Remember last week when I was really upset about my H wanting to take our kids camping with the OW because he thought it would be a "healing" experience for our kids?<P>He backed out on all our verbal agreements, and refused to sign a letter that laid all those agreements out in black and white. <P>I've been quietly in the background, trying to negotiate with my H - strictly via email (I've cut contact with him as much as possible). But at the same time, I've been getting my ducks in order to file for temporary orders regarding visitation. My atty told me that it would probably end up with me, H, and the OW in counseling together, and psych evals for all of us. I was willing to go that route if necessary...<P>However, this morning, after hearing all day yesterday from my H that his fax machine was some how mysteriously sending out faxes that didn't get received on my end (kinda like the deposited check that was forever "not cleared yet")....I called H, and simply told him that I was coming into his office to pick up the letter in person. <P>I prayed the entire hour long drive to his office.<P>I walked in, and he quietly signed it!!!!!<P>Ok, its probably not legally binding, BUT, it's definitely something that I can give to a judge to support my request to keep my H's OW and various bimbos away from my kids!!!<P>I've got a copy in my atty's office already!!!<P>Here's the letter I got him to sign:<P>May 17, 2001<BR> <BR>I. I, H, will not bring our children, S, A and I, into the presence of OW until after our divorce and annulment are finalized.<P>II. We, H and BR, both agree that we will not involve our children, S, A, and I, to any other love-interest before our divorce is finalized. <P>III. We, H and BR, both agree that we will not have a love-interest sleepover, or overnight vacations with a love-interest when the children, S, A and I, are present.<P>IV. We, H and BR, both agree to avoid perpetuating conflict; no 3rd parties should be present/participate in the exchange of children without mutual agreement.<P>V. We, H and BR, both agree that we will not leave our children, S, A, and I, alone or overnight with any person or persons that we do not both previously agree upon. The other parent will be given adequate notice (24 hours) before leaving the children alone with any individual(s) that have not yet been agreed upon by both parents.<P>VI. We, H and BR, both agree that when taking the children out of town, a basic itinerary (hotels, addresses, residences, etc) and phone number will be provided to the other parent.<P>Stipulations I-IV are in the best interest of the children to allow them time to emotionally adjust to the divorce and dating life of their parents. Stipulation V-VI is for the physical safety of the children.<P>This document does not encompass the entirety of our visitation arrangements, and does not address all of the issues regarding custody and visitation. This document is meant to lay some initial ground rules. Further additions and agreements may be added at a later date.<P>---------------------------<P>Thank you On*My*Own for giving me some good ideas for stuff in this letter. I blatantly plaguerized from you!!

Hi B Rose, <P>Good letter.<P>L.<BR>

BR...<P>I hope and pray you've got a good attny!!!<BR>...and can make it stick!<P> <P>Jim

thanks Orchid and Jim!!<P>I think my atty is pretty good - and better yet...my H doesn't have an atty, and at least right now, doesn't intend to hire one. I'm sure that at some point, that will change - the OW he's involved with will make sure of that. But then again...the atty she sent him to last summer....made MY atty laugh out loud when he heard who it was, and told me that my H had picked a "salmon", not a shark <P>At least I have something to fight with now though. Thank God! I can't tell you how relieved I feel.<P>But you know what is the best? I met a Benedictine monk online a couple of days ago. He just sent me a IM out of the blue. And he added my H to their devotions at the abbey - last night he told me that they were praying for H yesterday - so I am sure, that had something to do with it!<P>The abbey is in Morristown...not far from me at all, so I am headed out there on Saturday for mass and lunch with the brothers! <P>------------------<BR><I>Pain is a given, misery is optional.</I>

Don't know the circumstances, but there's a real sense of gearing up to fight and get nasty here. Maybe I'm way off, so please correct me. I've done the same, very recently. But I do try to remember not to act out of hurt or anger. I do think intersts all the time: mine, the kids, and his too. And try to figure where they all overlap. <P>Don't let sharks call the shots!<P>Try mediation: can you? Saves dough and it's more real.

Gonemad:<P>I'm not interested in his interests. And it's not about vindictiveness or hurt. It's about consequences for his choices, choices that involved his decisions to leave his wife and children for another woman, and to continue drinking. (I told him no reconciliation without AA or some other form of help - he declined and went back to the OW).<P>This is a woman who I have to protect my family from. She is the reason I filed for divorce in the first place...not because I was angry about her (although I am and was) but because she is a horrible influence on my H. <P>She broke up with him last year because he purchased my Jeep at the end of our lease. She did the footwork for my H of getting his mail diverted from our home, and a new bank account opened - in her town - 30 miles from where he lived....<P>I have an 8 page "battle plan" that she wrote up for my husband....<P>So yes, I'm adverserial. I am protecting myself and my children from his choice to turn his life and his decisions over to this woman. <P>Here are some choice quots from the OW's battle plan for my H to fight me:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><BR> You are going to need to open TWO separate checking accounts at TWO different financial institutions. Into the first you will deposit your paycheck and any other checks you receive. Into the second you will deposit CASH ONLY, drawn from the second account, in amounts to cover: (1) Child Support; (2) Mortgage; (3) Utilities; (4) BellAtlantic; (5) AT&T Long Distance; (6) Debt Counselors of America; (7) and any other expenses you will be paying for in relation to the house and/or the children. <P>You will be conducting any and all business regarding both<BR>accounts via hard copies of checks, deposit slips, etc. so a paper trail may easily be established and introduced to protect you in Court. <P>You MUST refrain from using Direct Deposit or electronic<BR>transfer IN ANY FORM until the divorce is finalized. The Courts love paper trails and documentation they can touch. Print-outs of electronic transactions just won't cut it in Family Court!!! Besides, with your ex-wife's sneaky, back-stabbing and intrusive nature -- aside from her obsession with hacking into your personal cyberlife -- you need to cover your [censored]! <P>This may seem like an inconvenience on the surface but, trust me -- you have to get into this. I can help with any running around and completing errands if you need me. <P>Rationale: Any idiot, once they know (or even SUSPECT)<BR>the name of your bank, can get a Subpoena issued to the institution for any and ALL records they have for ANY transactions you've engaged in and the bank must, by law, surrender these records. This includes records from<BR>before a merger! I know about this first hand; I've done it and I'm certainly no idiot. <P>This information is then used to sink you in Court. It's an excellent weapon. Remove it from your adversary's arsenal before they even think to use it against you. <P>Before you answer in haste, better sniff around . . . We're dealing with a sociopath here and our safety can ever be left to assumption. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Fortunately, all this stuff is sitting on my Lawyer's desk now <P>But THIS is why I am not being sweet and nice. I am giving my H every chance to work things out with me privately...hence the letter I posted above. We worked that out without lawyers. But if he wants to take away my ability to take care of our children, or flaunt his immoral choices in front of our children - yep - he's gonna have a fight. <P>I'm simply collecting information, preparing my case, researching everything, and making sure that I have every possible option I can think of. I don't have to use everything I have, and I won't choose to fight him if I don't have to. <P>But no one messes with my kid's well being....<P>Oh yeah...notice the sociopath comment? Nowhere in that email was the slightest expression of concern for my H's kids living with me....she was purely worried about herself. If I really was a sociopath...how irresponsible and selfish on her part....<BR>

bump - this has some good information

D.

BR-

Gear up. Pray hard and bunker down. Sounds just like my fight here. And about the sociopath part...They will just try to find anything that they think will help their arguement. They know the affair is wrong. Leaving your wife and kids is wrong. Camping and overnight visits is damn wrong.

And this is also soooooo similar. Darth's OW1, Ms. Monkeyho, is a pharmaceutical sales rep. NOT educated in medicine or in a clinical background, JUST A SALES BACKGROUND. And early last year, I get a thirty page copied from some web site about "bpd" alluding to that I had borderline. Darth wouldn't know what that was or where to go to find such articles. And it was from a health website. Any ideas here? Came from Ms. Monkeyho herself. About everyone I've ever met had at least one or two of the criteria. And I've been confirmed NOT TO HAVE THAT OR ANYTHING ELSE.

However I did suffer and still do from WSM. for novices here, that's WAYWARD SPOUSE MIGRAINES.

She is a toughie. Very enabling to your WH. He is going to be a very foggy one too. Buy you have to be tough. HE has to hit rock bottom before and if he ever changes. Mine isn't hit bottom yet and it will not be in time before we are divorced. So I am onward. Hurting, but moving onward.

God bless. Stay tough. THis will pass soon enough. Document everything and keep a diary and immediately forward any emails or IM's from him to lawyers for their filing and records. You have to show the trail. Take a few words from his mistress and like ju jitsu--USE HIS FOG AGAINST HIM NOW.