Sorry this is long. Nowhere else to turn & nothing left except more pain. I've been avoiding him, staying away,etc. <P>Big ugly fight. Subject upsetting me greatly. I did not curse though!<P>Where do I go from here? Back to the darned version of a "Plan A" that I cant get a grasp on? Work on myself, make him feel safe? HOW??? He wont let me meet his emotional needs & I can only guess what they were. He used to love my cooking but now stuff sits in the fridge untouched until yesterday he must've been starving & finally ate part of it. I don't want him to think I've accepted getting divorced & don't want to stop trying to do things for him. I feel sorry for somehow hurting him & when hes not furiously angry I can see his pain & fear & insecurity. But he wont let me in! He's afraid I guess to trust me again & I cant prove to him how much I am sincere. God help me. <P>Words of wisdom??<p>[This message has been edited by cantletgo (edited June 04, 2001).]

X<p>[This message has been edited by cantletgo (edited June 01, 2001).]

cantletgo,<P>Once again I don't have the time to resond to your post like I should but wanted you to know that I read it and feel so sorry for all the stuff your H is putting you through.<P>No one deserves to be treated like he is treating you.<P>More than anyhting I get the feeling that your H is really confused and dealing with a lot of stuff hinself and he is taking his frustrations out on you.<P>Take Care CLG, I will post more later.<P>((((((((((((((((hugs))))))))))))))))

anyone? Please respond! I'm starting to flip out. <BR>She's in his office again too, but thats in the other thread with the same title.

Cantletgo:<BR>You HAVE to "accept it" as he says in the fights. You can't fight if you agree. It's a simple principle. Agree with him each time he says something. It will get easier. He just needs affirmation that he is still valued ( although in his own eyes, he thinks he's a dog, ...self-loathing and all that).<P>That having been said, STOP DOING HIS LAUNDRY! He wants the divorce, he's a big boy, let him do his own!<P>Of course it hurts, but you need to make him see that if he wants the divorce, you won't fight him. Turn the tables on him, remind him to see a lawyer, get things organized. Ask him if he'll be "nice" about it.<P>You don't say waht the "same ol' discussion" is. Is it the seperate accounts? Why not, if he's prepared to be fair about it? Don't make him "pay" for what he's done, not if you still want him. There must be a reason he says " why do you still want me if I'm such a bad person". There must be something judgemental in what you're saying or doing. Remember WS are extremely sensitive and defensive when still in the "fog" of their A's.<P>I have more, but I'm tired and must go.....<BR>Chin up!<BR>muzohead

Dear Clg,<P>First off, breathe. Can't do much unless you do. Now calm down a little. This stuff with OW in his office has happened before. Prepare for the worst and you will make it through it. <P>You are trying to juggle everything at once and find some sort of logic. Listen!!!! There is no logic. <P>Next, you are not responsible for his inabilities. When he says that, just look at him and ignore those silly words. Let them slide off your shoulder. <P>Then, when confrontation issues come up (like OW in the office), know they will happen. Play act ahead of time to be prepared. When it does, you will know who to act cool or at least give a good impression. Hey, I was accused of being 'business like' and messing up OW's plans. It works!!!!<P>Finally, you are better than both of them right now. You can be there to help your H but the OW is not your family member. Just discard her presence as if she were a TV show you can turn off and on when YOU chose. <P>There, breathe again and then post. <P>L.<BR>

trying to erase the past I guess<p>[This message has been edited by cantletgo (edited June 04, 2001).]

I am SO sad for you. I have felt everything you're going thru so long ago (as many of us here have) and hate to hear the pain in people at the point you're at. It is horrible. I don't know what to say. I don't have any strategies. I tried everything also, I got "thru" to him MANY times and she was always able to manipulate him her way. Of course, that's when I found out that affairs were my X's normal way of life (and boy was I clueless on that) and that the war she was winning was going to be a bitter victory for her in a very short time (and I was right, he is definitely messing around on her too and just using her for a place to live and a playtoy). And by the way, the whole time I was clueless because while he was screwing around for 15 years from day 1 of our marriage (probably even the 6 years before), we also had the same kind of snuggly relationship, love letters, songs - while all that was going on behind my back. Then suddenly I was the one to blame for everything, controlling, couldn't do anything right in his eyes.<P>We divorced. I hate how I feel. What could have been. All those dreams of getting old together with grandchildren. But my dreams and world weren't real, he was living a double life. I guess the world that crumbled around me turned out to be one I could do without. Doesn't mean I don't love him still, like the song says, sometimes it just isn't enough. Yours seems hell bent to me. All I can say is let him go. Sometimes after they leave, and it may take a while, they discover it's not so green there. Do not trust him to take care of anything. I had all kinds of promises of him taking care of us and keeping us in the same lifestyle, blah blah blah. The man tried to literally destroy me and the kids (I have NO income). Doesn't mean you have to file, but if he wants it let HIM do it, but don't make agreements without a lawyer before the fact and definitely talk to one if he starts making moves on the money and selling/destroying things.<P>He is on a path for self-destruction and it's unfair, but he's taking you with unless you cut yourself loose. I don't want to seem so doom and gloom, but there is no way to force him to see he's being an idiot. The only way he'll see that is with time, and that could be a few years away. Right now, about all I think you can do is say calmly and from your heart to him one last time that you love him, really love him, and watching him self-destruct is the hardest thing you have ever had to witness - but you'll be there for him to fight for your marriage when he's ready to be the husband you've loved for so long, so much that he's in your very cells, and that God made him to be! Really, what more can you do? You can't strategize him back, that's mind games. It'll back fire on you and make her "case" stronger.<P>I know it's like giving in - but you can't fight for a marriage all by yourself. You're banging your head against the wall. Your best fight I think is letting him know you're there for him when he's ready to try.<P>But what the H do I know, I'm divorced now. I am seeing changes in mine tho. The vicious man that was out to destroy me - recently, I caught him in a moment of being choked up while looking at me walking holding my youngest son's hand. I believe he now is realizing he's a jerk and what he threw away compared to what he now has - nothing. It takes time. There is no overnight way to fix it. (Guess what, I'd never have him back in a million years now).<P>Take care.<P>------------------<BR>Kathy

copied msg from here to new post "How do I turn off this thinking?"<p>[This message has been edited by cantletgo (edited May 31, 2001).]

Sorry I have not been here more for you this week.<P>I am dealing with a lot of anger towards my STBX this week and feel I am not in a good place to give advice. STBX is asking for info he needs to fill out D papers and it really had me pissed.<P>I think it is good that you are seeking therapy. It will help. Your therapist should be able to help you deal with all the crap that your H is putting you through.<P>Take Care.<P>

Hopeless:<BR>Sorry to hear that? So H has filed? or is there some sort of application first? Can you tell him do it by himself if thats what he really wants? I hope it gets better. <P>(Ha ha, I typed 'beer' instead of 'better' at first. I think my unconcious mind wants numbing!! But actually, I dont drink.)

Yes he has filed and yes they are the real papers.<P>He moving forward so he can go see his OW in Norway with D in process. UGH!!!!!<P>I hate all this and never wanted the D but there was no stopping it once he made up his mind what he wanted (ie called ow to see if see was still interested in him).<P>My STBX has become the most self centered, jacka$$ on earth and I hope he ends up a miserable old man. I hope the OW does the same thing to him as he did to me so he knows what it feels like!!!!!!<P>See like I said I'm having some anger issues this week.<P>I will read your other post.<P>Take Care.

Hello cantletgo ---<P>I don't think I've ever responded to you before.<P>It sounded to me as if things are very tense and prone to conflict right now. And I do remember seeing postings from you where you say that you have lost it.<P>I was wondering, with all the conflict and stress that you are currently dealing with, what have you done for you? You specifically.<P>I'm really wondering if you have been to see a psychiatrist. Perhaps medication could help you to handle the current problems in a calmer fashion. <P>Parts of what you say sound quite familiar to me. But it took seeing a good Dr. and getting on the correct medication before I was able to begin to breakdown and understand the destructive cycle that was taking place......and I'm still peeling layers off the onion.<P>~Amy