I've been on the EN board for awhile now--over a year. My H and I have been discussing divorce lately--actually, we've discussed it on and off for a long time. I've been up practically all night, so if this doesn't make much sense it's the sleep deprivation!!<P>My biggest concern: our 4 year old daughter, who is very close to both of us. How in the world will she ever understand if we decide to divorce??? So, do you stick it out in an unhappy marriage for a child? Or not? How does one decide???????!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We don't have any abuse/affair issues.<P>Also, is joint-custody better, so she can see both parents a lot, or should I fight for sole-custody, so she'll have more consistency and routine???????<P>Help, please! I'm emotionally and physically exhausted. How does the impending pain ever go away when you are facing this????????<P>I'd rather get divorced at 29 (now) then ten or fifteen years from now, when I'm older. That is, if divorce is going to happen at all.<P>We haven't really fallen out of love, we're just totally incompatible, and probably never should have married in the first place.<BR>

I don't really know how you make the decision. I guess you need to exhaust all of your options before you make that decision. Have you tried counseling? If you are BOTH willing to work on the marriage, I believe that incompatibility isn't even a factor. Your child does deserve the chance to be with both of you. Is infidelity a factor? Good luck.

I really don''t know how to answer this question, I never had the chance to BUT i do think that every stone must be turned over to save the marriage. You both obviously need some intervention with either counseling, retreats or whatever. As it stands now, your now marriage is over, BUT you have a chance to make a NEW marriage with your now H BUT that means CHANGE. CHANGE is difficult, scary and sometimes painful. I would pick a time frame, a year, and work, work work work and then PERHAPS, make a decision to SEPARATE. Separation does not equal divorce. THere are many books on what separation is and how it can be effective in leading to healing and "remarriage"<P>GOD hates divorce and so do I. I believe it is the cancer of our society. All marriages must face a CRISIS to become stronger and better. Use this as an opportunity to face that crisis. You will have to reach down into your being and find strength , courage, commitment and a lot of other things you didn't know you have because divorce WILL make you find them in a time when you are emotionally almost incapable of finding it but you must. You are not OLD and what will one more year do to your life. It might make it better. I am sure that if you look at the birth of your child and now she is 4, how quickly time flies. 365 days. DON'T rush it.<P>I am in the divorce process, unwillingly, with 3 small kids. 3,4,and 5. <P>There is a difference between custody of the child and visitation of the child. Two separate issues.<P>go read a book about divorce and families and its impact financially, emotionally and for your child. It is an eye opener.<P>Take care and come here for help also.<P>hopelessmom<P>sdfghjiiy

Thanks for the replies.<BR>Unfortunately, I know the impact of divorce. I just watched my brother go through it ( he fought a custody battle to the tune of $30k.)<BR>That is why I didn't get any sleep last night. I'm afraid that is what is going to happen.<BR>I know custody and visitation aren't the same, but they are often tied together. <BR>I will try another year, I guess. We really need counseling, though. Hope I can get my H to go. <P>And, there is that lingering fear.....that I'm just going to get dumped when our daughter turns 18, anyway, so I might as well get it over with............

I believe when there is children involved, you need to give it your best effort. You need to try. Exhaust all efforts first before even thinking of making a decision.<P>Children are taught how to handle anger, how to handle conflict. We were taught, and we're teaching our children. We maybe were not taught in the right way. Those things we need to recognize and teach our children in the right way. Teach her that trying is worth something before giving up. Teach her that people can learn from one another, to live with one another, to work together. Teach her that divorce isn't the only solution. And the Harley's really are right. Anyone really can fall in love. But it is work.<P>Start phone counseling with the Harley's and maybe give yourself a time frame before revisiting the topic of D again. Like a good year. It definitely takes work.<P>Personally, I think divorce breeds more divorce. Children of divorce are more likely to get divorced themselves. And it's probably because that's how they learned to deal w/ problems in relationships and the emphasis on marital vows wasn't strong enough and had enough meaning to the people who took it.<P>We have a 4 year old too. Our child psychologist does recommend that at her age the best thing for her is to wake up in the same house day after day. That consistency is important at this age. I have thought about it too, and if push came to shove, I would file for full custody w/ plenty of visitation rights. There is no way I would ever keep my girls from their father. But they are both too young to keep switching from home to home.<P>We are trying. I believe. We aren't all for it, but we are doing counseling w/ the Harleys. There are plenty of points we argue with them. We don't always necessarily see their methods as all that feasible. But we are willing to try it anyways. We don't think we're in love. But we're both very much in love w/ our children and I think we'd do anything to provide them a loving household. Even try to fall in love again.<P>I believe that staying together "for the children" is a perfectly valid reason -- initially. But, you have to work on yourselves too and your relationship and gain good feelings out of it as well. Feelings like love.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jmv:<BR><B>And, there is that lingering fear.....that I'm just going to get dumped when our daughter turns 18, anyway, so I might as well get it over with............</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I recently completed an anger management class and I would highly recommend something of a similiar nature in your area. I took mine through my health insurance.<P>But what you stated above is self talk. Everyone has self talk going on all the time. One very key lesson we covered was how to tune into your self talk and to understand how that can affect your attitudes and behaviors.<P>Here's an example. We were separated when our second child turned 1 year. I decided at the last minute to throw a party. I was indecisive about inviting my husband, "He wouldn't want to come anyways. He'd feel uncomfortable around my friends. I'd feel uncomfortable around him. What would my family and friends be thinking." All sorts of self talk I went through. End results, I asked him, but I asked him in such a neg way that he answered negatively. I learned later, when I was able to reinvite him in a more positive way that he really did want to come the first time, but the way I had asked really turned him sour. Thankfully, we were doing this lesson on self talk right around the time of my party, so I really was able to apply it positively and understand why I was feeling the way I was feeling.<P>I don't know if I have any references on self talk. I would try to look up stuff on anger management or possibly assertiveness training. But it definitely colors one's world.<P>Good for you. Give yourself a year and work on change. Know that first and foremost you can only change yourself. But, you'd be surprised at how those changes can be "infectious." Definitely get some guidance, even if it's just for yourself. Steve Harley gave me a good quote, "Can one person save a marriage? No. It definitely takes two people. Can one person get the ball rolling? Yes, definitely. That's all it takes." So, start doing your homework, get your ball rolling, and make the grass greener. If anything, you'll feel better about yourself in the long run.<P><BR>