Hello everyone, this is my first time here. Actually I'm not even sure why I'm here, under normal circumstances, or the way I used to be a year ago I would have never considered posting on such a site if I was going thru the same problems I'm going thru now.<P>My current situation is this.. My wife of 5 years told me she wanted a divorce two months ago. As far as our marriage history, well we both got married way to young here even more so. Our first 2 years together was the typical newlywed dream of how a marriage should be, and in those two years we had a son who is now almost 4 years old. The next two years were quite rocky, and mainly my fault, I became quite detached. I became addicted to a game called EverQuest(I'm sure a few of you here have had the same encounter) and I for the most part ignored my wife and my son. About a year after I had started playing EQ I became pretty close to another woman, though this never led to anything outside of the game, and infact most of our time spent talking was about my wife, my son, and how badly the marriage was going and what I could do to repair it. I realized that I was only infatuated with this woman, I still loved my wife, and I still had a son to provide for, I My wife at that time was speaking of seperation, and as I was newly discharged from the military she was living with her parents until I was able to get a job and set up a place to live. She did find the email conversations I had with this other woman, and to this day still holds them over my head, even though there was nothing between us(I doubt the other woman even realized I had a crush on her) and most of the discussion in the emails was on how I could be a better husband / father. For about 3 months I did pretty well, I had quit playing EQ and was spending all my free time with the wife and my son. But unfortunantly I did not learn a strong enough lesson, I began playing EQ again and for the most part, but to a lesser degree treating my wife and son poorly again. That leads up to the most recent December and the birth of our second son. For reasons beyond my control I was forced to stop playing EQ, and again coming out of the haze of this fantasy world I again realized what I had been doing. But by this time my wife had decided it was to late, though she didn't tell me this. She started playing EQ shortly before I quit, and she began the same downward spiral that I had allowed myself to travel. Again I stopped playing for another 3 months, but I was unable to get her to do the same, so after awhile of being ignored(my own medicine thrown right back at me) I began to play again, she continued to ignore me, ignore the children as much as she could get away with, and in turn we didn't speak much. I do credit myself a very slight amount on the last time I started playing EQ, this time I did not forget my children and they ended up spending most of their time with me when I was not at work. About this time unknown to me she started to talk to another man who she meet online. I'm unsure how she managed to keep this a secret from me for so long as the phone bill was becoming quite large, but I thought she was just calling her parents more often and dismissed it.. I completely trusted her and never thought she would do such a thing. I found out later from a former marine I worked with while in the service that she had intentions of meeting this other guy in Las Vegas when my friend and his new girlfriend were going to fly out there to get married. But this never did happen. Then about 3 months ago she meet in person another man she had been spending alot of time on EQ with in person at a party, by this time I was slightly suspicious but with no real reason. This is also the time she began to completely ignore us(She excuses it now as "getting back at me"). This is also about the same time I was layed off from work.. From this point on I've had the children almost 24/7. There were at least a few times where she would go out and not come back till the next day, and would tell me that nothing was going on, it was just another EQ party that she went to, and neglected myself, the children, and the house, and I not in full gear yet, not realizing what was going on let it go this way, the house turned into a total health hazard(Which is as much my fault as well). I did ask her 3 times during this time if she was seeing someone else, and she told me no, and told me to trust her.. Which I did, until about a month after she told me she wanted a divorce. Now I'm not going to defend myself on my previous actions in my marriage, I have made many many many mistakes, I regret them as much as anyone can regret anything, I've apologyzed every chance I got. But what really hurt me the most was when she first mentioned divorce she made me out to the total villian, even though we had both wronged each other, and at this point I did not know she was seeing another man. I felt so bad and for that next month I was depressed, lost, and I felt I had failed her(which I had) but I felt my failing was the only reason she was leaving. And then I found the email to this other man whom she had been seeing, and staying with overnight under the same roof(granted it was with other people in the same house as well). During the time I found the email, she was staying at an uncles house and looking for a place to live with her grandmother. At that point I felt so betrayed I couldn't sleep for the next 2 days, I managed to trudge thru them caring for my children, trying to clean the house, also while trying to look for a job full time. Personally I'm not sure how mothers do it, I've yet to learn how to take care of the children full time and keep the house clean but I am getting better at it everyday. When I confronted her with the news that I knew about her and her new guy, and told her how I felt she basically turned a cold shoulder. I can understand where she is coming from when she says she is not happy, she did the same thing to me so I know exactly how she felt during those two years where I was very distant. She now refuses any kind of reconcilation, refuses to even see or talk to a counseler, she has made up her mind and nothing I've tried doing(which is pretty close to Plan A after reading it without prior knowledge) has been able to even waiver her one bit. Unfortunantly she insistes on dragging out children thru this, even though neither of us really has any money, she has no formal training(even though I had offered many times to put her thru college thoughout our marraige). I doubt even a job she manages to get will be enough to put the children in a decent daycare(something that I dread the most). At this point I'm not sure what to do, I don't think after much longer I could except her back into my life as my wife, only as my childrens mother. And I am at my last end with her as I feel, she is quite solid on what she wants. Luckly we do not have any dissagreements over the assets, and for the most part we do not disagree about how we will spend time with our children, the only thing we do disagree on is who will have primary custody. Admittedly I have not been even close to the best father over the 2 years I've had quite a wake up call in the last year as far as that is concerned. I would like to point out that she is a high strung woman with some issues with anger management, and she has more than once struck our oldest son in the head, last time of which I removed the children from the house and her presence until I could make her understand that she can not do that and that if I saw her even threating him again in such a way I would be forced to remove the children from her presence until CPS became involved and until custody could be resolved.. CPS has been called but other than the initial call has not been involved since that initial call was made. The wife of the guy(who also has two children of their own) called me last night and arranged to meet me. We discussed our spouses, children and so forth. Now granted I'm not sure where I should believe what she is telling me about her husband because she could be telling me these things out of vindictiveness so that I would tell my wife. But from what she had told me I've been able to gather that pretty much everything he has told her, about asking for a divorce 3 times, about not having sex with his wife for 2 years now, and many other things is quite untrue. And at this point I feel very sad for her, she says she doesn't want to be hurt again and that is why she is leaving me, but now she is hooking up with a guy who is the same exact way I was 2 years ago, with the exception that this is not the first time he has cheated on his wife. I fear she is going to have her heart broken by this guy, and I did discuss with her (not out of vindictiveness, but none the less really not my business and probibly a mistake) what his wife had told me. I let her know that I don't expect her to believe me, or his wife, but I wanted her to question or at least be aware of him so she won't go blindly into this relationship. Luckly we are both still very civil to each other, and personally I hope she either finds what she wants with this other guy and things work out for her, or manages to forgive my past(which I've already offered to fogive hers) and comes back into my life. But truthfully I don't think I could take her back if she doesn't decide soon, I still love her at this point, but I am sure I won't be able to do so later down the road in the same way. Just today after supressing my sadness and depression for the past month and a half, reopened myself to her to extend my heart and hand, and this will probibly be my last attempt as I'm not sure if I can deal with my heart being crushed again within a months time. She still stands by her decision at this point, but I do think I've made her realize why she is so unhappy.. Unfortunantly for my wife, she is the type of person that remembers everything you have done to anger her, and she holds that against you and never forgives. I told her today that until she learns to forgive she will never be happy in a relationship because she will always find something to anger her.(she has done this to her former friends over the years as I've watch them come and go). I do wish I would be the person she could forgive, before we drag our children through much more of this, but I seriously doubt it will happen.<P><BR>As for myself, I've made the desicion to go back to college starting in January whether or not we are together. Luckly I have a good amount of family living near me that can help with watching the children if I need it, especially if it means me going back to school and finishing my degree. Socialy I am inept, I've always been the shy, slink back in a corner at a party type of guy, who cannot bring himself to ask a woman on a date or even approach one for that matter. My self confidence was always low, and my wife has managed to knock that down more than a few notches. Sadly I can't remember a girlfriend or even my wife who I didn't meet thru a friend to begin the relationship hehe. But also the fact that now 3 out of 4 long term relationships have ended on my gf/wife cheating(The 4th I left because she was a psyco and well quite possibly cheated on me as well) on me has me totally jaded, and it seems to me that I should not even try, I may not end up as happy as I could be, but I have my children.<P><BR>I'm sorry this post is filled with bad grammer, run-on sentences, and everything seems a bit out of place, but thats how confused my head is, my thoughts will not straighten out for me at the moment.<P>Formerly Distant Husband w/ Recently Wandering Spouse

I have to apologize, I didn't realize my post would be this large when I started typing.

Short answer. "Yes", there is life after this.<P>I hope somebody with more energy will come along and talk about specific issues with you. I'm not up to giving advice right now. Wish I was, I know you're hurting. It WILL get better.<P>-AD

Hi FDH-WS,<P>You certainly have been through a lot. Sorry it took you so long to find this site, and sorry you are here. But now you are, you will at least have some support and people who care.<P>Your wife is in a fog...she doesn't see anything clearly, although SHE thinks she does. Using Plan A while she is in this fog gives her the opportunity to see the good in you, and when she comes out of it, she MAY decide to come back. There are no guarantees though; in the meantime, you are making a better YOU.<P>It's good that you can see where you went wrong, and where your W went wrong, too, because it means that you know some LB's that will get her goat, and avoid them. And you can foresee what is likely to make you react negatively, and you can stop it from happening. However, it's obvious to me that she doesn't like it when you tell her you are sorry, and that you forgive her, so it's best to stop that. She knows anyway, she doesn't want to hear it because it makes her feel guilty.<P>Some eg's from my Plan A: I don't talk about the kids...he says I'm trying to use them to make him feel guilty. I don't tell him I love him, miss him or anything similar. I don't try to get him to talk about this situation, because if he is ever ready to, he will, and besides it might push him away, I don't confront him with my suspicions, and I don't ask him what he's been doing. All of this I'd naturally LOVE to do!!! But the urge is wearing off.<P>I DO a lot of things though. I'm nice to him, I help him where I can, I try to look my best when I see him, I never react to anything he says or any situation with anger (he expects me to, like if he's late for the kids - he knows I detest lateness), I make sure he knows I'm still doing things fo myself and the kids, and I praise him for things he's accomplished.<P>And why? Because I know it's making me a better person, because I hope (but DON'T) expect that it will turn things around, and the sadist in me likes to see him confused when I act the way he doesn't epect...but most of all, for me, we need to be civil for the kids' sake, and this approach is helping that happen.<P>Don't know if I have helped in ANY way, but maybe it has given you some ideas....<P>Nina

Unfortunanty my oldest son has been effected drastically by this. Without prompting from myself, infact I discourage it because I know my son loves his mother, he has flat out told her that he doesn't like her anymore, and that she doesn't love him. It breaks my heart and I can't begin to fathom what my wife feels when she hears this coming from him. She accuses me and then my mother of prompting him but I have not, through out this I have assured him that we both love him very much. And I know my mother would never tell him that his mother doesn't love him.<P>My wife is quite stoic with me now, showing no emotion when I do, except when its something that comes from our son. Does this mean she no longer has feelings for me? Well I think now I'm convinced of that, or at least her new love has clouded her so much in its freshness(We all know how it is in the new beginning of a relationship). Unfortunanty I think she is putting to many of her hopes on this guy even though she assures me that she isn't(Considering she has already introduced him to her family). I watch her sister and brother in law go thru the same thing, her sister left her husband, after cheating on him, and got pregnant by another man. Then she wanted to come back to him.. I'm not sure yet whether I consider him a bigger man than I for taking her back under those conditions, or just someone that lets people roll all over him(He does work full time and come home and clean the house and care for the children while his wife watches tv). I am quite sure I would not be able to do that myself. I will always take my children, and I've even told her that if she needs to sleep on my couch over night(On special occasions like birthdays and such) thats fine with me.. But if her fog doesn't lift soon I don't think I could take her back permanantly.

Here's an interesting thing. My number one support person is a divorced WS. I knew her history before this happened, and it so happened that she was my best friend around here, so....she left the marriage because of her affair. She tells me she never let her X see her emotions because she would put on a mask whenever she dealt with him. He would say "Why are you being so unfeeling?" <P>But she told me it was because she WAS feeling that she put on the mask. She KNEW he hurt, and she was really upset and devastated because she had caused it, but she could never show it to him, instead she broke down with everyone else.<P>I have felt the mask on my H's face too, but someone has told me that when they ask him anything, he just turns away and "wants to cry...you can see it." The WS's DO feel stuff....they just don't show US. Probably fear, because when they are in this fog, they don't know what they want, and they are afraid that if they show US emotion it will sway their decision. And in this fog, they want total control of that decision.<P>So it's up to us to just be the best we can in the meantime, so that there is a safe place to come to, if they want, when the fog lifts.<P>I hope this helps.

Well I think I've done all the talking between us, trying to show her over the last year I have changed to an extent, I have along way to go, but I told her that I am willing to do what it takes to make our marriage work, which includes counselling and me giving up my hobby(well what do you call a hobby that takes over your life?). But I think she has blinded herself to me, she doesn't want to see me for what I am now, the only thing I believe she sees is what I was 2 years ago.

Have you read all you can on this site? Your showing very typical patterns at the moment, righ down to bring up the past to justify what's happening today. In my case, my H dates his unhappiness from the late 80's!!! Oh really? Such a good actor for at least the first ten years of that...cos he married me in 1991!!!<P>Read, read, read, here! Find out all about Plan A and B, love busters and the Love Bank. It will give you some stuff to work with, and is very encouraging for YOU.<P>Take care!

Well I just found out though her new love's wife that they have actually been sleeping together.. And well that was one thing we both understood when we went into the marriage, that any infidelity can only lead to this. I don't even think I could take her back now if she was the one doing the begging.

Sorry, obviously I didn't proofread. It should say your wife is showing very typical patterns....etc

Hehe, well I'm not much of a proofreader myself.<BR>

Oh ((((((((((((((((FDH-WS)))))))))))))))))))<P>That's a cyber hug.<P>I remember when I found that out.... I really fell for you.<P>You may think that you will never forgive her, you hate her and all those things going through your head, but later you may also surprise yourself, and her, in what you are willing to forgive.<P>I had always said that if he ever did that to me that would be the absolute end. And yet here I am, seven months after D-day, still fighting for my marriage. Be prepared for some unexpected reactions to all of this.

Oh S***!<P>That's I rally FEEL for you!!!!!

OOPS!!!<P>I guess that slipped by me too!!! REALLY!!!

Nina has given you some great advice. <P>Now, the next thing I would like to recommend is some counseling. Just because w won't go don't think that you can't. I made that mistake. <P>Why should you go? To work on yourself. Whether or not w ever comes around, you need to be healthy. If the marriage is to be restored, you must be healthy. If the children are to be healthy, you must be healthy. If the marriage does not recover, you must be healthy. Do you get the idea?<P>I don't know your financial situation so I will say that many employer insurance programs will cover a portion of psychological and psychiatric costs. And you may well need both. To deal with your emotional state and mental state - and they are different. There is situational depression which is like "serious blues" but, it that goes on too long, it can become clinical depression which is a chemical thing. There are things far worse than medication to get you through a terrible time. In fact, at terrible times it can be a godsend to have something to help your brain function better. After all, you have to be there for the children.<P>As far as counseling goes, bear in mind that you may not hit it off with the first counselor you see. There are many places you might find one. Do you have any divorced friends or friends who have seen counselors? Ministers often provide counseling or referrals. There are also community service agencies which provide services - often on a sliding scale - and many take medical insurance. There are also community mental health agencies. Your physician can probably make a referral and may be able to meet your medical needs, also. My x's did and mine would have except I already had a psychiatrist. <P>And, even if they should put you on an antidepressant, it doesn't mean you are doomed to be on one forever. I have been twice. Once for about 1 year or a little longer. Off for a year or more. Then back on for about 8 months. After I came off, the Dr. said I seemed to be so much better than he had ever seen me.<P><B>YES!! There is life after this!!</B><P>Sometimes it takes a while to get there.

My marriage is over with, she has made this quite clear not only in words but in action, and in her continous lying about everything, she even has done something she said she would never do, and that is lie about anything that involved our children.<BR> Most of me hopes that she finds in this guy what she really wanted, and it turns out well for her, because if it doesn't, well she was never really a "stable" person, I didn't find that out until my second year of marriage though.<BR> There is that small vindictive part of me that hopes she realizes what she has done to me, and sees the pain in our childrens eyes over what she has done to our family, this part also knows that the person she is with is just using her to get what he wants.<BR> Sadly I found out through his wife that they were having an actual affair and not just seeing each other. Sadly I find out that he has told my wife that he has not had sex with his wife for 2 years now, when his wife told me they have been having sex continiously throughout this affair. <BR> He also told my wife that he has tried to divorce his wife twice before but she would not sign the papers(And from my understanding of Texas law he could have had a divorce if he wanted it with or without her signature).<BR> I take great pity on my wayward wife, and I feel already the pain she is going to go through in the near future. But I have, and well she has made the descition for me that there will be no reconsilation of this marriage.

I would also like to mention that I feel so foolish, this morning I basically got on my hands and knees begging my wife to try and resolve this marriage, I told her I would do whatever it takes. She let me beg, probibly laughing at me in the back of her mind. Not two hours later I recieved that call from the OM's wife telling me that he confessed that they have had sex more than once over the last 2 months.

Nina, what is up with your keyboard? HONESTLY, I think it is moving the keys on you! (I don't type F-e-e-l, because I always end up with fell, too!) I didn't even bother editing mine today....even though I made some in Nicole's thread, and yours that might not make sense...but I don't always do that, and that's not the computer, either)<P>You are in for many more surprises about yourself, and her...I would refrain from making any all or nothing decisions for a while...like Cinderalla said, get some counseling. It pretty monumental when you find out that your santuary is no sanctuary, and that the world doesn't work the way you thought it did. Bitterness follows, then acceptance, then growth...its pretty standard. Keep moving is the secret. Like that game you played..it was bad because you quit moving forward...BTW, din;t minimize the effect of your (YES) inappropriate online relationship with another woman...soon to be classified as an IA (Internet Affair)...it is just like an EA, and still a no-no...quit trying to push it away simply because there was no physical union...doesn't matter one bit. The argument is tired, and she still was hurt by it...want to debate it? Tell Jerry Springer...look where your life is...enuff said.<P>Things seem all doom and gloom...I wish Ace was here, he is a little ahead of you on the curve, and could tell you some things to watch out for. Like your resentment towards her growing, and I can see that happening to you now. The trouble is, you can't get a different perspective on this because she is involved, and not with you. GET COUNSELING...READ READ READ....c'mon...you think that you are unique, and you are in many ways, just not this one. I have thought what you are thinking, felt what you are feeling...sometimes, I still do. My sit is pretty bleak, but if she left the OM, and I saw a few things...given time, I'd take that chance again still.<P>At some point, get alone...lie down on the floor, and talk to God DIRECTLY about this. Get it out, but remember who you are talking to. Then, make him the Master of your life, and give it all to him. Ask him to help you...he will carry your cross if you need him to...really. Have some peace in your life...if only for a little while. God bless you...I am going to pray for you. -Mike

OKAY....wait a minute......YOU ARE PURSUING...STOP....GO OUT ASAP...get 'Love Must Be Tough' by Dr. James Dobson...and reread the material here. I did not see that begging thing...LOOK DON'T FEEL EMBARASSED...WE ALL DID THAT...well, okay...I did that anyway. Read some of the posts in other threads...when we all get our wish...whatever that is...maybe we could have an awards ceremony for the weakest plea for reconciliation. Please lay on the floor, and talk to God some...be calm, and have some peace. You need that now. You deserve that now. -Mike

Are you in Central Texas? You mentioned Motorola. If you need some references for a good counselor and a very good attorney, I have both. You definitely need to get custody of those children (I was reading your other post)!