Enjoyed and learned a lot on the conflict avoider thread. So, folks, how do you deal with them? Esp concerning Plan A, B, fence sitting and reconcilliation? Are there some magic words that make these people look into their souls and become responsible adults. Cause right now, I'm ready to leave mine for good.<BR>T

Dear Twyla,<P>H is a big time C. A. He has perfected this to the level of<BR>awesome. He is so good, he had 3 conversations last night (with his sister, father and me). He managed not to make any commitments or real statements on any of them. He is good!!! <P>I am the opposite, face it head on and deal with it. Then go on with your life. So for me this has been a real challenge dealing with WS.<P>After listening to many, watching a few, implementing what I think may work, listening again with a better perspective, I have learned that it is better to:<P>1. Stand your ground firmly but with love. <BR>2. Speak without emotions (as much as humanly possible)<BR>3. OK to cry or shed a tear. <BR>4. Don't argue. As much as possible be agreeable. <P>H said before that he wanted a divorce, I said ok, then he said he didn't want a divorce, I said ok. Threw him for a loop. During that time there was a short period of santity. Sometimes that is enough to bring them back to reality other times or other persons it is not. <P>Being too agreeable aggreivates the WS & OP. If they threaten you, don't look like you are threaten or are threatening. WS & OP will have to reach down real hard before they can find anything. WS says OW has threatened to take me to the police, file a restraining order against me (read the post under the name Silent Correspondence), etc. but none were true. Since I had nothing to hide or lose, I said ok. No sarcasim (though I was accused of it - H had to accuse me of something, I was making him look bad by being so agreeable). <P>I am not always agreeable. I have my limits and when H goes there, I remind him he does not live here and needs to respect my home and us as persons. <P>So far it is working. Except WS is a slow learner. He perfers to blow up first, feel guilt and apologize the next day or two. <P>L.

Are you sure we're not with the same guy?? The only difference I can see is that mine doesn't blow up very often...as a matter of fact, can only remember twice in the last 10 years. Once in Dec when I had the nerve to be angry that he left me waiting at the airport for 3 hours ( couldn't get away from a meeting) and about 3 weeks ago when there was supposedly no contact and I looked at his pager. In both cases, I was in the wrong. His usual mode of operation is to do nothing/say anything. My absolute favorite is the reason he never told me about the affair..."you never asked"... I guess I'm supposed to ask daily for the rest of my life. Gets out of so much because he's a doctor and is so busy, yet certainly found time for her. Everyone makes excuses for him, staff, friends, even patients because he works so hard. This is why I feel recovery just ain't gonna work...he cannot be forthright of his own violation...even direct yes or no questions are hedged. Won't get counseling, so I'm in a place where I have to decide if a 60 year old man is capable of change. The only thing I have going for me is that we've never married. See my newest thread under recovery.<BR>T

Twyla,<P>I'm sorry, but what the HECK did you say when he said you didn't ask....<P>I'm sorry (again) but that takes the cake.<P>Now I have heard EVERYTHING.........<P>hugs to you<P>Jo

Jo...I said..."so, what, I'm supposed to greet you at the door everyday with a kiss, how's your day, who'd you f&*%?"<BR>And if you think that takes the cake, you really have to read my newest posting in Recovery>>>you won't believe it!<BR>T

going there now<P>be back soon<P>Jo

oookay,<P>I'm back.<P>I'm glad 'the girls' have taken a holiday. I'm cracking up laughing at that expression, it's priceless. I love it.<P>Now, to serious business.<P>The card would throw me for a 6. I would have loved to have received something like that when my ex was in the middle of his a. To me, knowing diddly squat about men and what they do or say, (!!) I would think that he really does have feelings for you. And very strong ones from what he writes. Men don't write things like that just for the sake of writing them.<BR>But he really needs to get his head out of the sand doesn't he.? He needs to end it with her. Has he said that he wants to end it with her.?<P>As far as the house goes, take him up on his offer. Nominal rent of course, and have a life-long tenancy drawn up. One that can only be ended by you. He can't terminate the lease. You start calling some shots here.....<BR>Unbelievable. Where do they get off. <P>We could talk for days about conflict avoiders. It's the one thing (topic) that is guaranteed to make me mad. It drives me insane. I have grown to hate his conflict avoidance. I'm not like that, I like to deal with things as and when they happen. I try to understand and be patient and tolerant, but really, there's a limit isn't there. <P>I said love, I said pet, I said love..........<BR>(an expression we use over here when we're discussing something that is *stupid* or burns our butt)<P>What do you think you'll do?<P>how come you're up so late? It's only about 9.00 pm here<P>hope you have a great weekend in sunny Hawaii, gads, I'd love to visit that place. One day.<P>hugs to you<P>JO

This whole discussion about conflict avoiders has been so good for me. I see my h in almost every description. One of the things that really strikes me about him is that he hates to make decisions - even about a simple purchase; used to ask me what movie I wanted to see - standard answer from me - "hjkjhf has had a good review - what about that?" - his response "OK" - and then on the way home "we should have gone to see fkgkjghdhb - it probably would have been better". Another - I ask a simple question eg " when do you think we should get the painters in?: ; answer "I dont know the answer to that". I have often thought in this whole saga that he was waiting for either me or OW to make the decision for him. Well, I suppose I have - I am now in Plan B; and I think I have finally got through to him that means "no contact"; this has taken quite some explanation - I should have realised he does not know what it means as he continued contact with OW over several months while he kept telling me he was not "seeing her" - silly me, didnt understand that three or four telephone calls a day didnt mean "contact" to him.<P>R

Hi friends,<P>I see my thread has a "spin off" <P>So if you love someone, and communication/conversation is one of your needs, how does a relationship survive? I do believe you really shouldn't try to change someone, because that is just not going to work, but you can change yourself.<P>It seems to me that dealing with this conflict avoider, that the person who is trying to communicate is going to wind up very frusterated and as if the problem isn't solved, question isn't answered.<P>I could see where years of this would cause a blow up, or even an affair.<P>