Hello everyone!<P>This is my first post, and I'm hoping some of you folks can give me your insight.<P>Recently (w/i 3 weeks), I confirmed that my husband of 9 years was having an affair when I found him at the home of his 19 year old girlfriend! We have a 4 year old daughter and he is a cop.<P>Immediately after the "capture", we went to a friends house to "talk". He said that he wanted the marriage to work and that he wanted me to take him back. Some other events later ensued, and I beleived he may be in danger to himself. I issued a restraining order, which has been dropped. Since the exposure, he has opted to stay at relatives houses, and even since the release of the order has not come home.<P>He says he doesn't know what he wants, and is going to counseling as part of his job requirement. In addition to this affair, he was involved in one night stands, pathologically lying, using secret emails, phone cards, and other peoples cell phones. He told his friends he wouldn't get caught.<P>He says that he loves his daughter, but has made little attempt to see her since 7/26. He's supposed to be "sorting things out", but he won't tell me where he's been or what he's been doing in his free time.<P>Here's the best - the girlfriend is due back at college (out of state) in about 2-3 weeks. I feel he's just buying time. <P>In a case such as this, which has been going on for the better part of 3-6 years, should I look to reconcile, or just cut my losses now?<P>Thanks so much!<BR>

<small>[ August 08, 2004, 02:53 PM: Message edited by: laura_lee ]</small>

Hi Arrested,<P>No one can make that decision for you. But I think you came to the right place to get the information that will help you make the decision that is best for you and your daughter.<P>I hope you will go to the Marriage Builders Home Page and do a lot more reading. Dr. Harley has written several outstanding columns on infidelity. Some of the insights are really profound, and it takes a while to absorb them.<P>Meantime, have you considered a trip to the family doctor? Might be a good time to let your doctor know what is going on, and get a thorough physical including blood work done.<P>Keep right on posting and venting anonymously here. There are some pretty good folks here, and as they get to know your situation, you'll find them very supportive.<P>Prayer and stuff,<P>Bumper

Thanks so much for your concern Bumpy!<P>I noticed that you are also in police work. Do you have any ideas to offer along those lines? My H had a bad childhood, saw parents fighting a lot, had 2 alcoholic grandparents, and dealt with a drug problem. I believe a lot of cops have had some silimiar problems. Funny thing is - I knew all that going into the marriage and was willing to help him deal with it all - he just stopped talking!<P>

Arrested,<P>Yes, I'm in my 39th year in the police or divorce department if you will. I'm also a recovered alcoholic. In our department traditionally seventy percent of the male officers are divorced. We started seriously hiring female officers in 1978. They caught up to us in two years, and by 1982 they were at ninety percent divorced.<P>In reading your first post, there are at least a half a dozen red flags that suggest that you folks are in need of professional help. The Harleys are the best in the business, and I was hoping you would read some of the columns that can be accessed from the home page. There aren't any quick fixes to the problems you speak of.<P>Just let me concentrate on one point for now. You used the term pathologically lying. One doesn't often see that term used here. It is widely misunderstood, and often confused with compulsive lying. <P>A. Do you by any chance have some specialized training?<P>B. What made you believe you could help him deal with it?<P>Looking forward to hearing more from you.<P>Prayers and stuff,<P>Bumper<P> <p>[This message has been edited by Bumperii (edited August 08, 2001).]

Congratulations on 39 years of service! That's amazing!<P>I used the term Pathological in regard to these situations:<BR>He lied about every aspect of his life. He told me that he was identified by the department to be suffering from depression and that he was being sent away on a retreat weekend to help him cope. I was worried sick the entire time, thinking that the outcome may cause him to loose his job. He returned, said that the weekend helped a lot and that as a result, he would have to do some "things". He referred to them as assignments, and said that the theripist would call him weekly to make the assignment. Also, he would need to go to group therapy on Friday nights. When he left on Fridays at 6:30 and wasn't coming in until 1:00, I inquired. He said the sessions were so emotionally draining, that the group (all police officers) got together at the diner to discuss things openly.<P>From there, he told me (when I found 2 movie stubs from a "therapy" night) that his assignments were to deal with "issues". The movie was to help him overcome his "black" issue. Then, Pearl Harbor (another ticket discovery) was to help him with a white supremacy issue. He was to work at an old age home all day - but it only lasted a couple of hours - too draining. He spent a day working with the special olympics children, and boasted that it was the best experience of his life and that everyone should do it. One of the final things, was an overnight fishing trip on a boat with old people. I admit I was suspicious when he left with only a change of clothes, and when he returned, he wasn't tanned, and didn't smell like salt water. All of the above were lies.<P>In the meantime, he went from family memeber to friend, telling them that we were in counseling, and asking them to cover for him for his resuce squad shifts, or to watch our daughter.<P>He went as far as to tell the g/f that she couldn't come to his fathers house because he was recovering from open heart surgery. <P>One of the best was that he was involved in a $350 million dollar lawsuit for a shooting. He was meeting with the attorney constantly - but the attorney never called him at home. Then, he said that the trial date was set, and called me that morning to say that they had issued a "stay" because the judge had been called away in the middle of his testamony - sounding pathological yet?<P>I am not a professional, but my sister is a nurse, which may be where I've come in contact with the term.<P>As for why I thought I could help him - I just believed that he was lacking in love - I knew I loved him, and that he (at one point) loved me. I knew that his beginings were rough, but I thought that we had enought love, trust and strength between us, that he could put that behind us.<P>He is in counseling now - because the department required it. He's on restricitve duty - but still says he doesn't know what he wants.<P>BTW, I heard you're a grandfather - is that recently, or for a while? In any event, congratulations - grandparents are the best!<P>I'd love your insight - thanks so much!<BR>

Congratulations on 39 years of service! That's amazing!<P>I used the term Pathological in regard to these situations:<BR>He lied about every aspect of his life. He told me that he was identified by the department to be suffering from depression and that he was being sent away on a retreat weekend to help him cope. I was worried sick the entire time, thinking that the outcome may cause him to loose his job. He returned, said that the weekend helped a lot and that as a result, he would have to do some "things". He referred to them as assignments, and said that the theripist would call him weekly to make the assignment. Also, he would need to go to group therapy on Friday nights. When he left on Fridays at 6:30 and wasn't coming in until 1:00, I inquired. He said the sessions were so emotionally draining, that the group (all police officers) got together at the diner to discuss things openly.<P>From there, he told me (when I found 2 movie stubs from a "therapy" night) that his assignments were to deal with "issues". The movie was to help him overcome his "black" issue. Then, Pearl Harbor (another ticket discovery) was to help him with a white supremacy issue. He was to work at an old age home all day - but it only lasted a couple of hours - too draining. He spent a day working with the special olympics children, and boasted that it was the best experience of his life and that everyone should do it. One of the final things, was an overnight fishing trip on a boat with old people. I admit I was suspicious when he left with only a change of clothes, and when he returned, he wasn't tanned, and didn't smell like salt water. All of the above were lies.<P>In the meantime, he went from family memeber to friend, telling them that we were in counseling, and asking them to cover for him for his resuce squad shifts, or to watch our daughter.<P>He went as far as to tell the g/f that she couldn't come to his fathers house because he was recovering from open heart surgery. <P>One of the best was that he was involved in a $350 million dollar lawsuit for a shooting. He was meeting with the attorney constantly - but the attorney never called him at home. Then, he said that the trial date was set, and called me that morning to say that they had issued a "stay" because the judge had been called away in the middle of his testamony - sounding pathological yet?<P>I am not a professional, but my sister is a nurse, which may be where I've come in contact with the term.<P>As for why I thought I could help him - I just believed that he was lacking in love - I knew I loved him, and that he (at one point) loved me. I knew that his beginings were rough, but I thought that we had enought love, trust and strength between us, that he could put that behind us.<P>He is in counseling now - because the department required it. He's on restricitve duty - but still says he doesn't know what he wants.<P>BTW, I heard you're a grandfather - is that recently, or for a while? In any event, congratulations - grandparents are the best!<P>I'd love your insight - thanks so much!<BR>

Arrested,<P>Thanks for the kind remarks. Yes, I'm well into the grandpa age, have three grandchildren, two boys, one girl, and I'm picking all of them up at noon tomorrow and we are going spend a long weekend together at Hershey Park, Gettysburg and Pennsylvania Dutch Country.<P>There is a very special corner of Heaven reserved for the wives of police officers. The problem of infidelity is only one of dozens we face.<P>You also mentioned that he dealt with a drug problem and depression. It has been a long time since I've dealt with an officer who only had a drug or only had an alcohol problem. Most of the folks today are cross addicted. If that is true, he shouldn't be fooling around with any mind or mood altering chemicals other than medication prescribed by a medical doctor.<P>All of the events he says he is involved in, well, most departments do those events whether you have a problem or not. We do the special olympics every year.<P>Most of the other stuff is probably nonsense. Those therapy sessions until 1:00 a.m. don't happen very often. If he said he was attending marathon AA meetings, going to one at 8:00 p.m. and again at midnight, you might believe that, but not professionals.<P>I need to think a little more about the things you have said so far, and I'll post back to you. Right now, there is quite a bit flying around in my head.<P>If his department has an employee assistance program, and he was that involved in it, they should have involved you by now too. These things don't happen in a vacuum.<P>Keep posting and keep coming back. Hope you read some of Dr. Harley's articles.<P>Prayers and stuff,<P>Bumper

Hey there Bumpy - <P>Thanks so much for the reassurance of my little corner in heaven! I only hope that the end result of this is that I'm still the wife of a cop! (or, more specifically - this cop!)<P>Just to be clear on some things - the depression "diagnosis" was a hoax - he was never found to be suffering from depression - just lied that he was so he could spend the weekend away with his g/f. He does drink a lot - when he drinks - but he doesn't drink all the time. In fact, he commented that as a result of the affair, he was drinking less (she doesn't drink at all - neither do I!)<P>As far as drugs - I believe he was around 16 and went to rehab. To the best of my knowledge, he hasn't been doing drugs. He only mentioned the "thought" of it once during our marriage, about 7 years ago. If anything, he may be using steroids, he's been lifting for 3-4 years now, and is huge - could be real, might be drugs.<P>I'm going to go back to the site and read some of the articles you suggested. Also, I'm seeing a therapist on Monday. I asked him about seeing his, and he said that the therapist said that "that point will come, but it's not a good idea right now". (whatever?)<P>Also, I didn't mention, but the reason for the restraining order was because he twice threatened suicide with a knife to his throat, and then chest (when found out about the affair).<P>I know he can be such a wonderful person. I know there is a place in his heart that is longing for something - love, affirmation, something - I just don't know how to get into his head that it's all right here for him. I just don't know if it's possible, or if his mental state may be irrecoverable at this point.<P>I'm saying my prayers, and going to read some articles.<P>thoughts and prayers!<P><BR>

Just moving this up - know you're away!

H is a cop(3yrs), married 17 yrs 8/11, biggest problem women wanting the uniform mostly young ones, H is 41 Im 47, finally told me that our marriage ended because of his job guess thats his way of saying he is sorry, he is trying to find another one but its too late for us, wait & see if he can change but never let your guard down, mine wasnt too smart, got caught while on duty down a dirt road with her, he was always home after work.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by arrested by the truth:<BR><B>Just to be clear on some things - the depression "diagnosis" was a hoax - he was never found to be suffering from depression - just lied that he was so he could spend the weekend away with his g/f. He does drink a lot - when he drinks - but he doesn't drink all the time. In fact, he commented that as a result of the affair, he was drinking less (she doesn't drink at all - neither do I!)</B><P>Sounds like he switches his addictions...was drugs, then drinking, then OW, then more drinking? I think you could get a lot of benefit out of Al-Anon. You know that you don't have to be a daily drinker to be an alcoholic, nor do you have to be a falling down drunk (most can walk, talk, do everything fine while under the influence).<P><B>As far as drugs - I believe he was around 16 and went to rehab. To the best of my knowledge, he hasn't been doing drugs</B><P>I would guess he isn't still working his 12 step program to deal with his drug addiciton. Unfortunately recovery is a lifelong process. There is a reason he resorted to the non-reality of drugs in the first place and if he isn't guarding himself against it now, then that's a real problem.<P><B>I know he can be such a wonderful person. I know there is a place in his heart that is longing for something - love, affirmation, something - I just don't know how to get into his head that it's all right here for him. I just don't know if it's possible, or if his mental state may be irrecoverable at this point.</B><P>You can learn a lot about detachment and not enabling at your local Al-Anon meeting. Your H is an addict (once an addict always an addict) who is not in recovery it sounds like. Possible an active alcoholic. He is in denial about his problems, and rather than face them with you he resorts to lying and affairs. One day it will all crash down on him. You don't have to wait to get help till then, you can get help now!<P>The MB principles work great for two emotionally healthy people. Go read Dr. Harley's Q&A's on alcoholic spouses, I think that will help you (regardless of whether your H is an active alcoholic now or "former" drug addict).<P>Good luck to you! You deserve to have a happy life!

Hi arrested,<P>Sure happy to see that msst and married2alcoholic joined the thread. Both posted things I thought about saying, but they did a much better job.<P>There are a few others in you situation that posted in the past, I'm kind of hoping you will meet as you post on this board. There is a woman police officer that posts occassionally, and there sure are a bunch who have had problems with wandering spouses, both male and female.<P>Just let me respond for a moment on the issue of the Uniform Girls. Just about every profession has its share of groupies. Show biz, music biz and sports are all notorious for it. To a much lesser degree, politicians, bosses, professionals, police, and fire services have their opportunities too. But I doubt that any of us is any more prone to infidelity than the general public, I seriously doubt that a police officer is any more sexually active than a computer programer. It just depends on what world you live in.<P>The office romance has been with us for over a hundred years. Cops didn't get involved in them because we were almost exclusively male organizations until about the last thirty years. What does happen is legendary, cops, nurses and or waitresses, anyone in the service industry who works the evening shift. They get off work and everyone else is home in bed. So many of these folks head for a favored watering hole. Here in Philadelpia it is the FOP lounge.<P>It all sounds pretty seedy, but many fine lasting marriages between cops and nurses began in these settings. Times have changed, but we now have women cops married to male nurses! And more than a few male offiers are turning to nursing for a second career after retirement. <P>Regretably, many otherwise good marriages ended up in the crapper in the same environment.<P>As for the business of the tryst during duty hours, sure, it happens, but it is rare, rare, rare. And when it does happen, it gets a whole lot more attention than it really deserves, it creates scandal simply because society expects us to meet a "higher standard" of behavior.<P>Prayers and stuff,<P>Bumper <BR>

Hey guys - problem with the computer for a while - but I'm back!<P>Thanks so much for your insight. I'd talked with the H. He says that he "thinks we're over", and to "do what you have to do". He's given me the go ahead to file for the big D. In his heart, I don't think he's convinced that this is what he wants.<P>As part of his job requirement, he's going to therapy. The therapist supposedly suggested that he not make any rash decisions right now. To this end, (until now), he wouldn't give me any indication of what he wanted at all. However, I found out from others that he was still seeing the OW. <P>I confronted him with it, and asked why he was still lying to me about everything. He said he was honestly trying to work out the issues he was going thru to see if we could work. But now, he feels that he's lost the feeling, and that the damage could never be undone. He still wants to be a part of out daughters' life - but says he needs to find out who he is - who he was supposed to be in life.<P>I guess I will file - but I'm still not convinced that this is what he really wants (just being optomistic I guess!) He's in tears telling me that when this started 3 years ago, that he just believed things would get better. He says he wanted to go to counseling then - but I wouldn't go - I don't remember that - He won't go now because he thinks it's too late.<P>Any advise on what to do at this point? We're having a family party (my side) on 9/2, and he says he still wants to come. (!!??) I just wish I knew what the real deal was!<P>Thanks for all your help!!<P><BR>

Don't have time to reply right now, but I will get to it tomorrow. Thanks for asking for my help!

Does he have a drinking or drug problem?? If he does, that could be effecting his behavior. If you haven't already, read all the stuff on this site, especially about emotional needs (en). Read the books "Divorce Buster" and "Stop Your Divorce", In your situation, I think the strategies in Stop Your Divorce would work very well. He sounds like he needs a wake up call. You can order it and download it right off the internet. <BR>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR> Funny thing is - I knew all that going into the marriage and was willing to help him deal with it all - he just stopped talking![/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I see here you were willing to "help" him deal with these<BR>things...the question remains...is it something he feels is<BR>a problem? A lot of ppl don't beleive that their past has anything to do with why they are like they are today...<P>ie: how they relate to others, how they handle conflict/or not handle it at all, how they relate to their children..<BR>everything..<P>So you need to look at that..was he willing to look at and get help in dealing with these things? Because if not..you can't help him..and you create a large frustration level in<BR>your own life..of trying to always "help" which in most<BR>cases..makes you suffer the consequences of the other persons actions..and they avoid suffering anything at<BR>all...someone is always there ready to pick up the pieces<BR>for them..because they are too "helpless" to care for themselves...<P>You say he's in counseling..what about yourself? Are you also getting counseling? maybe you should..and also look into al-anon or something for you..even when they sober up..they still have the same problems..the only thing is they need to learn how to deal w/ sober..and in cases like this..you also need to know how to handle the changes..<BR>because you will expect him to react the same way he always<BR>has..so in turn you will react the same way you always have..you need to learn new dance steps..so that you can<BR>grow together during this time..and not apart..<P>