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My fellow church goer needs help. He walked out on his wife right before Xmas. Their one yr anniversary is 7/29 this year. He realized he should not have done what he did but is scared to face her. She has been a very loving and faithful wife. He needs to listen to his heart and not his older sister. She only met his wife twice. Because she has kids from a previous marriage. They think her kids would wreck the marriage. NOT SO! They love him and want him back.<BR>Please can you reg mail him and help encourage him to get back to his wife. He still loves her but can not face the guilt of what he has put her through. Holly Deserves to have her dream back. She has had a rough time as it is. Won't you help bring these two together? That would be a great present. I am sure his family would appreciate anything. SSG.Vincent Cipolla,319thMiBn Box 252, Ft.Bragg,NC 28307. He does not know why he left, just got scared. Please they could use all the prayers and encouragement. I have his reg address too. He would appreciate anything. What should he do? He needs to stick to his vows and go back to his wife. She has done nothing to deserve this. Help please. The more the better.<p>[This message has been edited by heavensangel (edited July 12, 2001).]

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Please invite him here. He can post his story on the Just found out board and take it from there. There is much support there and on the GQII site. Both men and women WS are there who are working on their marriages. There periodic visitors who may not be interested on working on their marriage but the for most part the attitudes are healthy and helpful. <P>L.<BR>

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What, then is Holly doing about all of this? Honestly, people don't just 'do' this, there are reasons...I cannot see how she is totally blameless. You have given no real information to work with. I mean, sure we can still pray a pretty generic prayer, and that would help a lot, but there are more issues here than big sister, and her manipulations, that much is evident.<P>You are doing a good thing, but I suspect that we will need to peel this onion quite a bit in order to shed light on the situation. You are a churchgoer, you know Satan loves the darkness, he doesn't want this to work, and has a wedge in there, its not just Holly's SIL, Holly has some things she needs to do, too. As does Vincent.<P>I will e-mail Vincent tonight with my thoughts...they are the same in any case, but yes, he needs to come here to be helped...marriage counseling by proxy on BOTH sides will NOT WORK.<P>God bless you for intervening in this, I only wish I had that same help prior to my D, help seemd to be on the OTHER side of that fence, but....<P>Take care. God is pleased with you, I am sure.

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by waiting_for_her:<BR><B>What, then is Holly doing about all of this? Honestly, people don't just 'do' this, there are reasons...I cannot see how she is totally blameless. You have given no real information to work with. I mean, sure we can still pray a pretty generic prayer, and that would help a lot, but there are more issues here than big sister, and her manipulations, that much is evident.<P>You are doing a good thing, but I suspect that we will need to peel this onion quite a bit in order to shed light on the situation. You are a churchgoer, you know Satan loves the darkness, he doesn't want this to work, and has a wedge in there, its not just Holly's SIL, Holly has some things she needs to do, too. As does Vincent.<P>I will e-mail Vincent tonight with my thoughts...they are the same in any case, but yes, he needs to come here to be helped...marriage counseling by proxy on BOTH sides will NOT WORK.<P>God bless you for intervening in this, I only wish I had that same help prior to my D, help seemd to be on the OTHER side of that fence, but....<P>Take care. God is pleased with you, I am sure.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by heavensangel:<BR><B> </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE> She was doing everything to get things right. You could ask a lot of people. It was mainly he was scared and instead of sticking to his vows he rather run. He is a mamas boy. His family was afraid that her kids would interfere in their marriage like his brothers former wife's kids did.The only thing Holly is guilty of if not letting go of the fear what her ex did to her. Vincent showed the same traits. And that scared her. So, she fought even farther to keep her marriage from getting that same way. She was afraid that he would walk out or cheat on her too. Holly tried to get them in counseling. She did everything. Even sought counseling after he abandoned her.<BR>He just wont tell her anything. No one does not understand why. I did talk to her kids. The two young kids and they want their other dad back home. I just thought that their one year anniversary is coming up. She should have this one wish that she always wanted. Someone that she loved would love her back the right way. So, as a God fearing person I am trying to help encourage them both to go to counseling. She wants more than anything for that. But it does take two.<BR>I just thought that if more people would encourage him to stick to his vows and send him good thoughts he may see that<BR>others are out there that believe it could work. She has been still is, very faithful to him even when they are separated. No papers are filed. So there is hope.<BR>positive energy and prayers they can get back together by the end of the month<BR>I want to give them that gift of hope too.<BR>That is all I am doing.<BR>Yes I am sure she has some part, however, he is to blame for most. He is scared. Can not face her due to his guilt.<BR>Everyone on post knows that. I appreciate if everyone that has a loving heart and believes in miracles, that this miracle can happen. Just both of them need to be in the same room and to talk to one another. She is willing but he cant seem to get to that point. Help them too please. God bless!<P><p>[This message has been edited by heavensangel (edited July 12, 2001).]

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by heavensangel:<BR><B> </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>This soldier left without telling her a reason. No logical reason that anyone knows about. She went beyond the call of duty trying to understand where he was coming from. No one in his unit will understand either. She has never lied to him. If he accused her of anything, there was nothing to back his accusations up. No proof. I am doing this for the children. They want their otherdad back home. I never said she was blameless, but in this situation, the most of the blame is on this man.He is very immature and never really had much experience in relationships. He is a good person andhe should be lucky to have a woman like her. THey are a good family. He just has a lot of guilt that he can not handle. Your prayers are needed. Thanks L<BR>

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Okay, that's a little better, but you still owe me a lot of information on what Holly has done SPECIFICALLY...back to that in a minute.<P>If Holly fears this is just like her first marriage, then it is highly likely that she is making the same mistake twice. She had better be very wary of that. She may be bringing baggage from the first marriage into this one. I'm not talking about the kids, but they can be a convenient excuse to a person ready to find fault. (Vincent's mother perhaps? Or sister?)<P>Where is Vincent's father in this? I see two things here that he may have culpability for. Vincent should know that when you take a wife you are not allowed to simply walk away from that committment, no matter how liberally you interpret scripture, Jesus never said if it doesn't make you happy, then divorce. If you claim to be a Christian, you have stated that Jesus is Lord of your life, and that means that you are not allowed to do what he has done. Also, his father has been remiss in his duty as spiritual leader by not making it clear to his family that when a man takes a wife, he leaves his family of origin (FOO), and is commanded to cleave unto her. His stepchildren are part of that. Children are another facet to the mix, but they (themselves) do not 'get between'. Sometimes, they attempt to divide and conquer to get their way, but that is not the same thing at all, it doesn't matter if they are stepchildren, adopted children, foster children, etc. They are children, and the relationship is dynamic. There are ways to make it work, but I will not get into that now.<P>Vincent needs to realize that his mother is not the #1 woman in his life anymore, and his mother needs to realize Holly's position, and respect that. If she can't, then Vincent must choose one, and only one of them. The choice is clearly Holly. He was obviously not instructed prior to the marriage, but now it is too late to cry ignorance. God is not swayed by the same BS as we are. Ignorance is no excuse. Has he not read his Bible? This stuff isn't hidden, its all over the place in there!<P>I get the impression that you are displeased with Vincent as a man. He (God) is the potter, we are the clay. Vincent is a work in progress, don't judge him so harshly. Likewise, Holly is the same. I will break it down 'by the numbers' for you...<P>1. Holly needs to change her tactics somewhat. She needs counseling, even if it is alone. Have her read the articles at this site, not just the forums. She needs to 'get smarter' about her role. This is her second marriage, and it is failing in the same way as the first. Does that not make obvbious the fact that her methods are not working? This is serious...it would be more tragic to learn this at a later date, Holly...I'm not sure you could hold that much regret for long. Think about it.<BR>2. Vincent needs to put God first, Holly second, his stepchildren thirs, his FOO fourth, the Army fifth. This is in spite of what the Army says. This is what God says, and actually, the Army doesn't say any different, but there is a lot of BS in that respect...civilian work is the same...I've done both. The order listed is the correct one. He puts himself anywhere after his stepchildren....he gets that choice, anyway!<BR>3. YOU need to quit indicating to Holly that 'she has done all that she can', that's not true! Done alot...sure, I believe that. Done all she knows? Believe that, too. All she can? Is he back, and are things right? No. What I mean is that she hasn't educated herself in this particcular relationship enough to develop an effective PLAN to fix it. You need a plan, goals, milestones, ecology checks...in short, you need a program to fix this.<P>That's probably enough for now...I am not trying to anger you, but I want you to realize that this thing is at an impasse for a reason. Holly thinks its Vincent. Holly's ILs think it is her. Vincent doesn't appear to know (not unusual, he is young, and confused...not surprising). You seem sold on Vincent being the culprit. The true culprits in this are NOT PEOPLE, they are incorrect conclusions, anticipated negative outcomes, ignorance, and intolerance. As I see it, all parties involved are contributing in their own way, positive, and negative. Allow me to show you how I ecology check this one.<BR>Let me post it after this...this is getting long.

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Holly - Motivated by having this marriage NOT turn out like her first one. Unfortunately, when we motivate ourselves this way (with NOT wanting a NEGATIVE thing), we tend to bring it into being. This is the very definition of a self-fulfilling prophecy. Would she rather be positive, and wrong? Or negative, and right?<P>Vincent - He is what is referred to in the Bible as a 'double-minded" man. He has failed to detach properly as a son becoming a husband. He has made a blood covenant with God that he is trying to break without any sort of proper justification. He is, as they say 'on the fence'. God does not listen to double-minded men's prayers, they are 'tossed by the wind', and as the 'chaff separated from the wheat'. He is likely also proud, and therefore angry. 'God is opposed to the proud, but gives grace to the humble.'<P>You - A good friend to both, more motivated by Holly's desperation, Vincent's lack of sense of duty, and a sense of obligation to the children. Do not do anything 'for the sake of the children'. A reconciliation based on that will fail. Do it for the sake of doing God's will...the survival, and growth of the marriage.<P>I was unable to e-mail Vincent yesterday, I will do it after I leave here, okay?<P>BTW, how are you doing with all of this? I am certain that it is affecting you...We need to pray for you, too, you know. Since you have decided to help Holly and Vincent bear this cross, make sure that you help them equally, if you take sides, it will cause problems.<P>Take care, and God bless. I respect your committment to God's will. May he bless you greatly. -Mike

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I am not taking sides here Mike. I just pray for them both.<BR>She has admitted and has leg go of that fear of her ex (he was abusive and cheated in the past on her)and made peace with the former husband. Vincent honestly has not given anyone any reason as to why he decided to walk away. Some feel as though his family encouraged him to do so,as she is 7.5 yrs older than he is. They did not like the thought of their son/brother marrying someone older and with kids. No one believes that his family even gave her a chance to even get to know her. She has prayed about it, and corrected long ago some things that she thought was part of the problem. For ex; she had a medical problem. To avoid having a hystorectomy, she (she wanted to give Vincent a child if he wanted one in the future)and Vincent agreed for her to take these shots that could shrink the tumors so she wont have to have it. Instead knowning fully well these shots, had an acute side affects that could mess her up emotionally. But he said to the doctor he would be there for her. Well during the three mths she was on them, she felt every side effect to that and suffered through bouncing off the walls privately(she would not let it show or effect her relationship what so ever).She went through hell for this man, just so in case they wanted to have a child he would be able to have one. She did it all out of her love for this soldier. I guess he couldn't take it and at the time she finally told the doctor about it, she wanted off,she did and tried to tell her husband about it.<BR>By then he had made plans to move out. SO, on top of dealing with the side effects still in her. (It would take 2 weeks for the side effects to disappear)He walks out during that time. She is the type that would take coupons to the grocery store. Never spend money unless it was needed such as food, socks -nessity. He could not trust her with their joint account. Proof shows that there was no reason not to. Her pay check went into that account too. He closed it out and told her to get a separate one. His family all have separate accts. Holly felt hurt by that, thought that was one of the many links that tied them together as a couple. Another situation. A former friend moved to the UK. Called her on her cell phone and she returned the call, thought something was wrong. All this guy wanted was to get their address to send them a wedding gift. She decline with a thanks anyways. Vincent never met this guy but did not trust him. She dated this man once almost a year BEFORE she even met Vincent.They just remained friends as if she was like a family member. When he saw that phone number on the bill, instead of confronting Holly with it, he called and talked to his sister instead. She in turn calls Holly up and yelling at her accusing her of talking to her former lover. Holly was puzzled by this call as she had no idea who this person was.<BR>When she finally told her sister in law that all this person wanted was their address to send a gift to them, and told her that she told him no thank you that Vincent did not like her talking to her former friend. His sister felt stupid and asked if she talked to her brother about it,she said she tried. But, Vincent would not listen. There was nothing or anything going on. This former friend moved away before they got married to the UK. Holly has been soley devoted to Vincent from the time they first laid eyes on one another. That is the type of person she is. There was no proof of anything going on. Holly would never remotely even think about looking elsewhere. Vincent was everything to her. Her best friend/lover/husband everything. He acted as if someone planted a fear bug into his head and refuse to see the real picture.<P>I have been praying about this for their sake and for the Will of God to get inside of Vincent's heart and make him turn around and realize he made a foolish error and correct the problem. Holly has never said one negative thing about his family. THinks the world of them from what I can tell through our conversations. I am not taking sides. I just think they need both talk to each other and sit down with out Vincent talking ugly or getting hostile word wise towards her. He won't. He is scared to looks to everyone.<P>Hope you can get through to him. We all pray that they can reunite before their one year anniversary which is July 29th.<BR>God Bless you Mike for caring! Lisa

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She has read numerous books from Gary Smalley to others. She tried to call a few times but no one passed the message onto him. THey have banned her from calling him. They feel it might upset the unit. Sheesh. This is his wife for crying outloud. She has every right to call. She never yelled or anything, very mature on the phone. How can she when the unit only knows his side but wont get involved to help their families. They have a moral right in the army to help dependents and they block this one out, for fear it would cause some ill feelings or better yet they allow him<BR>to hide behind the army. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by heavensangel:<BR><B>I am not taking sides here Mike. I just pray for them both.<BR>She has admitted and has leg go of that fear of her ex (he was abusive and cheated in the past on her)and made peace with the former husband. Vincent honestly has not given anyone any reason as to why he decided to walk away. Some feel as though his family encouraged him to do so,as she is 7.5 yrs older than he is. They did not like the thought of their son/brother marrying someone older and with kids. No one believes that his family even gave her a chance to even get to know her. She has prayed about it, and corrected long ago some things that she thought was part of the problem. For ex; she had a medical problem. To avoid having a hystorectomy, she (she wanted to give Vincent a child if he wanted one in the future)and Vincent agreed for her to take these shots that could shrink the tumors so she wont have to have it. Instead knowning fully well these shots, had an acute side affects that could mess her up emotionally. But he said to the doctor he would be there for her. Well during the three mths she was on them, she felt every side effect to that and suffered through bouncing off the walls privately(she would not let it show or effect her relationship what so ever).She went through hell for this man, just so in case they wanted to have a child he would be able to have one. She did it all out of her love for this soldier. I guess he couldn't take it and at the time she finally told the doctor about it, she wanted off,she did and tried to tell her husband about it.<BR>By then he had made plans to move out. SO, on top of dealing with the side effects still in her. (It would take 2 weeks for the side effects to disappear)He walks out during that time. She is the type that would take coupons to the grocery store. Never spend money unless it was needed such as food, socks -nessity. He could not trust her with their joint account. Proof shows that there was no reason not to. Her pay check went into that account too. He closed it out and told her to get a separate one. His family all have separate accts. Holly felt hurt by that, thought that was one of the many links that tied them together as a couple. Another situation. A former friend moved to the UK. Called her on her cell phone and she returned the call, thought something was wrong. All this guy wanted was to get their address to send them a wedding gift. She decline with a thanks anyways. Vincent never met this guy but did not trust him. She dated this man once almost a year BEFORE she even met Vincent.They just remained friends as if she was like a family member. When he saw that phone number on the bill, instead of confronting Holly with it, he called and talked to his sister instead. She in turn calls Holly up and yelling at her accusing her of talking to her former lover. Holly was puzzled by this call as she had no idea who this person was.<BR>When she finally told her sister in law that all this person wanted was their address to send a gift to them, and told her that she told him no thank you that Vincent did not like her talking to her former friend. His sister felt stupid and asked if she talked to her brother about it,she said she tried. But, Vincent would not listen. There was nothing or anything going on. This former friend moved away before they got married to the UK. Holly has been soley devoted to Vincent from the time they first laid eyes on one another. That is the type of person she is. There was no proof of anything going on. Holly would never remotely even think about looking elsewhere. Vincent was everything to her. Her best friend/lover/husband everything. He acted as if someone planted a fear bug into his head and refuse to see the real picture.<P>I have been praying about this for their sake and for the Will of God to get inside of Vincent's heart and make him turn around and realize he made a foolish error and correct the problem. Holly has never said one negative thing about his family. THinks the world of them from what I can tell through our conversations. I am not taking sides. I just think they need both talk to each other and sit down with out Vincent talking ugly or getting hostile word wise towards her. He won't. He is scared to looks to everyone.<P>Hope you can get through to him. We all pray that they can reunite before their one year anniversary which is July 29th.<BR>God Bless you Mike for caring! Lisa</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>

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Lisa,<BR> Again, I am neither shocked nor surprised at what you say. Keep these things in mind:<P>The 'unit' is male dominated, and not in a good way. The unit only understands the good of the unit as dictated to them by the Army, JCOS, DOD, etc. Yes, her calls threaten that, but there is an equal argument for getting Vincent 'right', too...humble man = good soldier. But, listen to me here, please...they don't, by and large, get that. It runs counter to their purpose, so don't expect any support there. I would not push there, if I were you, or Holly. Not smart. Give him that safe haven, please...for the marriage's sake.<P> I e-mailed him...we'll see what he comes up with, and go from there.<P> The sister sounds a little quick to action, and also maybe a little too defensive...is she older than Vincent? You never told me if Vincent's father is in this picture...he is a potential ally in this, don't overlook that. It seems to me like he is not in the picture...well? Would you describe his FOO as patriarchal (ran by the father), or matriarchal (ran by the mother). This is also pretty important in dealing with Vincent in this matter. You need to consider these types of things in order to find out his strategies. That is how you find out how to 'reach' someone. You need to appeal to a value higher on his internal list. Trouble is, you are appealing to what you think is right, don't expect him to respond as you would. you cannot make him see what you see, only make him see things <I>with a different perspective</I> that allows him to make a choice that fits into his 'ecological view' of things...his re-presentation of reality to himself.<P> About the medical situation...that is laudable for her to do, as long as she <I>never</I> harbors any resentment towards him about it, even though he chose that time to leave. She made the decision, she took the consequences. That is all. There is no profit in trying to make him feel guilty...he won't do it, and that is not Vincent's exclusive flaw, either...read the forums...I think you will find 50% do this. The guilt comes in its own time, and of its own accord....sound familiar? Refrain from trying to control, manipulate, etc.<P> There is a book that I would recommend Holly read as soon as she can. It is called 'The 7 Principles For Making Marriage Work' by John Gottman and Nan Silver. It is practical, and based on thorough research of married couples. The difference is that these couples were not in counseling at the time, and they were followed up with after a while.<P> Don't expect any help from most people outside this forum. This scares the hell out of most people, and Vincent and Holly are already pigeon-holed into their narrow view of the world. Also, a lot of people don't 'get it' the way you do. Too bad for them. I'd say his sister may be able to help, she felt some pretty instant guilt WRT the phone call, which BTW...was a LB to Vincent. Definitely have Holly read about Love Busters elsewhere, and get on that ASAP. Not calling may be better for her anyway. She needs to stop being clingy...trust me...seek out and eliminate all of that before she destroys what is left by trying <I>too hard</I> to fix it. You keep saying that she has done all she can...makes me think she is trying to do <I>too much</I> and working <I>too hard</I>. Read 'Love Must Be Tough' by James Dobson for insight into that dynamic, or 'Divorce Busting' by Michelle Weiner-Davis. Or, read about it here...definitely go and print out the articles, and give them to her. Read them together, work it out in a positive way. You might try picking up some of her attitude when it comes to Vincent, your tendency to play the devil's advocate where he is concerned might be clouding your mind enough to make you the devil's advocate...not an accusation, just a little warning to be careful. You have Holly's best interests at heart...Vincent's FOO has his best interests at heart too, and look how they are acting...be careful, Lisa...be very careful.<BR>I'm not sure that the July 29th deadline is realistic, or doable...put it out of your mind. If he comes back too soon, it will all be for naught. Be careful there, too.<P>Lisa, I am exhausted from 10 loads of laundry, and a lot of programming, and running my mouth to you, and others. Sleep awaits, but not patiently, I'm afraid.<P>Do you have your Intercessors on this? Is there a prayer chain at your church? Go her for an interesting perspective: <A HREF="http://www.restorem.org" TARGET=_blank>http://www.restorem.org</A> <P>God bless...I will talk to you later tonight. Be strong, Lisa, and keep a pure heart in this. -Mike<BR><p>[This message has been edited by waiting_for_her (edited July 10, 2001).]

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I appreciate what you have said Mike, She has read that book Love must Be Tough. She has excepted that it is over and has moved on some, still her heart is still with her marriage. I appreciate you writing to him. She has been doing well with her job and tending to her two kids. She has not contacted him in any way shape or form. She has given him his space from day one. His sister is the middle child. He has an older brother and Vincent is the youngest. His father is like the rest. He expressed his feelings already I guess. He was not keen on them getting married cause Holly is older and has children. I appreciate it . <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by waiting_for_her:<BR><B>Lisa,<BR> Again, I am neither shocked nor surprised at what you say. Keep these things in mind:<P>The 'unit' is male dominated, and not in a good way. The unit only understands the good of the unit as dictated to them by the Army, JCOS, DOD, etc. Yes, her calls threaten that, but there is an equal argument for getting Vincent 'right', too...humble man = good soldier. But, listen to me here, please...they don't, by and large, get that. It runs counter to their purpose, so don't expect any support there. I would not push there, if I were you, or Holly. Not smart. Give him that safe haven, please...for the marriage's sake.<P> I e-mailed him...we'll see what he comes up with, and go from there.<P> The sister sounds a little quick to action, and also maybe a little too defensive...is she older than Vincent? You never told me if Vincent's father is in this picture...he is a potential ally in this, don't overlook that. It seems to me like he is not in the picture...well? Would you describe his FOO as patriarchal (ran by the father), or matriarchal (ran by the mother). This is also pretty important in dealing with Vincent in this matter. You need to consider these types of things in order to find out his strategies. That is how you find out how to 'reach' someone. You need to appeal to a value higher on his internal list. Trouble is, you are appealing to what you think is right, don't expect him to respond as you would. you cannot make him see what you see, only make him see things <I>with a different perspective</I> that allows him to make a choice that fits into his 'ecological view' of things...his re-presentation of reality to himself.<P> About the medical situation...that is laudable for her to do, as long as she <I>never</I> harbors any resentment towards him about it, even though he chose that time to leave. She made the decision, she took the consequences. That is all. There is no profit in trying to make him feel guilty...he won't do it, and that is not Vincent's exclusive flaw, either...read the forums...I think you will find 50% do this. The guilt comes in its own time, and of its own accord....sound familiar? Refrain from trying to control, manipulate, etc.<P> There is a book that I would recommend Holly read as soon as she can. It is called 'The 7 Principles For Making Marriage Work' by John Gottman and Nan Silver. It is practical, and based on thorough research of married couples. The difference is that these couples were not in counseling at the time, and they were followed up with after a while.<P> Don't expect any help from most people outside this forum. This scares the hell out of most people, and Vincent and Holly are already pigeon-holed into their narrow view of the world. Also, a lot of people don't 'get it' the way you do. Too bad for them. I'd say his sister may be able to help, she felt some pretty instant guilt WRT the phone call, which BTW...was a LB to Vincent. Definitely have Holly read about Love Busters elsewhere, and get on that ASAP. Not calling may be better for her anyway. She needs to stop being clingy...trust me...seek out and eliminate all of that before she destroys what is left by trying <I>too hard</I> to fix it. You keep saying that she has done all she can...makes me think she is trying to do <I>too much</I> and working <I>too hard</I>. Read 'Love Must Be Tough' by James Dobson for insight into that dynamic, or 'Divorce Busting' by Michelle Weiner-Davis. Or, read about it here...definitely go and print out the articles, and give them to her. Read them together, work it out in a positive way. You might try picking up some of her attitude when it comes to Vincent, your tendency to play the devil's advocate where he is concerned might be clouding your mind enough to make you the devil's advocate...not an accusation, just a little warning to be careful. You have Holly's best interests at heart...Vincent's FOO has his best interests at heart too, and look how they are acting...be careful, Lisa...be very careful.<BR>I'm not sure that the July 29th deadline is realistic, or doable...put it out of your mind. If he comes back too soon, it will all be for naught. Be careful there, too.<P>Lisa, I am exhausted from 10 loads of laundry, and a lot of programming, and running my mouth to you, and others. Sleep awaits, but not patiently, I'm afraid.<P>Do you have your Intercessors on this? Is there a prayer chain at your church? Go her for an interesting perspective: <A HREF="http://www.restorem.org" TARGET=_blank>http://www.restorem.org</A> <P>God bless...I will talk to you later tonight. Be strong, Lisa, and keep a pure heart in this. -Mike<P><BR>[This message has been edited by waiting_for_her (edited July 10, 2001).]</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P><p>[This message has been edited by heavensangel (edited July 13, 2001).]

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by heavensangel:<BR><B>My fellow church goer needs help. He walked out on his wife right before Xmas. Their one yr anniversary is 7/29 this year. He realized he should not have done what he did but is scared to face her. She has been a very loving and faithful wife. He needs to listen to his heart and not his older sister. She only met his wife twice. Because she has kids from a previous marriage. They think her kids would wreck the marriage. NOT SO! They love him and want him back.<BR>Please can you email him and help encourage him to get back to his wife. He still loves her but can not face the guilt of what he has put her through. Holly Deserves to have her dream back. She has had a rough time as it is. Won't you help bring these two together? That would be a great present. Vincent would appreciate anything. cipollav@bragg.army.mil. He does not know why he left, just got scared. Please they could use all the prayers and encouragement. I have his reg address too. He would appreciate anything. What should he do? He needs to stick to his vows and go back to his wife. She has done nothing to deserve this. Help please. The more the better.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>It may sound simple... but someone needs to ask him what he loves about his wife... what brought him to her... why he got married in the first place. I want to believe that he married her for reasons of love, rather than lust, convenience, or any of the other reasons people, unfortunatley, sometimes choose to get married. They are still newlyweds... however, I too, was very scared after even 1 year of marriage... the committments of the institution do not become real until you face some adversity.<P>Concentrate on why it was there in the first place, is what I would tell him. Be brutally honest with yourself. Be willing to admit you are human... and you have faults and weaknesses. If he married for love, he needs to concentrate on that... not on what others, who know less about the situation, think. Everyone has an agenda... if you are going to follow someone elses, make sure they have your true best interests at heart, and are wise enough to know the consequences of the action.<P>

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Ericksoa,<BR>Your thoughts are good here.Do you think you could email him and encourage him with what you just said? You are right.<BR>I just hope and pray that something happens soon. His email is above please? I appreciate it. I am trying to get his wife to not concentrate on what is taking place this month.It has really been a downer month for her. Instead of celebrating this joyous occasion, she is alone and missing him. All she can do is go on with her life in the mean time and try to get through this. Prayers are needed for them.<BR>Let me know. Lisa<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ericksoa:<BR><B> It may sound simple... but someone needs to ask him what he loves about his wife... what brought him to her... why he got married in the first place. I want to believe that he married her for reasons of love, rather than lust, convenience, or any of the other reasons people, unfortunatley, sometimes choose to get married. They are still newlyweds... however, I too, was very scared after even 1 year of marriage... the committments of the institution do not become real until you face some adversity.<P>Concentrate on why it was there in the first place, is what I would tell him. Be brutally honest with yourself. Be willing to admit you are human... and you have faults and weaknesses. If he married for love, he needs to concentrate on that... not on what others, who know less about the situation, think. Everyone has an agenda... if you are going to follow someone elses, make sure they have your true best interests at heart, and are wise enough to know the consequences of the action.<BR></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>

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Hello,<BR>I sent an e card to Vincent to offer support and encouragment. I encluded the web address for this site. <P>I truly hope that he will return to his family... and that they can make their marriage work.<P>The greatest joy in life is to love and be loved. I hope he can see past his fears and follow his heart.<P>Hugs & Kisses,<BR>TCF

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Please if you can send some prayers their way.<BR> I did not know that if you want to help this couple and family. Please the better way is to keep your prayers coming. Thank you and God Bless you all!<p>[This message has been edited by heavensangel (edited July 13, 2001).]

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Oops...what happened to mine, then...the 'unit' must have it...great. I was wondering why there was a huge fox hole in my back yard...incoming!<P>Okay, I actually like that better, although I have no paper for my printer...guess I will have to 'get' some.<P>How are things going, Lisa? How are you holding up? Is Holly reading? Has there been any word from Vincent on this?<P>Hang in there, Lisa....we are storming heaven, too.<P>'Again I say to you, that if two of you agree on earth about anything that they may ask, it shall be done for them by my Father who is in heaven.' -Matthew 18:19<P>God bless you, Lisa -Mike.


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