Five years from now will it matter to you if you got laid today? Will it matter to you if you ate steak or lunch-meat today? Will it matter to you five years from now if your wife is chatting on the computer tonight? Will it matter to you if your husband put his dirty clothes in the hamper? Will it matter if you wanted a hug and she want to sleep? OR OR OR Will it matter if 5 years from now your wife is still there? Will it matter to your children if daddy is there? Will it matter if the love of your life is still the love of your life? I really believe that is the difference between the committed and the non-committed. The ability to see into the future. When you are committed in a relationship you are able to plan,to dream, to work towards a goal. When you are not you care only about the pleasuses of today? which mean what. Tell me who can look back 3 months ok and tell me if they got laid, had a good supper, saw a great movie, ect. On the other hand who can look back and say my children were there, my wife was beside me, my Lord was with me I was happy. We do not remember the day to day happinings so why do we dwell on them. I to am guilty of this at times but if I could take back the *****ing, the complaining, the worring, I would in a heartbeat. I will not make the same mistake twice from this day on.

rusty,<p>I think I understand what you mean, and certainly we can tend to miss the long range view by dwelling only on short term things. But I think you're missing something. You ask does it matter (as far as long term goes) that my wife is chatting on the computer tonight, did I miss a hug, etc. In the short term, no. But the long term view you refer to can only be reached if the short term views that comprise it are more positive than negative - generally speaking. One missed hug, one chat session here or there is not worth worrying about. But if they comprise too much a part of our every day relational experience then how can a positive long term vision (intact relationship with love, trust, affection, etc.) be reached?<br>The long view cannot be divorced from short term actions.

true,true,true<br>but what i am saying is that people tend to worry and fret over the short term to the neglect of the long term. i.e they are never happy because then worry more about short term things then seeing the big picture. For example. Will it give you more happiness to watch your children grow up day by day or to see them grow up every other weekend? And if the answer is the former then wiil it give you more happinees to then say missing a hug or having the wife on puter for a long time. I guess what I am saying is that we have been condistioned by society to foucus on the present instead of the future and in the present you will never be happy for long because the present changes so very much only by committing to the long view can true stable happiness be achieved that is what I get from reading the bible. Just an observation that is all.

rusty,<p>Thanks for the clarification. I see what you're saying and I think you're right. I took a walk today and was thinking about my situation. I don't know about you but I don't have anyone I can share my feelings with. Not locally anyway. When you're alone you tend to get a little crazy sometimes. A friend, or some sort of confident, can often give you feedback and let you know if you're on a good track or if you need to calm down or whatever. I do have a friend I grew up with that I talk to long distance quite often. But his views on marriage are so liberal that I can't relate to them. He's just gone through his second marriage and is still living in the house with his former wife and her new husband. Is that whacked out or what?<br>I know that in each case there is some right thing I should be doing. But when you're going it alone you sometimes wonder just what you're doing, why, does it matter, etc. Sometimes those reference points get lost in the fog.

Rusty,<p>My problem is that I'm so obsessed right now with the long view that the day to day things frustrate me more because of the hopelessness I feel that we will never start really working on things. I agree that your whole outlook and the values that govern your actions from day to day can be stronger if driven by the "long view". But it's so difficult when you and your spouse are not on the same wave length. When one is a "short view" kind of person. Has "dreams" but day to day actions run counter to those dreams. I believe dreams don't just fall into your lap, you have to work toward them. It's so frustrating to live by different sets of rules. But what do you do?

Wow, rusty, guess it shouldnt matter, but im pissed that i am missing hugs and she spends hours chatting, even tho thats where she met the om. I have found some comfort, or a batter way to say it, forward momentum, by seeing the future as ok w/ Gods help. She has freewill, thats either the problem or the solution, her choice. I cannot change it and really even God cant change it. By that I mean she can choose to love and try, he will bless that, and work a miracle, or she keeps her heart hard and prays dryly waiting for lightning to strike...that sound familiar guys,why do we love these women unconditionally, search our hearts and actually like what we see, feel that any woman w/ a sane mind would like us, then there is this person who will not honor the vow by taking a baby step of faith. blows me away.<br>Im in the same situ Bruce, no one to talk to. My oldest best friend is not living in such a wacked situ as yours but he is librel and not a Christian. I have no bros or sis's, my Mother cant relate, so believe it or not my support network is my wifes family...wierd.<br>Send me an email if it'll help<br>idahopotato3@yahoo.com

support network? Wow that would be great but the only support I want/need is from my wife and she is 500,000,000,000,000 miles distant. Like Bruce and Prag I do left my friends behind when I married. I felt that we should be each other's friends and companions. Talk about anything and everything. <br>Now after five years two affairs, two seperation and a wife who is so cold to me it is like being in a winter storm naked, I have noone to talk to because my family think I am nuts to want to work things out with her but my belief in marriage is so strong that divorce is not an answer untill all avenues are used. Why do we think that people who do not know what true love is will see the light if we just keep shinning it. I worry about my children and the lessons they are learning. I want them to understand what love is all about. Not that love is painful all the time. But that love is wonderful, painful, happy, sad, warm but never cold, caring, giving, recieving ect. In short love is the highway we travel on to reach true happiness and the final destination is at God's house.

To All,<br>My husband of 3 yrs (we are in our early 50's) has said to me in the past that I taught him what the bottom line is. It is you can have fights and pretty much whatever, that is if you both understand that the bottom line is you are both committed to the marriage. We have had some wonderful times together once he understood "the bottom line"<br>But now he has backslid again and every time we have an argument (and in my mind it's over nothing really serious) he gets mad and kind of picks on something I may be trying to tell him and I start defending what I'm talking about then we get into an argument. When I start defending he says I'm attacking him, when I thought he was attacking what I was talking about. I had no intentions of starting an argument. Anyway now he is forgetting about the bottom line and he pretty much gives me the cool shoulder most of the time. Anyway he has for the past 2 weeks. I kind of lable it this way. I go around panting after him like a puppy trying to make up. Then tonight after a movie during which I held his hand, cuddled under his arm. etc. He was walking ahead of me out of the theatre I said hey wanna walk with me, he said, come on, come on, comeon (not waiting for me) Then I hurried on to my car and drove home without waiting on him (we had driven there seperately after work) I know, I know that was childish. But it was because of the cool shoulder all week then I try to make up and it's brushed off. BUT now he is mad at me again for driving home hurriedly> I tried to tell hime it was the buildup of the cool shoulder all week and I try to make up and he just continues the col shoulder.So now he is in bed not talking to me again and he says I started the fight and I/m like a time bomb.<br>Hey! I AGREED and tried to tell hime it was because of going 2 weeks w/ a cool shoulder. I tried to say let's just quit being like this. and he says "you have to prove you mean it. It takes time." So I'm back to that puppy dog thing again and I guess he wants another 2 weeks of me being (What?) I don't know some kind of angel or what? around an around and around we go. What gives? Will cherish all answers.<br>didi

double post removed<p>[This message has been edited by Alice (edited 03-20-99).]