn't made me afraid of men. Maybe a little afraid of the committment but not the people themselves. Actually, I look forward to having another real relationship sometime in the future.<P>Keep your chin up!<BR>Mitzi

My ex didn't start hitting me until after i gave birth to our child. She was 3 months old. It was only a slap. Years later it was a push up against the wall for being 2 hours late from his expected return time. After our honeymoon that night we returned the police were called because i had a torn t shirt and scratches about my chest and neck. My girlfriend called the police because when the phone went dead she thought he would kill me. Countless choke holds, and tossing things around. I left the house one night with my daughter and stayed at a hotel because he was ramsacking our house. This was christmas eve. Recently i file charges against him for assault. I came out black and blue. He put me through a wall, and spit in my face. <P>I won't lie. I broke a window throwing something at him. I tried my best to choke him until he passed out(never succeded) But i always got whatever i dished out back ten fold.<P>He already knows that the abusive was a factor in my decision. But the reason for the letter was to let him know that he didn't fulfill me. I'm a good person and deserve better than that. He denies the abusive and i have witness's!!!!<P>I'm not a saint nor do i pretend to be. But i feel safer now then i have in years. For the first 6 months after we separated i had nightmares about him killing me. I started believing at the end of my marriage it was him or me.<P>Do you know how hard it is to sleep with one eye open???<P>He tells me i made the biggest mistake of my life. That i'll never be happy. That any woman is lucky to have him, because he knows how to treat a woman and make her feel "fulfilled"<P>I believe in marriage. I believe in the vows i took. But no where did it say that he woud decide when i got to live or die.<BR>God forgives me and understands.<P>I forgive myself.<BR>I make my own decisions.<P>How do you respect a man that denies his daughter and tells her that she lies and that when she refuses to take a bath one night that she is a dirty little girl and no one will like her. etc.... Then when she gets so upset she wants to come see me, he tells her if you leave your never coming back.<P>Nellie, please tell me why was i suppose to stay?

la,<P>You weren't supposed to stay!! Yes, marriage is supposed to be forever but you can't go thru life living like that.I went thru all of the same things that you did. I also hit my stbx but it was in self-defense. If I hadn't done it a couple of times, I wouldn't have been able to get away from him. My only mistake was never getting the police involved. <P>Don't worry about divorcing your ex. It was something that needed to be done. And there are men that would treat you a lot better than he did. <P>Mitzi

Mitzi,<P>Thank you<P>Every now and again i let his words haunt me.<BR>My fault, I ruined our child's life.<BR>ect......<P>Listening to myself in counselling i realized it will be a long time before i feel whole again. After all he took ten years destroying my faith.<P>How are you today?

looking ahead,<P>I did not say that you should stay if you were being abused. I just think that telling your spouse that they didn't fulfill you as a husband is cruel and hurtful, and not justifiable under any circumstances. My H said a number of hurtful things to me, but thank goodness nothing like that.<P>You should never cast aspersions on a man's manliness. It is not only cruel but dangerous. My nephew is dead because his murderer's girlfriend questioned what kind of man he was not to stand up for her sufficiently when she and my nephew argued.<P>

Nellie,<P>I understand what you're saying. BUT...any man who abuses his wife IS unfulfilling as a husband! <P>la,<P>I'm doing good today. Had to talk to the STBX. He amazes me more and more! <P>Mitzi

Mitzi,<P>I disagree. I think she is just trying to figuratively "hit him where it hurts."<P>If you left your spouse because he was a serial killer, would you tell him you were leaving because he didn't fulfill you? Of course not - that would be ridiculous.<P>She either left him because he was an abuser, or not. There is no other good reason to leave your spouse. <BR>

Just an observation:<P>I would think that if LA's H were an abuser, she would not write him a letter at all. I would think she'd run, not walk, as far away as possible and not bother to write him a letter thanking him. <P>I am the FIRST one to tell a woman (or a man, if ya'll have read FrankS's posts onthe Emotional Needs forum) to leave an abusive relationship. I believe abuse is real and happens, unfortunately, every day.<P>I believe that LA wrote this letter to her H because she wanted some kind of closure. I did the same with David, as he did with me, although in our case there was no abuse (unless you consider serial-cheating abuse). In that way, I don't see a problem with the letter at all. <P>(This is not to say that LA's H is not abusive, only LA knows that. I do think it's odd that she didn't mention it in the original letter though.)<P>P.S. Nellie, if someone were dying from lung cancer because they smoked, would you think they deserved it because they smoked, or have compassion for their pain? I would hope the latter. Nellie, I do wish you could step away from your own situation long enough to see that there are other reasons (besides abuse) for divorce. I know you're hurting terribly, but you aren't alone in your pain -there are lots of hurting people here - me included. Pain is Pain.<p>[This message has been edited by new_beginning (edited October 25, 2000).]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by new_beginning:<BR>[B]<BR>P.S. Nellie, if someone were dying from lung cancer because they smoked, would you think they deserved it because they smoked, or have compassion for their pain? I would hope the latter. Nellie, I do wish you could step away from your own situation long enough to see that there are other reasons (besides abuse) for divorce. I know you're hurting terribly, but you aren't alone in your pain -there are lots of hurting people here - me included. Pain is Pain.<BR>/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>new_beginning,<P>Yes but remember that there is a difference between compassion and believing someone needs to take responsibility for their own actions. Sure I would feel bad for that person with lung cancer, but I would also be the first to remind them about all the signs and people who were there to warn them of this outcome. And maybe to tell them that instead of just feeling sorry for themselves now, maybe they should be going out and helping others who are just like they were. Am I compassionate - yes. But I being compassionate should never entail condoning their wrongful actions.<P>just my 2 cents...

well, sotired, here you are again! <P>Believe me, I take responsibility for my actions, and expect all around me to take responsibility for theirs. Honestly, do a search on me, read about what I've gone through the last 18 months... and see that I have been the first to take responsibility for the place I find myself now. <P>That said, I feel that compassion stands alone. You either hurt for the person and their pain or not. It doesn't depend on how they got there. <P>That's just how I feel. And believe me, my heart ACHES for my stbx. He put himself here too, by cheating again. That doesn't mean I don't cry MANY MANY tears for his pain.