That's right. I'm taking the next step. I'm calling my attorney in about an hour, hope to get an appointment for tomorrow. Should be fairly clean, no children, few shared bills, but I did have money pulled for a Roth IRA from our joint account, will "probably" owe her half of what was invested. Oh well.<P>Guess I came to this conclusion last night while talking to a buddy. He asked me if I wanted her back. In light of what she has done to my life in the last four months, all the while never taking me into consideration, thinking only of herself, with this happening last fall also, why would I want her back? I feel the odds are pretty good that this will happen again in the future, and I'm not willing to go through it again. So his comment was, "If you feel that way, file. Why wait any longer? There's a 90 day coolong off period anyway, so just do it. Take the initiative and be on the offensive. But, if you have any desire to ever have her back, wait. If not, what are you waiting for?<P>K. Guess it's time to move on with my life. This is what she wanted anyway, isn't it? Guess I have changed through all of this and grown as a person.

That growing part is what Plan A is really all about. I gave up when she made it clear she didn't want to try any more. It's not what I want, but the emotional investment became too painful for something that I could never fix on my own.<P>She appears to want this to be as fair and painless as possible, but it still sucks. I'm just holding on to that runaway train...<P>------------------<BR>nick<P>it's only time that heals the pain and makes the sun come out again

Nick,<P>You know, I agree. I finally determined that it's time to take control of my own life. This is now what I want. We had our good times and bad, we had memories that can never be taken away, but it's time to move on. I don't think that I could ever trust that this wouldn't happen again.<P>Maybe this is my way of dealing with the situation. My way of closure. In the whole time we have been separated, I have never heard a "I think that I may want to work on this, but I need a little more time". That would have been enough to stop me. If after 4 months, I can't even get that, then I think I know my answer.<P>Eric

<B>Maybe this is my way of dealing with the situation. My way of closure. In the whole time we have been separated, I have never heard a "I think that I may want to work on this, but I need a little more time". That would have been enough to stop me. If after 4 months, I can't even get that, then I think I know my answer.</B><P>Exactly. I feel like she put up an appearance of trying for some reason, but that it was over when she first told me she "wasn't in love with me". She was deep in withdrawl before I ever had a clue what was going on, and her new circle of divorced friends helped her decide that she should quit our marriage & head out into the single world again. Of course the fact that she basically trashed two other guys (me & my son) lives never entered her mind, I'm sure.<P>I had to let her go. I held on as long as I could, but in the end I had to recognize that there was <B>NOTHING</B> I could do to make her want to even try. She was already gone <P>------------------<BR>nick<P>it's only time that heals the pain and makes the sun come out again

Still Praying,<P>OK, here goes...First keep in mind that I am also meeting with an attorney on Friday of this week. With me though, things are a little different - she filed first and it was not at all what I expected. We had talked off and on about a "no fault" divorce, but here I was served last week with a divorce based upon "extreme cruelty". And to make matters worse, the charges were embellished quite a bit. The meeting with my attorney is to protect myself and to make sure that I just don't cave in to false accusations. In the mean time, I am still going to try a few alternate routes to see if I can head this off before it gets out of hand. Not to prevent the divorce if that is truly what she wants, but rather to bring it back down to a simple parting of the ways (a "no fault" divorce or at least one based on "irreconcileable differences").<P>With that said, I just want to caution you on advice you get from friends and family. Keep in mind that they have your best interests in mind, but for them it always seems to be "cut and dry". Why? Because they have no emotional ties to their friend's spouse. They are only looking at things from a unemotional point of view. But what does this mean to you? I guess I am just saying that once someone starts looking at things from a emotionless point of view then as soon as any problems come up in a marriage, they can find all kinds of reasons to leave.<P>I have had friends and family ask me the same exact question "would I want her back". My answer is always "yes" and it is an immediate answer. I believe this based upon my faith. Beginning with the faith that God wants every marriage to work - no matter what the circumstances. Even in the case of abuse He will pull for the marriage. I am not saying that he wants people to stay in an unhealthy or threatening relationship - rather He hopes that the spouse who has the problems would somehow be able to fix his/her shortcomings and the spouse who is the victim would be able to demonstrate the forgiveness God shows us everyday.<P>But even above all that, I have faith that if, "if" my wife came back it would be with forgiveness in her heart and with God in her life. I truly 100% believe that if we both had God in our daily lives and we both asked Him to fix our marriage, it would be a simple task for Him to accomplish. For it is what He desires in the first place.<P>And finally, trying not to just focus on God in all of this, look at Love itself. 99% of the time it happens when we least expect it - usually when we are not looking for it at all. Why do we assume then that when our marriages are in dire straits that we have direct control over bringing it back? Sure we have some control, but I think if we focus on letting go of that control, we are opening the door for love to make some miraculous accomplishments.<P>I still wear my wedding ring. Not all the time, but most of the time. I still think about my wife - I still pray for some kind of miracle, BUT my life moves on. I go out and meet people, I do whatever it is I want to do. No longer am I "holding back" - I believe that I can "move on" with my life without waiting around for her. That is why I did not make the first step in filing for divorce, and if she did not recently file, I felt comfortable in giving her as long as she needed. Not because she deserved it - not because of what other people told me, but because I love her and I trust in that love. For me, trust in love is different than just trust in my wife. Trust in love goes on to a whole different level - a higher level. Trust in love is based upon my faith and that is too important to me to allow my wife to sway by her misguided actions and her beliefs.<P>To me this is the biggest test of faith I have had in my life. I feel like I am being asked to trust in the face of certain impending doom. To have faith when there is no "light at the end of the tunnel" as far as our marriage is concerned. But even more importantly, this may be the one time in my life where I can resemble the love God has for us - "unconditional love". Loving her right now, knowing that most of the thoughts she has about me are negative. Loving her with little thought of getting anything in return.<P>Everyone is different. These are only my beliefs. But you know what? Once I explain them to my friends and family, you'd be amazed at their reactions. You see I am also a big proponent of leading in my faith by example. Let me put it to you this way: How many friends and family have advised you to hold to your faith? To stick it out in spite of insurmountable odds? I would imagine not many - at least that is the case with me (and my friends and family are also good Christian people). Could it be that if we did stick to our faith, we would be releasing ourselves from our own situations and thereby becoming an example to others?<P>It is so early for a discussion of faith And I don't mean to at all sound judgemental, really. I do tend to be opinionated (imagine that), I like to be the one who speaks about things that are not always in the highest public opinion.<P>Your choice is your choice and you need to do what you believe is best for yourself. We all make hard decisions everyday. For that I pray for God's guidance and wisdom to help you make one of the most difficult decisions of your life.<P>Be strong. God Bless.<BR>Mike

I'm sitting here at 5:30 in the morning, and this is heavy on my mind. After all the pain and suffering that I've been through in the last 4 1/2 months, this still bothers me. I need to do it for myself. I need to show her that I am independent and can live without her. This will demand respect for me in one way or another. It can always be stopped, we can always get back together, I don't even know why I am thinking in those terms. It is what it is, and it needs to be done in my mind.<P>I have a strange feeling that I will be upset after I leave the lawyers office, I can feel it now. I would be a liar if I said that this didn't bother me or that I still didn't think about her, I have shared every day of my life with this person for almost 12 years. This sucks.<P>Eric

Eric,<P>I couldn't agree with you more:<P>"this does suck"!<P>Mike

Yes it does. <P>I hope it starts to suck less, but this whole thing has really messed me up. I wonder how long it takes to get over them and start moving on?<P>------------------<BR>nick<P>it's only time that heals the pain and makes the sun come out again

Ok Guys. Yes this does suck, for all of us, but it does get better. Getting over your spouse and moving on is a process and not an event. You won’t just wake up tomorrow morning and be over this. It will take time, it will take effort, and it will take tears, but it will happen. Just the process of venting our feelings and sharing our emotions with others on this site has been a major help for me in the last few months. It’s not the same as individual therapy with a trained professional, but it still helps and I’m sure my insurance company is happy not to be forking out $100 an hour any more!<P>Mike had given me this concept awhile back, “The winter of (insert name here)” I took that idea to heart and have been doing things that I have wanted to do, just for me. I quit trying to save my marriage when it was obvious that my stbx didn’t want any part of it, I started spending time with my friends, I’ve taken a few small vacations, I’ve been meeting people, I’ve been flirting, I’ve been learning about life again as a single man, I’ve been having fun AND I’ve been doing all of this just for me! Every now and again I drop a line to my stbx about the things I’m doing and that I’m really able to survive without her. I’ve done this in a subtle way, but I know she’s picked up on it. Call it immature, but it made me feel better and I didn’t rub her nose in it.<P>For the longest time I have been internalizing the failure of my marriage and have been trying to figure out what I’ve done in my life to deserve this pain. I’ve always been a good person and I couldn’t put a finger on why this is happening to me. I felt as if I was being punished for something and nobody could tell me what that ‘something’ was. It finally occurred to me just last night that I really DO deserve this. But I deserve this for good reasons. I deserve to have a woman love me for the right reasons. I deserve to have a wife who is with me because she loves the person I am today and the person I will become in the future. I deserve to be open as a person and not have to worry about what others will think of me. I deserve to be successful and not have a financially irresponsible person dragging me to the brink of bankruptcy. I deserve to start my own family. I deserve a better life. <P>As I said before, moving on is a process and not an event. With each passing day, every single one of us is that much closer to moving on with our lives. <BR>

Yes. It's taking awhile, but I'm seeing the changes in me that I need in order to be the person I want to be. I realize that I need to define myself as a person based on me, not anyone else, and I think that's what plan A is really all about. My plan A is now about nothing more than learning to survive on my own. That's the first step. The next step is learning how to be happy on my own. I think until I make to that point, it would be foolish to entertain thougts about another relationship.<P>------------------<BR>nick<P>it's only time that heals the pain and makes the sun come out again<p>[This message has been edited by c00ker (edited November 15, 2000).]

Hey Jayhawk,<P>Yep, the "fall/winter of mike" is continuing as well! Her most recent action of filing the papers took me back a step, but it also freed me up at the same time. Now I have something better to focus on - how to get through all this with as much dignity and maturity as I can. <P>OK, call it childish or whatever, but I have been showing the papers to quite a few people - mostly to get their reaction. One thing they all have in common is that they laugh and then say "she definitely is not the person we thought she was". If the papers were more mature and fair, I would have kept them to myself, but they are "public record" right? I know I am only rationalizing, but to be brutely honest, I need to hear other people tell me 2 things after they read the papers: 1) She is way out there and 2) The things she lists are in no measure worth getting divorced over.<P>In any case, life goes on. Family and friends continue to be so supportive and helpful. You'll think I am a little nuts when I say this but yes I still would take her back. I have come to terms with the fact that in some ways I will always love her and the vows I made are still as strong as the day I made them. With that said, I have begun to formulate a list of what the perfect woman would be for me. Not surprisingly, my wife has many of these traits, but I am kind of surprised at the ones she does not possess. You guys and gals may want to try the exercise, I think it does help see that there is someone else out there for us all.<P>BTW: Setup a meeting with our counselor for next Wednesday to see if he will agree to try and intervene. I'll keep you posted.<P>Mike

5:08 p.m.<P>Well, I did it. Felt a little funny going in, actually sat in the car for a while and thought about it. It's not exactly what I wanted to do, but we're closing in on 5 months and something needs to change.<P>In Iowa, a no-fault state, the day she is served, (probably Monday), starts a 90-day window before we can go in front of a judge. After this window, if we have agreed upon the terms or as soon as we do, we set a court date, and it's over.<P>I guess what I will do as soon as I hear from her or her circle of friends is to explain why I did it. She's a psycho bit-just kidding. That according to everything that she's told me, this is what she wants. That she has neither the time nor the resources to accomplish it, so I thought I would do it for her. That this isn't what I want, but I am willing to give her what she wants, she has control, and can ask me to stop it at any time.<P>What's done is done, I feel fine, and time will tell. We are still looking at 3 months before it can be final, but at this point I won't stop it unless she convinces me otherwise.

Mike,<P>Similarities again, only this time I'm not referring to our wives. A few months back I realized my vision of the perfect woman. Although my wife matched some of the characteristics, she did not come close to filling the list. This was pretty amazing when I stopped and looked at it in this light. Yes I love my wife, but she was not the right one for me based on my own list.<P>I shared this list with two of my very good guy friends to which one said, "good luck in finding that one" and the other replied, "that woman does not exist." I don't know if my idea of the 'perfect' woman is out of line or not. I really don't think it is, it's just a combination of qualities that's hard to find in just one person.<P>Now the questions I have to ask myself as I move forward are, "does this woman exist and what I am willing to drop from the list if I find one that is close?" Also, "what will I need to give up to be with her?"<P>Now do I really believe this person exists and can I find her? That's a tough question to answer and I don't know for sure, but I have seen glimpses already. <P>It gives me hope that the she is out there.<P>Jayhawk<BR>

So I have a question gent's whats on your list for the "perfect mate" in your eyes??<P>EB, Sorry to hear about the "D" I know it's not what you wanted..and had hoped things would have changed. I am looking at filing myself and not waiting on my "h" anymore..<BR>I started working a couple weeks ago..and now<BR>he's having a fit at what he's giving me to support the kids..says "since your working you don't need my money anymore"..I think he's trying to make me suffer..but oh well..<BR>I know that God will continue to provide..<BR>He has so far..even to the point of a pay raise after having only been working a week..lol..maybe you could e-mail me..<BR>cornerp@theglobe.com and I could share some of the other things going on here..<P>

Hmmmm perfect mate.<P>Not sure there is one, but aside from possessing what I find physically attractive (yeah, I know, but I'm a guy);<P>Someone who wants to work with me building our lives together.<P>And......<P>Funny <BR>Spontaneous<BR>Adventuresome <BR>Mischevious<BR>Curious<BR>Shy<BR>Extroverted<BR>Demure<BR>Honest<BR>Intelligent<BR>Sensitive<BR>Witty<BR>Secure<BR>Romantic<BR>Adaptable<BR>Pragmatic<BR>Responsible<BR>Cute<BR>Healthy<BR>Eclectic<BR>Sexual<BR>Happy<BR>Playfull<BR>Hardworking<BR>Worldly<BR>Esoteric<BR>Classy<BR>Sexy<BR>Forgiving<BR>Caring<BR>Trashy<P>I'm looking for a:<BR>Navigator<BR>Asst.Gardner<BR>Part time Cook<BR>Part time Housekeeper<BR>Co-Pilot<BR>Vacation partner<BR>Snuggle mate<BR>Friend<BR>Lover<BR>Lifetime soulmate<P>(I wonder if I can special order one)<P> <P><BR>------------------<BR>nick<P>it's only time that heals the pain and makes the sun come out again<p>[This message has been edited by c00ker (edited November 17, 2000).]

c00ker,<P>I don't see why you can't special order...<BR>just need to talk to God about it..tell Him<BR>what your looking for..and He can make it happen..just don't be in a rush to step in<BR>and find her first.. <grin> and don't be afraid to be picky!!

OK,<BR>I'm placing my order to avoid the Christmas rush.<P>And while I'm at it..<P>Dear Santa, I've been good....<P> <P>------------------<BR>nick<P>it's only time that heals the pain and makes the sun come out again<p>[This message has been edited by c00ker (edited November 17, 2000).]

OK - my perfect mate.<P>Let me start by saying that I don't really have a type as far as "looks" go but I'll start there:<P>* Either Blonde hair - brown eyes or brown/black hair - blue eyes or even red hair - green eyes. (but in any case her eyes must be captivating when you look into them). And hair should be long but not too long - a little below shoulder length<P>* Fit - Not too slender (Ally McBeal type) but not "out of shape" either<P>* Beautiful smile - one that comes often and lights up a room<P>* Incredible sense of humor - the ability to find the best in any situation<P>* Intelligent - can hold a conversation about current events, business, technology, etc... But does not have to be a rocket scientist<P>* Tall, but not too tall - maybe 5'8" - 5'10"<P>* Has the ability to look good in jeans and a sweatshirt with her hair up in a pony-tail, but also be a knockout in a fine cocktail dress - Can pull off wearing blue jeans with Pearls!<P>* Speaks her mind - Someone who will be an equal partner - not afraid of telling me what she wants (but not bossy)<P>* Happy to stay at home and rent movies, but forceful when she wants to "go out" - "maybe you did not hear me, I said we ARE going out tonight!" <P>* Concerned about her appearence but not too much - wears little if any makeup and still looks great<P>* Doesn't have to be a big sports fan, but does enjoy going to the occassional football/hockey game. And is interested enough to learn the game's rules.<P>* Can spend time by herself - Doesn't need me around 24/7. Independent<P>* Very sentimental - will cry at sappy movies and not care who sees<P>* A sex drive that is in "third gear" - not too fast, but definitely not in "park"<P>* Willing to "call in sick" from work and spend the day in bed together<P>* loves children and family in general. Maybe a teacher. Someone who just doesn't have kids, they participate in their kid's lives where ever and whenever they can. A woman/girl who can be standing in shopping mall and have little children just gravitate towards her.<P>* Loves holidays - Likes to decorate - but not Martha Stewart like - Our house can look really cute, but still be functional as well - don't want to live in a museum - She likes the "country look"<P>* Likes the beach and the mountains - but is not a snow-bunny or tanning goddess<P>* Loves animals - Has a cat and/or a dog - Not against having a parrott<P>* Good sense of reality but at the same time an incredible dreamer.<P>* Hates no one - loves everyone for who they are<P>* Strong religious beliefs and background (Catholic if possible - but not mandatory)<P>* Did I mention a great sense of humor?? Really important<P>* Loves to wrestle. Does care if she gets dirty. Likes to "play" and goof around. She is just a little ticklish.<P>* When/if she gets mad/upset she lets you know it - does not hide things inside.<P><BR>Well off the top of my head that is all I can come up with. Just someone who is pretty, fun to be around, enjoys a good time, not too serious, and cares about people and children.<P>Is this too much to ask for?<P> Mike

well gee guys..sounds like you described me and some of my single friends..<P>I guess we should e-mail our requests to Santa this year huh??? but knowing how busy he is he probably has a backlog on the e-mail..lol..<P>actually it's funny you mention santa..last year I took the kids to see santa..and I sat on his lap too..and put in my request..<BR>(asked for the sexy nighty in the fredricks window across from where he was sitting)<BR>even took my picture on santas lap..

Gee Rose, any of those single friends like convertible sports cars ? <P>I've got this mental picture of you sitting on the lap of a blushing Santa. You whispering in his ear & pointing across the mall towards F'ricks <P>------------------<BR>nick<P>it's only time that heals the pain and makes the sun come out again