Is it terribly unhealthy to feel a sense of entitlement to your kids if your ex was the one who wanted divorce while you didn't?<P>My ex filed for divorce within a month of telling me she wanted out because she wasn't happy and she liked another guy. Our counselor nearly fell out of his chair when I told him she had filed; he wasn't expecting that so soon. I wanted to try to work it out by realizing where I had been a terrible husband (I read and learned a lot here). She said no way, she's out.<P>I now feel that since I was the one who wanted to keep us together, I should have more say about our daughter, or at least my daughter should stay with me more (we have joint custody, and our daughter currently stays with me a little bit more, but my ex says she wants it to be exactly equal once she buys a house). To put it another way, I'm not seeing my daughter as often as I'd like because my ex wanted out, so time she spends with her is a gift from me to my ex. Yet another way, if my ex wanted to see my daughter as often as she wanted, she should have at least *tried* to keep us together.<P>Steve Harley and I got into this issue a tiny bit, but not to any conclusion. I'm sure other betrayed spouses feel this way too, but is this a feeling I should struggle to remove? Am I not being fair? Am I being destructive?

Don't put your daughter in the middle...enjoy the time you have with her..

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ThornedRose:<BR><B>Don't put your daughter in the middle...enjoy the time you have with her..</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Yes, this is putting her in the middle, which I agree is bad. But I do have worries about this time dwindling because my ex has mentioned that society thinks a mom is the primary caregiver, so she should give most of the care. I mentioned this to Steve who said, "Society also thinks you shouldn't get divorced."<P>My ex feels very ashamed and guilty about the divorce; she used to say so explicitly. I think that puts pressure on her to show people how good a single mom she is.

You know, regarding the guilt and shame thing. It has crossed my mind that if our roles were reversed, and I felt my wife was so bad I couldn't take it any more, and then I filed for divorce right away and then immediately went to some woman I liked, I don't quite see how I could live with myself. If no kids were involved, I think I could live with myself, but with a young child...<P>I sometimes feel that a lot of her defensiveness (I sometimes make a comment about how our daughter behaves, and my ex gets angry and says I'm attaking *her*) and anger (that I've already talked about) is a result of that guilt and shame, and maybe I should understand that I would react the same way as she is.<P>Well, just a thought. Haven't decided how much I agree with it.

My mom did this crap to my dad, so I had a lot to work with. Mom left dad for OM taking us two boys with her. She eventually moved up 400 miles from our dad. The "love" with the OM (our step-dad) went away after about a year. It was a dead, miserable, marriage from there on out. The vast majority of the time my step-dad slept on the couch. My mom was a miserable person till the day she died of cancer.<P>So here I am. Wife wants divorce to be with OM. Knowing that the same scenario could happen to my daughter, I press for primary custody. (it is joint custody, but my daughter lives with me) I do everything possible to keep things as normal as possible for my daughter.<P>XW is totally guilt ridden and shamed. She can't handle not being the primary custodian because society thinks it should be that way. Nevermind that a few hundred years ago society gave custody to the father automatically.<P>I do not feel entitled since my XW wanted the divorce. I just want to see my daughter grow up and provide a healthy and happy environment for her. I was miserable living with my mother and the OM and not seeing my dad very much. My mom didn't give a damn about us boys. She was totally selfish. She often referred to us as "self-raised".<P>My XW is a great mother, but is totally unable to discipline our daughter (almost 5). My XW is a conflict avoider. I work to teach my daughter how to behave and work with my XW (as crazy as she is right now) to the best of my ability. Divorce is bad for spouses. Divorce is horrible for the kids. That's why I work so hard. <P>My XW is not able to move away from me thinking that it would help her shame and guilt because I am the primary custodian. If she did, she would have to make the entire trip to see our daughter.<P>I'm not sure where I'm going with this, but I've done my best to make things as good as I can for my daughter.<P>Kevin<P>

No, I think it's normal to feel entitled. My xH felt that way because I was the one that filed for divorce. However, in our situation it was very unpractical on his part. My children were ten, nine and three and he knew nothing about them. I was the 90% caregiver. When I asked him simple questions about what their favorite color was or the size clothes they wore or even their best friends, he had no idea. Nada, zip. He was fun, but when my three year old wolk up in the middle of the night from a nightmare, it was me she called for. My two oldest would follow him anywhere, but when they had a problem in school or needed advice, it was me they came to .<P>The one thing you need to ask yourself and be very honest, is, are you fighting to keep her because you really want her? Or is this an ego/I'm going to make you suffer trip? You talk about your daughter as though she were a possession. My xH did the same thing and YES, it was destructive to them and their relationship with him. It took me a lot of talking to convince them that their father was going through a rough time and really did love them and didn't mean to use them, because I feel it's important that he remain in their lives. <P>Something else you might want to think about, if you had a boy it might be a little different, but little girls always need their mothers and sooner or later there will be things you will not be able to deal with, especially as a male parent. This is not arrogance, this is truth.<P>Also, remember this, your 4.5 year old isn't just a child, she's a person and she will remember how her parents made her feel like a yo-yo. Don't use her in your tug-of-war. She's old enough to understand if you tell her that you will be available to her no matter what.

"I'm not sure where I'm going with this, but I've done my best to make things as good as I can for my daughter."<P>"Kevin"<P>Amen and happy Father's Day Kevin and to all that have posted! <P>Ragamuffin<P>