I am a BS and my wife was the WS in which discovery was February 2001. Throughout our marriage, I have been the perfect husband according to my wife and to this day, I will never understand her reasoning for our divorce! <P>We are currently waiting to hear that our divorce is final, but I couldn't help but feel angry for some reason today. I can't believe that I am actually at THIS point in my life. I have always been a good husband and provider and I have always catered to her emotional needs and in the process, I have sacrificed my own needs to help her deal with her low self esteem issues. <P>One question that I will never understand is that if my wife still considers me to be a great husband and she has told me that she doesn't understand HERSELF why she is wanting a divorce, Why is she divorcing me?? She has never been totally open with her feelings about this and I am very frustrated that I don't know the exact reasons behind her decision! She has told me that she "married too young" and she " didn't feel in love with me anymore", but how am I to try and meet her "unmet" emotional needs if she won't tell me or will not see a doctor or go to counseling with me? Is there anyone else out there with similiar experiences?<P>Thanks<P>Bryan<P>------------------<BR>BJK

this sounds so familaiar to me, I was told the samethings and she even said she had everything she wanted and had no reason to be unhappy, that was right before she left me and filed for divorce, if she is having and affair like mine was and still is, then all I can say is she is deep in the fog and all you can do is plan A your butt off and wait for the results.<P>

Jabber..<P>Thanks for your message. I have tried very hard to Plan A as much as I can, but I cannot control her lack of desire to save our marriage. This is what is so sad about our situation. <BR><P>------------------<BR>BJK

Sorry to hear about your painful situation. It does take two and perhaps you can find true love down the road. Keep the faith! I'm sure your wife will reflect on all this and realize what great love she truly has in you. Maybe it won't be too late before she realizes it?? People get remarried all the time! I don't believe that idea is too far-fetched. In the meantime, focus on your own health--spiritual, mental, & physical. You're gonna make it!

Quite familiar. You need to mend your heart, then follow it.

Hmmmm.... are you sure you're not secretly married to my wife? Tells me how wonderful I am, how she feels guilty over not loving me the way she used to. Slowly, however, her disappointments are coming out. To me, they're still things that could be worked out, but she's not open to it.<P>You say you catered to your wife's emotional needs- perhaps she doesn't even know what they are. The A must have happened for a reason- the OM must have met some need that you weren't, and she didn't have the boundary in place that would have told her to go to you for that need instead of the OM.<P>It is true that you won't be able to meet her needs unless she tells you, and lets you try. If she won't stay, won't go to counseling, won't "see a doctor" (do you mean you suspect she's clinically depressed?), then you're in the rough spot that I am (although my wife will go to counseling with me, it's now divorce counseling, not marriage counseling). All I'm doing is plan Aing my butt off, and trying to understand how we got here- so we'll either be able to get back together, or I'm be able to go on and not make the same mistakes next time.

positivebryan:<P>I have refrained from answering many of your posts because you absoluetely detest WS and are very open on how much you blame us.<P>I am the WS and despite what you may think I tried to save my marriage. I Caught my husband involving himself with udate.com's dating service. It was only a few months after that when I was in an emotional affair (I know now that that's what it was) which shortly afterwards went physical. <P>I still work with the OM and it has been over for about a year now - it was very short. Sadly I knew the distance between husband and I was real - long before the online stuff or my affair; I knew that it wasnt getting better but I didnt know how to "fix" things then - had not discovered Dr. Harley or MB. When I made the discovery of the online stuff it sent me into a panic. I drug him to counselling but he didnt return after only two sessions; he shut down from me and became a recluse. I turned to someone that I worked with (which I do regret) who befriended me at a time when I really thought I needed answers - that was not the answer. He still is a good friend to me - we only talk about business stuff and it is fine.<P>So - a year later I was still working at my marriage and beliving that things are doing better and improving - despite my husbands total failure to meet my emtional needs or have any desire to know what those were, or my sexual needs, or even discuss my therapy sessions that I went to alone - he didnt even want to know when or if I went. I continued to love and persevere in hopes that better times were around the corner. He even discussed having a baby and so I really thought we were recovering.<P>July 22 he decides, after a wonderful day together, that he wants to sell our home and go our separate ways - NO WARNING to me at all. He tells me this at 11:00 PM at night after we get into bed. I was devistated. I told him he had not EARNED a divorce - it was me for the past year trying to meet his needs, support him on everything he wanted to do and I wasnt wanting out! I dont believe you just throw away eight years of marriage because you hit a pothole in the road of life!!<P>Bryan - he has financially supported me better than I could ever hope for. He makes sure that I have everything that I need but he cannot be intimate with me emotionally or verbally and admits he cannot, and blames it on his job - he is a mortician and very emotionally shut down.<P>So...now, we have filed for divorce - I am attending a seminar called "When the Vows Break" - A RECOVERY FROM SEPARATION/DIVORCE"....and even asked him to go - (still was trying) and he said he didnt need it. <P>I said all of that to say - I still consider my husband an excellent provider and very sweet man. However, I now have accepted that I cannot repair this marriage alone and I am letting go and I am so beat from it all. I think I too can just shut my feelings down. I was angry more yesterday for his ability to just throw it away like a bag of garbage, and the day before was more remorseful for everything I had ever done wrong from paying the phone bill a day late to buying a pair of shoes I really didnt need; today I am just sad.<P>He just apologizes to me and says that he doesnt feel like he has been a man to me; and just says that I need to find someone with my same ZEST for like and move along. Just like that. He even wants us to be friends...HA.<P>So - although you may hate me - we are in similar boats just arrived in them thru different routes. I am making plans now for the removal of my things from our home when it sells and figuring out the next step.<P>In answer to your other question on how long to wait before dating? I hope to wait a minimum of six months as I kinda hope husband will miss me and we can still reconcile. I am stupid I guess, but I am not going to start dating until that time has passed and I think I will know when I am ready but I am going to at least wait six months.<P>So - that is my .05 cents worth - inflation ya know.<P>Scuba<BR>

Scuba..<P>Come on now! I DON't detest the WS! I detest the WS who continue to have affair after affair and they still have no remorse or no respect for the BS regardless! Its the frame of mind that I detest! If you are a WS and are trying to make things right for both people in the marriage, I am 100% supportive!<P>I agree with you that the OM in my situation maybe addressed an emotional need that my wife had that I didn't address, but that still does not make adultery an optional! Adultery is NEVER an option. However, I think alcohol played a huge role in her "one time affair".<P>I wish you the best in your situation with your husband! <P>Take Care<P>Bryan<P><BR><P>------------------<BR>BJK

Bryan,<BR> okay peace then...<P>Alcohol is a tough one and can diminish senses and memory - that is tough.<P>What do you think the answer is to your question on how long to wait before dating again?<BR>Scuba<p>[This message has been edited by Scuba2 (edited August 10, 2001).]

Binthere..<P>Thank you for your kind words! I wish you the best as well!<P>Thanks<BR>Bryan<BR><P>------------------<BR>BJK

sisyphus..<P>Thank You!<P><BR><P>------------------<BR>BJK

Here's an exploration of my anger and desire for revenge: <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum34/HTML/001675.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum34/HTML/001675.html</A> <P>You might find something in there helpful.

positivebryan:<BR>I don't understand your wife's reasoning for leaving either. It sounds like you were a wonderful, caring husband. I will tell you though, in this world there are givers and takers. I am definately a giver and because of that, I have been hurt. For 16 years, I cooked, cleaned, mowed the grass, edged, washed the clothes, ran my girls everywhere, washed the cars, etc., etc. you name it, I did it.<P>All those years, nothing was ever good enough and he always had something critical/negative to say, he was controlling and jealous. I just laughed it off and appeared happy on the outside, but on the inside it tore me apart emotionally, a little piece at a time. I was brainwashed into believing I could not make it on my own, no one would want a divorced woman w/2 teenage girls, I was nothing but a b___tch and complained all the time. As much as I tried to block it out, it eventually lowed my self esteem to nothing.<P>I have always been dedicated and loyal to my girls and I too thought an affair was never an option. Someone paid attention to me, said the things I wanted to hear and that was all it took. My ex also said how could you throw away 16 years of marriage. I was so hurt and emotionally torn apart by that point that I just didn't even want to live anymore. Somehow I got the strength together and left with only a sleeping bag, pillow and my clothes, got an apt, got a 2nd job and I paid child support for 4 months.<P>I tried hard not to talk bad about my husband and it only took my girls 4 months to realize what a jerk he was. They came to live with me, the tides changed and all hell broke loose. It was very sad what he put my girls through because they chose to live with me. They were the innocent bystanders. For the 1st time, last Wednesday night they actually spent the night with him. He has never taken them on his weekends, but takes them out to eat a couple of times a week.<P>You have to remember, you STBX is in the fog right now and is not seeing things clearly. Sometimes no matter what you do you can not change their mind because it is already made up. My X begged and begged me to come back, go out to dinner just one more time, etc., etc. I refused, it was hard but I finally let go of the person that was supposed to love, cherise and respect me all those years. I took charge of my life for the first time and said no, you are not going to hurt me anymore. It has been very lonely for me, but I'm a survivor and so are you. Life goes on, take one day at a time and before you know it the healing will start. <P>I don't dislike men, but it has been very difficult for me to date. I dated someone about 7 months after my divorce and I was in the fog because he was actually nice to me and respected me; however, I was very cautious and I'm glad I was because he started the controlling issues, but in a different way. I blew him off.<P>Now it has been 2 years and I'm just out to have fun, nothing serious, don't like the bar scene, so I stay home a lot. I still work 2 jobs so my girls will have the same standard of living. Sometimes you just have to let go and the sooner you do the easier it will be on you. You are young, life is too short to hold onto something that is impossible. Be patient and cautious, you will come out ahead and it will be worth the weight and effort.

Scuba..<P>Thank You! Peace is Good! <P>I think 6 months to start dating again is fine! I would rather be happy by myself then be miserable with someone and I need to find myself again emotionally before dating someone.<P>Take Care<P>Bryan <BR><P>------------------<BR>BJK

Elliott!<P>You are a hero in my book! <P>You are showing your girls that you are an AWESOME role model and a great mom! I am sure that your girls will have HUGE respect for you now and in the future. <P>Thank you for your kind words! I know that both of us will be stronger from the situation and we will march on to find that one special person that we have been looking for all of our lives!<P>Take Care Hero!<P>Bryan <BR><P>------------------<BR>BJK

Thank You!<BR>

Hi Bryan,<P>I am newer at this than you, but I am going through similar things. My h expressed during our one counselling session that he didn't want to try any more and he wanted a divorce. So now I'm Plan A'ing madly, but I think, well, what's the point if he doesn't even want to try?<P>I hit a low point this week, really low, yuck! But I'm still going to do it. Why? Because it's the only option left to me now. Because it makes me feel like a better person to take the high road. Because it is giving me respect for myself not to grovel and beg, and all that stuff. Because it's giving him an opportunity to see that I am a good, safe person to be with, and available for him when he gets out of the fog.<P>The thing I don't like about Plan A is that there are to be no guarantees. Well, I'll be a better person who has retained my dignity, I suppose, and he'll never be able to say the things about me that his sister did about her h when she ended her marriage. And I know my h. That will matter to him. <P>And we've got 3 kids...so we need it to be a good relationship whatever happens, for their sake.<P>Hope I helped a bit. Take care.

Nina..<P>Wow...you are a great person for acting the way that you are towards your husband and children. You are a great role model for them. The fact that you are acting with TOTAL CLASS in this situation is a HUGE POSITIVE and it makes you look like a star!<P>I wish my wife had the same attitude that you have! GOOD LUCK and please keep me updated on your situation. <P>Take Care and God Bless..<P>Bryan <BR><P>------------------<BR>BJK

Hi Bryan,<P>I'm sorry you are in this position. I too am still hurting from a relationship ending. The difference is that I ended it because of the abuse. I decided that I would do everything in my power to keep my marriage together. When it finally ended he BEGGED me to go to counselling. We went...with me fully participating in keeping OUR marriage together.<P>You see Bryan...when people leave the marriage, they leave the marriage emotionally long before they physically leave the marriage. My ex wanted the marriage to be done with. He didn't care that three children were left behind in pain or that even though he damaged me so much I was STILL willing to work on *us*. <P>What I have learned through this whole process is that the only person you can change is yourself. You can't control the actions of others. The first time we were in marriage counselling together and the counsellor told him that he wasn't listening to me....the man stood up and told the woman she was a *f---ing idiot* and walked out. This was a couselor that HE picked out because I knew that if I picked a counselor he would say I picked a *rotten* one on purpose.<P>Sometimes people are just not ready to hear the truth. For many years I worked HARD on a marriage...but there finally comes a time when you realize that you can't work on it by yourself.<P>Hang in there my friend. Continue counselling for YOURSELF if anyone. And know that there are so many more out there that have felt the same pain. I'm so very sorry -- but I do know that time does heal.... eventually.<P>I do have another man in my life. One that is willing to work on US and is willing to communicate. There will never be a time that I forget my ex or the things that he did. Right now I am working on the good memories.<P>Sorry this is so long. I just felt that I had to respond to you. Chin up.

Elan..<P>When I read messages from people like yourself, I cannot help but thing that our situations are TOTALLY unfair and unjust in this world. <P>How could someone like your husband treat you like he has? This behavior is SHOCKING to me and it almost makes me think that people like my wife and your husband are not really human! No Human should treat another like this!<P>I admire your willingness to try to make things right with your marriage, but like you said, both people need to work on it together! I do believe that my wife removed herself emotionally from our marriage many months ago, but now that I look back, why didn't she communicate with me about her feelings, I never got a straight answer from her, never.<P>Right now, I sometimes feel like an a** because I had committed lots and lots of money to helping her pay off her car and student loans, and through all of this, she probably allowed me to do so knowing that our marriage would die soon. This is what makes me very mad! <P>I wish you the best and keep us updated on your situation.<P>Take Care<BR>Bryan<BR><P>------------------<BR>BJK