Finally got a chance to talk to stbx and get some of my questions answered. It was enlightening to say the least and leaves me feeling better overall.<BR> According to him he broke up our relationship because I did not push him hard enough to change or to move forward in his career. That I "let" him stay in his old job too long and that I didn't make him do better in life. I allowed him to be a loser and that he needs more in his life and the OW can change him.<BR> He told me he married me because he felt he owed it to me after all those years(unlike honesty which I was not owed apparently)and that maybe the problem would go away. (Personally this does not wash as he started his affair right after we married, he made no effort to make it work)That he did really love me at one time but I cannot give him what he needs(apparently a mommy who will hold his hand.)<BR> Well, I feel less like a loser and more like someone who escaped a sucking black hold of need. Why on earth does he believe anything or anyone can change another person from without? He refuses to take responsibilty for his own shortcomings and blames me for letting him let himself go. ??????<BR> I have to admit I went off on him today in a couple of e-mails. I'm damned tired of pussyfooting around him and trying to boost his ego. I told him that he's running away yet again from himself(he's done this before when he was younger) and placing blame on everyone around him but himself. That putting the onus on another person to "fix" him is unfair and rediculous and that he needs to face the fact that he needs therapy and to look at the problems and it's solutions in himself. I also told him that I never got close to his mother(this he used to yell at me for) because she is a dishonest person who marries older, lonely and often dying rich men for their money and then divorces them shortly after for a huge settlement; I find such behavior morally disgusting and well if you can't say something nice......<BR> Guys, I feel relief and so much better about myself. There was nothing I could do to fix any of this. The man has a gaping hole the size of the Grand Canyon in him and no person can fill it. He was raised by a decietful gold digger, abandoned at 16 to fend for himself(surprisingly they are close now, she began sniffing around as soon as he landed a good job.)never knew his father and has the worst self image in the world. All my "I love you's" and "I believe in you's" that I've given him over the years couldn't help him and neither will this divorce. Any of you who pray out there, pray for this man. He's hurt and is not doing anything to repair it and is merely self destructing as per usual. I'm so sorry for him and am worried for him. I don't think I'm in love with him anymore, quite honestly, but no one should be carrying around that sor of baggage without help.

You certainly had alot to say there, I feel good hearing you unload the truth, and not making excuses for his choices. You take care of yourself.<P>

It sounds like you have crossed that barrier from confusion and/or being compassionate for the person you are married to...to a reality check with how this person actually is. I know how it feels to lose the blinders and congratulate you. Don't slip back. It is great to hear how healthy you are about recognizing this is NOT your fault, as much as your H wants to blame you. YUK. Run as fast as you can.

Dear Nduli,<P>Sounds like you are crossing over to the acceptance stage. It is not always a one way trip but relieving some of the stress will help you deal with your issues better and even help your outlook. <P>What helped me get to that point was when I told my H that I no longer chose to accept his guilt on me for issues that he created. I would willingly take the blame for items I did cause or do but not his stuff. That took a load off my shoulders because H was making everything look like my fault. This shocker through him for a loop but he did it. In his e-mails to OW, he still blames me for some of the stuff, but hey, if he wants to lie to her and she wants to believe it, that's up to them. I will not be a part of it. <P>You are getting stronger. I will do what you ask and remember your H like I did mine. <P>Take care, <BR>L.<p>[This message has been edited by Orchid (edited May 06, 2001).]

Nduli2,<P>How are you feeling today?<P>I'm glad you two got all that out. Very helpful for you I'm sure. Still doesn't really make this mess any less painful to go through. <P>Your analogy to him being a sucking black hole of need was very good. I feel that my stbx is a bit that way as well. He is looking for someone to make him feel a certain way not realizing that it is only a temporary fix. He has some real issues from his past that he needs to face but he won't do it.<P>We, as the closest people to them, should be the one they turn to but instead they choose to run away and leave us hurting us a great deal in the process.<P>I will never fully understand all this. <P>Hope you are doing better today.<P>Take Care

It is amazing that he admits that he has such codependent tendencies. And it is very good that you see it too. You know that it has nothing whatsoever to do with you. That IS a relief. My ex cited some of the same reasons though not as drastic. He needed me to believe in him, and no matter what I did, it never seemed to be enough to squelch his insecurities. You can't love someone like that enough.

((((((((Nduli)))))))<P>These tired cryin eyes can't read all that without some paragraphs girlfriend <P>Anyhow I agree, we can't change someone else, only ourselves, I've always said that. And along with that, we can't look for a person to "change" us, thats our own job. And I almost wonder, after someone changes him, when he wakes up one day and realizes he's still not happy if he'll blame that person for not doing something right, or for controlling his life.<P>Its very easy to blame someone else, and justify whatever he wants from his affair. The bottom line, is that you deserve a better life, and I think you can start to heal either way with this info. You were doing good before until you found out he was single. Dont' let that be the only factor in your feelings for him. <P>I'm confused though, last I read he told your room mate to tell you not to talk to him again, right?<P>As confused as I am by the men in my life,yours is confusing too! <P>Hugs, Dana<BR>

Yup and then he turns around the next day and plays nice-nice.<P>On Mon. I had to drive down to were he is to take care of some business and I saw him. *shakes head* He's delusional. He stated that he finally found the one person that will make him completely happy forever, I told him no one can do that and he stated "well, I believe in those fairy tales". He said that the OW is pure in a way I will never understand and she knows what real love is and I never will. By me being hurt by all this and by not being happy for them I am selfish and psychotic. <P><BR> The house was covered in sparkly heart stickers from her(she's very much like a teenage girl) and she's been sleeping in my bed apparently. Messages on the answering machine for her. They break up on a regular basis it seems. I gleaned all this from our short conversation. He said that she was back in his life but that I was making their relationship a terrible one due to the situation and that I am still involved with him on some level. I laughed about that one.<P><BR>And then true to form; OW breaks up with him again that night because he talked to me. She's playing a game with him by holding him emotionally hostage and by pulling away anytime that he talks to me or expresses any feelings towards me. She does it under the guise of not being able to deal with him being a married man but I can see through that. She's a master manipulator just like his mother....gives me the shivers no end.<P><BR> I give up and I'm glad of it. He's a co-dependant jack off and I'm tired of being blamed for everything. He projects all of his weaknesses on me and you know what? OW can have him, I'm done.<P><BR> He wrote to me today apologizing for his words to me but it's a hollow apology just meant to calm his guilty consience. Let him have his fantasy land I know what the truth is.<P>[This message has been edited by Nduli2 (edited May 09, 2001).]<p>[This message has been edited by Nduli2 (edited May 09, 2001).]

Nduli2,<P>Has your H just about drained your love bank or what? What a total jerk!<P>Sounds like he is the psychotic one. Once you are out of his life and gone bet the romance of a life time fizzles out with incredible haste.<P>It is so incredibly sad to see one we love(ed) so much do this, but now you have the opportunity to begin again with a clean slate. Your H on the other hand carries tons of baggage with him.<P>Good to hear you sound so strong Nduli2.<P>Take Care.

The old LB is at -10 now and all I can do is just sit back in awe at the denial and delusional behaviour of this man. I wouldn't want him back even if he came back on bended knee, crying tears of regret. He's got more problems than I'm qualified to deal with and I won't.

Hey, you sound great!<P>But, please know that you have permission to crash and fall! We're there for you. Draw on this strength but don't berrate yourself when you have your ups and downs... I hope and pray for steadfastness in your soul and spirit. <P>I do NOT know how you stand this?!<P>------------------<BR>We cannot do everything at once... but we can do something at once

Thanks. I can stand this because I am watching an emotionally weak man being used and manipulated by a vindictive, spoiled young woman. It's hilarious in a warped way. That he can't see it and ascribes the purest motives to her behavior shows me just how weak and dependant he is on her. Btw, I forgot to mention in the above post, while we were at the house talking he kept excusing himself to go into the bedroom and e-mail her. I know it is her he was talking to because he practically burst a blood vessel when I asked him about it.<P><BR>He's a bad liar.<P>It's all so pathetic and he's being led around like a little lap dog. Any dignity the man had in my eyes is gone and it's really hard to love someone that you have no respect for.<p>[This message has been edited by Nduli2 (edited May 09, 2001).]

Oh man... I'm sorry to say this as it's not good to bad-mouth your stbx but GIVE ME A BREAK!? What is up with that kind of behaviour? How old is he?<P>------------------<BR>We cannot do everything at once... but we can do something at once

He's never been very good at handling his own affairs and so I'm sure the OW is utilizd often when it comes to making decisions for him. He just turned 30 in January but he acts like he just turned 12.