I have been doing a lot of reading here and of course, posting and today I am feeling that maybe I messed up everything and drove H away. I didn't do a good Plan A, I was in divorce mode already, even though I didn't want it. I really can't do plan B. He just doesn't care. <P>Part of me feels that I failed, that I could have done better, I should be able to control myself and my hurt and anger. But I can't. I am hurt and angry, although the hurt is diminishing and so is the anger. I am not saying it is not there but I get periods of I'm okay. <P>I know I also have a problem with disrespectful judgements. Still do. How do you change that. For example, if your best friend is having an affair with OM, and you tell her your feelings about what she is doing to all involved, is that a DJ. I would have a hard time being this person's friend, if she continued. I would help her to see the light but if she continued, I don't know. <P>Anger. Sometimes I don't even know what I am angry about and to tell the truth sometimes I don't/can't have the desire to figure it out. Why do I get angry/annoyed at kids for telling them the 1,0000000th time, not to throw food on the floor. It pisses me off sometimes. <P>I know I am rambling now, My H told me that I didn't love him enough. I didn't say it enough. I never knew, until now, how important that was for him. I always felt that He should know I love him, once a day was good, why should I have to tell you 5x a day when you call me on the phone. Well, I never heard/understood emotional needs. I never sat down and thought I have needs. he has needs, What are they?<P>It is interesting that I grew up in a family that was really non demonstrative in the love department. Parents hugged me, rarely told me they loved me, I just knew. Parents really never showed affection to each other in front of us kids. H family different. Always hugging and kissing, and saying I love you although I don't know if this has just been in the last 15 years, since both his parents are recovering alcoholics. He is the youngest of 7, oldest sibling is 17 years older than he. His next sibling up is 5 years. I believe his childhood has something to do with how he behaves now. Oh well, I can't fix/change him. <P>He used to be a nice guy. The guy who knew everyone, liked everyone and everyone liked him. He would help anyone out anytime. <P>Today, he picked up kids. Asked how the water system was working. This is about the 4th time he has asked about it. I said again, Fine. He changed the filters on Tues. He had a somewhat not so happy/not so sad face. Just sort of there face.<P>YOu know, I know life is hard. I am sure it could be worse, with sickness and all that stuff. It just irks me , for all the BS, that people just want life to go but when it gets really tough, they run away. It is so easy to just get out when you've had enough. I am curious if the people who escaped by divorce thought later on in life that life is soooo much better now. HMMMMM.<P>Well, got to go read now.<P>Hopelessmom

Hopelessmom,<P>from the sound of your words, you need to both do the reading, as much as you can, and do your own counseling, to uncover your own personal issues, and to decide what kind of person you wish to be.<P>Everyone is a combination of genetics, FOO imparted values, and personality. do you understand the value system that was imparted to you from your family of origin? what characteristics did it demonstrate? do you know what MBTI <BR>personality you are, and your Husband? once you learn that, you can understand His motivation, his way of thinking, etc.<BR>also, you can understand your method of thinking, etc.<P>What genetics have been imparted upon you? such as good memory? poor memory? what chips do you have on your shoulder? physically, how do you rate? <P>there are alot of variables that go into you and your relationships. it is very interesting to think through the variables, and see how they affect you.<P>did you come from a traditional family, or divorced family? was your family of origin dysfunctional? how? how does it compare to your H's famliy values? was your marriage a rebound relationship? did you marry young? what resentments do you have from your life? what deficiencies in education do you have, both social and academic?<P>what was your relationship with your parents? your parents with their parents?<P>the reason for all the questions is that there are a ton of variables in this quest to understand yourself, and these just start to scratch the surface. however, IMO, there are two routes you can go to understand yourself, counseling or your own reading/analyzing.<P>what would work the best for you?<P>

Hi Hope,<P>Just a small suggestion. When I was feeling similar to you, I took the Emotional Needs questionnaire and found out how much of my needs were not being met by H. Is was an eye opener. I did not think I had many needs, but I did. <P>That one hit me right in between the eyes. Now I had a place to focus my attention on what I could work on. <P>Can any of this help you?<P>L.

I have done reading but I guess I have to do more. My H told me I was not a giver. But I gave of myself to him mostly but he didn't recognize it. I give to my children but not to him. Now it is too late to give to him again. <P>I read and did the EN and LB ? and learned alot. I value honesty, family and others but these 2 are not going to happen with H now. My family now is me and the kids.<P>I need to focus on them and me. It is hard with them being so young. 2 more years and youngest will be five. Then maybe more time for me. Something for me. I guess I have to get over that something for me is not selfish.<P>I did MBTI. I guess I good place to start is to really decide what kind of person I want to be and make a plan on getting there. It is hard when my whole last year in therapy has been my H betrayal. It has been almost 1 year since Dd and I think that the A with ow #1 was at least 6-9 months prior to my dd. I just realized that, although, can not say for 100% certainty. That makes me feel like a stupid A$$. Anyway, besides the roller coaster of the destruction of my marriage, I have to help protect and take care of my kids, and somehow become a better person. Sometimes I feel like I need everything to happen now. I know it doesn't work that way. I guess my whole world has turned upside down. <P>Hopelessmom

Hi Hope,<P>Just wanted to let you know I was thinking about you and your family today. Sounds like you are working towards the acceptance stage. I am almost there myself. Some days feel better than others. <P>I remind myself what others have told me that I am the one that can allow what goes on around me to affect me. Also, I am the one who can control where my life goes. Others (including H) can influence my decisions but I am the final decision maker. <P>That thought does not always remove my problem just sizes down to something easier to manage. You and your children are your world now. The same for me. H is on the outside looking in. We are on the inside watching. <P>Take care, <BR>L.

Not all is hopeless, Mom, maybe your marriage, but not your life, and not your single parent family.<P>The Harley books discuss behavioral problems and solutions to typical marriage problems. However, those solutions are designed to teach you marriage skills that weren't taught to you for whatever reason.<P>However, alot of the bad habits were either learned from your FOO, or not taught in FOO, as well as your social developmental years growning up.<P>I will give you a personal example. My parents were upper middle class, they believed very strongly in education as the best gift they could provide their kids. all of us went to private, expensive boarding schools. ok, i am extremely well educated, BUT I have ZERO social education, since between age 13 and 22 I lived, worked, studied and played with all guys, zero girls or woman, all through prep school and military college. I have academic and athletic achievements, but how does that help a marriage?<P>I am currently learning what i was never taught and never exposed to due to my atypical childhood. I can cope very well with business, work, play, just not the opposite sex, but i am getting better. It doesn't help that my personality type doesn't rate highly on being socially graceful.<P>When I went to grad school at age 30, WOW! it was like i was dropped into a liberal arts college at age 20! did a number on my psyche, some for the good, some for the not so good! lots of attractive single women, all like myself, i won't go much further <P>so what i am asking you to think about is your childhood development, what events had a big impact on you, what values were you taught? were your parents depression era parents? etc. how well did you learn coping skills?<P>all this comes from personal individual therapy to understand who you are, and why you are the way you are. This is only done to accept yourself, and forgive yourself on short of your shortcoming, since if you were taught by exposure in your family of origin, not your fault, just existential luck of the draw.<P>after coming to terms with yourself, you can move forward very easily, because when you understand where traits etc come from, you more easily have the ability to try to change them, or at least realize how to change.<P>it may be too late for your marriage, but NEVER, NEVER too late for making you a great person.<P>good luck,<P>and its not as hopeless as you think, jut alot tougher. now, how did your family values teach perseverance? or did they teach conflict avoidance?

Hopelessmom,<BR>you sound like a female version of me. I too didnt plan A. I started in divorce mode too, even though i didnt want it. And Plan B would not work for me either, cause i think she is glad that she will not be seeing me anymore.<BR>And my wife told me that she didnt think i showed her enough love, and that i didnt kiss her enough, or hug her enough. and I thought i always showed her love. She never had to cook, i did all that, and i did anything she asked of me. Go figure. <BR>She grew up in a family where she was not allowed to go many places and not allowed to date. So she has always needed other people to show her attention. I guess that she started getting the level of attention she thought she needed from the OM.<BR>Good luck. and Try to do something nice for yourself.<P>------------------<BR>Experience is what you get when you don't get what you want.