H brought kids home on sun nite. Oldest (5) says in front of both of us, Daddy, you love mommmy don't you. He says,,yes D i love mommy, Pause... But not that way. I care about mommy. She looks at me and says, you love daddy too. I don't respond and push (slightly) out the door because other kids were crying and screamming for Daddy.<P><BR>I put them in bed and he calls to see how they are. I say that is how it is in divorce land. Kids crying and screaming to have daddy stay and not go away. He then says, I do care about you..Is that Okay. I said I had to go be with the kids. <P>What am I supposed to say to that. Of course I could think of answers but they would all come out in a sarcastic tone. <P>So, he still loves me and cares for me but doesn't want to be married to me. I guess that makes sense doesn't it. LOL<P>I also found out from my 4 year old that they all went to visist OW's dead husband (died feb2000) grave site. H took out kids. Now isn't that just pleasant.<P>The more things that he does that I don't think are "normal" or the best interest of our kids, the more I can't stand him. I actually feel sorry for my kids to have a Dad that is the way he is. I am starting to feel less and less sorry for him. HE will have to live with the repurcussions of his choices and actions. That is no longer my problem nor my job to be a part of Dadddy's and his kids relationship. <P>Hopelessmom

My stbx says the same thing to my kids.....Loves mommy and still cares for her.<P>I think it only confuses them as they don't understand why he is leaving. <P>He just is too much of a coward to take responsibility. Also a huge conflict avoider and wants to just gloss over the real issues and make it seem like what he is doing is a huge favor to me.

Hey you 2, <P>Those words of your Hs to your children will come back in there ears in the near future if not already. Children have a way of reminding you of things at what appears to be the most inopportune times. <P>Your little ones may be having a greater impact on your H's than you realize. Mine said a few words that cut right to the heart. I know you all know my story. <P>So let your children say how they feel and have the H hear it, know about it and deal with it. The conclusions your kids come to will appear to be different logic from your but in reality, it is similar. They just don't have our prejudices and insight. Kids speak from the heart to the heart. <P>I am glad you both posted. Please take care. I've been thinking about both of you. <P>L.<BR>

sorry dbl post<p>[This message has been edited by Discovery2000 (edited June 06, 2001).]

Greetings,<P>I don't post or read here very often but, This topic caught my eye.<P>In our case it's our grand child that says what's in her heart.<P>She is very much in tune with what's going on. We are/were very close to all our grandkids and eachother. Our 5yr old grand daughter, "Miss Ashley" has come out with some real doozies! <P>The lastest being some weeks ago we took her grocery shopping (we are seperated but see eachother and do things together. My "H" is WS, "A" is over now for 6mos. no contact for the last 2mos. (they had <B>some</B>phone contact after the "A" ended. Now "I" am having the tough time commiting to "him" LCB). Anyway, I'm pushing the cart down the isles. She says in a very loud voice, "Pa, do you love Grammy?" I'm silent.......once again "Pa, Do you hear me? Do you love Grammy?" I cart Miss Ashley aside and tell her that we can talk about it later. This was not good enough for her. "I just want to know if Pa loves you." <P>I told her that Pa doesn't love me anymore but, We both love her very much and that will never change. And we will still do things together.<P>Now Pa comes over and starts pushing the shopping cart. I go looking for yogurt. I see pa and Miss Ashley talking at the end of the isle. Suddenly I hear her little voice. "You do?! Well lets go tell her...Grammy thinks you don't love her...let's go tell her you do love her! GRAMMY....GRAMMY...Pa loves you!<P>Kids...ya gotta love'em.<P>d2k

Well, 9 yo d asked me if i love mommy, and I said "Yes, but she treated me very badly with her behavior!" This statement also reinforces the same statement i make to children that i love them and won't give up on them, but their behavior needs alot of improvement. Plus, i have set up positive incentives for expected behavior, which i was brought up with, which X was not not, and therefore has unreal expectations and no goals.<P>and this was after 9 yo d and I had one of her fights, and i finally convinced her that she was treating her friends that she <I> likes </I> better than the dad that she <B> loves </B>. They have a hard time manipulating dad, and they hate it! but an easy time manipulating X. Now that made a big impact, and she started to cry and see that the rules in my house are made to structure and improve communication skills, not the type that X used to display. And the rules are designed to encourage responsibility and coooperation and contribution to a common family cause FIRST, and a common external cause SECOND.<P>Its all how you communicate and that takes alot of practice. Patience takes practice, speaking/communication to get the correct answer and to get the correct understanding takes alot of practice, and life is hard, and full of problems, and you have to learn problem solving skills or the problems get bigger and bigger.<P>Hopelessmom, I suggest that you think about an answer that reflect inappropriate behavior, which is true, so that the kids learn that you won't NOT love them if they make behavior mistakes.<P>remember, we need to live our life as our example for our kids to learn and remember. We are shaping our kids lives every single day we parent by example.<P>

How's this for a child's logic: Daddy says he loves Mommy, but he left us. He didn't leave because of Mommy, so it must be <I>my</I> fault.<BR>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GnomeDePlume:<BR><B>How's this for a child's logic: Daddy says he loves Mommy, but he left us. He didn't leave because of Mommy, so it must be <I>my</I> fault.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P><BR>BINGO!<BR>That's exactly what my D did. <BR>So I told her that it wasn't her fault.<BR>Then she asked if it was daddy's fault. Now what am I supposed to say? If I say that it IS his fault, then I'll be accused of prejudicing his daughter against him. So I say that it isn't his fault. <BR>What do you think her conclusion was?<BR>It's my fault.<P>Great.<P>So then we had to have a big discussion about how things can happen and it's really nobody's fault....using the most elementary examples possible.<P>The kids are on the roller coaster ride too.<P>~Amy<BR>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by out of the fog:<BR><B>So then we had to have a big discussion about how things can happen and it's really nobody's fault....using the most elementary examples possible.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>So now the lesson being taught is that no one has any responsibility. <I>That's</I> a valuable lesson for a child to learn. <P>Kids <I>know</I> there's something wrong, and pretending that there isn't is a good way to build dysfunctions.<P>I don't know what to about the problem of "prejudicing" or turning a child against a parent. I really don't. Our country is in a very sad state when you risk losing your children over trying to teach them right from wrong, or even that there <I>is</I> a right and wrong. <BR>

GDP, <P>i saw this in action yesterday, when 9 yo daughter accidentally packed 12 yo's soccer cleats in her bag,<BR>and we couldn't find 12 yo's cleats. Once i figured out where they could be, i was right, and 9 yo felt bad, and<BR>first words from X's mouth to 9 yo d was, "It isn't your fault!"<P>My response was, "This is a lesson about what to do better."<P>It wasn't relieving her of being wrong, but it was telling her she can do better, and this is an example of why doing better works.<P>I never thought X would turn out this way, but WOW, she hates making the kids feel bad, or learning from mistakes in any way! And she is a teacher! I quickly lose faith in the teaching system in this country!<BR>